Palestinian President Abbas Declares Hamas's Militia Illegal
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=adxlO9zx61fQ&refer=home

Some hope emerging.

Yes when you grab a Arab by the money sack it like grabbing them by the balls and squeezing, you get co-operation.

Yes when you grab a Arab by the money sack it like grabbing them by the balls and squeezing, you get co-operation.

lol,:) i like your style.

Yes when you grab a Arab by the money sack it like grabbing them by the balls and squeezing, you get co-operation.


Abraham (Hebrew: אַבְרָהָם, Standard Avraham Ashkenazi Avrohom or Avruhom Tiberian ʾAḇrāhām ; Arabic: ابراهيم, Ibrāhīm ; Ge'ez: አብርሃም, ʾAbrəham) is regarded as the founding patriarch of the Israelites and of the Arabic people in Jewish, Christian and Islamic tradition.

Jesus was an Arab.

Of the four gospels, only Matthew and Luke give accounts of Jesus' genealogy. The accounts in the two gospels are substantially different, and various theories have been proposed to explain the discrepancies (see Genealogy of Jesus). Both accounts, however, trace his line back to King David and from there to Abraham.

Besides the Palestinian Arabs are descendants of the Canaanites, same as the Jews.

According to Sir James Frazer, the majority of Palestinian Arabs are descendants of the ancient Jebusites and Canaanites. In 1902, he wrote in his book The Golden Bough:

"The Arabic-speaking peasants of Palestine are the progeny of the tribes which settled in the country before the Israelite invasion. They are still adhering to the land. They never left it and were never uprooted from it." [3]

Until now.

The genetic profile of the Palestinians which has been studied in [4] [24] supports Sir James Frazer claims:

"Archaeologic and genetic data support that both Jews and Palestinians came from the ancient Canaanites, who extensively mixed with Egyptians, Mesopotamian and Anatolian peoples in ancient times."

There were no Arabs, when JEW-Jesus was in JUDEA.

There were no Arabs, when JEW-Jesus was in JUDEA.

Evidence?:)

The first written attestation of the ethnonym "Arab" occurs in an Assyrian inscription of 853 BC, where Shalmaneser III lists a King Gindibu of mâtu arbâi (Arab land) as among the people he defeated at the Battle of Qarqar. Some of the names given in these texts are Aramaic, while others are the first attestations of Proto-Arabic dialects.

Arab origin is divided into two major groups:

1. al-ʻĀriba (العاربة) "Pure origin": They are the Arabs known as Qahtanite who are traditionally considered to be direct descendants of Noah through his son Shem through his sons Aram and Arfakhshaath. Famous noble Qahtanite Arab families from this group can be recognised in the modern days from their surnames such as : Alqahtani, Alharbi, Alzahrani, Alghamedey, aws and khazraj (Alansari or Ansar), Aldosari, Alkhoza'a, Morra, Alojman, etc. Arab genealogies usually ascribe the origins of the Qahtanites to the South Arabians who built up one of the oldest centres of civilisation in the Near East beginning around 800 BC. These groups did not speak one of the early forms of Arabic or its predecessors, however, but instead South Semitic languages such as Sabaic, Minaic, Qatabanic, and Hadramitic.[2]

2. al-Mustaʻribah (المستعربة) "Arabised Arabs": The term Arabised-Arabs can be used in three different cases:

* Is used for defining the Arabs who are traditionally considered to be descendants of Abraham through his son Ishmael through his son Adnan, and they are known as Adnanite: it is defined of the Arabs who settled in Mecca when Abraham took his Egyptian wife Hagar or (Hajar) and his son Ishmael to Mecca. Ishmael was raised by his mother Hagar and the noble Arab tribe "Jurhom" who left from Yemen and settled in Mecca after the drought in Yemen at that time). Ishmael learned Arabic language and he spoke it fluently during his life. And that is the main reason for calling this Arab group as Arabised. It is believed also that the Prophet of Islam Mohammad is descended of Adnanite Arab tribe which is "Quriesh". Some famous noble Adnanite Arab families from this group are: Alanazi, Altamimi, Almaleek, Bani Khaled, Bani Kolab, Bani Hashim, etc.

* The term Arabised-Arabs is also used for defining the Arabs who spoke other Afro-Asiatic languages. They are Arabic speakers and regarded as Arabs in contemporary times.

* The same term al-Musta'ribah "Arabised-Arabs" is also used for the "Mixed Arabs", between "Pure Arabs" and the Arabs from South Arabia.

Sorry Sam He was a Israelite, Tribe of Judah, House of David, which makes him a Jew, the people who the Palestinians and the Arab's and radical Islam have swore to destroy.

Jesus was an Arab.

Jesus was semitic, arabs didn't show up in the area in any significant numbers until after the advent of islam(they were mostly nomads in the area at the time).

Edit: Unless you are claiming that semites=arabs which is an entire discussion unto itself.

Tribe of Judah, House of David, which makes him a Jew

Jesus was semitic, arabs didn't show up in the area in any significant numbers until after the advent of islam(they were mostly nomads in the area at the time).

Edit: Unless you are claiming that semites=arabs which is an entire discussion unto itself.

Jews, Palestinians, and Syrians share a genetic link.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?CMD=search&DB=pubmed


Another finding, paradoxical but unsurprising, is that by the yardstick of the Y chromosome, the world's Jewish communities closely resemble not only each other but also Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese, suggesting that all are descended from a common ancestral population that inhabited the Middle East some four thousand years ago.

He said the finding would cause "a lot of discussion of the relationship of scientific evidence to the manner in which we evaluate long-held academic and personal religious positions," like the question of who is a Jew.


The analysis by Dr. Hammer and colleagues is based on the Y chromosome, which is passed unchanged from father to son. Early in human evolution, all but one of the Y chromosomes were lost as their owners had no children or only daughters, so that all Y chromosomes today are descended from that of a single genetic Adam who is estimated to have lived about 140,000 years ago.

In principle, all men should therefore carry the identical sequence of DNA letters on their Y chromosomes, but in fact occasional misspellings have occurred, and because each misspelling is then repeated in subsequent generations, the branching lineages of errors form a family tree rooted in the original Adam.

These variant spellings are in DNA that is not involved in the genes and therefore has no effect on the body. But the type and abundance of the lineages in each population serve as genetic signature by which to compare different populations.

Based on these variations, Dr. Hammer identified 19 variations in the Y chromosome family tree.

The ancestral Middle East population from which both Arabs and Jews are descended was a mixture of men from eight of these lineages.

The ancestral pattern of lineages is recognizable in today's Arab and Jewish populations, but is distinct from that of European populations and both groups differ widely from sub-Saharan Africans.

The close genetic affinity between Jews and Arabs, at least by the Y chromosome yardstick, is reflected in the Genesis account of how Abraham fathered Ishmael by his wife's maid Hagar and, when Sarah was then able to conceive, Isaac. Although Muslims have a different version of the story, they regard Abraham and Ishmael, or Ismail, as patriarchs just as Jews do Abraham and Isaac.


The study, reported in today's Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, was conducted by Dr. Michael F. Hammer of the University of Arizona with colleagues in the United States, Italy, Israel, England and South Africa.

Tribe of Judah, House of David, which makes him a Jew

Prophet Dawood (David) also a Prophet for Muslims, and of the House of Abraham.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophets_of_Islam

But all in all a son of the Nation of Israel, tribe of Judah, House of David, which makes him Jewish, a person sworn by your people of Islam to be destroyed, and all of his nation, deny that Sam.

But all in all a son of the Nation of Israel, tribe of Judah, House of David, which makes him Jewish, a person sworn by your people of Islam to be destroyed, and all of his nation, deny that Sam.

As usual you are talking out of your ass.

Islam holds Jesus (Arabic: عيسى‎ `Īsā) to have been a messenger and a prophet of God and the Messiah (The concept of prophecy in Islam is broader than Judaism and Christianity since Muslims distinguish between "messengers" and "prophets". Unlike prophets, messengers are assured of success. All messengers are prophets but not vice versa) [1] According to the Qur'an, Jesus was one of God's (Arabic Allah) most beloved messengers, a precursor to Muhammad [2], and was sent to guide the Children of Israel.

The various names of Jesus in the Qur'an

* Kalimatullaah meaning "God's Word", mentioned in the original text of 3:45
* ruhun minhu meaning a "a Spirit from Him", mentioned in 4:171
* al-Masih meaning "The Messiah" mentioned eleven times.
* Nabi meaning "prophet" mentioned in 29:30
* Rasul meaning "envoy, messenger" mentioned in the Qur'an 4:157, 5:75
* Ibn Maryam, Isa ibn Maryam meaning "son of Mary" or "Jesus son of Mary" mentioned thirty three times. This expression appears only once in Gospels. EI mentions a source [3] that considers the name came from the Church of Ethiopia after the return of the second group of emigrants.
* Min al-muqareeabin meaning "among those who are close to God", later explained by the fact of his "ascension" mentioned in the Qur'an 3:45
* Wadjih, meaning "worthy of esteem in this world and the next". EI quotes al-Baydawi who explains that Jesus is on earth a prophet and in Heaven an intercessor; mentioned in the Qur'an 3:45.
* Mubarak, meaning "blessed" explained by EI as "a source of benefit for others, probably a bringer of barakah."; mentioned in the Qur'an 19:31.
* Qawl al-haqq, meaning "sure word", EI states that this is 'an obscure expression which is perhaps not a title but refers to the preceding statement'; mentioned in the Qur'an 19:34.
* Abd Allah, meaning "Servant of God". EI states that Abd literally means "slave", but in theological terms it means "the creature". Man is not only the "servant" of God but also his property. In the Qur'an, unlike the Bible, the angels are also called Abd and the basic meaning of adoration is found, with various nuances, in all derived meanings. EI, pointing out that Qur'an insists that the status of Jesus was no more than that of a created being, argues that Abd Allah, the first word uttered by Jesus, should have meant to emphasize his non-deity. EI doesn't agree with Ledit[4] who interprets the meaning of this term in the Judaeo-Christian sense and argues that "Everywhere in the Qur'an the word means a being created by God and subject to Him."

samcdkey, no Sam, you still have to admit that Jesus was a Jew, and many in your religion of Islam are sworn to wipe the Jews from the face of the Earth, why? there is no why in there reasoning other than he is a Jew, Israelite, follower and son of Yahweh's, Founder of the Christian Religion, and man of true peace, 300 years before Mohammed stopped shitting in his diapers.

samcdkey, no Sam, you still have to admit that Jesus was a Jew, and many in your religion of Islam are sworn to wipe the Jews from the face of the Earth, why? there is no why in there reasoning other than he is a Jew, Israelite, follower and son of Yawah', Founder of the Christian Religion, and man of true peace, 300 years before Mohammed stopped shitting in his diapers.

I thought Paul was the founder of Christianity?:confused:

Anyway, it does not matter what Jesus was, Jew or Christian, he is a Prophet in the Quran, so for us he is a Muslim as are all Prophets.

And how many Moslems are being killed by Moslems? and how many in Islam are sworn to wipe the Jews from the face of the earth? and Jesus was a Jew, so would he be recognized in time or just be considered another Jew to be wiped from the face of the earth?

And how many Moslems are being killed by Moslems? and how many in Islam are sworn to wipe the Jews from the face of the earth? and Jesus was a Jew, so would he be recognized in time or just be considered another Jew to be wiped from the face of the earth?

Well if Jesus was here, we'd consider him a Muslim so that problem would not arise.:rolleyes:

And how many Muslims have died at Muslim hand in the last 40ty years?, 100ed years?, and if Jesus being a Jew can be considered a Muslim, why can't the rest of the Jews be given the same consideration, you still have a large majority of Islam that has sworn death for all Jews, again I ask would they even notice that he was a prophet before they killed him?

And how many Muslims have died at Muslim hand in the last 40ty years?, 100ed years?, and if Jesus being a Jew can be considered a Muslim, why can't the rest of the Jews be given the same consideration, you still have a large majority of Islam that has sworn death for all Jews, again I ask would they even notice that he was a prophet before they killed him?

umm if you read the Quran, you will realise that Muslims accept all the Prophets. They do not make cartoons of Moses or Jesus, because they are our prophets too. The problem is not on our side.:)

Muslims do not kill for religious reasons anyway. It just so happens that so much oil is in the ME. And its not the Muslims who came to Iraq or Palestine or Lebanon to fight a war. There has NEVER been a war between Muslims for ideological reasons, only political ones, like between the Allies and Germany.

The Palestinians or Lebanese are not fighting for religious reasons either, and the al-Qaeda are terrorists. There are Christians and Samaritans in Palestine and in Lebanon.

There are also Jews in Iran, so your claim is false.

Although Iran and Israel are bitter enemies, few know that Iran is home to the largest number of Jews anywhere in the Middle East outside Israel.

About 25,000 Jews live in Iran and most are determined to remain no matter what the pressures - as proud of their Iranian culture as of their Jewish roots.

samdkey why don't you do us a favor and stop putting the koran teaching in the Jewish-Christian-bible.

Lol

samdkey why don't you do us a favor and stop putting the koran teaching in the Jewish-Christian-bible.

I'm glad you recognised the right direction of it.:)

samdkey the direction of Muhammad's invention & intention when writing HIS Quran?

The Jews of Iran
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------1948 Jewish population: 100,000
2004: ~25,000

A thriving population wouldn't you say? Sam, what happened to the other 75,000, the peace of the grave?

The Jews of Iran
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------1948 Jewish population: 100,000
2004: ~25,000

A thriving population wouldn't you say? Sam, what happened to the other 75,000, the peace of the grave?

Is that why Iran has the second largest population of Jews in the ME?

Israel happened.
http://www.iranian.com/Times/June98/Tehran/497k.html#letters
there also exist Iranian Jews who try to disassociate themselves from Iran and their nationality - for example, those who go exclusively by their Jewish names or those who, for whatever reason, moved to Israel. For them, their Jewish identity is more important than their Iranian identity, which I think is unfortunate.

Jesus was semitic, arabs didn't show up in the area in any significant numbers until after the advent of islam(they were mostly nomads in the area at the time)..that is true to the region as a whole, but as far as Israel-Palestine land, not even until recently.

Is that why Iran has the second largest population of Jews in the ME?



not that much left, though still more than in Arab countries, then again the kind & compassionate Iranains do NOT let the Jews out, they have to go via difficult ways... look for better sources than Ahmadinejad's official "evidence".

not that much left, though still more than in Arab countries, then again the kind & compassionate Iranains do NOT let the Jews out, they have to go via difficult ways... look for better sources than Ahmadinejad's official "evidence".

Yes the formation of Israel has been very good for them.

So why do they still live in Iran, do you think?

Jews, Palestinians, and Syrians share a genetic link.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?CMD=search&DB=pubmed


This is common knowledge but saying jews are arab is a bit of a stretch.

This is common knowledge but saying jews are arab is a bit of a stretch.

I meant this:

The ancestral Middle East population from which both Arabs and Jews are descended was a mixture of men from eight of these lineages.

The ancestral pattern of lineages is recognizable in today's Arab and Jewish populations, but is distinct from that of European populations and both groups differ widely from sub-Saharan Africans

:)

umm if you read the Quran, you will realise that Muslims accept all the Prophets. They do not make cartoons of Moses or Jesus, because they are our prophets too. The problem is not on our side.:)


So you don't see the global reaction that lead to the deaths of around 200 people and millions of dollars in property damage as a problem?

samdkey why don't you do us a favor and stop putting the koran teaching in the Jewish-Christian-bible.

good Morning Tazmaniac,

I hope all is going well with you

How do you mean the Jewish-Christian Bible, I thought Jews did not even believe that Jesus was the Messiah.

do the Jews follow the teachings of Jesus or was he rejected by the High priest at the time?

Muslims on the other hand, read and follow the bible and Jesus is one of their prophets and the messiah. so whebn Jesus(PBUH) comes back to earth again, jews will reject him as a false messiah, while muslims will follow him. As Sam says Jesus was muslim too, as in he submits to the will of God..

And another thing we can stop, not just you tazmaniac, but lets stop saying that muslims want to wipe the jews off the face of the earth. The Israeli/Palestine situation has nothing to do with religion but is about Economics, Politics and Land.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Take care
zak

So you don't see the global reaction that lead to the deaths of around 200 people and millions of dollars in property damage as a problem?

Not more than say, the Iraq war (http://www.nytimes.com/2006/10/11/world/middleeast/11casualties.html?ex=1318219200&en=516b1d070ff83c15&ei=5088&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss), or the deaths (http://www.fromoccupiedpalestine.org/taxonomy/term/111) in Palestine. They are all problems but more politically motivated than religious.

Not more than say, the Iraq war, or the deaths in Palestine. They are all problems but more politically motivated than religious.

So you can excuse criminal action by individual civilians by point out any and all alleged actions of sovereign nations? "If Johnny can do it, then I should be able to do it, too!" Is that how you see it, Sam? Revenge is not only permitted, it's celebrated?

Baron Max

Some hope emerging.

Abbas is pro-Israel tactics man, his main concern as he says is to preserve peace...meanwhile concern of Palestine people is to preserve their land...Abbas had made Palestine to patches of dirt on Israel, there will never be peace there, only an illusion. Every act Abbas does by suppressing the so called terrorists, who are people who want their land back and their only option is to bomb the oppressors. And now this Abbas is failing his own people. For the world it is better for Abbas to halt Palestine. For Palestine...Abbas is the worth thing there is.

Abbas is pro-Israel tactics man, his main concern as he says is to preserve peace...

The more peace there is between Israelis and Palestinians, the more freedoms and the more prosperity the Palestinians will have in the region.

....terrorists, who are people who want their land back and their only option is to bomb the oppressors.

In this era of international law, no individual or group of individuals have the right to take the law into their own hands. If you permit such acts by one group of individuals, how can you criminalize other acts by other individuals ...like murder and rape? It's the same thing ...taking the law into their own hands.

NO INDIVIDUAL OR GROUP OF INDIVIDUALS HAS THE RIGHT TO TAKE THE LAW INTO THEIR OWN HANDS!

Baron Max

NO INDIVIDUAL OR GROUP OF INDIVIDUALS HAS THE RIGHT TO TAKE THE LAW INTO THEIR OWN HANDS!


So you condemn the invasion of Iraq by the US then.

So you condemn the invasion of Iraq by the US then.

You don't know the difference between "a group of individuals" and "a sovereign nation"?

Geez!!

Baron Max

...

NO INDIVIDUAL OR GROUP OF INDIVIDUALS HAS THE RIGHT TO TAKE THE LAW INTO THEIR OWN HANDS!

Baron Max

So what Palestine now becomes a Group of Individuals and not a sovereign nation?
And...People fighting for freedom and rights become terrorists.

So what Palestine now becomes a Group of Individuals and not a sovereign nation?

Palestine was never, ever, a sovereign nation ...never in the history of all of mankind since the first human! The area that we call Palestine was under the control of other empires or sovereign nations for gazillions of years or longer ....Palestine was never, ever, a sovereign nation.

And...People fighting for freedom and rights become terrorists.

Yes, exactly! If everyone on Earth took up arms and started killing and bombing people because of what they felt about their "freedom and rights", just what kind of a world do you think we'd have? That's why there are laws!! People can't just decide what they want, then go out and start killing people ....is that what you want the world to become???

Baron Max

The more peace there is between Israelis and Palestinians, the more freedoms and the more prosperity the Palestinians will have in the region.



In this era of international law, no individual or group of individuals have the right to take the law into their own hands. If you permit such acts by one group of individuals, how can you criminalize other acts by other individuals ...like murder and rape? It's the same thing ...taking the law into their own hands.

NO INDIVIDUAL OR GROUP OF INDIVIDUALS HAS THE RIGHT TO TAKE THE LAW INTO THEIR OWN HANDS!

Baron Max

you are living with your family in a house. Some men come and throw you out to live in your house backyard, meanwhile the men live inside your house. You go to police and next door neighbors to tell that you have been thrown out...the police and next door neighbors tell you to be peacifull and not escalate this situation to cause any more problems. While living in the backyard the men decide the house is too small so they decide to expand it...living even less space for you to live in the backyard. You decide its time to take action and go inside the house and blowup the coffe-pot from which the men drink, one of the men is spilled with hot coffe causing little burn...the man becomes angered and so do the neighbors and the police. So the man takes a dart in his hands and throws it and kills one of your kids.

I am talking Israel-Palestine relationship here.

And than comes a preacher to instruct the family living in the backyard that they must be at peace with themselves and the God and embrace the beauty of life....meanwhile the preacher slowly moves the kids to the corner to allow a garage to be built by the man...leaving the family with even less area to live.

Now let there be peace...embrace it...for God/Allah will save us, because there is heaven. Isnt there?

you are living with your family in a house. Some men come and throw you out to live in your house backyard, <snip>...the man becomes angered and so do the neighbors and the police. So the man takes a dart in his hands and throws it and kills one of your kids.

All of those acts are against the law. But if you take up arms and kill anyone because of it, you will be committing murder! That's why there are laws ...so people can't and won't take such actions on their own.

In this era of international law, no individual or group of individuals have the right to take the law into their own hands. If you permit such acts by one group of individuals, how can you criminalize other acts by other individuals ...like murder and rape? It's the same thing ...taking the law into their own hands.

NO INDIVIDUAL OR GROUP OF INDIVIDUALS HAS THE RIGHT TO TAKE THE LAW INTO THEIR OWN HANDS!

If you permit or excuse the acts of the Palestinian terrorists, then you'd also permit or excuse murders in New York City or London. There is no difference!!

Baron Max

All of those acts are against the law. But if you take up arms and kill anyone because of it, you will be committing murder! That's why there are laws ...so people can't and won't take such actions on their own.

In this era of international law, no individual or group of individuals have the right to take the law into their own hands. If you permit such acts by one group of individuals, how can you criminalize other acts by other individuals ...like murder and rape? It's the same thing ...taking the law into their own hands.

NO INDIVIDUAL OR GROUP OF INDIVIDUALS HAS THE RIGHT TO TAKE THE LAW INTO THEIR OWN HANDS!

If you permit or excuse the acts of the Palestinian terrorists, then you'd also permit or excuse murders in New York City or London. There is no difference!!

Baron Max

well than I guess you will be allright if someone took away your house and killed your son after all. The law prohibits you from taking action. So stay still afterwards and sip a nice cup of tea.

well than I guess you will be allright if someone took away your house and killed your son after all. The law prohibits you from taking action.

Well, Dragon, how else would you have the world?

A world where "..if someone took away your house and killed your son...", then it's okay for that person to kill not only the perpetrator, but his family as well?

Is that what you'd like to see, Dragon? ...all over the world? ...a world where each person could seek his own form of justice for what he, alone, perceives as an injustice to him? Is that really the world in which you would want to live?

Baron Max

Well, Dragon, how else would you have the world?

A world where "..if someone took away your house and killed your son...", then it's okay for that person to kill not only the perpetrator, but his family as well?

Is that what you'd like to see, Dragon? ...all over the world? ...a world where each person could seek his own form of justice for what he, alone, perceives as an injustice to him? Is that really the world in which you would want to live?

Baron Max

sip a nice cup of tea, I suppose.

sip a nice cup of tea, I suppose.


Well, while ye're sippin' that tea, do some thinking about what I asked and pointed out. Perhaps it will help you in understand some of the conflicts in the world ...and some of the tactics being used by some people.

Baron Max

Well, while ye're sippin' that tea, do some thinking about what I asked and pointed out. Perhaps it will help you in understand some of the conflicts in the world ...and some of the tactics being used by some people.

Baron Max

yeah I see those tactics. Ahmidinejad sees clearly his enemies.

yeah I see those tactics. Ahmidinejad sees clearly his enemies.

Well, great! See? Now ye're beginning to understand. But now, please try to grasp this ......that a sovereign nation is different to that of an individual human.

If Ahmi-whatever, the leader of Iran, decides to declare war and take his army against Australia, then that's much, much different to Abdullah in Palestine taking it on himself to shoot an Israeli. Okay?? Got it now??

Baron Max

So what Palestine now becomes a Group of Individuals and not a sovereign nation?
And...People fighting for freedom and rights become terrorists.:) unbelievebale! finally moderate Palestinians realize that enough is enough with massacring innocent human being under an ugly mask of "freedom fighting" and you area against this moderation???

:) unbelievebale! finally moderate Palestinians realize that enough is enough with massacring innocent human being under an ugly mask of "freedom fighting" and you area against this moderation???

this Palestinians are one...and his name is Abbas...and he is a puppet of Israel.

From world's perspective...its better that Palestine shrink even more
From Palestine's perspective...soon they will be living on each other's toes and die of starvation.

samdkey do you feny that huzbullah is not a proxy of radical islamic iran to make lebanon all militant?

dragon, abbas is no puppet of no one, please don't play into hands of radicals, including self-infliction & self-starvation in putting all energy into sucidal & terrorism cult- Hamas style, instead of rebuilding lives-Abbas style.

Sam you would make a good Nazi, I remember in reading the Nuremburg Trials, and that the exact same thing was brought up by Nazi defendants, that if thing were so bad in Germany why were there so many Jews in Germany, well let remember that for a Jew to leave Germany they had to pay to do so, but it still comes down to that the population keep's falling as they die, move when they can finally pay the fees to leave Iran, or are killed by Devout Iranian Moslems for what ever reason, (mostly religious), so tell me how well the Iranians treat these few remaining Jews in Iran.

Sam you would make a good Nazi, I remember in reading the Nuremburg Trials, and that the exact same thing was brought up by Nazi defendants, that if thing were so bad in Germany why were there so many Jews in Germany, well let remember that for a Jew to leave Germany they had to pay to do so, but it still comes down to that the population keep's falling as they die, move when they can finally pay the fees to leave Iran, or are killed by Devout Iranian Moslems for what ever reason, (mostly religious), so tell me how well the Iranians treat these few remaining Jews in Iran.

Better than this?

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article14799.htm

In large parts of Gaza nowadays, there is no electricity. Israel bombed the only power station in Gaza, and more than half the electricity supply will be cut off for at least another year. There's hardly any water. Since there is no electricity, supplying homes with water is nearly impossible. Gaza is filthier and smellier than ever: Because of the embargo Israel and the world have imposed on the elected authority, no salaries are being paid and the street cleaners have been on strike for the past few weeks. Piles of garbage and obnoxious clouds of stink strangle the coastal strip, turning it into Calcutta.

More than ever, Gaza is also like a prison. The Erez crossing is empty, the Karni crossing has been open only a few days over the last two months, and the same is true for the Rafah crossing. Some 15,000 people waited for two months to enter Egypt, some are still waiting, including many ailing and wounded people. Another 5,000 waited on the other side to return to their homes. Some died during the wait. One must see the scenes at Rafah to understand how profound a human tragedy is taking place. A crossing that was not supposed to have an Israeli presence continues to be Israel?s means to pressure 1.5 million inhabitants. This is disgraceful and shocking collective punishment. The U.S. and Europe, whose police are at the Rafah crossing, also bear responsibility for the situation.

Gaza is also poorer and hungrier than ever before. There is nearly no merchandise moving in and out, fishing is banned, the tens of thousands of PA workers receive no salaries, and the possibility of working in Israel is out of the question.

And we still haven?t mentioned the death, destruction and horror. In the last two months, Israel killed 224 Palestinians, 62 of them children and 25 of them women. It bombed and assassinated, destroyed and shelled, and no one stopped it. No Qassam cell or smuggling tunnel justifies such wide-scale killing. A day doesn?t go by without deaths, most of them innocent civilians.


Or this?

Abdullah a-Zakh identified his son's body by the belt. The shoes and socks also looked familiar, irrefutable proof that he had lost his son. In the morgue of Shifa Hospital, after hours of searching, he found the bottom part of the boy's body. The next day, when Operation "Gan Na'ul" - "Locked Kindergarten" - ended and the Israel Defense Forces exited the Saja'iya neighborhood of Gaza, leaving behind 22 dead and large-scale destruction, the other body parts were found.

Mohammed was buried twice. He was 14 years old at the time of his death. He was killed last week, three days before the start of the new school year, so he never got to enter ninth grade. Did the planners of the operation give thought to the children who would be killed before giving it the satanic name "Locked Kindergarten"? Did the IDF computer that comes up with the names know that there would be five children and adolescents among the dead? Did they think about the popular song that the operation's name evokes? It was unpleasant, very unpleasant (in the words of the song) this week to see the results of Locked Kindergarten in the Saja'iya neighborhood in the eastern section of Gaza City.

"Mohammed was killed by two shells fired by a tank, and both shells hit him. Mohammed is fourteen years and four months old. He was not armed and he didn't know what a weapon was. They saw that he was a boy. Maybe he went there to see the defenders, maybe he wanted to take part. Maybe he threw stones at a tank. They fired a shell at him. That is Mohammed's story and that is the end of Mohammed."

http://www.fromoccupiedpalestine.org/node/1676

Or this?

A whole society is being destroyed. There are 1.5 million Palestinians imprisoned in the most heavily populated area in the world. Israel has stopped all trade. It has even forbidden fishermen to go far from the shore so they wade into the surf to try vainly to catch fish with hand-thrown nets.

Many people are being killed by Israeli incursions that occur every day by land and air. A total of 262 people have been killed and 1,200 wounded, of whom 60 had arms or legs amputated, since 25 June, says Dr Juma al-Saqa, the director of the al-Shifa Hospital in Gaza City which is fast running out of medicine. Of these, 64 were children and 26 women. This bloody conflict in Gaza has so far received only a fraction of the attention given by the international media to the war in Lebanon.

His son Baher al-Tuba described how for five days Israeli soldiers confined him and his relatives to one room in his house where they survived by drinking water from a fish pond. "Snipers took up positions in the windows and shot at anybody who came near," he said. "They killed one of my neighbors called Fathi Abu Gumbuz who was 56 years old and just went out to get water."

Sometimes the Israeli army gives a warning before a house is destroyed. The sound that Palestinians most dread is an unknown voice on their cell phone saying they have half an hour to leave their home before it is hit by bombs or missiles. There is no appeal.

But it is not the Israeli incursions alone that are destroying Gaza and its people. In the understated prose of a World Bank report published last month, the West Bank and Gaza face "a year of unprecedented economic recession. Real incomes may contract by at least a third in 2006 and poverty to affect close to two thirds of the population." Poverty in this case means a per capita income of under $2 a day.

There are signs of desperation everywhere. Crime is increasing. People do anything to feed their families. Israeli troops entered the Gaza industrial zone to search for tunnels and kicked out the Palestinian police. When the Israelis withdrew they were replaced not by the police but by looters. On one day this week there were three donkey carts removing twisted scrap metal from the remains of factories that once employed thousands.

"It is the worst year for us since 1948 [when Palestinian refugees first poured into Gaza]," says Dr Maged Abu-Ramadan, a former ophthalmologist who is mayor of Gaza City. "Gaza is a jail. Neither people nor goods are allowed to leave it. People are already starving. They try to live on bread and falafel and a few tomatoes and cucumbers they grow themselves."

Yes the Iranians treat there Jewish citizens well don't they?

Arrests hang over Iran's small Jewish community

By Afshin Valinejad

SHIRAZ, Iran, January 2, 2000(AP) -- At a synagogue in the heart of this ancient city's Jewish quarter, worshippers end their Sabbath service with a solemn prayer for 13 loved ones jailed by Iranian authorities on accusations of espionage.
"We pray that those we love will be safely among us soon," the rabbi murmurs, then hundreds of people shuffle into the Rabeezadeh Synagogue's courtyard to exchange greetings and news and gossip about their small community.
"They are never far from my mind," said Arman Goel, a teen-ager who knows some of those arrested well. "Even my grades have dropped since they were taken."
The spy case has cast a pall over the 6,000 Jews of Shiraz, the ancient capital of the Persian empire whose wealth and tolerance were a magnet for people of all faiths.
Among the 13 who are in prison are merchants, religious teachers, two civil servants and a 17-year-old boy, said Eshaq Niknava, head of the Jewish Society of Shiraz. Eleven are from Shiraz, two from nearby Isfahan.
The first were arrested one and a half years ago, while others were arrested last March. They have been accused of spying for Israel and the United States, Iranian authorities say, but formal charges have not been brought.
In another case in January 1997, two Jews were hanged at Tehran's Evin prison on similar spying charges.
The plight of the imprisoned Jews has attracted attention from the United States, Israel and several European countries that have demanded Iran free the suspects.
The attention, though, especially from Israel, has created new pressures. Relatives of those held fear that the more their loved ones are defended by the West and Israel, the more adamant Iranian authorities are about pressing the case.
"We should let the issue solve itself quietly, that's the only way," said the wife of one of the men in jail, speaking on condition of anonymity.
Relatives said they had received hints at least some of the Jews would be freed soon. They feared that speaking on the record, or saying anything more about the plight of their loved ones, could jeopardize a release.
Family members get one 5-minute visit every Tuesday. They used to deliver kosher food on each visit, but prison authorities banned that several months ago, saying the food was rotting because prisoners had no refrigerators, relatives said. The inmates now eat prison food.
One woman recounted how her husband was arrested about a year ago.
"Some men knocked on our door at midnight and took my husband," she said. "It took me three months to see him. Now I get to see him for five minutes every week, with a thick glass wall between us, but that's all right."

At its height, Iran's Jewish community numbered about 100,000 and was still around 80,000 just before Iran's 1979 Islamic revolution. Now there are about 25,000 Jews.
Most who left went to the United States, Europe and, to a lesser degree, Israel.

Yes the Iranians treat there Jewish citizens well don't they?

Arrests hang over Iran's small Jewish community

By Afshin Valinejad

SHIRAZ, Iran, January 2, 2000(AP) -- At a synagogue in the heart of this ancient city's Jewish quarter, worshippers end their Sabbath service with a solemn prayer for 13 loved ones jailed by Iranian authorities on accusations of espionage.
"We pray that those we love will be safely among us soon," the rabbi murmurs, then hundreds of people shuffle into the Rabeezadeh Synagogue's courtyard to exchange greetings and news and gossip about their small community.
"They are never far from my mind," said Arman Goel, a teen-ager who knows some of those arrested well. "Even my grades have dropped since they were taken."
The spy case has cast a pall over the 6,000 Jews of Shiraz, the ancient capital of the Persian empire whose wealth and tolerance were a magnet for people of all faiths.
Among the 13 who are in prison are merchants, religious teachers, two civil servants and a 17-year-old boy, said Eshaq Niknava, head of the Jewish Society of Shiraz. Eleven are from Shiraz, two from nearby Isfahan.
The first were arrested one and a half years ago, while others were arrested last March. They have been accused of spying for Israel and the United States, Iranian authorities say, but formal charges have not been brought.
In another case in January 1997, two Jews were hanged at Tehran's Evin prison on similar spying charges.
The plight of the imprisoned Jews has attracted attention from the United States, Israel and several European countries that have demanded Iran free the suspects.
The attention, though, especially from Israel, has created new pressures. Relatives of those held fear that the more their loved ones are defended by the West and Israel, the more adamant Iranian authorities are about pressing the case.
"We should let the issue solve itself quietly, that's the only way," said the wife of one of the men in jail, speaking on condition of anonymity.
Relatives said they had received hints at least some of the Jews would be freed soon. They feared that speaking on the record, or saying anything more about the plight of their loved ones, could jeopardize a release.
Family members get one 5-minute visit every Tuesday. They used to deliver kosher food on each visit, but prison authorities banned that several months ago, saying the food was rotting because prisoners had no refrigerators, relatives said. The inmates now eat prison food.
One woman recounted how her husband was arrested about a year ago.
"Some men knocked on our door at midnight and took my husband," she said. "It took me three months to see him. Now I get to see him for five minutes every week, with a thick glass wall between us, but that's all right."

At its height, Iran's Jewish community numbered about 100,000 and was still around 80,000 just before Iran's 1979 Islamic revolution. Now there are about 25,000 Jews.
Most who left went to the United States, Europe and, to a lesser degree, Israel.

what are they doing there anyway?
Let see...there is a country, people there hate you, you can move anywhere else (your nation is spread everywhere)...but you choose to stay. I say the logic breaks down right there.

Tehran has 11 functioning synagogues, many of them with Hebrew schools. It has two kosher restaurants, and a Jewish hospital, an old-age home and a cemetery. There is a Jewish representative in the Iranian parliament. There is a Jewish library with 20,000 titles, its reading room decorated with a photograph of the Ayatollah Khomeini.

Before the revolution, Jews were well-represented among Iran's business elite, holding key posts in the oil industry, banking and law, as well as in the traditional bazaar. The wave of anti-Israeli sentiment that swept Iran during the revolution, as well as large-scale confiscations of private wealth, sent thousands of the more affluent Jews fleeing to the United States or Israel. Those remaining lived in fear of pogroms, or massacres.

But Khomeini met with the Jewish community upon his return from exile in Paris and issued a ''fatwa'' decreeing that the Jews were to be protected. Similar edicts also protect Iran's tiny Christian minority.


The revolution? The revolt against the Shah of Iran, installed by the CIA who deposed the democratically elected Mossadegh. For OIL. The Shah and his men tortured Iranians for 25 years. And Israel and the US helped.

The joys of American intervention. Iran yesterday, Iraq today, where else tomorrow?

http://www.iranian.com/Opinion/May98/Jews/index.html

The invisible Iranians
Iranian Jews seek more visibility - and acceptance

By Maryam Shargh
May 29, 1998
The Iranian
A spontaneous discussion that transpired in the aftermath of a panel discussion on changing Iranian identities struck a chord of seeming cultural contention. It was a discussion on Iranian Jewry and the tendency for Iranians to question the national allegiances of Iranian Jews. "Iranian or Jewish?", they ask.

"Jews have been in Iran for 2,700 years. That's ninety generations ago! Why do you still not accept us as Iranians?", demanded one vociferous member of the audience standing in the back of the crowded room. "Our parents had two names, one Persian and one Jewish," recalled another member of the audience, and added, "In our generation, we only have one name... a Persian one." Some audience members concurred as she continued. "Sometimes in America, Jewish people ask me what my Hebrew name is and I say I don't have one. They're surprised. We've done everything," she proclaimed. "It's you, the Muslims, who don't accept us."

http://arizonapersian.com/iranopinion/_disc8/0000000f.htm

Finally, one of the abhorrent and despicable dimensions of discrimination and persecution is the daily humiliation of a non-Moslem Iranian in a religiously fanatical Moslem environment. The fact that from early childhood, a non-Moslem learns that, at best, he is a second class citizen, not equal to his peers, able to enjoy the same rights and privileges, and subject to their ridicule and humiliations.

Every fair-minded Iranian, in contact with the Persian Jews, must recall such occasions of abuse, when a Jewish child is ridiculed, called a miser and a coward, afraid at sight of blood, only because when hit and abused, a Jewish child knows that he cannot return the punches. During the years of my boyhood in Tehran, and as a devout fanatical Shi'ai, I can recall many such occasions, and only the years of learning and reflection, aged by the sufferings and wiser by the teachings and experience of our people's struggle for their freedom, equality and democratic institutions, have I come to learn that no Iranian is ever free, till all Iranians are free, equal and proud citizens of our beloved land. I know that day shall come soon, when the Iranian people shall topple the towers of this new Babylon, the minarets of our people's captivity, servitude and sufferings, Moslem and non-Moslem alike, and build a free and democratic Iran.

Beh Omide Iran-e Azaad O Abaad

F Ashkey

So even a Iranian realizes that the life of the Jewish Iranians is not equal to that of a Moslem Iranian.

Yes, too bad the revolution had to happen.

And the Jews of Iran are still being Persecuted, and Attacked and Killed, yes Sam tell me how well the Jews are treated in Iran, and I will tell you that you Lie.
There is a big difference between what the Moslem say and profess, and the facts, that are the daily life of a Iranian Jew

Seven years ago a group of Jews in the southern city of Shiraz was accused of spying for Israel - eventually they were all released. But today many Iranian Jews travel to and from Iran's enemy Israel.

In one of Tehran's six remaining kosher butcher's shops, everyone has relatives in Israel.

In between chopping up meat, butcher Hersel Gabriel tells me how he expected problems when he came back from Israel, but in fact the immigration officer didn't say anything to him.

"Whatever they say abroad is lies - we are comfortable in Iran - if you're not political and don't bother them then they won't bother you," he explains.

His customer, middle-aged housewife Giti agrees, saying she can easily talk to her two sons in Tel Aviv on the telephone and visit them.

"It's not a problem coming and going; I went to Israel once through Turkey and once through Cyprus and it was not problem at all," she says.

Gone are the early days of the Iranian revolution when Jews - and many Muslims - found it hard to get passports to travel abroad.

"In the last five years the government has allowed Iranian Jews to go to Israel freely, meet their families and when they come back they face no problems," says Mr Mohtamed.

He says there is also a way for Iranian Jews who emigrated to Israel decades ago to return to Iran and see their families.

"They can now go to the Iranian consul general in Istanbul and get Iranian identity documents and freely come to Iran," he says.

The exodus of Jews from Iran seems to have slowed down - the first wave was in the 1950s and the second was in the wake of the Iranian Revolution.

Those Jews who remain in Iran seem to have made a conscious decision to stay put.

"We are Iranian and we have been living in Iran for more than 3,000 years," says the Jewish hospital director Ciamak Morsathegh.

"I am not going to leave - I will stay in Iran under any conditions," he declares.

...

Yes, too bad the revolution had to happen.

Sam, do you actually and truly call what's going on with the very few radical, violent Palestinians a "revolution"?

Baron Max

And the Jews of Iran are still being Persecuted, and Attacked and Killed, yes Sam tell me how well the Jews are treated in Iran, and I will tell you that you Lie.

Yes and yet they continue to live there, and have, since 3000 years.

What is the chief suspicion that haunts them?

Despite the official distinction between "Jews," "Zionists," and "Israel," the most common accusation the Jews encounter is that of maintaining contacts with Zionists. The Jewish community does enjoy a measure of religious free dom but is faced with constant suspicion of cooperating with the Zionist state and with "imperialistic America" — both such activities are punishable by death.

Obviously religious persecution.

I would like to add that many American Jewish leaders like to look upon Iran's Jews as this small oppressed minority, who don't have anything in common with the Muslim population - almost as if they were foreigners living in a foreign country. To them, Iranian Jews really aren't Iranian but rather just Jewish; they try to somehow disassociate their Iranianness from their Jewishness, in the process just ignoring the fact that they're Iranian as much as they're Jewish. I believe this reflects these Jewish Americans' own prejudices and ignorance about Iran, and that's just too bad.
http://www.iranian.com/Times/June98/Tehran/497k.html#letters

Sam, do you actually and truly call what's going on with the very few radical, violent Palestinians a "revolution"?

Baron Max

The Iranian revolution?

Yes Sam tell me about the Fatwa, there is what they say and there is what they do, and there is a gulf between those points,


http://www.sephardicstudies.org/iran.html

Khomeini protection

Iran's Jewish community is confronted by contradictions. Many of the prayers uttered in synagogue, for instance, refer to the desire to see Jerusalem again. Yet there is no postal service or telephone contact with Israel, and any Iranian who dares travel to Israel faces imprisonment and passport confiscation. ''We are Jews, not Zionists. We are a religious community, not a political one,'' Yashaya said.

Before the revolution, Jews were well-represented among Iran's business elite, holding key posts in the oil industry, banking and law, as well as in the traditional bazaar. The wave of anti-Israeli sentiment that swept Iran during the revolution, as well as large-scale confiscations of private wealth, sent thousands of the more affluent Jews fleeing to the United States or Israel. Those remaining lived in fear of pogroms, or massacres.

But Khomeini met with the Jewish community upon his return from exile in Paris and issued a ''fatwa'' decreeing that the Jews were to be protected. Similar edicts also protect Iran's tiny Christian minority.

You mean people are disobeying a fatwa? So a fatwa is not law?

Really?

(edit: your information about the contact with Israel is outdated. See my previous post above. It has been reopened since 5 years, unless the present Israeli announcement of a nuclear strike has renewed these travel restrictions to Israel, a country that is announcing its intention to make a nuclear strike)

The Iranian revolution?

Didn't you read my question, Sam? You even included it in your post, then asked your stupid question!

Let's see ....revolution, huh? How 'bout the one going on in India, Sam????

Posted on Sun, Jan. 07, 2007
Violence in India leaves 21 more dead
Separatist rebels in northeast blamed for two days of bloodshed
By Wasbir Hussain
ASSOCIATED PRESS
GAUHATI, India - A second day of bloodshed in India's restive northeast took at least 21 lives Saturday, including 13 migrant workers shot while they slept and eight government employees killed by a land mine explosion.

On Friday, a series of attacks by suspected separatist rebels killed 35 other migrants and wounded at least 19 in Assam state's tea-growing districts of Tinsukia and Dibrugarh, officials said.

The attacks were the worst violence in the region in years and widely seen as an attempt by the insurgents to boost waning support among the impoverished area's indigenous peoples and to force the government to resume peace talks.

Most of the casualties over the two days were poor, Hindi-speaking migrant workers, said R.N. Mathur, police chief of Assam.

Migrants are frequently attacked by rebels of the United Liberation Front of Asom in an effort to draw national attention to their demands for independence for ethnic Assamese. At least 10,000 people, mostly civilians, have died since the rebellion began in 1979.

The latest violence appeared to have done that. The federal Home Ministry called a high-level meeting in New Delhi, the capital, Saturday, and the country's junior home minister, Sriprakash Jaiswal, planned to visit Assam on Sunday.

But officials insisted the government would not be forced back to the negotiating table.

The deadliest incident was the slaying of 13 workers while they slept before dawn Saturday in Sadiya, a town 370 miles east of Assam's capital, Gauhati, local administrative officer Absar Hazarika said.

Mathur said 35 workers died Friday in a series of attacks in Tinsukia and Dibrugarh. Those districts remain insurgent strongholds despite a decrease in popular support for the rebels the last few years as violence killed locals and migrants alike.

Also on Saturday, a land mine killed five policemen and three government officials returning from supervising a local election in Assam's Karbi Anglong district. Police did not immediately lay blame for the attack.

A bomb also exploded on an express train running from New Delhi to Dibrugarh without causing any injuries, but officials said they were not sure if rebels were involved.

The United Liberation Front of Asom did not claim responsibility for any of the attacks, but rebel leaders don't usually comment on such incidents.

The group has stepped up violence since India's government called off a six-week truce in September and resumed military offensives. A second group, the National Democratic Front of Bodoland, is fighting for autonomy for ethnic Bodo, a tiny minority in Assam's 26 million people.

India's entire northeast is very poor with widespread unemployment, and bitterness toward the central government has spawned dozens of extremist groups in Assam and the region's six other states.

The militants say the central government in New Delhi, 1,000 miles to the west, exploits the northeast's natural resources while doing little for its indigenous peoples, most of whom are ethnically closer to Burma and China than to the rest of India.

The violence is an attempt "to cash in on the popular anti-outsider feeling among the masses who are agitated over the fact that up to two million people in Assam are without jobs," said Ajai Sahni, executive director of the Institute for Conflict Management in New Delhi.

Baron Max

You have the answer in your post:
The violence is an attempt "to cash in on the popular anti-outsider feeling among the masses who are agitated over the fact that up to two million people in Assam are without jobs," said Ajai Sahni, executive director of the Institute for Conflict Management in New Delhi.

poverty and unemployment. And they all still have the vote.

You have the answer in your post: poverty and unemployment. And they all still have the vote.

And do you support that revolution, Sam? If not, why is it any different to how you view the Palestinian "revolution" or the Iranian revolution? How can you fully support one "revolution", yet not support another?

Baron Max

And do you support that revolution, Sam? If not, why is it any different to how you view the Palestinian "revolution" or the Iranian revolution? How can you fully support one "revolution", yet not support another?

Baron Max

Hmm lets see

The people in Assam can vote. They can change their government.
Anyone over the age of 21 (including the militants/separatists) can get on a platform and ask people to vote for them. So why are they fighting? Because no one is voting for them. Since 1979.

Hmm lets see

The people in Assam can vote. They can change their government.
Anyone over the age of 21 (including the militants/separatists) can get on a platform and ask people to vote for them. So why they fighting? Because no one is voting for them. Since 1979.

So if a people have a vote in their government, then anyone in that system that takes up arms and begins to kill people because they aren't getting what they want ....then it's not a revolution? It's what, then? Terrorism? Just a bunch of murdering criminals?

I think the Palestinians vote, don't they?

Baron Max

So if a people have a vote in their government, then anyone in that system that takes up arms and begins to kill people because they aren't getting what they want ....then it's not a revolution? It's what, then? Terrorism? Just a bunch of murdering criminals?

I think the Palestinians vote, don't they?

Baron Max

The Palestinians vote for the Israelis?:confused:

And didn't Hamas win?

The Palestinians vote for the Israelis?

Huh?? What the fuck are you talkin' about?

And didn't Hamas win?

No, Hamas didn't win! Hamas only won seats in the congress (or whatever the fuck they call it). And Hamas was also unable to make it work and keep the government intact ...the people were losing essential services, the government couldn't pay for the police and fire and social services, the government was going broke or already is broke!!

And now Abbas is trying to call for a new election to see if that's what the people really want ....a totally disfunctional government under Hamas, or a functioning, viable government under Abbas and his group.

No, Sam, Hamas did not win!

Baron Max

Huh?? What the fuck are you talkin' about? etc


Baron Max

The people of Assam vote for a government representative of their state in the Indian Parliament. Clearly they do not desire the militants. And clearly they are supporting the Indian government.

The Palestinians did not vote for Israel to be established. Nor do they vote for the almost daily incursions they are subjected to.

Anyway, you don't even consider the Palestinians to be a country. So what do elections matter?

...LOL! Sam, you are so fuckin' good at post/forum tactics that there should be a shrine erected in your name!! ..LOL!

I've never seen or heard of anyone so good as side-stepping issues, yet still maintaining a semi-discussion. I still call it "stirring the shit pot", and, Sam, you are good, very good, at stirring the shit pot .....while not answering any-fuckin'-thing brought to your attention!

....LOL!

Baron Max

...LOL! Sam, you are so fuckin' good at post/forum tactics that there should be a shrine erected in your name!! ..LOL!

I've never seen or heard of anyone so good as side-stepping issues, yet still maintaining a semi-discussion. I still call it "stirring the shit pot", and, Sam, you are good, very good, at stirring the shit pot .....while not answering any-fuckin'-thing brought to your attention!

....LOL!

Baron Max

You mean like how you constantly focus your posts on me personally so as to divert attention from the post topics? ;)

And do you support that revolution, Sam? If not, why is it any different to how you view the Palestinian "revolution" or the Iranian revolution? How can you fully support one "revolution", yet not support another?

Baron Maxthe title "revolution" on the dangerous Jihad- caliphate agaainst the entire world is hardly a moderate term.

And the Jews of Iran are still being Persecuted, and Attacked and Killed, yes Sam tell me how well the Jews are treated in Iran, and I will tell you that you Lie.
There is a big difference between what the Moslem say and profess, and the facts, that are the daily life of a Iranian Jewafter all they are "only" infidels under Islamic supremacy.

Yes Sam tell me about the Fatwa, there is what they say and there is what they do, and there is a gulf between those points,


sephardicstudies.org/iran.html

Khomeini protection

Iran's Jewish community is confronted by contradictions. Many of the prayers uttered in synagogue, for instance, refer to the desire to see Jerusalem again. Yet there is no postal service or telephone contact with Israel, and any Iranian who dares travel to Israel faces imprisonment and passport confiscation. ''We are Jews, not Zionists. We are a religious community, not a political one,'' Yashaya said.

Before the revolution, Jews were well-represented among Iran's business elite, holding key posts in the oil industry, banking and law, as well as in the traditional bazaar. The wave of anti-Israeli sentiment that swept Iran during the revolution, as well as large-scale confiscations of private wealth, sent thousands of the more affluent Jews fleeing to the United States or Israel. Those remaining lived in fear of pogroms, or massacres.

But Khomeini met with the Jewish community upon his return from exile in Paris and issued a ''fatwa'' decreeing that the Jews were to be protected. Similar edicts also protect Iran's tiny Christian minority.remember when Islamic cruel Iran republic has arrested the religious non Zionists Jews saying they were "spies"?

remember when Islamic cruel Iran republic has arrested the religious non Zionists Jews saying they were "spies"?

Is that like when the Christian cruel Americans arrested the nonreligious American Japanese saying they were "spies"?:rolleyes:

Sam again no comparison, and has nothing to do with what is going on today, again with the moral relativism, in your world nothing is wrong, and you justify even the Terrorist who use Islam and the Quran to justify they act of terror, you have never truly denounced any Moslem terrorist, you always find something to justify there actions because something else happened decades ago, yes Sam the apologist/terrorist supporter.

Sam again no comparison, and has nothing to do with what is going on today, again with the moral relativism, in your world nothing is wrong, and you justify even the Terrorist who use Islam and the Quran to justify they act of terror, you have never truly denounced any Moslem terrorist, you always find something to justify there actions because something else happened decades ago, yes Sam the apologist/terrorist supporter.

So you supported the incarceration of the Japanese Americans too huh?

Figures.:rolleyes:

Wasn't around to do so, and as for after the fact no I don't, but this has nothing to do with what is going on today except for your using it as a moral relativism, to justify the terrorism of the Jihad terrorist Moslems that you refuse to totally condemn, you always have a way to excuse there behavior, which means in the end you support their cause, and the act that they commit in the name of your precious Allah, Prophet, and Islam.

Wasn't around to do so, and as for after the fact no I don't, but this has nothing to do with what is going on today except for your using it as a moral relativism, to justify the terrorism of the Jihad terrorist Moslems that you refuse to totally condemn, you always have a way to excuse there behavior, which means in the end you support their cause, and the act that they commit in the name of your precious Allah, Prophet, and Islam.

So would you support an incarceration of all Muslim Americans for the War on terror?

So would you support an incarceration of all Muslim Americans for the War on terror?Of course they would. They want an apartheid America complete with Christian White Only rulers and a return to our shameful past. That's what conservatism is about, REverting, REversing and REmoving all social progress.

allah akbar oops, throats cut, thousands dead!

Of course they would. They want an apartheid America complete with Christian White Only rulers and a return to our shameful past. That's what conservatism is about, REverting, REversing and REmoving all social progress.
like Arab world does not have apartheid on all non Muslims or non Arabs (like Kurds, etc.) or on blacks in Sudan (by Arab janjaweeds)?

allah akbar oops, throats cut, thousands dead!In Haifa! In Netanya! In Jerusalem! YES!!!!

like Arab world does not have apartheid on all non Muslims or non Arabs (like Kurds, etc.) or on blacks in Sudan (by Arab janjaweeds)?Get it all out before your pathetic ass is banned again. Poor Kiwi has no friends. So here he is, begging for attention to his lost cause. Poor, pitiful kiwi. :p

like Arab world does not have apartheid on all non Muslims or non Arabs (like Kurds, etc.) or on blacks in Sudan (by Arab janjaweeds)?The only Arab governments I don't support are Jordan, Egypt, Sudan, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and Iran. I don't hate the people, just the governments. As a pro troll you should be better at baiting.

In Haifa! In Netanya! In Jerusalem! YES!!!!aand... everywhere on the planet, Bali Indonesia, Malukku islands, spain, somalia, UK, US, Iraq, S. Arabia, Israel, Lebanon, Southern Thailand, Philippines (abu sayyaf), Jordan, Egypt, Nigeria, Eritrea, Uzbekistan, Russia (by Chechyn Islamists), Pakistam, Afghanistan, India, Kashmir, Swistezerland (good that they caught/stopped before the islamists terrorists went ahead to blow up the UN in Geneva last year), France (1995), Argentina (1994 by Iran), etc.
Where not?

All in the name of religion by radical Muslims, allah akbar oops, throats cut, thousands dead!

Elderly Iranian Jew
Executed For Helping Jews Escape


A 60-year-old Jewish man was hanged in Iran last week, presumably for his assistance to Jews fleeing Iran, Yediot Aharonot reported on June 8, 1998. The man, from the Kathodzada family, was a member of Teheran's Jewish community and was known for assisting Jews in distress.

The man disappeared last month, and his family was notified of his execution by Iranian government officials last week. The authorities failed to give any explanation for the execution.

At least 13 Jews have been executed in Iran since the Islamic revolution 19 years ago, most of them for either religious reasons or their connection to Israel.

aand... everywhere on the planet, Bali Indonesia, Malukku islands, spain, somalia, UK, US, Iraq, S. Arabia, Israel, Lebanon, Southern Thailand, Philippines (abu sayyaf), Jordan, Egypt, Nigeria, Eritrea, Uzbekistan, Russia (by Chechyn Islamists), Pakistam, Afghanistan, India, Kashmir, Swistezerland (good that they caught/stopped before the islamists terrorists went ahead to blow up the UN in Geneva last year), France (1995), Argentina (1994 by Iran), etc.
Where not?

All in the name of religion by radical Muslims, allah akbar oops, throats cut, thousands dead!Let the fires of freedom burn in Israel.

Elderly Iranian Jew
Executed For Helping Jews Escape


A 60-year-old Jewish man was hanged in Iran last week, presumably for his assistance to Jews fleeing Iran, Yediot Aharonot reported on June 8, 1998. The man, from the Kathodzada family, was a member of Teheran's Jewish community and was known for assisting Jews in distress.

The man disappeared last month, and his family was notified of his execution by Iranian government officials last week. The authorities failed to give any explanation for the execution.

At least 13 Jews have been executed in Iran since the Islamic revolution 19 years ago, most of them for either religious reasons or their connection to Israel.Who needs a Kleenex?? I don't!!:D

Elderly Iranian Jew
Executed For Helping Jews Escape


A 60-year-old Jewish man was hanged in Iran last week, presumably for his assistance to Jews fleeing Iran, Yediot Aharonot reported on June 8, 1998. The man, from the Kathodzada family, was a member of Teheran's Jewish community and was known for assisting Jews in distress.

The man disappeared last month, and his family was notified of his execution by Iranian government officials last week. The authorities failed to give any explanation for the execution.

At least 13 Jews have been executed in Iran since the Islamic revolution 19 years ago, most of them for either religious reasons or their connection to Israel.that's so sad

Some hope emerging.
Abbas seems cool.

Abbas seems cool.in what way?

in what way?

Talking to yourself?:D

Since the US/Israel have not approved of the Palestinian democractically elected Hamas government and are summarilty replacing it with a Lite version who will the US replace Iraq's Maliki with? Democracy only works if Jerusalem agrees with the results. And some wonder where all the anger comes from.....

israel gives in too much to arabs that only tries to annhilate it.
and arabs elect "democratically" such genocidal figures just like germans elected hitler.

Sam, do you actually and truly call what's going on with the very few radical, violent Palestinians a "revolution"?

Baron Maxthe palestinian violence is no revolution, just plain oldd crimes.

This is common knowledge but saying jews are arab is a bit of a stretch.like saying muhammad was jewish.

like saying muhammad was jewish.They are both Semetic people's.

Muhammed was jewish?

Muhammed was jewish?An aerospace engineer doesn't know????

The U.S. approved the Hamas Government, it just that we told them if they wanted U.S. aid they had to renounce violence, and stop using that aid to buy weapons over helping the Palestinian People, if you want the money from a hand out you have to dance to the tune of the Hand that holds the money.

An aerospace engineer doesn't know????

Genji you are attacking me here! stop it. Lets do a favor for a favor...take back that report...and I will not report you. :D

Genji you are attacking me here! stop it. Lets do a favor for a favor...take back that report...and I will not report you. :DOnly if I can see you dancing wildly on a bar in a purple thong.

Only if I can see you dancing wildly on a bar in a purple thong.

stop trying to make me gay.

The U.S. approved the Hamas Government, it just that we told them if they wanted U.S. aid they had to renounce violence, and stop using that aid to buy weapons over helping the Palestinian People, if you want the money from a hand out you have to dance to the tune of the Hand that holds the money.No. The Palestinians were basically told to elect a pro-Jew that believes in cutting & running from the fight against illegal occupation, or else. The US finances Israel's bloodthirsty quest for more holy land every year, thousands have died, cities devastated, refugee camps bombed. None of that has stopped US welfare for the zionist expansion.

If you want the money, dance the tune, and the tune is Peace.

Current U.S. Restrictions on Aid to the Palestinians
Direct Assistance to the PA. Since the signing of the Oslo Accord in 1993, the
U.S. government has committed more than $1.8 billion in economic assistance to the
Palestinians. Approximately 80% of U.S. funding for the Palestinians has been channeled
through USAID contractors and 20% through private voluntary organizations (PVOs).
According to annual foreign operations legislation, congressionally approved funds for
the West Bank and Gaza Strip cannot be used for the Palestinian Authority, unless the
President submits a waiver to Congress citing that doing so is in the interest of national
security. To date, the United States has provided direct assistance to the Palestinian
Authority on four occasions. In1993-1994, the United States provided $36 million
through the Holst Fund at the World Bank for direct assistance to the Palestinian
Authority and an additional $5 million in cash and equipment for the Palestinian police.
From 1995-2002, no U.S. assistance went to the Palestinian Authority or any of its
constituent bodies. On July 8, 2003, the United States announced that it would provide
$20 million out of a $50 million FY2003 supplemental appropriations as direct aid to the
PA for infrastructure projects. On December 8, 2004, President Bush again approved $20
million in direct assistance to the PA to pay off overdue Palestinian utility bills to Israeli
companies. Following PA President Mahmoud Abbas’ May 2005 visit to the White
House, President Bush transferred an additional $50 million from unobligated ESF funds
to the Palestinian Authority.

Seem like we are taking care of the Palestinians to, not just Israel. How about that Gengi?

New Appropriations
! Congress appropriated $75 million in Economic Support Funds (ESF) for
USAID’s West Bank and Gaza program in P.L. 108-447, the 2005
Consolidated Appropriations Act. The United States also provides $100
million annually to the United Nations (UNRWA) for Palestinian refugee
camps in the Gaza Strip.
! Congress appropriated $200 million in supplemental ESF in P.L. 109-13,
the FY2005 Iraq supplemental appropriations act.
CRS-3
2 “U.S. Spent $1.9 Million to Aid Fatah in Palestinian Elections, “ New York Times, January 23,
2006.
3 “U.S. Funds Enter Fray In Palestinian Elections,” Washington Post, January 22, 2006.
! In the FY2006 Foreign Operations, Export Financing, and Related
Programs Appropriations Act (P.L. 109-102), Congress has provided
$150 million in ESF for the West Bank and Gaza Strip, which is double
the recent annual amount of economic aid for USAID programs for the
Palestinians.
Reprogramming
! The Bush Administration and USAID reprogrammed an estimated $45-
$75 million in ESF that had been previously designated for a
desalinization plant in Gaza.
Direct Assistance to the PA
! President Bush used the waiver authority granted him by Congress to
provide $50 million in direct assistance to the Palestinian Authority to
rehabilitate roads, water facilities, schools, and health clinics in Gaza to
help ease the transition after the Israeli disengagement. The direct aid
came out of the $75 million ESF appropriation for FY2005.
Non-Lethal Security Assistance
! Of the $200 million in FY2005 supplemental ESF, the United States
designated $2.3 million for non-lethal assistance to security forces under
the command of the PA Interior Ministry. This equipment included
vehicles, riot gear, and basic provisions. All items were cleared through
Israeli Customs and were coordinated by the U.S. Security Coordinator
for the Palestinians and USAID.

I bet it was the news of US funds that lost Fatah the elections.

why should US give money to the palestinians, that don't behave?