http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2005/04/05/military/4405195503.txt


Marine reunited with dog he rescued in Iraq

By: CANDICE REED - For the North County Times

RANCHO SANTA FE ---- He was just a small, homeless pup that brought smiles to Marines at Camp Fallujah in Iraq as he stumbled around with his four oversized paws and silly doggy grin.
On Monday, the dog known now as "Lava" was reunited at the Helen Woodward Animal Center in Rancho Santa Fe with one of his rescuers, Lt. Col. Jay Kopelman, a U.S. Marine reservist with the Camp Pendleton-based 1st Marine Expeditionary Force.

"His name should probably be changed from Lava to Lucky because if you go from Fallujah to Rancho Santa Fe you're a pretty lucky dog,"

***********

With the daily reports of dogs & cats & animals being maimed & killed in the daily bombs there its always nice to hear of animals being rescued.

i heard there was a un-armed cat injured in one of todays many explosions, does anyone know if it survived?

Are there animal hospitals in Iraq?

Or are they being flown air vac to american or uk animal hospital?

How about bullet proof vests for iraqs animals?

Are there blood banks for animals there?

Can i or we donate blood?

http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2005/04/05/military/4405195503.txt


Marine reunited with dog he rescued in Iraq

By: CANDICE REED - For the North County Times

RANCHO SANTA FE ---- He was just a small, homeless pup that brought smiles to Marines at Camp Fallujah in Iraq as he stumbled around with his four oversized paws and silly doggy grin.
On Monday, the dog known now as "Lava" was reunited at the Helen Woodward Animal Center in Rancho Santa Fe with one of his rescuers, Lt. Col. Jay Kopelman, a U.S. Marine reservist with the Camp Pendleton-based 1st Marine Expeditionary Force.

"His name should probably be changed from Lava to Lucky because if you go from Fallujah to Rancho Santa Fe you're a pretty lucky dog,"

***********

With the daily reports of dogs & cats & animals being maimed & killed in the daily bombs there its always nice to hear of animals being rescued.

i heard there was a un-armed cat injured in one of todays many explosions, does anyone know if it survived?

Are there animal hospitals in Iraq?

Or are they being flown air vac to american or uk animal hospital?

How about bullet proof vests for iraqs animals?

Are there blood banks for animals there?

Can i or we donate blood?


you undermine that we are all humans and that these wars will not separate us species' wise. So donate blood to humans...not other species.

you undermine that we are all humans and that these wars will not separate us species' wise. So donate blood to humans...not other species.

I see so animals dont count?

Do you know how many animals have been killed since this war?

I am sick of hearing of animals killed in the daily explosions there, who speaks for them?

How about a united nations for animals, & animal refugee camps set up in iraq & afghan.

I see so animals dont count?

Do you know how many animals have been killed since this war?

I am sick of hearing of animals killed in the daily explosions there, who speaks for them?

How about a united nations for animals, & animal refugee camps set up in iraq & afghan.

I dont care how many animals have died. I care for humans and humans alone...and only than do I care of other species. Priorities here.

I dont care how many animals have died. I care for humans and humans alone...and only than do I care of other species. Priorities here.

It seems to me you are playing god here, who are you to say humans are the devine species to cared for, breast feeded & nappy changed.

It seems to me as one of your priority species a humanbeing, that the only thing worth saving in iraq now are other species, not human ones, most of us have given up on them long ago, i dont know any dogs that strap dynamite to themselves & kill dozens of other dogs for fun do you?

So who are the most intelligent species in Iraq?

Are animals killing hundreds of eachother every day, no they are not, i dont know about you but i am totally numb too the daily human body count in iraq, where all past the point of being startled by 100 blown up in a market in iraq today, its like snoozeeeeeeeeeeeeeee, flick the channel & find something a bit more interesting than this daily carnage.

I thought the whole point of terroism was shock, & headlines,
I ask you dragon do you ever look at a newspaper & bother to read about the 30 or 70 killed today in iraq, or would you be more interested in reading about a panda giving birth in a iraq zoo today.

If CNN ran 2 stories today, one about the 30 killed in todays exposion, & the other about a pand giving birth in a iraq zoo, guess how many hits the panda would get compared to the human death link, my guess is a million more, easily.

Human blood cannot be transfused to any other species.

We get so inured to violence against humans. Deep down inside, even the best of us has a little voice saying, "But those are probably the bad guys. They deserve it at least a little bit." Or, "Those are our soldiers. They knew the risk when they signed up."

When we see an animal caught up in it, and we know there is absolutely no way that animal bears any blame for what's going on, it shocks us back to our civilized selves and we realize that the use of deadly force is always wrong among people who call themselves "civilized."

Yes, we cry for the dog because we have had a special relationship with dogs for 15,000 years and most of them treat us better than we treat each other.

But it is really ourselves whom we cry for. The suffering dog reminds us that we did this and we are so ashamed. There has been a local breakdown of civilization.

Those are tears of shame, not just grief.

End the War in Iraq! Put a dog on every street corner!

:p

- N

I think you could end a lot of violence in the inner cities if those kids could grow up with dogs like normal children do. Dogs help socialize us better. They teach us that there is such a thing as lifelong unconditional love. They see right through our bullshit and they love us anyway.

It's no coincidence that the lunatic fringe of sociopathic fundamentalist Muslims don't allow their children to have dogs.

I think you could end a lot of violence in the inner cities if those kids could grow up with dogs like normal children do.

The reason there ain't no dogs in the inner cities ghettos is that the little bastards use them for target practice! ...and the parents do nothing about it or try to stop them!

They see right through our bullshit and they love us anyway.

Hard to see through eyes that have been shot out by kids with automatic weapons!

It's no coincidence that the lunatic fringe of sociopathic fundamentalist Muslims don't allow their children to have dogs.

Apparently, once in a goon's age, you actually say something that I agree with. I'm amazed each time, but nonetheless......

Baron Max

It's no coincidence that the lunatic fringe of sociopathic fundamentalist Muslims don't allow their children to have dogs.

Quite right. Everyone knows how the presence of dogs turned Englishmen into peace loving colonials who peacefully starved and divided many nations. Not to mention the peace loving policies of the animal loving US which transformed the world into a democratic haven.

Quite obvious, the connection there.

Or in other words: it is a coincidence. I'm glad someone finally pointed that out.

Englishmen basically invented sportsmanship, chivalry, general gentlemenly conduct, etc.
The whole concept of being patient and generous with lower classes, holding these kinds of values in high esteem.

Whether or not they perfectly upheld these ideals consistently or forwarded them to the natives of far away lands is neither here nor there, this is the culture that arose, they wanted to, they found the value in these values and put them on a pedestal.
Which is more than anyone else can say.

And it just so happens dogs did have alot to do with it. Sportsmanship arose from hunting and bloodsports which involved dogs.
The emphasis on the importance of fairness came from watching less than fair contests and finding them unpleasant and adapting them to be more aesthetically pleasing by being fairer.
The "underdog" became an icon of admiration, and was embodied with the 30 lbs bulldogs taking on the 2000 lbs bulls.
Originally the bull catching dogs were large and powerful for practical bullcatching ability.
But with the sport of bullbaiting a smaller dog was favoured to get kicked around and beaten down and flung off but be resilient and determined to succeed against the odds.

Of course the lower class lacked the sense of sportsmanship and bastardised the bullbaiting concept, engaged in their own shoddy versions in back alleys where the whole point was torturing a bull and not witnessing a dramatic contest where dogs might succeed against the odds.
But the english culture initially came up with an activity where the whole point was fairness, or even giving the edge to the adversary so that they can succeed against the odds as opposed to in accordance with them.

By our standards today even the noble sportsmanlike version was just unbridled cruelty and brutality, but our standards stem from the ideals incorporated into bloodsports and fieldsports involving dogs competing with other animals in combat/the chase/etc and going to great lengths to make it "sporting" and fair.
Before that the idea of caring how unfair it was for an animal in whatever was absurd.

Same thing with spain and bullfighting. We see it as a dickhead killing a bull unnecessarrily.
But to them bull's get killed anyway, the point here is the bull get's a fair chance to fight for it's life.
Our thinking a guy with a sword stabbing a bull is unfair stems from these guys with swords thinking it's unfair bulls don't get a chance to fight for their lives.

And spanish bullfighting also originates from spanish alano(dog) vs bull contests, which stemmed from the dogs needing to catch the bulls for butchers.

So, in other words, no coincidence.
Dogs brought out these bizarre human concepts of fairness, and ultimately caring about rivals and adversaries and prey and etc.

Too bad they never saw the people in their colonies on the same terms.

The "its not cricket" seemed rather limited to the "old boys" and "hunting with the hounds" never seemed very fair to the fox.

Some tried to uphold the ideal, and cursed the unfair treatment of natives in their colonies. But these were large groups of people, which were at their essence still humans despite the upper class trying to be something more.
And humans are cruel and greedy and selfish.

What's hilarious and ridiculous is the idea that if other groups of people had the capacity to travel and colonise far away nations, that they would have conducted themselves in a more ethical manner.
It would have been purely hostile savage take overs, amongst the british there was an element trying to do things in a gentlemenly fair way.
You wouldn't have got this from any other group of people.
They were just overshadowed by the many who either never genuinely were swayed by the cultural more's, or regressed to savage behaviour when confronted with wide open free wild lands.
Any other nation would have been unashamedly all out savage from the get go.

You're here all aware of the injustices and caring of the unfairness and poor treatment only because you've been influenced by the british culture which came up with giving a shit about any of this stuff.

You're here all aware of the injustices and caring of the unfairness and poor treatment only because you've been influenced by the british culture which came up with giving a shit about any of this stuff.


Yeah right we grew up learning about how wonderful the British sense of fairness, and how it advanced and enhanced our country and civilisation.:rolleyes:

Yeah right we grew up learning about how wonderful the British sense of fairness, and how it advanced and enhanced our country and civilisation.
Oh I'm sure you learned the opposite to a degree which would insult the intelligence of a rational person, it's quite evident in your posts.
But the british had already had their effect on your culture, and you ironically criticised them with their eyes.
And the british culture has had a massive effect on this "global culture" you are tapped into via the internet and other media sources.

Oh I'm sure you learned the opposite to a degree which would insult the intelligence of a rational person, it's quite evident in your posts.


Yeah their legacy is still evident.

British colonial policy was always driven to a large extent by Britain's trading interests. While settler economies developed the infrastructure to support balanced development, some tropical African territories found themselves developed only as raw-material suppliers. British policies based on comparative advantage left many developing economies dangerously reliant on a single cash crop, which others exported to Britain or to overseas British settlements. A reliance upon the manipulation of conflict between ethnic, religious and racial identities, in order to keep subject populations from uniting against the occupying power — the classic "divide and rule" strategy — left a legacy of partition and/or inter-communal difficulties in areas as diverse as Ireland, India, Zimbabwe, Cyprus, Sudan, and Uganda.

Sound familiar?

But the british had already had their effect on your culture, and you ironically criticised them with their eyes.
And the british culture has had a massive effect on this "global culture" you are tapped into via the internet and other media sources.

How incredibly presumptuous of you.
The British stripped the cultures they invaded, many of which were light years ahead in understanding social dynamics. An ability to kill more people has never been a hallmark of civilisation. Its what comes after that counts. I suggest you remove the blinkers.

and "hunting with the hounds" never seemed very fair to the fox.
Not never, just now.
Well it was compared to the chinese equivalent which was trapping a fox.
It was a sporting contest where the fox had a very real chance of escape, and it did escape alot of the time, and it was designed to be this way on purpose purely for the fox's sake.
It was revolutionary stuff at the time.
No other nations could understand the trouble they were going to to catch a fox when they could just trap it.
They also didn't understand fishing all day with one hook when you could net across a stream and catch everything, etc.
The english decided there was a certain beauty in a fair contest, they didn't revel in assured success but rather defying the good chance of failure.
And were often just as glad to see that the fox or whatever escaped.
It was still a productive day of good sport, where a chinese man would just be irate with a fox's escape, and would have done anything to make sure he got it.

Fox hunting is relatively recent anyway, and is actually a bastard off shoot of hunting stags which was more sporting and fair.

Not never, just now.
Well it was compared to the chinese equivalent which was trapping a fox.
It was a sporting contest where the fox had a very real chance of escape, and it did escape alot of the time, and it was designed to be this way on purpose purely for the fox's sake.
It was revolutionary stuff at the time.
No other nations could understand the trouble they were going to to catch a fox when they could just trap it.
They also didn't understand fishing all day with one hook when you could net across a stream and catch everything, etc.
The english decided there was a certain beauty in a fair contest, they didn't revel in assured success but rather defying the good chance of failure.
And were often just as glad to see that the fox or whatever escaped.
It was still a productive day of good sport, where a chinese man would just be irate with a fox's escape, and would have done anything to make sure he got it.

Fox hunting is relatively recent anyway, and is actually a bastard off shoot of hunting stags which was more sporting and fair.

Must be nice to have the rosy views.

Unfortunately 200 years of a history of colonial oppression tend to give one a different view of all the sport and fairness.

Yeah their legacy is still evident.
Indeed, like cricket, the one shining beacon of hope for your nation's youth.

And if you hosed an indian "city" with soapy water some remnants of civilisation would emerge amongst the filthy rubble, as fleeting vestiges of britain's rule.
Or "the good old days", as indians should call them.

Now they're back to knocking bear cubs' teeth out with rocks and putting ropes through their noses which they can tug on to make them bellow and dance in pain.
Thumbs up india for returning to your roots.

Unfortunately 200 years of a history of colonial oppression tend to give one a different view of all the sport and fairness.
Your beef is with their capability. You can only be annoyed that they developed such resourcefullness, inventiveness and intelligence.
You're perceiving advanced cruel tendencies only because they were dominant enough to subject other people to their courteous brand of mild cruelty.
It could have been much worse, and would have been if any other population had those capabilities.

The first wave of crusaders, they were cruel, that was back when the british were pretty much just like everyone else. Even then the ideals were budding, but few had incorporated them into their lives, and the crusaders were violent ruthless savages.
Much like arabs today.

Indeed, like cricket, the one shining beacon of hope for your nation's youth.

And if you hosed an indian "city" with soapy water some remnants of civilisation would emerge amongst the filthy rubble, as fleeting vestiges of britain's rule.
Or "the good old days", as indians should call them.

Now they're back to knocking bear cubs' teeth out with rocks and putting ropes through their noses which they can tug on to make them bellow and dance in pain.
Thumbs up india for returning to your roots.


Your beef is with their capability. You can only be annoyed that they developed such resourcefullness, inventiveness and intelligence.
You're perceiving advanced cruel tendencies only because they were dominant enough to subject other people to their courteous brand of mild cruelty.
It could have been much worse, and would have been if any other population had those capabilities.

The first wave of crusaders, they were cruel, that was back when the british were pretty much just like everyone else. Even then the ideals were budding, but few had incorporated them into their lives, and the crusaders were violent ruthless savages.
Much like arabs today.

Yes, its nice to see how far we developed under British rule, from a rich country with a rich history to a poor third world nation with disease and illiteracy, divided into 3 pieces over religion.

Sport and fair play.

Yes, its nice to see how far we developed under British rule, from a rich country with a rich history to a poor third world nation with disease and illiteracy, divided into 3 pieces over religion.

Sounds just like a Muslim to say something like that ....blaming someone else for all of their problems.

How many times do you hear any white nations blaming others for their problems? Nope, that's a non-white thing to do ...ditto for non-christians, particularly Muslims!

By the way, Sam, you should try to be more unbiased in your praises of ancient India ...before the British came, India wasn't even India ...it was collection of distinct groups of people ....mostly who fought amongst themselves at every opportunity. Rich history? Over the entire sub-continent? Or just one little tiny place that you prefer to look at???

But ...if you have some good reading material about this wonderous, peaceful, special place in ancient history called "India", I'd love to read it.

Baron Max

Sounds just like a Muslim to say something like that ....blaming someone else for all of their problems.

How many times do you hear any white nations blaming others for their problems? Nope, that's a non-white thing to do ...ditto for non-christians, particularly Muslims!

War on terrrrrrooorrrrrr ring a bell?

By the way, Sam, you should try to be more unbiased in your praises of ancient India ...before the British came, India wasn't even India ...it was collection of distinct groups of people ....mostly who fought amongst themselves at every opportunity. Rich history? Over the entire sub-continent? Or just one little tiny place that you prefer to look at???

But ...if you have some good reading material about this wonderous, peaceful, special place in ancient history called "India", I'd love to read it.

Baron Max

Now isn't that sweet?

You could start with The Discovery of India (http://www.amazon.com/Discovery-India-Jawaharlal-Nehru/dp/0195623592)by Jawaharlal Nehru, go on to An Argumentative Indian (http://www.amazon.com/Argumentative-Indian-Writings-History-Identity/dp/0374105839) by Amartya Sen. Then let me know if there is any specific period you have more interest in.

It's no coincidence that the lunatic fringe of sociopathic fundamentalist Muslims don't allow their children to have dogs.

Yeah, and in, I think it was Minnesota or somewhere, the Muslim cab drivers won't let seeing-eye dogs or other disability dogs into their cab because their saliva is supposedly unclean. Hell, when I have a wound, the first thing I'd like is a dog to lick it clean, heh.

- N

War on terrrrrrooorrrrrr ring a bell?

9/11 ring any bells with you, Sam?

As for your suggestions on the history of India, I was hoping for something that might be less biased .....know what I mean? I know of lots of books that can sing the praises of the USA - but do you read those?? If you do, you sure ain't learned much from them!

I've also discovered something about India ....y'all are seemingly afraid to let any news out of India to the rest of the world (other than good stuff!). Why is that? And why, when I type in "India - racial conflicts" into google, I only get outsider reports, nothing from Indian sources?? Does India control it's news media and keep the lids on such happening in India?

Baron Max

9/11 ring any bells with you, Sam?

As for your suggestions on the history of India, I was hoping for something that might be less biased .....know what I mean? I know of lots of books that can sing the praises of the USA - but do you read those?? If you do, you sure ain't learned much from them!

I've also discovered something about India ....y'all are seemingly afraid to let any news out of India to the rest of the world (other than good stuff!). Why is that? And why, when I type in "India - racial conflicts" into google, I only get outsider reports, nothing from Indian sources?? Does India control it's news media and keep the lids on such happening in India?

Baron Max

Well in that case you'd have to ask an unbiased person.

As for the googling, quite possibly because we don't have the concept of race in India. The social stratification is based on caste (varna). Try those.

Yeah, and in, I think it was Minnesota or somewhere, the Muslim cab drivers won't let seeing-eye dogs or other disability dogs into their cab because their saliva is supposedly unclean. Hell, when I have a wound, the first thing I'd like is a dog to lick it clean, heh.

- N

Its not unusual to find people wary of dogs in countries where healthcare for people is limited let alone animals.

Most people in India, for example, are wary of dogs because they have seen/know of people bitten by rabid animals and dying painful deaths.

Stray dogs in Mumbai, for example, are routinely put to sleep for reasons of hygiene and safety.

As for the googling, quite possibly because we don't have the concept of race in India. The social stratification is based on caste (varna). Try those.

No, not just that, Sam .....there don't seem to be ANY fuckin' news about India on the Internet. There's some papers written, for example, or articles of special interest, but there ain't no up-to-date news items. In the USA, when someone sneezes, there's a news report about it .....in India, they could kill thousands of people and there ain't no report for months, if at all.

Baron Max

Stray dogs in Mumbai, for example, are routinely put to sleep for reasons of hygiene and safety.

Aww, jesus!! And the world animal rights organizations ain't crying foul to the heavens????

And how can you call yourselves civilized if you go around killing dogs?

Baron Max

No, not just that, Sam .....there don't seem to be ANY fuckin' news about India on the Internet. There's some papers written, for example, or articles of special interest, but there ain't no up-to-date news items. In the USA, when someone sneezes, there's a news report about it .....in India, they could kill thousands of people and there ain't no report for months, if at all.

Baron Max

Well I read news about India everyday, so I don't see what you mean.

Any specific incident in mind?

Well I read news about India everyday, so I don't see what you mean.

Any specific incident in mind?

No, Sam ....I want to read the Indian news every day, too. Where is it? And is it written in English or translated to English somewhere on the net? For once, you could actually provide me a link that's useful .....yet you didn't.

Baron Max

No, Sam ....I want to read the Indian news every day, too. Where is it? And is it written in English or translated to English somewhere on the net? For once, you could actually provide me a link that's useful .....yet you didn't.

Baron Max

I read the papers in the library,

but you can try http://news.google.co.in/

I haven't used it yet, but hey, its google.

I read the papers in the library,

but you can try http://news.google.co.in/

I haven't used it yet, but hey, its google.

That site has ONLY world news, Sam, not news about India. Surely there's some link to Indian news papers that's in English, ain't there?

Baron Max

That site has ONLY world news, Sam, not news about India. Surely there's some link to Indian news papers that's in English, ain't there?

Baron Max

Umm if you look at the site you can see news about India.

Newspapers online (but I doubt they'll be as detailed as the print versions)
http://www.google.com/search?q=india%2Bnewspapers&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a