How is this possible? Is it because they aren't mammals??



Italian wall lizards (http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2008/04/080421-lizard-evolution.html) introduced to a tiny island off the coast of Croatia are evolving in ways that would normally take millions of years to play out, new research shows.

In just a few decades the 5-inch-long (13-centimeter-long) lizards have developed a completely new gut structure, larger heads, and a harder bite, researchers say. :eek:

In 1971, scientists transplanted five adult pairs of the reptiles from their original island home in Pod Kopiste to the tiny neighboring island of Pod Mrcaru, both in the south Adriatic Sea.

Genetic testing on the Pod Mrcaru lizards confirmed that the modern population of more than 5,000 Italian wall lizards are all descendants of the original ten lizards left behind in the 1970s.

While the experiment was more than 30 years in the making, it was not by design, according to Duncan Irschick, a study author and biology professor at the University of Massachusetts, Amherst.

After scientists transplanted the reptiles, the Croatian War of Independence erupted, ending in the mid-1990s. The researchers couldn't get back to island because of the war, Irschick said.

In 2004, however, tourism began to open back up, allowing researchers access to the island laboratory.

"We didn't know if we would find a lizard there. We had no idea if the original introductions were successful," Irschick said.

What they found, however, was shocking.....

They're small with very very short lifespans? Or maybe they have some type of virus that causes rapid mutation? Also doesn't the climate effect the development of reptile eggs?

so why them and not other reptiles worldwide? I see more and more people with pet lizards and they aren't native to the US. Climate change should affect them as well.

Perhaps it is not only the climate but chemicals in the water and air there.

but a whole new gut structure that works? People are having 2 faced and 8 limbed babies. These lizards aren't deformed, they are changing. Changes that work.

how about changes in their diet? being that they are not native to the area...

Their changes might alsoi be due in part to a starting population of 10 and lots of inbreeding.

yeah but dont you think that inbreeding would have the opposite effect and exacerbate weaknesses. I know that when fish inbreed while introduced into a closed system they get weaker and have shorter\truncated life spans etc.

so why them and not other reptiles worldwide? I see more and more people with pet lizards and they aren't native to the US. Climate change should affect them as well.

Often the pets that people get are put in environments that mimic their own.

Often the pets that people get are put in environments that mimic their own.

yes because the natural habitat of the nile monitor is suburbia

The lizards have not necessarily evolved (yet). The two populations are genetically indistinguishable from each other so far, according to the researchers. If so, the changes are expression of phenotypic plasticity, already part of the previously evolved, genetically established capability of the lizards.

Such changes would be reversible, and either population would eventually produce the other in the other's circumstances.

That situation does enable evolutionary change - the lizards have used up some of their range of adjustment, and this is a handicap for at least one of the populations (probably the new one). Genetic changes that move that range would be an advantage in selection - the stage is set for evolutionary change that imitates the phenotypic adjustment. (The Baldwin Effect)

so if the lizards went back to where they came from, they would de-evolve?

so if the lizards went back to where they came from, they would de-evolve? Unless their genome has been changed by selection upon mutation or other genetic rearrangement, yes.

That hasn't been determined yet - so far, from the data presented, they are genetically identical with the founding population, and no actual Darwinian evolution has occurred. But it is possible that we are looking at a mixture of phenotypic response and a mutation or two - or even something more complicated yet, such as an atavistic mutation reactivating or deactivating a stretch of the genome, that is common at a certain weak spot (like color blindness in humans, teeth in chickens, etc), followed by phenotypic response of the inherited variety, etc etc.

If there's no actual Darwinian evolution involved, and the whole thing is completely reversible, reversal might still take many years. There are known Lamarckian mechanisms (methylation of sequences of codons, etc) that modify the expression of a given genome, and are inherited. They are all reversible AFAIK, but it can take a few generations.

And interesting discovery.
One that christian "scientists" are sure to overlook no doubt.

Their changes might alsoi be due in part to a starting population of 10 and lots of inbreeding.

Exactly what I thought. They got lucky probably.

so if the lizards went back to where they came from, they would de-evolve?

Not necessarily. Besides, their genes would be absorbed right back into the existing genepool. Only if their genetic make-up also poses a benefit in the new environment they may survive.

The fact that an existing animal can become modified has been seen so many times before.

so if the lizards went back to where they came from, they would de-evolve?

Devolve is not the right way to look at it. Would they become similar to what they were before? YES, well probably because some physical adaptations may in fact remain but are beyond the scope of this thread. The reason is their diet and some other factors but this does show that the ability to change with their diet does show good design and adaptability which is inherent in living creatures.

Also, remember that lizards are cold blooded so their adaptability is different than warm blooded creatures.

Oh yeah, essentially one can conclude that these changes which took place were already built into the lizard because they can adapt to either a diet of insects or one consisting of leafy vegetables. So really nothing changed only what was borne out of them heretofore.

How is this possible? Is it because they aren't mammals??



Italian wall lizards (http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2008/04/080421-lizard-evolution.html) introduced to a tiny island off the coast of Croatia are evolving in ways that would normally take millions of years to play out, new research shows.

In just a few decades the 5-inch-long (13-centimeter-long) lizards have developed a completely new gut structure, larger heads, and a harder bite, researchers say. :eek:

In 1971, scientists transplanted five adult pairs of the reptiles from their original island home in Pod Kopiste to the tiny neighboring island of Pod Mrcaru, both in the south Adriatic Sea.

Genetic testing on the Pod Mrcaru lizards confirmed that the modern population of more than 5,000 Italian wall lizards are all descendants of the original ten lizards left behind in the 1970s.

While the experiment was more than 30 years in the making, it was not by design, according to Duncan Irschick, a study author and biology professor at the University of Massachusetts, Amherst.

After scientists transplanted the reptiles, the Croatian War of Independence erupted, ending in the mid-1990s. The researchers couldn't get back to island because of the war, Irschick said.

In 2004, however, tourism began to open back up, allowing researchers access to the island laboratory.

"We didn't know if we would find a lizard there. We had no idea if the original introductions were successful," Irschick said.

What they found, however, was shocking.....
Easy - simplicity. The same principle apply to everything. For instance, businesses. A large business will take a much longer time to change then a small one, primarily due to complexities (and size). :shrug:

I have a scientific question about this: how come when Orleander posts this, everyone chimes in, but when Geoff posts the same bloody article everyone ho-hums and wanders off to the Cesspool for a dip?

Fickle sods.

:mad:

I have a scientific question about this: how come when Orleander posts this, everyone chimes in, but when Geoff posts the same bloody article everyone ho-hums and wanders off to the Cesspool for a dip?

Fickle sods.

:mad:

Where did you post it?

Over in Bio & Genetics.

Hmm. Might explain the innate flight response.

The title was something like "Microevolution of the Edsel"

Marketing.

Easy - simplicity. The same principle apply to everything. For instance, businesses. A large business will take a much longer time to change then a small one, primarily due to complexities (and size). :shrug:

Thats like the worst answer evah.

The title was something like "Microevolution of the Edsel"

Marketing.

Philistines.