TIMBUKTU, Mali (Reuters) - Researchers in Timbuktu are fighting to preserve tens of thousands of ancient texts which they say prove Africa had a written history at least as old as the European Renaissance.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20061110/sc_nm/mali_manuscripts_dc



Private and public libraries in the fabled Saharan town in Mali have already collected 150,000 brittle manuscripts, some of them from the 13th century, and local historians believe many more lie buried under the sand.

The texts were stashed under mud homes and in desert caves by proud Malian families whose successive generations feared they would be stolen by Moroccan invaders, European explorers and then French colonialists.

Written in ornate calligraphy, some were used to teach astrology or mathematics, while others tell tales of social and business life in Timbuktu during its "Golden Age," when it was a seat of learning in the 16th century.

"These manuscripts are about all the fields of human knowledge: law, the sciences, medicine," said Galla Dicko, director of the Ahmed Baba Institute, a library housing 25,000 of the texts.

"Here is a political tract," he said, pointing to a script in a glass cabinet, somewhat dog-eared and chewed by termites. "A letter on good governance, a warning to intellectuals not to be corrupted by the power of politicians."

Bookshelves on the wall behind him contain a volume on maths and a guide to Andalusian music as well as love stories and correspondence between traders plying the trans-Saharan caravan routes.

Timbuktu's leading families have only recently started to give up what they see as ancestral heirlooms. They are being persuaded by local officials that the manuscripts should be part of the community's shared culture.

"It is through these writings that we can really know our place in history," said Abdramane Ben Essayouti, Imam of Timbuktu's oldest mosque, Djingarei-ber, built from mud bricks and wood in 1325.

HEAT, DUST AND TERMITES

Experts believe the 150,000 texts collected so far are just a fraction of what lies hidden under centuries of dust behind the ornate wooden doors of Timbuktu's mud-brick homes.

"This is just 10 percent of what we have. We think we have more than a million buried here," said Ali Ould Sidi, a government official responsible for managing the town's World Heritage Sites.

Some academics say the texts will force the West to accept Africa has an intellectual history as old as its own. Others draw comparisons with the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls.

But as the fame of the manuscripts spreads, conservationists fear those that have survived centuries of termites and extreme heat will be sold to tourists at extortionate prices or illegally trafficked out of the country.

South Africa is spearheading "Operation Timbuktu" to protect the texts, funding a new library for the Ahmed Baba Institute, named after a Timbuktu-born contemporary of William Shakespeare.

The United States and Norway are helping with the preservation of the manuscripts, which South African President Thabo Mbeki has said will "restore the self respect, the pride, honor and dignity of the people of Africa."

The people of Timbuktu, whose universities were attended by 25,000 scholars in the 16th century but whose languid pace of life has been left behind by modernity, have similar hopes.

"The nations formed a single line and Timbuktu was at the head. But one day, God did an about-turn and Timbuktu found itself at the back," a local proverb goes.

"Perhaps one day God will do another about-turn so that Timbuktu can retake its rightful place," it adds.

Amazing what kind of lies you'll believe to support your insane liberal ideology that blacks are somehow "equal" to whites. ;)

I'm really disappointed in the quality of the reporting. Will someone please tell me what language these texts are written in? I would assume Arabic, from the background implication that the country had already fallen to Islam.

It was written in Arabic. The Sword of Islam Invaded the south around 640 AD. Before then the written lanaguage was Meroitic & Ge'ez.

It was written in Arabic. The Sword of Islam Invaded the south around 640 AD. Before then the written lanaguage was Meroitic & Ge'ez.Meroitic and Ge'ez appear to be languages of northeastern Africa. Ge'ez is even Semitic. Did the educated people of ancient Mali actually learn these languages and do all their writing in them, rather than adapting the alphabets to their native language?

I suppose this is no different from the habit the Europeans had for a long time of writing only in Latin. But this can be traced to their status as former Roman colonies in which all formal education was performed in the language of the conquerors. Did an Ethiopian empire extend all the way to Mali?

The West has had a written history for 2,500 years. Eurasia as a whole for 5,000. Call me when you can develop an African civilization without the help of the Arabs.

Meroitic and Ge'ez appear to be languages of northeastern Africa. Ge'ez is even Semitic. Did the educated people of ancient Mali actually learn these languages and do all their writing in them, rather than adapting the alphabets to their native language?

I suppose this is no different from the habit the Europeans had for a long time of writing only in Latin. But this can be traced to their status as former Roman colonies in which all formal education was performed in the language of the conquerors. Did an Ethiopian empire extend all the way to Mali?

"Grimaldi Man", look it up, and tell me what you find.

The West has had a written history for 2,500 years. Eurasia as a whole for 5,000. Call me when you can develop an African civilization without the help of the Arabs.

The Grimaldi were there in the southern tip of Africa, and traveled up the entire western coast, then came to the northwestern coast of Africa, and crossed into Spain. Not only in Spain, but all the way up to Austria; it was found that the Grimaldi had traveled and left their drawings in caves all along the way. In the Museum of Natural History, New York City, New York, you can see Grimaldi paintings going back to at least 35,000 years ago.

http://www.nbufront.org/html/MastersMuseums/DocBen/SpreadOfAfricanCulture.html

Sorry you're wrong again, African civilization predates the Arabs and Europeans by 30,000 years. Good try though, are you ready to cry yet? Because your crutch of superiority due to pigmenation defficientcy has crumbled.

Wow....writing in the 1500s. Now there's an achievement. Ganymede, you are pathetic.

The Grimaldi were there in the southern tip of Africa, and traveled up the entire western coast, then came to the northwestern coast of Africa, and crossed into Spain. Not only in Spain, but all the way up to Austria; it was found that the Grimaldi had traveled and left their drawings in caves all along the way. In the Museum of Natural History, New York City, New York, you can see Grimaldi paintings going back to at least 35,000 years ago.

http://www.nbufront.org/html/MastersMuseums/DocBen/SpreadOfAfricanCulture.html

Sorry you're wrong again, African civilization predates the Arabs and Europeans by 30,000 years. Good try though, are you ready to cry yet? Because your crutch of superiority due to pigmenation defficientcy has crumbled.I think we have a misunderstanding of the definition of the word "civilization." It means "the building of cities." The essence of the transition from the Neolithic era to the Age of Civilization was our need to overcome our pack-social instincts. They motivate us to regard anyone whom we aren't well acquainted with or related to as a competitor for scarce resources. Cities bring tribes together and require them to live harmoniously and cooperatively with strangers. It was the second Paradigm Shift, after the invention of the technology of agriculture got us to stop living as nomadic hunter-gatherers and settle in permanent tribal villages in the first place.

Cities leave behind vast quantities of sturdy ruins that last for millennia. Urban trash alone leaves evidence that even a first-year archeology student can identify. There are no ruins of 30,000-year-old cities. The oldest city that has been excavated is probably Jericho, which only goes back about 10,000 years. And it was not built by Europeans or Arabs.

Thirty thousand years ago was the Paleolithic Era. Humans had not developed agriculture and therefore had not stopped living migratory lives. They were not living in permanent settlements of any kind, much less cities. Nomadic life severely restricts the development of culture to a very primitive level because everything that people create--tools, clothing, art--has to be carried.

TIMBUKTU, Mali (Reuters) - Researchers in Timbuktu are fighting to preserve tens of thousands of ancient texts which they say prove Africa had a written history at least as old as the European Renaissance.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20061110/sc_nm/mali_manuscripts_dc



Private and public libraries in the fabled Saharan town in Mali have already collected 150,000 brittle manuscripts, some of them from the 13th century, and local historians believe many more lie buried under the sand.

The texts were stashed under mud homes and in desert caves by proud Malian families whose successive generations feared they would be stolen by Moroccan invaders, European explorers and then French colonialists.

Written in ornate calligraphy, some were used to teach astrology or mathematics, while others tell tales of social and business life in Timbuktu during its "Golden Age," when it was a seat of learning in the 16th century.

"These manuscripts are about all the fields of human knowledge: law, the sciences, medicine," said Galla Dicko, director of the Ahmed Baba Institute, a library housing 25,000 of the texts.

"Here is a political tract," he said, pointing to a script in a glass cabinet, somewhat dog-eared and chewed by termites. "A letter on good governance, a warning to intellectuals not to be corrupted by the power of politicians."

Bookshelves on the wall behind him contain a volume on maths and a guide to Andalusian music as well as love stories and correspondence between traders plying the trans-Saharan caravan routes.

Timbuktu's leading families have only recently started to give up what they see as ancestral heirlooms. They are being persuaded by local officials that the manuscripts should be part of the community's shared culture.

"It is through these writings that we can really know our place in history," said Abdramane Ben Essayouti, Imam of Timbuktu's oldest mosque, Djingarei-ber, built from mud bricks and wood in 1325.

HEAT, DUST AND TERMITES

Experts believe the 150,000 texts collected so far are just a fraction of what lies hidden under centuries of dust behind the ornate wooden doors of Timbuktu's mud-brick homes.

"This is just 10 percent of what we have. We think we have more than a million buried here," said Ali Ould Sidi, a government official responsible for managing the town's World Heritage Sites.

Some academics say the texts will force the West to accept Africa has an intellectual history as old as its own. Others draw comparisons with the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls.

But as the fame of the manuscripts spreads, conservationists fear those that have survived centuries of termites and extreme heat will be sold to tourists at extortionate prices or illegally trafficked out of the country.

South Africa is spearheading "Operation Timbuktu" to protect the texts, funding a new library for the Ahmed Baba Institute, named after a Timbuktu-born contemporary of William Shakespeare.

The United States and Norway are helping with the preservation of the manuscripts, which South African President Thabo Mbeki has said will "restore the self respect, the pride, honor and dignity of the people of Africa."

The people of Timbuktu, whose universities were attended by 25,000 scholars in the 16th century but whose languid pace of life has been left behind by modernity, have similar hopes.

"The nations formed a single line and Timbuktu was at the head. But one day, God did an about-turn and Timbuktu found itself at the back," a local proverb goes.

"Perhaps one day God will do another about-turn so that Timbuktu can retake its rightful place," it adds.

I'm not surprised at this. It would take a complete fool to believe that just because a country is organized different that it's somehow inferior.

Africans had text, and math, and civilizations, verbal language was invented in Africa, and the most complex forms of communication verbally are still African languages. Music was also invented there, and used as a form of communication, and to induce trances.

Of course if people were to see this from an outside point of view, they'd see a bunch of savages in trances dancing around doing weird rituals. But how is this any different from how Africans and Native Americans viewed the European war ritual as savage?

Basically all the civilizations have it's brilliance and it's stupidity. No civilization is immune to being savage.

What have white people done recently? More than lying about raping and killing Jonbenet Ramsey?


White people invented the personal computer. Notice I said the personal computer, not the super computer, or the internet.

Some guy from Africa who they call the black bill gates helped invent a super computer. Philip Emeagwali is his name. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philip_Emeagwali

I don't know if he invented the first super computer, but he definately invented internet super computing. The type of computer where hundreds or thousands of computers connect over the internet to cure say, cancer, or to do a big calculation.

Some of his other claims are debateable, as to exactly how big or how small his contribution was, but it seems obviously he did make a contribution to super computing over the internet.

Philip Emeagwali (born 1954) is a Nigerian-born computer scientist/geologist who was one of two winners of the 1989 Gordon Bell Prize, a prize from the IEEE, for his use of the Connection Machine supercomputer to help analyse petroleum fields. He received $1000 US for this award.

He won the prize, for his USE of the connection machine super computer to analyze petroleum fields.

Basically, in every field of study, from math, to science, to language, to neuro-science, every form of technology has an array of different cultures and people working in these industries.

We should give credit to Europeans for inventing the computer, we should give credit to Europeans for inventing programming languages, and the personal computer, but the broader the technology, the more influence it recieves from the global population. Take the internet, it started out just in America, but even the internet was developed by programmers of all races, all genders, in all parts of the world, just observe the open source movement as a perfect example.

Linux was created by everyone. So I'd say, Europeans have mastery over the sciences, above everyone else, but then after it's made, everyone else refines it and improves it. In Japan, they took the science and improved on it, in China they make it cheaper, in India they program everything, and then you have Africans who figure out how to use it analyze petroleum fields, and Americans who will use it to build websites and create entire industries out of that, and so on and so forth.

The idea may originate in the mind of a European, to create the internet for military purposes, but then it's the people who actually build it and make it practical, and extend it into the real world.

Another example is space technology, Europeans built that, and can take credit for going into space and building up the space technology, but the private sector, the space industry, will require the support of minorities, because if you want to make it "cool" to go into space, or actually have reasons to put stuff in space besides military, well you'll need people who can think up how an ordinary person would need satelties in space, cellphones, notice most of the cellphone usage started in urban environments?

What I think will happen in the future is that each group will find it's niche, as th economy grows. When it comes to the city, or urban environments, only people who live there or who know the environment will be able to design products for that environment and then make those products cool. So there will be a huge market due to the fact that there will be a lot of demand for new toys, PDAs and whatever else. I don't think anyone else is focused on design right now besides minorities in the USA, because in China, they build stuff thats cheaper but it's not well designed, it breaks easily, just buy something from Walmart and find out.

In Japan they sell stuff that is refined versions of American inventions. Basically, in order for the economy to grow forever you need endless new ideas, and unlimited forms for products, designs are the ones who create the forms, handle the marketing, and make stuff practical.

If Africa is to have a role I'd predict it would be in the design and marketing industry first, and then eventually develop into the urban niche market, very much like what Japan once did.
The science and technology would still be invented by Europeans, but the products and marketing would be exported to people who know the market and how to make stuff cool and practical.

This is all my opinion here, it could be wrong, but seriously, in America today most people still can't figure out how to use the personal computer, but everyone knows how to use the cellphone.

The Grimaldi were there in the southern tip of Africa, and traveled up the entire western coast, then came to the northwestern coast of Africa, and crossed into Spain. Not only in Spain, but all the way up to Austria; it was found that the Grimaldi had traveled and left their drawings in caves all along the way. In the Museum of Natural History, New York City, New York, you can see Grimaldi paintings going back to at least 35,000 years ago.

http://www.nbufront.org/html/MastersMuseums/DocBen/SpreadOfAfricanCulture.html

Sorry you're wrong again, African civilization predates the Arabs and Europeans by 30,000 years. Good try though, are you ready to cry yet? Because your crutch of superiority due to pigmenation defficientcy has crumbled.
I like this chap.

It wouldn't surprise me much since Egypt is in Africa and borders other countries with populations that are largely black... and if you google for egyptian wall paintings you see mostly black people.

Whats so great about this anyway?

No you don't, Someguy. The majority of Egyptian artwork is of distinctly non-negro character.

Verbal language was invented in AfricaThis alone should confer permanent honor on the Africans. Linguistic analysis using massively parallel computing continues to classify the world's languages into a smaller number of larger families. If the hypothesis is substantiated that there is only one language family, then that means that the technology of spoken language was invented in Africa. Language provides the ability to plan, organize and share information, and might very well be what made it possible to successfully migrate out of Africa in the first place.

So in other words, they did anything they could to get out of that shithole? What's that say for those who remained?

No you don't, Someguy. The majority of Egyptian artwork is of distinctly non-negro character.

http://images.google.nl/images?hl=nl&q=egyptian%20wall%20painting&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wi

google images seems to disagree with you

So in other words, they did anything they could to get out of that shithole? What's that say for those who remained?

My ancestors remained. aha.
it's funny how many africans think europe is a shithole. so it's all relative.

....and yet when we found you you were still stuck 3000 years in the past.

....and yet when we found you you were still stuck 3000 years in the past.

Who's you? You didn't find anything. It's sickening that some White people like you use the achievments of your past ancestors and claim them as your own accomplishments. And this is a myth, that every inhabitant of south africa was an illiterate savage prior to the white mans arrival.

We = white people. In case you hadn't noticed this is spiralling into "us" vs. "them" and if I can't speak for "us" then I'm not sure what's going on any more.

south africa was not the first part that was discovered by the white man.

i don't know you and neither do my ancestors (their souls rest in peace).

what does "we" mean anyways? you and your friends came to Africa? when?

Funny how it's the ones whose ancestors did nothing of any worth who disassociate themselves from their ancestors like that and pounce on those who try to claim their people did something.

We = white people. In case you hadn't noticed this is spiralling into "us" vs. "them" and if I can't speak for "us" then I'm not sure what's going on any more.

south africa was not the first part that was discovered by the white man.

This isn't a "Us" VS "Them" This is about education. And whenever someone provides "facts" that doesn't fit in your racist point of view, you discredit the facts, without providing any of your own besides vile insults. And then turn it into a Black VS White. You, J.B/D-ster/Baron Max are racist pinheads who turn anything positive about a Black person into a negative. Because you define Blacks "only" by their worst examples. While you judge Whites only by their "Best" examples. And that's when you loose all credibility.

This isn't a "Us" VS "Them" This is about education. And whenever someone provides "facts" that doesn't fit in your racist point of view, you discredit the facts, without providing any of your own besides vile insults. And then turn it into a Black VS White. You, J.B/D-ster/Baron Max are racist pinheads who turn anything positive about a Black person into a negative. Because you define Blacks "only" by their worst examples. While you judge Whites only by their "Best" examples. And that's when you loose all credibility.

WORD!
:)

schleebenhorst, just make sure your kids don't grow up like you 'cause they'll have a hard time in our increasingly diverse world.
gone are the days where you could openly state your racist views (except typing it safely behind a computer screen of course) and not expect to get jumped or beat up and kicked back to your room.

So you think it's OK to meet opinion with violence lowi?

That looks like hate speech to me.

James R doesn't like hate speech....but you'll probably be OK because you're not white.

This isn't a "Us" VS "Them" This is about education. And whenever someone provides "facts" that doesn't fit in your racist point of view, you discredit the facts, without providing any of your own besides vile insults. And then turn it into a Black VS White. You, J.B/D-ster/Baron Max are racist pinheads who turn anything positive about a Black person into a negative. Because you define Blacks "only" by their worst examples. While you judge Whites only by their "Best" examples. And that's when you loose all credibility.

In the smallest scale it's not....but these things always turn into "us vs. them", because that's exactly what it is, in case you haven't noticed. Take a look at the world, it's full of ethnic tensions. When someone like you comes along and claims black people invented the traffic lights, shoes and atoms and all the usual nonsense you flamboyant reverse-racist types usually come out with, what sort of reaction do you expect? You're never satisfied with any answer. I mean what do you really expect the white people of sciforums.com to say? I am sorry your people were so weak that they became enslaved? I am sorry that my ancestors were successful? I am sorry that white people pulled the world from the dark ages into the space age while all your people can do is try to get a bigger slice of the white man's pie?

What are you seriously trying to achieve, and why do you have to look so hard for something positive? Will some greater peace between the races come out of it, or are you just sh*t stirring and creating hatred in the long run? Your "friend" there has already "implied" (James R seems to think that this is sufficient evidence) that violence upon me because my opinion is different to his and your own is a positive thing. Is that what you really want?

gone are the days where you could openly state your racist views ... and not expect to get jumped or beat up and kicked back to your room.

Wow, are you wrong! Blacks can make racists statements any time they want to and nothing happens. But if whites make racist statements, all hell breaks loose amongst the blacks ...and the mamby-pamby liberal whites back 'em up!

But I'm truly suprised that you imply that you're happy with the loss of free speech in this great nation. That bothers me ...even for a black to say and/or imply!

Baron Max

Wow, are you wrong! Blacks can make racists statements any time they want to and nothing happens. But if whites make racist statements, all hell breaks loose amongst the blacks ...and the mamby-pamby liberal whites back 'em up!

But I'm truly suprised that you imply that you're happy with the loss of free speech in this great nation. That bothers me ...even for a black to say and/or imply!

Baron Max

When Blacks make those type of statements they're marginalized. Take a look at Luis Farrakhan for instance. The man has no credibility outside of his base.

So in other words, they did anything they could to get out of that shithole? What's that say for those who remained?We're talking about a time 70,000 years ago in the Paleolithic Era, when mobility beyond the boundaries of a tribe's hunting/gathering territory and communication between tribes were both very limited. All it says is that the vast majority of Africans did not live close enough to the Isthmus of Suez to:

A. Know that it existed;
B. Consider crossing it as a practical idea.

A study of the geographical range of other mammal species shows that it is extremely difficult for a species to expand and adapt into an area which is markedly different in climate, ecology, or topography from the one in which it developed. Our primate ancestors with their high intelligence and prehensile hands had tens of millions of years to populate the world, yet only the hominids managed to spread out of the tropics.

Even after the diaspora out of Africa started, it took Homo sapiens 45,000 years to become established in Europe and an additional 10,000 to reach the Western Hemisphere. The narrow passages into those areas were very effective throttles on migration, even for people who had already invented sophisticated transportation technology such as seagoing boats.

And those were freeways compared to the passage from Africa to Asia Minor.

All it says is that the vast majority of Africans did not live close enough to the Isthmus of Suez to:

A. Know that it existed;
B. Consider crossing it as a practical idea.

The Olduvai Gorge area, where humans supposedly began, is a helluva long way from the Suez. Someone, some group of people, at some time in history, decided to do better for themselves and leave. They didn't know about the Suez at that time, so....

So for all your typing about geography, you've explained nothing about why some people left and others remained, Fraggle. Nor has your statements done anything to refuted what G. F. Schleebenhorst has implied by his questions: "So in other words, they did anything they could to get out of that shithole? What's that say for those who remained?"

You do know what's implied by his statements, don't you?

Baron Max

It is telling that Africa, the home of humanity, was and is, with the exclusion of aboriginal Australia, the most backwards human area. It is also telling that everyone that left (excluding the aforementioned Aboriginees) did tremendously better for themselves.

This whole thread is bullshit, and I am beginning to doubt the popularity of this forum. Instead of respecting the found items, they drivel over who's black and who's white. I just wonder, when will the white man get over himself? Is it untill the moon drifts away from the Earth, the whole thing is becoming too gay on this forum. Now I am not directing this at anybody but they know themselves. White people are taking advantage of other rather brilliant white people, then to claim the whole race is superior. Its not as if every single white man in history was intelligent, no, but knowledge is contagious and people easily fool themselves to be intelligent...just because they see other people like them. One of the most advanced language in human terms is english, but english did not become what it is over night, it took thousands of years to perfect it, such feat was so great that everybody decided to adopt the idea. It wasn't invented by all white people, it was invented by a few, and even that took forever. Of cause there have been many black inventors and mathematicians in history, but we should also remember that "all ideas have their time and use", maybe the time was against black inventions. Barox max will tell you black people never built a civilization, who the hell is he to know anything about black people and culture. The bullshit society you guys have in America is brainwashing him. They have been many civilizations in Africa. For one thing, all the people in West Africa are the Nok people, a civilization as far back as the Aztecs in America. The lower Nok was the Oyo kingdom, it was ruled by the house of Ife( "house of love" in English)which was the most powerful empire in all of central Africa. The upper part was more for free ranging, which eventually became influenced by Arabs, and then became the Sokoto kingdom. They were a civilized society that rivaled any society in its time. The portugese went into that region in search of trade and spread of discoveries, for some reason black africa's problem started when they discovered more knowledge. Right after the portuguese, there was chaos, divisions, and envy; the same situation in Africa today. But many states in Africa have managed to preserve wonderful art and culture...but the stupid fucks are still at it today. So there you are, a brief history for the ignoramous. If you ask me, whites can be equal to blacks, or maybe they shouldn't even be compared in the first place...maybe not. Whites are generaly good at some things and blacks are good at some things, but you can never under estimate the power of brainwashing, socio economic class, change of events, and denial. In general, I think whites are superior per 100 human, but you would never have had people like Ronadhino, pele, and michael jordan without Africa.

And George Foreman. Everybody has a lean, mean, fat reducing, grilling machine.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timbuktu_Manuscripts_Project

"Timbuktu Manuscripts Project is a cultural project which aims to preserve around 700,000 scholarly Islamic manuscripts in the city of Timbuktu, Mali. Some of the manuscripts date back to the 13th century and are currently held in 24 private libraries in and around Timbuktu [1].

It also aims to make access to public and private libraries around Timbuktu more wider and easier to the Malian society and to show that the conventional historical view of Africa as a purely "oral continent" is not correct. The project begun on 2000 and it is scheduled to end in 2007"

The Olduvai Gorge area, where humans supposedly began, is a helluva long way from the Suez. Someone, some group of people, at some time in history, decided to do better for themselves and leave. They didn't know about the Suez at that time, so....Sure dude, but that was two and a half million years ago! That's plenty of time for humans to spread across the continent from population pressure, shifting prey animal and food plant ranges, and natural curiosity. They weren't looking specifically for a way out of Africa, just new ground to expand to.

We don't really know for certain that no explorers set out for Asia Minor in earlier times. There's just no evidence of their success. The recently discovered possibility of an adequately expressive language being invented just in time to make that next trip successful makes sense. So for all your typing about geography, you've explained nothing about why some people left and others remained, Fraggle.Yes I have. The people who lived in that corner of Africa tried walking to the northeast and ran into a narrow, possibly inhospitable passage to another continent. The stronger, more adventurous ones came back with plans and supplies and went off for an adventure. The people who lived in Rhodesia and Swaziland would obviously not have been involved in that because they couldn't have known about it. Nor has your statements done anything to refuted what G. F. Schleebenhorst has implied by his questions: "So in other words, they did anything they could to get out of that shithole? What's that say for those who remained?"I find it a wise policy to stay out of arguments about racism except in private among people I know and trust. Anybody who wanted to crack our pseudonyms could probably do it in thirty seconds.You do know what's implied by his statements, don't you?Yes, and as I said I'll leave that topic for braver or more foolish folk. I doubt that in all of history anyone has ever succeeded in making anyone else change their mind about racism anyway so it's hardly worth the trouble.

I'm sure I have violated my own policy and gotten sucked into a few of these but I'm not going to do it today.

In general, I think whites are superior per 100 human, but you would never have had people like Ronadhino, pele, and michael jordan without Africa.

How can you say that with a straight face? Are all of them even full-blood negroids? Is that the best you can come up with for the entire black race?

How can you say that with a straight face? Are all of them even full-blood negroids? Is that the best you can come up with for the entire black race?

(laughs) I am not even going to begin to answer your question. Okay white people are better than blacks. Are you happy now?

Did you think I needed to hear that from you or something?

How can you say that with a straight face? Are all of them even full-blood negroids? Is that the best you can come up with for the entire black race? Why not? Maybe I like soccer and sports, maybe thats what's more important to me. Soccer has brought together many people around the world, it does a lot of good things. Besides...for the love of God..not all fuckin whities are smart, most of them are dumb fucks that cling on the stereotype just so they can get ahead in the society, its called "due dillegence", I call it facade. Talking about strings, hey guess what?...mine's longer and bigger.

reuters is a biased, very unreliable source.

Talking about strings, hey guess what?...mine's longer and bigger.

LOL, I think this is probably what you wanted to say in your first post.

I bet you can jump higher too, huh? Who's the one stereotyping now?

Why not? Maybe I like soccer and sports, maybe thats what's more important to me. Soccer has brought together many people around the world, it does a lot of good things. Besides...for the love of God..not all fuckin whities are smart, most of them are dumb fucks that cling on the stereotype just so they can get ahead in the society, its called "due dillegence", I call it facade. Talking about strings, hey guess what?...mine's longer and bigger.

reserved

Ganymede:

HAAAAAA HA HA HA HA! He's BLACk, Ganymede. He's black and SUPPORTING YOUR POINT!

HAHAHAHAHAHA Prince James the post was actually intended for you!!! I just quoted the wrong post! Hahahahahahahaha:D

Did you think I needed to hear that from you or something?

Obviously you do! You're nothing but another looser who has to bash another race to make himself feel better. That's the common attitude of racists who fail at life.

LOL! That's exactly what you're attempting to do.

Time Traveler: No civilization is immune to being savage.

The world is coming to an end we finally agree on something.

Prince James: The majority of Egyptian artwork is of distinctly non-negro character.

What exactly do you mean by 'non-negro character'? What would be a negro character?

Prince James: It is telling that Africa, the home of humanity, was and is, with the exclusion of aboriginal Australia, the most backwards human area. It is also telling that everyone that left (excluding the aforementioned Aboriginees) did tremendously better for themselves.

Well you must admit James that the continent was not left to its own development. However you may deem African's the continent is abundant with resources which have been exploited time and time again insuring the demise and exploitation of the people. Sven Lindqvist's Exterminate All The Brutes is a good analysis of how Africans underwent genocide, colonization, brutalization and nation building divisions that were placed to keep the people from utilizing their own resources. Look at Brussels for christs sake? Where did they get their diamonds, gold not to mention the mouth watering chocolate? All of Europe was built by what they could steal, what they were willing to kill for. So I ask were African's backward or were they undermined and fell behind?

'Masterpiece' built in Timbuktu in the 15th century: (by Arabs, actually)

http://www.exodus.co.uk/pictures/a02hp48b.jpg


What Europe was doing three hundred years earlier:

http://www.agofs.com/imagesatol/Tom%20Guffey/Notre%20Dame,%20Paris%20-webshot.jpg

What Europe was doing three hundred years earlier:

What Europe was doing five hundred years later:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/b9/Monte_Cassino.jpg/250px-Monte_Cassino.jpg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/6/69/Warsaw_siege3.jpg/180px-Warsaw_siege3.jpg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/81/WW2_TitlePicture_For_Wikipedia_Article.jpg/300px-WW2_TitlePicture_For_Wikipedia_Article.jpg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II)

What Europe was doing four hundred years later:

Just proves that we can destroy what we built earlier, then build it all back again even better than before ......while the Africans still live in the same mudhuts that they built a million years before ...all of them without running water, central heat and air conditioning, and without sanitary sewers! (And still begging for the white man to save them with donations!)

Yeah, Zephyr, it's tells us a lot .....a whole lot.

Baron Max

LOL, I think this is probably what you wanted to say in your first post.

I bet you can jump higher too, huh? Who's the one stereotyping now? You are driving me insane, but I am glad you found some temporal humor

Just proves that we can destroy what we built earlier, then build it all back again even better than before ......while the Africans still live in the same mudhuts that they built a million years before ...all of them without running water, central heat and air conditioning, and without sanitary sewers! (And still begging for the white man to save them with donations!)

Yeah, Zephyr, it's tells us a lot .....a whole lot.

Baron Max

Hey maybe they like it. What do you think is better, having a family or living in air condition? Is life about air condition? Black people are not resourceful, agreed, black people aren't superior, agreed. So what's the problem again?

Ganymede,
Obviously you do! You're nothing but another looser who has to bash another race to make himself feel better. That's the common attitude of racists who fail at life.

Are you paying attention to that guy, I am sure he doesn't know certain things about science...but wait minute I thought he was white...and that makes up for it right...right? I have checked his posts and very seldom does he contribute anything to science, he's just one of those empty barrels still figuring out why he is not black

Prince James
It is telling that Africa, the home of humanity, was and is, with the exclusion of aboriginal Australia, the most backwards human area. It is also telling that everyone that left (excluding the aforementioned Aboriginees) did tremendously better for themselves.

So why is that a problem, I mean, what is the problem here? People still live there, and people around the world( including Europe) have always lived in relatively deplorable conditions before the technical revolution happened recently. What is the big deal here? Or do you want me to find exerts on the conditions of the previous world and how long it took?

Let me make my own case here, the world is very big, and Africa lived their own way the best they could, they were happy. Wealth is a relative idea. Agreed, most of Africa's primitive civilization, literature, and folklore are known to a few, but since when has all that been important. If Historical literature was important places like India and China will be world class cities, there is a lot more to making a world class civilization, it takes a mighty lot of determination and money. Besides, lets be frank, the height of civilization the so called white man has done today is relatively crap because it is not enough to develop the entire World. With all the so called...technological advancement we have people are still sick, in poverty, and undeveloped. And for your information there are plenty of very developed placed in Africa, plenty, the crap they show you guys on network news is just part of it; the same way they show the good part, and due diligence of developed countries. Give us a break will you? I mean, what else can you come up with? There is a lot of favoritism in history, Personally I don’t care. If You ask me, I think black people are to busy watching the white man to get things done, I think a lot of the reason why black people bent over for white men is because they became fascinated by their perculiar looks, but thats just a hunch. You have to be fascinated by white people, they are a work of art, both physically and mentaly, they just have a lot more to look at at times, and you have to be insane not to notice this. Its time everybody gets over their features and move on with it. Its too late for black people to all return to that continent and reappoint their kings, I don't control the world so thats probably not going to happen, but black people everywhere just have to try to avoid the stereotype hype and end the drought

Yes, Africa looks like paradise, eh?

http://www.humanities.uci.edu/users/vfolkenflik/VRF%20Sources/Darfur%20NYT%2022806%20Michael%20Kamber.jpg

Having seen that picture I'm certain I'll never be going to Africa, god help them!

Yes, because the whole continent is described by one picture. Just like the whole of Europe is identical to these London slums:

http://peer.tamu.edu/curriculum_modules/Ecosystems/Images/slums.jpg (http://images.google.co.za/imgres?imgurl=http://peer.tamu.edu/curriculum_modules/Ecosystems/Images/slums.jpg&imgrefurl=http://peer.tamu.edu/curriculum_modules/Ecosystems/Module_1/storytime.htm&h=195&w=286&sz=26&hl=en&start=4&tbnid=RV3pp-jjSZUOjM:&tbnh=78&tbnw=115&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dlondon%2Bslum%26svnum%3D10%26hl%3Den% 26lr%3D%26sa%3DN)

What is it with people and the inability to see beyond stereotypes? :bugeye:

I guess all Americans are desert cowboys who drink from cactuses and eat coyote jerky.

Just proves that we can destroy what we built earlier, then build it all back again even better than before
It tells me that it took years of war, fascism and communism before Europe learned to see far enough past its differences to get along. But how permanent is that learning? This century will show...

As for mud huts, that shows what you know. The problem in many parts of Africa isn't lack of infrastructure; it's that rival groups keep murdering each other with the latest neat weapons - primarily sold to them by the West.

Lord Hillyer
Yes, Africa looks like paradise, eh?

You are a red Uakari. Why didn't you post the developed parts?

The reason why Africa looks undeveloped most of the time is because they started to developed buildings similar to the West and unfinished. It was much more beautiful when they had mud houses and cities. I actually think a lot of the mud house pictures on this forum are fucking beautiful... but sadly, they are going to be toppled and replaced one day.

"civilized countries are nothing but going out and getting more stuff"

I guess all Americans are desert cowboys who drink from cactuses and eat coyote jerkyNo way, you can never develop the American, even if you tried (lol), but I love them.

You live in a mud house, surrounded by friends and family, ample food in cattle, entertainment, and succulent women, all in a beautiful country, with year round summer. What's really wrong with that? No, what's really wrong with that? I mean, what else do you really need in life? Can someone tell me..because I seem to be lost. Is anybody up for a challenge?

Yes, because the whole continent is described by one picture. Just like the whole of Europe is identical to these London slums:

http://peer.tamu.edu/curriculum_modules/Ecosystems/Images/slums.jpg (http://images.google.co.za/imgres?imgurl=http://peer.tamu.edu/curriculum_modules/Ecosystems/Images/slums.jpg&imgrefurl=http://peer.tamu.edu/curriculum_modules/Ecosystems/Module_1/storytime.htm&h=195&w=286&sz=26&hl=en&start=4&tbnid=RV3pp-jjSZUOjM:&tbnh=78&tbnw=115&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dlondon%2Bslum%26svnum%3D10%26hl%3Den% 26lr%3D%26sa%3DN)

What is it with people and the inability to see beyond stereotypes? :bugeye:

I guess all Americans are desert cowboys who drink from cactuses and eat coyote jerky.

Ummm I highly doubt those are in London, unless that London happens to be in south africa or something.

True.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/39747000/jpg/_39747403_olympics1.jpg

You are a red Uakari. Why didn't you post the developed parts?

You mean the parts built by Caucasians?

You live in a mud house, surrounded by friends and family, ample food in cattle, entertainment, and succulent women, all in a beautiful country, with year round summer. What's really wrong with that? No, what's really wrong with that? I mean, what else do you really need in life? Can someone tell me..because I seem to be lost. Is anybody up for a challenge?

Sanitary sewer facilities, unpolluted water supply, undiseased water and food supplies, diseases and injury, hospital care, schools, electricity, sanitary living and food preparation facilities, transportation to the hospitals, control of the population (so it doesn't exceed the food supplies), defense against invading neighbors and wild animals, protection from natural disasters, .....

Oh, gee, I think that there's a whole slew of things. Chatha, I think you just didn't give this much thought, did you?

Baron Max

protection from natural disasters, .....

What happened with that hurricane in New Orleans not too long ago?

Sanitary sewer facilities, unpolluted water supply, undiseased water and food supplies, diseases and injury, hospital care, schools, electricity, sanitary living and food preparation facilities, transportation to the hospitals, control of the population (so it doesn't exceed the food supplies), defense against invading neighbors and wild animals, protection from natural disasters, .....

Oh, gee, I think that there's a whole slew of things. Chatha, I think you just didn't give this much thought, did you?

Baron Max

You live in a mud house, amble cattle for barbecue, growing rice as a side dish, a woman with big knockers, entertainment, beautiful open country, and year round summer. What else do you really need? People have been surviving fine for hundreds of years before the TV commercials rolled in. And according to the law of diminishing returns, you can only gain total satisfaction from anything for so long. Do you think that developing countries are happy? Why do they always look subconcious? Western countries also have diseases, I have a friend who's father is a diplomat and we know that there are plenty of incurable diseases there too, but hidden from the world. Just answer the question, what else do you need in life? Is there something I am missing?

You mean the parts built by Caucasians?

Show them to me. By the way black people also have a huge hand in the building of developed countries. Can somebody tell me something in the Western countries that we really need? That we shouldn't live without?

By the way black people also have a huge hand in the building of developed countries.

Which ones??? Can you name a few of them, please?

Baron Max

Which ones??? Can you name a few of them, please?

Baron Max

U.S, England, Portugal, France, and Holland. I can even go back to the preceedng civilizations; Egypt, Roman, and Greek. By the way you haven't answered my question, what else do you need in life thats so important that Africans are missing so badly? Is it WWF, is it television, is it microwave, is it escalators?

Um, what significant role did any black person play in Greece or Rome?

Wow, this is retarded...

why can't we celebrate humanity as a whole? :bugeye:

U.S, England, Portugal, France, and Holland. I can even go back to the preceedng civilizations; Egypt, Roman, and Greek.

Blacks had a "huge hand" in developing those nations?? How so? Please explain their "huge role".

I'd also remind you that in the beginnings of the US, the whites had to tell the blacks what to do, then use whips and clubs in order to make them do it! We did the same with horses and mules, but no one would say that horses and mules had played a "huge hand" in developiing the US.

...what else do you need in life thats so important that Africans are missing so badly?

Well, hell, if black Africans are doin' so freakin' well, then why should western, white nations be sending them so freakin' much money??

Baron Max

why can't we celebrate humanity as a whole?

Because humanity is NOT a "whole" ....which you seem to have overlooked somehow. Perhaps because you're living in your ivory tower, and can't see what right before your eyes?!

Baron Max

Because humanity is NOT a "whole" ....which you seem to have overlooked somehow. Perhaps because you're living in your ivory tower, and can't see what right before your eyes?!


Do you have evidenc to suggest that humanity is not a whole?

[QUOTE=Oniw17;1202677]Do you have evidenc to suggest that humanity is not a whole?[/QUOTE

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War

What about war?

Blacks had a "huge hand" in developing those nations?? How so? Please explain their "huge role". Hard labor slaves, it may not be significant to some, but its still a part. Try building any building today without the laborers.

I'd also remind you that in the beginnings of the US, the whites had to tell the blacks what to do, then use whips and clubs in order to make them do it! We did the same with horses and mules, but no one would say that horses and mules had played a "huge hand" in developiing the US. The whites also enslaved other whites. England also whipped scottish white people for hundreds of years. Do we have to go into that too? Chinese men were slso whipped as slaves, have you heard of the country of Chile, who do you think build that country at one time? Chinaman slaves. Slavery is part of life dear. It actually still exists today
Well, hell, if black Africans are doin' so freakin' well, then why should western, white nations be sending them so freakin' much money??

Baron MaxLOL how many times are we going to go down this road. I have asked you close to five times now. What do you really need in life that Africans don't have? Yes, they are poor.

Because humanity is NOT a "whole" ....which you seem to have overlooked somehow. Perhaps because you're living in your ivory tower, and can't see what right before your eyes?!

Baron Max

One piece of evidence is that we are the same species.

Listen, I am going to admit that black kingdoms have totally bent over for most other races in the past. But slavery is never going to rear its ugly head again, and if it does there will never be peace. There wasn't peace then and they can be no peace in such a case. Back then, there was relative sanctity in the white man's country, but back in Africa it was like what Iraq is today; constant terrorism. There are way too many big black countries today, from Brazil to India, to Pakistan, to Nigeria, to South Africa, and East Africa. If slavery ever happens again like it did, I would do what the white man want's of me, I am not one of those "i'd rather kill myself type people", fuck them. I am staying alive.

India is not a black country. Neither is Brazil. Stop trying to claim half the world for yourself.

U.S, England, Portugal, France, and Holland. I can even go back to the preceedng civilizations; Egypt, Roman, and Greek. By the way you haven't answered my question, what else do you need in life thats so important that Africans are missing so badly? Is it WWF, is it television, is it microwave, is it escalators?

What did black people build in England?

One piece of evidence is that we are the same species.


Ha, ha! Many animals of the same species fight each other constantly in competition for food sources and territorial rights and for the choicest females. Being of the same species doesn't make the species "whole" ...and certainly not in the way you meant/implied.

Got any more of your brilliant ideas?

Baron Max

civilizations are built on the accumulation
of info
the more you have the better you are at civil shit

accumalation of info is dependant on time
therefore
past glories are shit and retarted
the present rules

conclusion
i spit on mud huts and pyramids
while worshiping manhattan

alternate conclusion:
primitive negroes
space faring aryans

is xerses black?

understand this o african
it is not your time in the sun

retarted


....and you would be american?

conclusion; i spit on mud huts and pyramids
while worshiping manhattan

With all of the crime going on in NYC, you can worship it???? Geez! There's a murder probably happening right now in NYC, and a violent rape happens about every twelve minutes. If you look, you'll see a robbery or burglary happening ...about every seven minutes. Homelessness is a dire problem in NYC, with thousands of them wandering the streets begging for money like they do in "fourth world" contries! Is that something to worship, or are you just seeing what you want to see and ignoring all of the rest of the shit happening around you?

And interestingly, virtually none of that happens in Podunk, Arkansas, pop. 265. Hmm? What's that say about people???

Baron Max

....and you would be american?

pfft
you dare iinsult me?
the label is mere legalities

my blood originates in the iranian plateau. the homeland of the glorious aryan tribes

Is that where you live Baron?

Is that where you live Baron?

Nope, I live in The Great State of Texas!

Baron Max

What's that say about people???

Baron Max

fool
nothing
just you

go back to africa if you cant hack it

Nope, I live in The Great State of Texas!

Baron Max

ja
the retards of america
in bred cattle herders
the rest of us spit on ya'll

the rest of us spit on ya'll

Texans don't let people like you get within spitting range! :)

Baron Max

When Baron Max sits in his study, enjoying a good read, he usually gets up and flushes before the smell becomes too pungent.

In an ideal world his trailer is resting on wheels and his old-lady still has her two front teeth.
Fortunately for him, the T.V. still exists to tell him what to think and to lull him with a false sense of security and importance.

When Baron Max sits in his study, enjoying a good read, he usually gets up and flushes before the smell becomes too pungent.

In an ideal world his trailer is resting on wheels and his old-lady still has her two front teeth.
Fortunately for him, the T.V. still exists to tell him what to think and to lull him with a false sense of security and importance.

That's bullshit!

My woman don't still have her two front teeth ...they were pulled out with all the rest so I don't get scratches on my dick when she blows me!

Baron Max

That's bullshit!

My woman don't still have her two front teeth ...they were pulled out with all the rest so I don't get scratches on my dick when she blows me!

Baron Max

Blow up dolls don't count Baron.

Texans don't let people like you get within spitting range! :)

Baron Max

Yep, he lives in Texas. The execution capital of first world countries.

My ancestors remained. aha.
it's funny how many africans think europe is a shithole. so it's all relative.

profound

Ha, ha! Many animals of the same species fight each other constantly in competition for food sources and territorial rights and for the choicest females. Being of the same species doesn't make the species "whole" ...and certainly not in the way you meant/implied.

Got any more of your brilliant ideas?

Baron Max

So are you suggesting some kind of civil war to kill all the blacks so that there will be more food for your fat white ass? AFAIK, we live in a world of extreme surplus.


is xerses black?

I am white. If you must know, half Moroccan (white), quarter Austrian, and a quarter Russian :)

Moroccan's are white now? Last I checked they were a mixture of North African, Phonecian, and Moorish. None of these are Indo-Europeans. Unless your family was French.

Our people got kicked out of Spain and Portugal during the inquisition. The community was still white before shrinking 100x.

Xerxes:

So your family hailed from these Visigothic Spaniards?

Hard to know. The point is that I come from a European ancestry... To answer Gustav...

Moroccan's are white now? Last I checked they were a mixture of North African, Phonecian, and Moorish. None of these are Indo-Europeans. Unless your family was French."White" traditionally means Caucasian, not Indo-European. If you define it as Indo-European you exclude some of Europe's "whitest" people: the Finns, Estonians, Hungarians, Basques, and Bulgarians. You at least get to toss out the Phoenicians, Ethiopians and various Semitic and Turkic peoples, yet you still have to include the Indic people, which most Religious Redneck Racist Retards are dying to find a way to classify as "colored people," even though they are not just Caucasian but the original Aryans.

Satyr
When Baron Max sits in his study, enjoying a good read, he usually gets up and flushes before the smell becomes too pungent.

In an ideal world his trailer is resting on wheels and his old-lady still has her two front teeth.
Fortunately for him, the T.V. still exists to tell him what to think and to lull him with a false sense of security and importance

(LOL) This is the funniest post I ever read on Barox Max. I cracked up before I even finished the post. Thanks satyr.

Barox max, why are you still pushing the issue? You said you hate blacks and no one should push the issue. If you don't care about blacks why then are you still pushing the issue so far. You see how full of shit you are? Why should anybody believe you? Why don't you find your white buddies and forget about the issue and leave black people's condition out of your brain? Aren't you free to mind your own business in Texas?

Barox the max...Barox the man...the great white hope

Satyr


(LOL) This is the funniest post I ever read on Barox Max. I cracked up before I even finished the post. Thanks satyr.Reality is always funny.


Baron Max
That's bullshit!

My woman don't still have her two front teeth ...they were pulled out with all the rest so I don't get scratches on my dick when she blows me!

Baron MaxThis is where the Great Big Red Necked One shows his reading abilities.
All those guns and ammo issues and he still hasn’t mastered American, like his hero George W. has.
He rushed to absolve himself through humor and failed to see that I said “In an ideal universe”.
Unless he believes that this universe is his ideal.

40 years in the grindstone and nothing to show for it but a 4x4 and a big old Stars and Stripes flapping next to the front door.


Is it coon season yet?

LOL. But I am beginning to like the guy though. Always funny satyr

Barox max, why are you still pushing the issue? You said you hate blacks...

You've never seen me say that I hated blacks ....never, ever have you read that on this forum.

Baron Max

Spidergoat:
So you do hate black people?

Baron Max:
Yes ...but I hate all humans equally! ...white, black, brown, yellow, red, pink, blue, reddish-brown, whitish-black, blackish-white,.........

Spidergoat:
So you do hate black people?

Baron Max:
Yes ...but I hate all humans equally! ...white, black, brown, yellow, red, pink, blue, reddish-brown, whitish-black, blackish-white,.........

I had a feeling someone would search that out! But I answered the question that he asked/IMPLIED ....i.e., that I hate blacks, but not other races.

I stand by my answer, spider, but thanks for pointing that out.

Baron Max

Ah ha, he didn't ask about other races. The court finds you guilty of hating blacks. You will hereby be fed to a hyena.


http://xs309.xs.to/xs309/06465/nigeria_004.0.jpg (http://xs.to)

So you think it's OK to meet opinion with violence lowi?

That looks like hate speech to me.

James R doesn't like hate speech....but you'll probably be OK because you're not white.

I'm not saying it's right to get kicked in the ass for making racist comments but it does happen and i've seen it happen that's why.

say it behind a pc screen if it's your opinion (oh no. don't say it anywhere 'cause it's immoral) but don't say it out loud on the streets (especially not near my street) people kick racist's ass. lol
or you could get a time machine, go back maybe a couple of years.

you know i love you and will never do you any harm. sike:bugeye:
lol



ah, spidergoat. that's a cute pic. it's pretty art actually. me likes.

You've never seen me say that I hated blacks ....never, ever have you read that on this forum.

Baron Max

that's nice to hear.
we're making some progress now Baron Max. :)

We = white people. In case you hadn't noticed this is spiralling into "us" vs. "them" and if I can't speak for "us" then I'm not sure what's going on any more.

south africa was not the first part that was discovered by the white man.

South Africa is going to end up like Egypt. Its going to end up being mixed but slightly white. And then the semantics will roll in.

LOl, give me a break!

Africans and Libraries is an oxymoron. Could it be possible it was the Arabs who established the libraries?

Amazing what kind of lies you'll believe to support your insane liberal ideology that blacks are somehow "equal" to whites. ;)

Not whites, non Aryan whites are generally pretty thick. The Blacks can never to equal to the Semitics or the noble Aryans.

It's funny, I don't think you will find a single group or category of people that don't think that they are better in some way than other groups. It is easier to identify with a group than to be truly honest with yourself.