Islamic Banking Systems Adopted and Applied

Islamic banks appeared on the world scene as active players over two decades ago. But "many of the principles upon which Islamic banking is based have been commonly accepted all over the world, for centuries rather than decades".

The basic principle of Islamic banking is the prohibition of Riba- (Usury - or interest):

"While a basic tenant of Islamic banking - the outlawing of riba, a term that encompasses not only the concept of usury, but also that of interest - has seldom been recognised as applicable beyond the Islamic world, many of its guiding principles have. The majority of these principles are based on simple morality and common sense, which form the bases of many religions, including Islam.

"The universal nature of these principles is immediately apparent even at a cursory glance of non-Muslim literature. Usury was prohibited in both the Old and New Testaments of the Bible, while Shakespeare and many other writers, particularly those writing in the 19th century, have attacked the barbarity of the practice. Much of the morality championed by Victorian writers such as Dickens - ranging from the equitable distribution of wealth through to man's fundamental right to work - is clearly present in modern Islamic society.

"Although the western media frequently suggest that Islamic banking in its present form is a recent phenomenon, in fact, the basic practices and principles date back to the early part of the seventh century." (Islamic Finance: A Euromoney Publication, 1997)

http://www.islamic-banking.com/ibanking/whatib.php

that's why there is so little growth in the ummah countries

if usury was allowed you'd be much better off
time to get with the times... what's it called... oh yeah.. modern!

Ever heard of Malaysia ?? it is an islamic country and yet one of the most advanced 15 IN THE WORLD ?

how about DUBAI ????????? :rolleyes:

Ever heard of Malaysia ?? it is an islamic country and yet one of the most advanced 15 IN THE WORLD ?

how about DUBAI ????????? :rolleyes:
PM, have you checked their banking system? Islamic or western?

Here are the interest rates from the National bank of Dubai
Interest rates (http://www.nbd.co.ae/NBD/NBD_CDA/CDA_Web_pages/Rates_Charges/interest_rates) ;)

From what I can gather malaysia is working on an islamic banking system

Central bank of Malaysia (http://www.bnm.gov.my/)

This sounds like the Bank of England
http://www.bnm.gov.my/index.php?ch=7

Some interest rates for this month.
http://www.bnm.gov.my/index.php?ch=12&pg=136

Malaysia and Turkey aside.
those have secular democratic governments.

how about the rest?

It looks like the islamic republic of Iran has interest free banking but I just took a quick look
bank of Iran (http://www.cbi.ir/legislation/monetarypolicy.asp)

If that is so it might have something to do with this
Unrest in Esfahan
Daneshjoo Information Services
April 3, 2004

Windows of several banks and public buildings were smashed in Esfahan during a protest demo which took place, today, in the Jey Avenue.

Hundreds of residents defyied the security forces and set tires abalze in order to show their anger of the local Islamic funds' empty promises on the restitution of millions of Tomans (Iranian currency) of their deposited assets.

The rumor of the bankruptcy of the local Islamic funds has resulted on massive withdraws and is leading toward its collapse.

From here Iranian activist chat (http://www.activistchat.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=1424)

so they want a interest-free banking and a lot of money?
can't have it both ways, son!

It seems like alot of people in Iran are fed up with the Mullahs, interest free banking or no.

This thread was originally posted in the "Religion" forum, but as it raises no point of religious discussion, it seemed better to place it in the "Economics" forum.

What the heck is wrong with charging interest? Seriously, I'm never understood why it's prohibited in Judaism and Islam. There are lots of good arguments for why interest is a good thing, and I'm not aware of any on why it would be a bad thing.

It's a "bad" thing, immoral actually, because it is money earned without due work.

ahem ahem its not prohibited in Judaism heh
and its work cheking and enforcing loan agreements is work...

Islamic banking isn't adopted and isn't applied... becuase it never existed until they realized how down the evolutionary way they came without proper monetary systems.
which the whole world embraces except the religious morons who put god infront of better living conditions and ecconomic prosperity.

ofcourse its a "bad" thing to lend someone money to buy a house because then they wont be your virtual slave and you cant make them pay a fielty fee for living on your land. Its a whole system built to keep rich forever rich and poor forever poor compared to capitalism its like abyss. Islamic retarded s.o.b.s...

That sounds like a really bizarre view to take. Interest is:
1. Compensation for taking a risk (since you don't know if it will be paid back).
2. Compensation for the loss of utility that you suffer when you loan money to someone.
3. An incentive to make loans to people who you otherwise wouldn't.

I wonder if by that same logic people would object to making money by renting things out to people.

it's immoral to charge interest because it's seen in Islam as exploitation

i think it's immoral not to charge interest
aside from the miniscule profits banks make from user-fees, their only source for making money is through interest payments.
considering inflation, the lenders usually get paid less than what they expect (lose), even after taking inflation into consideration and adjusting the interest rates accordingly

without the bank being there to lend cash, there would be no business upstarts, no financing plans to buy houses, cars, furniture, finance kids' education, etc.

no interest = no banks
no banks = people can't borrow to buy things & invest
people can't borrow to buy things & invest = no growth
no growth = shit living condition
shit living condition = extremism, rich minority poor majority
shit living condition = poor education
poor education = subjugation

hmm... makes one wonder...

Is this idea of banking without interest supposed to be a joke? From my knowledge, the only banking system that operates without charging interest is "Bankrupt" so PM, are you seriouly joking or just simply joking since I cannot even imagine how you can even be serious?

Malaysia may have many Islamic people living in it but it is not an Islamic country. By the way, many Islamic people also live in the U.S. but do not even think it because it has already been too much for me to laugh at your bankrupt system!

i heard somewhere that in Islamic countries (and no, i don't mean Malaysia :rolleyes: ), in order to follow Islamic banking principles and not charge interest, some banks hide interest through user-fees.

so let's say you want to get a mortgage from the bank
the bank will charge you a "fee" of $25,000 which you can pay in installments that are added on top of the principle payments.
but don't you think for a second it's interest! because Muslims don't charge eachother interest :rolleyes:

Proud Muslim, an Islamic bank cannot charge interest on loans, but deposits will generate money, correct? What about stocks and bonds and the like, that's not forbidden by the Quran, is it?

Randolfo, this thread is about a unique economic system, not spreading your Christian propoganda. Please take it elsewhere.

if you used logic, you would abandon islam for something more modern & true, like Christianity

eh, though I agree P_M is basically a propaganda machine for Islam and that this topic is silly... it's hard for me to see how you are any less brainwashed than he is.

I couldn't help but notice the only word you capitalized in that sentence was "christianity" (including that sentence's first word). Your form of propaganda is, perhaps, a bit more subtle but it's propaganda nonetheless.

I'd even go so far as calling it insidious, at least P_M is straight forward.

That sounds like a really bizarre view to take. Interest is:
1. Compensation for taking a risk (since you don't know if it will be paid back).
2. Compensation for the loss of utility that you suffer when you loan money to someone.
3. An incentive to make loans to people who you otherwise wouldn't.

I wonder if by that same logic people would object to making money by renting things out to people.

The basis of this system is religion. It presupposes a Muslim society. One who's goal are not higher GNP but the fullfilment of the needs of society, specially the subsistence of less talented. I gives more talented and interpreneuring individuald the chance to become very rich. But not by exploiting the poorer co-citizens. Interest in forbidding because of this. If a poor man lends a sum, for necessity he should not have to pay interest. If he borrowes it to do buisiness he shoul compensate the owner of the money.

I really have to go. So pardon my spelling.

Peace.

The basis of this system is religion. It presupposes a Muslim society. One who's goal are not higher GNP but the fullfilment of the needs of society, specially the subsistence of less talented. I gives more talented and interpreneuring individuald the chance to become very rich. But not by exploiting the poorer co-citizens. Interest in forbidding because of this. If a poor man lends a sum, for necessity he should not have to pay interest. If he borrowes it to do buisiness he shoul compensate the owner of the money.

I really have to go. So pardon my spelling.

Peace.

Please reread your post and think about what you said

:bugeye:

Is there supposed to be a contradiction in what I wrote?

The basis of this system is religion. It presupposes a Muslim society. One who's goal are not higher GNP but the fullfilment of the needs of society, specially the subsistence of less talented. I gives more talented and interpreneuring individuald the chance to become very rich. But not by exploiting the poorer co-citizens. Interest in forbidding because of this. If a poor man lends a sum, for necessity he should not have to pay interest. If he borrowes it to do buisiness he shoul compensate the owner of the money.

I really have to go. So pardon my spelling.

Peace.

what gives? this sounds like socialism? did socialism work? I don't think so. did any muslim empire follow this & did it work there? the califate, the Seljik, the Mumluk, the Ottoman, the mohgol, the Khanate, plenty of chances, any of them work as advertised? proof? sources please

eh, though I agree P_M is basically a propaganda machine for Islam and that this topic is silly... it's hard for me to see how you are any less brainwashed than he is.

I couldn't help but notice the only word you capitalized in that sentence was "christianity" (including that sentence's first word). Your form of propaganda is, perhaps, a bit more subtle but it's propaganda nonetheless.

I'd even go so far as calling it insidious, at least P_M is straight forward.
thank you for noticing, actually, I don't always capitalise 'christianity', just felt like there,

am I brain-washed? well my brain is bright & shiny, no alzheimer's, no missing brain cells, (that I can count).

say Buffy, are you brain-washed? and how would you tell? or can you? can anyone?

say Buffy, are you brain-washed?

thats an odd question, of course I'm brainwashed. Brainwashing is a fundamental part of growing up. I guess the difference (as I see it) is that I'm aware of it, you and P_M genuinely seem to think you're right.

How is it that Randolfo can say what government systems do and don't work?

By what are judging a government working? General happiness, GNP, military buildup, ¿que, hombre?

How long the society lasts? Would that be a good judge for systems?
Because in that case, Muslim thoecracy would definitely win out; Saudi Arabia has been a theocratic monarchy for at least 1200 years.