fanatics are trying hard to make "Islam, the religion of war"

From: http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/asiapcf/10/20/pakistan.bhutto.ap/
Pakistan police question 3 men in bombing of Bhutto caravan

KARACHI, Pakistan (AP) -- Police questioned three people Saturday over the bombing of Benazir Bhutto's caravan, which killed at least 136 people and shattered what was intended to be a triumphant return from exile.


From: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,150930,00.html
27 Killed in Pakistan Bombing
Saturday, March 19, 2005

QUETTA, Pakistan — A bomb exploded Saturday as minority Shiite Muslims congregated at a shrine in a remote town in southwestern Pakistan (search), killing at least 27 people and wounding 18, police said.


From: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/07/13/AR2005071300336.html
Bombing in Iraq Kills Mostly Children
27 Die in Suicide Attack in Baghdad as U.S. Troops Hand Out Candy and Toys
By Andy Mosher and Khalid Alsaffar
Washington Post Foreign Service

Thursday, July 14, 2005; Page A19
BAGHDAD, July 13 -- Inside the morgue at Kindi Hospital lay the remains of Amjad Kudeer. Flying shrapnel from a suicide car bomb struck him in the head and chest Wednesday, killing him instantly. He was 13.


From: http://www.tcf.org/list.asp?type=NC&pubid=1028
The Proliferation of Suicide Bombings
Carl Robichaud, The Century Foundation, 6/10/2005
The June 13 attack on an American military convoy in Afghanistan—the third suicide bombing there in recent weeks—suggests that an alarming development may be under way: the importation of insurgent techniques from Iraq to Afghanistan.

From: http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/07/world/africa/07algeria.html
Suicide Bombing Kills 14 in an Algerian Town
By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
Published: September 7, 2007

ALGIERS, Sept. 6 (AP) — A suicide bomber detonated an explosive in the middle of a crowd awaiting a visit by Algeria’s president on Thursday, killing 14 people and wounding at least 60, said Interior Minister Noureddine Yazid Zerhouni.

Btw, this is not an anti-muslim rant, just the facts

Also, hopefully waiting for a muslim Gandhi or MLK to push islam into the next level, you know, peaceful

fanatics are trying hard to make "Islam, the religion of war"

All religions are about war.

My god is all powerful, your god has no power because your god is a fake and my god is real.

Na-na-na na-na...

religion has killed more people in history than plagues!

religion has killed more people in history than plagues!

No bullocks Vega man has killed man!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

A lot of the examples stated above such as Bhutto's bombing are politically motivated, along with the bombings of American soldiers, the Algerian crowd.
Add strong tribal and family influences into the mix and you cannot solely blame Islam as the root cause of all these bombings.
A lot of other muslims around the world are peaceful, have good relationships with their neighbours and form a part of the community. But those that have their land invaded, are politically volatile, or insecure, psychotic, will either see religion as an excuse or a barrier.

Radical Islamists have committed almost 10,000 deadly terror attacks SINCE 911.

Christians have committed 0.

Weekly Jihad Report, Oct. 13 - Oct. 19
Jihad Attacks: 45
Dead Bodies: 348
Critically Injured: 1021


Ramadan Bomb-a-thon
2007 Body Count Jihad Attacks: 282
Countries: 20
Dead Bodies: 1327
Critically Injured: 1648

Radical Islamists have committed almost 10,000 deadly terror attacks SINCE 911.

Christians have committed 0.

Weekly Jihad Report, Oct. 13 - Oct. 19
Jihad Attacks: 45
Dead Bodies: 348
Critically Injured: 1021


Ramadan Bomb-a-thon
2007 Body Count Jihad Attacks: 282
Countries: 20
Dead Bodies: 1327
Critically Injured: 1648

snap shots in time sandy snap shtos in time...

I dare you to go back...oh lets say a thousand years and then add them all up..... If you atke on snapshot in time you are bound tio get distortions.....

Kinda like doing a work measurement.... if iw as to base a job on the quickest member of staff doing that job for like 15 minutes then i will be screwed..

Its bloomin distortion

and how many innocent muslims have been killed by American bombs since 2001!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

it would be intersting if you could find this out for me Sandy

I don't care about history. I care about now. I care about keeping Americans alive despite terrorists desire to convert/kill us.

There is no distortion in the facts I posted. This is war. We will win.

I don't care about history. I care about now. I care about keeping Americans alive despite terrorists desire to convert/kill us.

There is no distortion in the facts I posted. This is war. We will win.
heya Sandex

of course you dotn care about histroy thats why there is trouble learning from past mistakes!!!!!
Win against who exactly Sandy?????
when you aint even doing anything about it!!!!

oh and how many innocent muslims ahve been killed by american bombs!???????????????????????

~~~~~~~~~~~
cheers
zak

I don't care about history. I care about now. I care about keeping Americans alive despite terrorists desire to convert/kill us.

In other words, you aren't interested in the fact that YOUR cult is responsible for murdering millions of people throughout history.

There is no distortion in the facts I posted. This is war. We will win.

"We" being Christian fundamentalists?

In other words, you aren't interested in the fact that YOUR cult is responsible for murdering millions of people throughout history.



"We" being Christian fundamentalists?
Sandy,
"Q" is right nhow do you explain that?

There is no distortion in the facts I posted. This is war. We will win.

We'll see.

Atheists have killed more than ANY religion can possibly DREAM of killing

But Islam is pretty bad right now man these supposed moderate Muslims should step up and stop it if Islam really is a religion of peace like they say it is

Sandy,
"Q" is right nhow do you explain that?

Hahahahahahahahahhahah

dont expect too much now vega!!!!!!!!!

heya Sandex of course you dotn care about histroy thats why there is trouble learning from past mistakes!!!!!
Win against who exactly Sandy????? when you aint even doing anything about it!!!! oh and how many innocent muslims ahve been killed by american bombs!???????????????????????
~cheers zak

We're doing as much as we can to prevent future Islamic terror attacks here including "spying" on terrorists' phone calls. We took out Saddam. We are making progress in Iraq.
We have killed very few "innocent" Muslims. The radical Islamic terrorists are doing most of the killing: :mad:

The Real 2006 'Iraq Body Count': 16,791 Iraqi civilians killed last year by ISLAMIC Terrorists!! 225* Iraqi civilians killed collaterally in incidents involving Americans and Islamic terrorists. Iraqis aren't dying from war. They are being murdered by Islamic terrorists. :mad:

*Source: IraqBodyCount.net (includes civilians caught in crossfire who may have been killed by the terrorists, and terrorists who may have been counted as civilians)

Screeching on about how Americans are killing "innocent" Muslims is getting old. I'm surprised you don't know the facts.

We WILL win the war on terror against radical Islamists. :bravo:

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Pages/IraqBodyCount2006.htm

Isn't the US arming the Sunni insurgents in Iraq? The ones that are responsible for most of the suicide attacks?

No. The ones responsible for most of the attacks are coming from Iran and Syria.

That makes no sense, their government is already in power (pro-Iran, pro-Syria). The Sunnis however, are receiving support from the Saudis, who do not want a pro-Iran Shia government next door. The Sunnis are also the Saddam legacy, so would suffer if the US were to leave and so have an interest in keeping the country destabilised. At the same time, they are anti-Shia and anti-US so a few car bombs here and there keep them happy.

We're doing as much as we can to prevent future Islamic terror attacks here including "spying" on terrorists' phone calls. We took out Saddam. We are making progress in Iraq.
We have killed very few "innocent" Muslims. The radical Islamic terrorists are doing most of the killing: :mad:

The Real 2006 'Iraq Body Count': 16,791 Iraqi civilians killed last year by ISLAMIC Terrorists!! 225* Iraqi civilians killed collaterally in incidents involving Americans and Islamic terrorists. Iraqis aren't dying from war. They are being murdered by Islamic terrorists. :mad:

*Source: IraqBodyCount.net (includes civilians caught in crossfire who may have been killed by the terrorists, and terrorists who may have been counted as civilians)

Screeching on about how Americans are killing "innocent" Muslims is getting old. I'm surprised you don't know the facts.

We WILL win the war on terror against radical Islamists. :bravo:

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Pages/IraqBodyCount2006.htm
sigh.............

thank you for your answer Sandex

but i am afraid with that attitude the situation will get worse..


Isn't the US arming the Sunni insurgents in Iraq? The ones that are responsible for most of the suicide attacks?

Well yes of course they are sam cos now they are gunning for Iran!!!!

thye dont really have a clue what they are doing at all in Iraq!!

~~~~~~~~
cheers
zak

Isn't the US arming the Sunni insurgents in Iraq? The ones that are responsible for most of the suicide attacks?
Maybe. And if we weren't, they'd be using whatever means necessary to kill each other and anyone else that gets in their way.

Get over it sam. They're fanatical, suicidal assholes. You think they're fighting against the west for their homeland? Wrong. They fucking hate each other, and it has nothing to do with us. They've been killing each other en masse in these backward tribal fuckwad areas of the world long before there even was a USA.

Also Sandy i was wondering whether you know what Saddam had to do with 9/11?????????

~~~~~~
cheers
zak

Many of the former terror-supporting Iraqis know we will win and are turning in terrorists. That kept the U.S. soldiers killed down to 0 last week.

Many of the former terror-supporting Iraqis know we will win and are turning in terrorists. That kept the U.S. soldiers killed down to 0 last week.

hey sandex

which ones are those

the non iraqis sunnis?
the saudi funded foriegn sunnis??
the suadi funded iraqi sunnis
the iraqis sunnis
the iranian funded shias
the iraqi government suppoprted shias
the other shias
the non politically involved sunnis or shias??

which ones are doign what

Also Sandy i was wondering whether you know what Saddam had to do with 9/11?????????
~~~~~~
cheers
zak

Possibly not much. His friendship with binLaden didn't help his case much. His harboring alQaeda didn't either. :mad:

911 was not about Saddam. It was about binLaden's attack on innocent Americans. It was the beginning of war. We will finish it.

We are not going to sit down and talk with the terrorists. We don't negotiate with them. We never will.* We will destroy them. :yay:

*Unless a lib gets into the WH. Then we will be told to convert or die--only this time it will be by liberal "Americans." :mad:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/10/24/0320/2227

Many of the former terror-supporting Iraqis know we will win and are turning in terrorists. That kept the U.S. soldiers killed down to 0 last week.

You just don't know when to stop lying, do you?

http://icasualties.org/oif/BY_DOD.aspx

Possibly not much. His friendship with binLaden didn't help his case much. His harboring alQaeda didn't either. :mad:

911 was not about Saddam. It was about binLaden's attack on innocent Americans. It was the beginning of war. We will finish it.

We are not going to sit down and talk with the terrorists. We don't negotiate with them. We never will.* We will destroy them. :yay:

*Unless a lib gets into the WH. Then we will be told to convert or die--only this time it will be by liberal "Americans." :mad:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/10/24/0320/2227

So, this is the Sandy who doesn't care about history, or the fact that her cult was responsible for millions of deaths. She claims to only be interested in now. Well, it would appear that Sandy is calling on her cult to murder more people, now. And then she will choose to ignore those deaths as well.

Possibly not much. His friendship with binLaden didn't help his case much. His harboring alQaeda didn't either. :mad:

911 was not about Saddam. It was about binLaden's attack on innocent Americans. It was the beginning of war. We will finish it.

We are not going to sit down and talk with the terrorists. We don't negotiate with them. We never will.* We will destroy them. :yay:

*Unless a lib gets into the WH. Then we will be told to convert or die--only this time it will be by liberal "Americans." :mad:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/10/24/0320/2227

sANDY


i LOVE YOU!!!!

i am working in the office today and i almost choked on my coffee reading yoru first sentence!!!! You are hilirious!!!! A securlar military dictator harbouring and being friends with ol' BIn lid!!!! yeah right!!!! And i will win the lottery tonight!!!!!!

I found it funny cos you i first asked you what you doin about 9/11 and you said we took out saddam now i n your second sentence here you say 9/11 was not about saddam.

if you wamnt to destroy terrorism perhaps you should look at the country which own like 6% of America
~~~~~~~~~
cheers
zak

sANDY
i LOVE YOU!!!!
i am working in the office today and i almost choked on my coffee reading yoru first sentence!!!! You are hilirious!!!! A securlar military dictator harbouring and being friends with ol' BIn lid!!!! yeah right!!!! And i will win the lottery tonight!!!!!!
I found it funny cos you i first asked you what you doin about 9/11 and you said we took out saddam now i n your second sentence here you say 9/11 was not about saddam.
if you wamnt to destroy terrorism perhaps you should look at the countrywhich own like 6% of America
~~~~~~~~~
cheers
zak
Go ahead and laugh. I know what I'm talking about. You get leftwing talking points. I actually read the documents. binLaden and Saddam were friends. How else do you explain the ring? And if you say "what ring?" that proves you know little about their relationship.

Maybe. And if we weren't, they'd be using whatever means necessary to kill each other and anyone else that gets in their way.

Get over it sam. They're fanatical, suicidal assholes. You think they're fighting against the west for their homeland? Wrong. They fucking hate each other, and it has nothing to do with us. They've been killing each other en masse in these backward tribal fuckwad areas of the world long before there even was a USA.

I'm guessing you've met many of them. Right?

Ever actually hear what Iraqis have to say for themselves?

http://iraquna.blogspot.com/

Or is it enough to make believe that they are "not us" and hence its alright to be in their country, destabilising their government and bombing their civilians?:bugeye:

Go ahead and laugh. I know what I'm talking about. You get leftwing talking points. I actually read the documents. binLaden and Saddam were friends. How else do you explain the ring? And if you say "what ring?" that proves you know little about their relationship.

Sandex

I love you!!!!

actually i wouldnt mind checkin these documents out!!! you got the links!!!

~~~~~~~~~~~~
Cheers
zak

Many of the former terror-supporting Iraqis know we will win and are turning in terrorists. That kept the U.S. soldiers killed down to 0 last week.

Stop lying.

Latest Coalition Fatality: Oct 25, 2007

10/27/07 MNF: MND-N unit attacked - 1 Soldier killed
A U.S. Soldier assigned to Multi-National Division - North was killed when he sustained small arms fire while conducting operations in Salah ad Din Oct. 25.

10/26/07 DoD Identifies Army Casualty
Pfc. Adam J. Chitjian, 39, of Philadelphia, Pa., died Oct 25 in Balad, Iraq, of injuries sustained when he came in contact with enemy forces using small arms during combat operations. He was assigned to 3rd Battalion, 8th Cavalry Regiment...

10/26/07 MNF: MND-B unit targeted by EFP - 1 soldier killed, 4 wounded
A Multi-National Division-Baghdad Soldier was killed and four others wounded when their unit was attacked with an explosively-formed penetrating device in a southern section of the Iraqi capital Oct. 25.

10/26/07 DoD Identifies Army Casualty
Staff Sgt. Robin L. Towns Sr., 52, of Upper Marlboro, Md., died Oct 24 in Bayji, Iraq, of wounds suffered when an improvised explosive device detonated near his Humvee during combat operations. He was assigned to the 275th Military Police Company...

Stop lying. It's a sin.

...

Spidey,

i will not have you talkign about the lovely Sandy in such a manner!!!

she never lies!!!!!!!!!

~~~~~~~~~

cheers
zak

I repeated a comment from O'Reilly that no one died last week. Maybe it was the week before. :confused:

I repeated a comment from O'Reilly that no one died last week. Maybe it was the week before. :confused:

YOU SEE SPIDEY!!!

the lovely sandey is just a little confused thats all.

give her a break!!!

~~~~~~~~

Cheers
zak

I repeated a comment from O'Reilly that no one died last week. Maybe it was the week before. :confused:

And here i was thinking at least you pasted some sources... but you repeating o rielly ? that sinks even lower in the scale of things.. Seriously, Being a hardcore conservative is bad enough , but listening to O Reilly is just gross.

hey sandex

which ones are those

the non iraqis sunnis?
the saudi funded foriegn sunnis??
the suadi funded iraqi sunnis
the iraqis sunnis
the iranian funded shias
the iraqi government suppoprted shias
the other shias
the non politically involved sunnis or shias??

which ones are doign what

Are you saying that there is no hope for Iraq without a cruel leader to keep people in line through fear?

I've wondered about this, myself.

YOU SEE SPIDEY!!!

the lovely sandey is just a little confused thats all.

give her a break!!!

~~~~~~~~

Cheers
zak

Confused, and possibly afflicted with multiple personality disorder, since she keeps referring to herself as "we".

So, this is the Sandy who doesn't care about history, or the fact that her cult was responsible for millions of deaths. She claims to only be interested in now. Well, it would appear that Sandy is calling on her cult to murder more people, now. And then she will choose to ignore those deaths as well.

Some observations, Sandy isn't Catholic, and the it was the Catholic Religion that was responsible for the Crusades, and the Inquisitions, actually Sandy's religion along with mine suffered under the Inquisitions of the Catholic's it was one of the reasons that America was founded, for the freedom to practice our religions.


Now lets look at a religion that is still killing heretics, apostates, and non- believers, a religion that is still using violence to make people convert or die, a religion that attacks any other religion in Dir al Islam, and destroys the houses of worship of any other religion, that religion is Islam.


Under Islam, land once possessed by Islam, if subsequently lost to an invader, remains land that is holy to Islam. It is especially imperative that such lost lands be restored to the rightful rule of Islam. Historically, of course, such lost lands now lost to Islam include not only Israel but large portions of Southern Europe, Spain and North Africa. Since Allah's will is for the entire world to come under subjection to the rule of Islam, Muslims are known for their zeal in spreading their religion, whether by peaceful means or by the sword.

Dar al-Islam (Arabic: دار الإسلام literally house of Peace) is a term used to refer to those lands under Islamic rule. In the orthodox tradition of Islam, the world is divided into two components: dar al-Islam, the house of peace and dar al-Harb, the house of war.

Dar al-Harb (Arabic: دار الحرب "house of war") is a term used to refer to those areas outside Muslim rule. The term traditionally refers to those lands administered by non-Muslim governments. The exact definitions of these territories can vary widely according to the viewer's concept of who is and is not a Muslim, and which governments are or are not Muslim in practice. The inhabitants of the Dar al-Harb are called harbi (Arabic: حربي), as opposed to dhimmi. A harbi has no rights, not even the right to live. If a harbi wants to enter the territory of Islam (dar al-islam) he needs a safe-conduct pass called an aman

The London-based Arabic language daily Asharq Al-Awsat interviewed Sheikh Yusuf al-Qaradawi on July 19, 2003, where he said:

"It has been determined by Islamic law that the blood and property of people of Dar Al-Harb [the Domain of Disbelief where the battle for the domination of Islam should be waged] is not protected."

Also, in an interview conducted in July 2003 by the Egyptian newspaper Al-Haqiqa, Dr. Sheikh Ali Gomaa said:

"...it is permitted to kill him, because he is a Harbi and the Harbi spreads corruption throughout the face of the earth."

Dar al-Harb and its associated terms are not found in the two most basic works of Islam, the Qur'an and the Hadith.

In Reliance of the Traveller, point w43.2, a hadith is referred to containing the exact word Dar al-Harb.

Even the Catholics no longer practice Crusade, or Inquisition, and the rest of the Christian Religions never did, so do some research about who is killing in the name of religion today.

And here i was thinking at least you pasted some sources... but you repeating o rielly ? that sinks even lower in the scale of things.. Seriously, Being a hardcore conservative is bad enough , but listening to O Reilly is just gross.

Can't post good sources anymore. They get deleted and I get infracted. :rolleyes:

O'Reilly is awesome. The number one rated cable tv commentary show. All fair and balanced too :bravo:

Are you saying that there is no hope for Iraq without a cruel leader to keep people in line through fear?

I've wondered about this, myself.

Imagine in the US having a white Christian Party, a Jewish Party, an African American party, a Hispanic party.

When your initial assumption of what constitutes administration is wrong, you cannot go right. The division of the Iraqi peoples into Sunni Shia and Kurds by the US administration has ensured that there can be no lasting peace. Ever see a news item about an American that includes his religious belief? The Jew Alan Greenspan, the Christian Bush, the Catholic Mexican immigrants, etc.

Imagine in the US having a white Christian Party, a Jewish Party, an African American party, a Hispanic party.

When your initial assumption of what constitutes administration is wrong, you cannot go right. The division of the Iraqi peoples into Sunni Shia and Kurds by the US administration has ensured that there can be no lasting peace.
Thanks SAM.
Please explain what should be done.

Are you saying that there is no hope for Iraq without a cruel leader to keep people in line through fear?

I've wondered about this, myself.
hey clusterman

thank youf or yoru input

OF COURSE THEIR IS HOPE CLUSTERMAN, but not with all the politics and econimic power shit going on behind the scenes, by muslims and non muslims.

to be honest muslism killng muslims is appaulign and there is no excuse what so ever for it... why we let other forces play us off like this is beyond me!!! i just wish we woudl rise above this nonsense!! perhaps then thinsg woudl change coupled with the all the external shit going too.

~~~~~~~
cheers
zak

Can't post good sources anymore. They get deleted and I get infracted. :rolleyes:

O'Reilly is awesome. The number one rated cable tv commentary show. All fair and balanced too :bravo:

pretty please wonderfull sandy!!

i amsure spidey and the gang wont mind!!

Can't post good sources anymore. They get deleted and I get infracted. :rolleyes:

O'Reilly is awesome. The number one rated cable tv commentary show. All fair and balanced too :bravo:

Post your sources. I promise no infractions.

~String

You know, Muslims and Christians have one thing in common. Higher Law. Which is the enemy of the American left. So why do muslims and the left appear to be united?

Anyone?

Some observations, Sandy isn't Catholic, and the it was the Catholic Religion that was responsible for the Crusades, and the Inquisitions, actually Sandy's religion along with mine suffered under the Inquisitions of the Catholic's it was one of the reasons that America was founded, for the freedom to practice our religions.

Christians killing other Christians. Christians were responsible for the Crusades. America was not founded to practice religions. :rolleyes:

Even the Catholics no longer practice Crusade, or Inquisition, and the rest of the Christian Religions never did, so do some research about who is killing in the name of religion today.

Denial?

You know, Muslims and Christians have one thing in common. Higher Law. Which is the enemy of the American left. So why do muslims and the left appear to be united?

Anyone?

That is an artifact of the times. The conservatives have replaced the liberals as the warmongerers. In theory, a conservative who wants low government and less taxes should oppose war, since war automatically lead to more government and higher taxes.:shrug:

In fact, the conservative philosophy of the necessity of religion and the love of tradition for political stability and a value based society, is very similar to the Islamic idea of an ideal society. The only part where we Muslims could possibly be different is in the obligations toward weaker members of society and the social welfare system built into the religious philosophy of Islam.

Thanks SAM.
Please explain what should be done.

It is too far gone now to be reversed, the idea that the Shias and Sunnis are discrete and opposite camps has already set in. What I would like to see is for the US to stop arming militant factions who want to overthrow the government. As usual, the US does not really agree with the popular choice since it means that it will increase the support for and power of Iran in that region; however, for them to support the Sunnis and hope for another Saddam is a bit too much. Plus, giving out feelers to the Kurds in the beginning for a separate Kurdistan has also led to more conflict since there are Kurds in not just Iraq but other countries like Turkey in the region. Its like a waviform explosion. :(

What the US can do now is move out, they have lost credibility and anything they say or do will be seen as another jingoistic trick.

Thanks SAM.
Please explain what should be done.


tee hee..

...sits down next to flux to listen at SAMS feet.

You know, Muslims and Christians have one thing in common. Higher Law. Which is the enemy of the American left. So why do muslims and the left appear to be united?

Anyone?

hey clusterman

there is mor ein common than that beleive me!!!

Jesus was a muslim for a start!!!

~~~~~~~
cheers
zak

My best NET sources for radical Islam updates are:

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/

Some other good sites/blogs are:

Jihad Watch:

http://jihadwatch.org/

Gates of Vienna:

http://gatesofvienna.blogspot.com/

LGF:

http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/

My best source for immigration news/updates is WND and:

http://wehategringos.com/

Most of my links to Ann Coulter and Debbie Schlussel are deleted as hate speech. :rolleyes:

My other links to WND, Boortz, Newsmax, Drudge, Savage, HotAir, FOX, etc... are just mocked. :rolleyes:

Jesus was a muslim for a start!!!

~~~~~~~
cheers
zak


Thanks Zak.

Was this "muslim Jesus" like others who spread the faith through conquest? Or just the promise of lower taxes?:confused:

Thanks Zak.

Was this "muslim Jesus" like others who spread the faith through conquest? Or just the promise of lower taxes?:confused:

well it like this clusterman

to be a msulim you need to submit to the will of God... obviosuly Jesus (PBUH) did what God commanded, so therefore he submitted to the will of God.

islam means to submit to the will of GOD

you were a muslim too, when you were in your mums womb and probaly for few months after you were born.

Nature is islamic, eg the treees and grass and plant life etc..

and for my sins i aint that islamic to at the moment!!!


~~~~~
cheerss
zak

Well, I don't think anyone's God wants people to strap bombs on their chests and walk into a crowd before setting it off...I could be wrong.
Yet these people are still called Muslims. Would you change their title if you had a choice?

Well, I don't think anyone's God wants people to strap bombs on their chests and walk into a crowd before setting it off...I could be wrong.
Yet these people are still called Muslims. Would you change their title if you had a choice?

I think they are frustrated young men, most of whom are probably not religious at all.

Based on studies, they are usually more educated and more aware of choices, so more likely to feel hard done by. Devout people would usually consider it all qadr and just resign themselves to it.

Well, I don't think anyone's God wants people to strap bombs on their chests and walk into a crowd before setting it off...I could be wrong.
Yet these people are still called Muslims. Would you change their title if you had a choice?

Suicide bombers and the mothafackas who get them to do such acts are the enemies of human kind!!!

Human kind is God's creation so i suspect he would be kinda pissed off with them!!

they may call themselves muslims but i would prefer to give them a different label!!!

~~~~~~~~
cheers
zak

well it like this clusterman

to be a msulim you need to submit to the will of God...

islam means to submit to the will of GOD

That would therefore encompass knowing the will and having the capacity to take the action of submitting to the will.

you were a muslim too, when you were in your mums womb and probaly for few months after you were born.

That wouldn't be possible for the exact reason stated above.

Nature is islamic, eg the treees and grass and plant life etc..

There are several billion people on the planet who would adamantly disagree with you.

And after just speaking with a tree, the perennials don't agree with you either.

I'm guessing you've met many of them. Right?

Ever actually hear what Iraqis have to say for themselves?

http://iraquna.blogspot.com/

Or is it enough to make believe that they are "not us" and hence its alright to be in their country, destabilising their government and bombing their civilians?:bugeye:
You mean the way they are bombing their own civilians and those of any other country that they take a disliking to? Long before we even got there? You mean the joke of a government they have? A bunch of "tribes" who'd sooner kill each other than take a crap in the morning?

Oh, I'm sorry. You must mean the overwhelming majority of the Islamic population who go out of their way to demonstrate how peaceful and tolerant they are of other cultures.

They've been sharing their cultural and religious tolerance with us for quite some time now. I think we get the message.

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html#Attacks

That would therefore encompass knowing the will and having the capacity to take the action of submitting to the will.



That wouldn't be possible for the exact reason stated above.



There are several billion people on the planet who would adamantly disagree with you.

And after just speaking with a tree, the perennials don't agree with you either.

Dear (Q)

thank youf ro yoru response...

i am sorry but i can nto explain it further, through my own in-abilities... But i think you are getting the wrong end of the stick, which again is probaly due to my not so good explaination.

Ok lets oput it like this.. you dont habve to knwo how to piss you just piss!!!

its like digesting food, your body just does it!!!! you dotn will your body to do it it just does!!!

~~~~~~
cheers
zak

Thanks, guys,(girl).

I hope that we can encourage strong minded folks like you to stay in their homelands and try to influence the radical powers (from anywhere) to keep out.

But, history shows that war will not be going away soon. On all sides we must work harder to reduce the hate and bring light to how alike we truley are.

Once again, thanks and goodbye for now.
Clusterflux

Thanks, guys,(girl).

I hope that we can encourage strong minded folks like you to stay in their homelands and try to influence the radical powers (from anywhere) to keep out.

But, history shows that war will not be going away soon. On all sides we must work harder to reduce the hate and bring light to how alike we truley are.

Once again, thanks and goodbye for now.
Clusterflux


excellent post cluster man!!!

I abosuletely agree with you!!!!

I posted the below in the Religion section:
(perhaps where this string belongs)

Wanted: a Muslim Reformation
National Post (Canada)
Sept 26, 2003

No religion has a monopoly on violence. Christianity has the Spanish Inquisition and the bloody excesses of the Crusades...."
But it will Not do to take the Politically Correct course and Lump all Religions in the Same basket, at least not insofar as our own era is concerned. Christian civilization underwent a Reformation in the 16th century, embraced the Enlightenment with its intellectual and theological pluralism, separated Church from State and encouraged scholarship and democracy. Judaism has followed a similar process -- as have, more recently, the faiths of the far East. Islam, on the other hand, is still struggling with this transition. And if there is to be peace in the Middle East and an end to terror worldwide, Muslims must accept that their faith is overdue for a doctrinal overhaul...."


"....Christianity still has its fanatical, bigoted elements. But those Christians who advocate the slaughter of non-believers make up an almost imperceptibly tiny fraction of the faithful. Much is made of the intolerant pronouncements of high-profile evangelists. A few deranged anti-abortion snipers aside, however, this is just talk. Even terrorists that claim to be part of the Christian world-- such as Spain's Basque extremists and America's Timothy McVeigh-- typically do not operate under any sort of religious aegis.

By contrast, a large minority of the world's one billion Muslims still adhere to militant interpretations of their faith, including the Wahabi sect of Sunni Islam, centred in and spread by Saudi Arabia. These interpretations all embrace as a central tenet the duty of jihad -- which, despite whitewashing efforts in the West, continues to mean what it has meant since the 7th century: the slaughter or forced conversion of non-Muslim "infidels." With few exceptions -- such as old-school Palestinian terrorists who cling to Marxist rhetoric -- Muslim terrorist groups all explicitly take Islam as their inspiration. Osama bin Laden is a Hero to Hundreds of Millions of Muslims, and al-Qaeda continues to receive financing from a wide array of Muslim charities.
Christians kill. Jews kill. Hindus kill. But no other faith group on the planet has embraced random slaughter in anything approaching the manner of radicalized Muslims.

The mainstream Arabic media is shot through with the most extreme sort of Hatred...
"Muslim advocacy organizations in the West, including Canada's own Canadian Islamic Congress, typically reject the claim that there is a problem with contemporary Islam, preferring to lay the world's problems at the feet of Israel and U.S. foreign policy.

Indeed, any Critical Scrutiny of their Religion is decried as "Bigotry"..... But it is evident these commentators are putting pride of faith above Truth.
The celebrations in the Islamic world on Sept. 11, 2001...."

Original link expired, The full article can now be found here:

http://www.jewishtoronto.com/content_display.html?ArticleID=85448

More Israli propaganda.

Israel is fast attaining the first place worldwide in torture and occupation as an official state policy.

Human kind is God's creation so i suspect he would be kinda pissed off with them!!

Why would a god create something only to be pissed off with it? And if he already knew he'd be pissed off with it before creating it, why bother to do so in the first place, and simply create things that would never piss him off?

they may call themselves muslims but i would prefer to give them a different label!!!

I also have some expletives I could impart here, but they ARE Muslims, my labels and yours are of no consequence. The fact that they have only a slightly different interpretation of Islam than you only serves to demonstrate just how dangerous a religion Islam is to mankind.

You mean the way they are bombing their own civilians and those of any other country that they take a disliking to? Long before we even got there? You mean the joke of a government they have? A bunch of "tribes" who'd sooner kill each other than take a crap in the morning?

Oh, I'm sorry. You must mean the overwhelming majority of the Islamic population who go out of their way to demonstrate how peaceful and tolerant they are of other cultures.

They've been sharing their cultural and religious tolerance with us for quite some time now. I think we get the message.

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html#Attacks

Yeah look at them invading and occupying countries on false pretexts, air bombing civilians who don't share their beliefs. Not to mention the missing millions of barrels of oil and the trillion dollars that they will not spend on welfare. You're right, the 1400 years the Iraqis have been living together makes no sense. Unlike other, more advanced countries, which are only based on wiping out everyone else, including the people who were there to begin with. Thats what I call tolerance. Sitting in the safety of a plane or tank and collateral damages, the height of bravery, intelligence and tolerance.

If they are so backward and tribal, what is the US still doing there? Why do they not get out?

More Israli propaganda.

Israel is fast attaining the first place worldwide in torture and occupation as an official state policy.That's from the National Post of Canada.

Funny, whenever I post something they don't like on ARAB boards (I post on a few) they Idiotically and Kneejerkingly call it "Zionist Propaganda" no matter what the topic.

What a Coincidence S.A.M. does the same.

BTW you never answered on what S.A.M. stood for.
Whether it had anything to do with your residence in Saudi Arabia. Or perhaps that you were also a Muslima?

Why would a god create something only to be pissed off with it? And if he already knew he'd be pissed off with it before creating it, why bother to do so in the first place, and simply create things that would never piss him off?.

Well their is evil around and some peopldo shit things... God does not control what we do



I also have some expletives I could impart here, but they ARE Muslims, my labels and yours are of no consequence. The fact that they have only a slightly different interpretation of Islam than you only serves to demonstrate just how dangerous a religion Islam is to mankind.

Ok glad you know what my interpretation of islam is??

thanks (q) i dotn even know it!!!!

Jewish toronto?

Yeah, very unbiased.

What do you call the IDF soldiers enjoyment of breaking arms and legs of four year olds?

Some junior commanders encouraged the brutality and even endorsed it. "After two months in Rafah a [new] commanding officer arrived ... So we do a first patrol with him. It's 6 A.M., Rafah is under curfew, there isn't so much as a dog in the streets. Only a little boy of four playing in the sand. He is building a castle in his yard. He [the officer] suddenly starts running and we all run with him. He was from the combat engineers. We all run with him. He grabbed the boy. Nufar, I am a degenerate if I am not telling you the truth. He broke his hand here at the wrist. Broke his hand at the wrist, broke his leg here. And started to stomp on his stomach, three times, and left. We are all there, jaws dropping, looking at him in shock ... The next day I go out with him on another patrol, and the soldiers are already starting to do the same thing."

Advanced secular warfare?

How would you expect any sane person to deal with this kind of oppression on a regular basis for decades?

The callousness of some of the soldiers produced extreme indifference to the Arabs' suffering: "We were in a weapon carrier when this guy, around 25, passed by in the street, and just like that, for no reason, he didn't throw a stone, did nothing - bang, a bullet in the stomach - he shot him in the stomach and the guy is dying on the sidewalk and we keep going, apathetic. No one gave him a second look."

There were some tough soldiers who developed an ideology holding that even minor events necessitated a brutal response. "A 3-year-old kid, he can't throw, he can't hurt you no matter what he does, but a kid of 19 can. With women I have no problem. With women, one threw a clog at me and I kicked her here [pointing to the crotch], I broke everything there. She can't have children. Next time she won't throw clogs at me. When one of them [a woman] spat at me I gave her the rifle butt in the face. She doesn't have what to spit with anymore."

Most of the soldiers who were interviewed vividly recollect their first encounter with brutality. In one case, while still in basic training, they served as escorts for a group of suspects. "They took the Arabs, the commanding officers did, and put them on the bus between the back door and the last seat, put them only between the seats. On their knees. Then they told us: Within two minutes - and this is still just basic training - within two minutes everyone is on the bus. No one steps on the seats ... And everyone started to trample them [the Arabs] and step on them on the run ... It was a really bad winter. Minus 4 degrees [Centigrade] and rain and hail ... They each went out in the middle of the night ... They weren't given time to dress. Some of them had clogs, short-sleeved shirts ... Everyone opened the windows deliberately. People poured water on them from the canteens, so they would freeze from the cold. And the whole way they were bombarded with blows ... and I mean the whole way."

Another soldier describes one of the first times he entered a house to arrest an Arab, "an absolute giant, around 30, maybe. Rampaging. We shout at him to lie down, we hit him, but he doesn't lie down, he wants to escape ... These four guys show up and throw stones at him from all sides, and we are beating up on him ... Lie down! Lie Down! Lie down! Until in the end he lies down ... We get to company headquarters and it turns out he lost consciousness ... and a few days later he is dead."
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/909589.html

This is when they are not suffering daily military incursions, bulldozed houses, having sonic booms at night or being denied access to basic necessities like electricity, food, sanitation and medical supplies?

The Article was originally in the National Post/canada - 'jewishtoronto' only LATER picking it up as the original link expired.
As I said in the post. Doh!

and then YOU Cite Ha'aretz!
TRUE "Israeli Propaganda"/Source
(and put up your daily, but OFF-topic, anti-Israel Talking points)

LOL

Ok lets oput it like this.. you dont habve to knwo how to piss you just piss!!!

its like digesting food, your body just does it!!!! you dotn will your body to do it it just does!!!

Other than being one of the most ridiculous things I've ever read here, it's gotta be one of the funniest, too.

I suppose the fact that most Muslims are located in certain regions of the world, one can conclude that taking a piss and digesting food has some other progenitor in other regions of the world?

Of course, we could all just be Muslims and don't know it.

My sides are asplit.

Other than being one of the most ridiculous things I've ever read here, it's gotta be one of the funniest, too.

I suppose the fact that most Muslims are located in certain regions of the world, one can conclude that taking a piss and digesting food has some other progenitor in other regions of the world?

Of course, we could all just be Muslims and don't know it.

My sides are asplit.

heya (Q)

i am glad you find my post amusing!!!

i guess you cant undertsand my logic in the same way i cant undetsrand yours!!!

however i do try not to mock someone in a srious discussion such as this

~~~~~~~~
cheers
zak

Well their is evil around and some peopldo shit things... God does not control what we do

But, he created that evil as he created all things. He is all-knowing, and should have known he would be creating the evil things people do.

It is Allah Who created the seven heavens and of the earth the same number, the Command descending down through all of them, so that you might know that Allah has power over all things and that Allah encompasses all things in His knowledge. (Surat at-Talaq: 12)

You do not engage in any matter or recite any of the Qur'an or do any action without Our witnessing you while you are occupied with it. Not even the smallest speck eludes your Lord, either on earth or in heaven. Nor is there anything smaller than that, or larger, which is not in a Clear Book. (Surah Yunus: 61)

What is in the heavens and in the earth belongs to Allah. Allah encompasses all things. (Surat an-Nisa': 126)

He knows what is in front of them and behind them. But their knowledge does not encompass Him. (Surah Ta Ha : 110)

Never forget that Allah has everything under His control. As is stated in the Qur'an, "No leaf falls without His knowing it" (Surat al-An'am: 59)

Ok glad you know what my interpretation of islam is??

thanks (q) i dotn even know it!!!!

Then, your interpretation must be exactly the same as the fundamentalists, or else I wouldn't have mentioned it most likely wasn't.

heya (Q)

i am glad you find my post amusing!!!

i guess you cant undertsand my logic in the same way i cant undetsrand yours!!!

however i do try not to mock someone in a srious discussion such as this

~~~~~~~~
cheers
zak

Currently zak, I am seeing absolutely no logic whatsoever in your posts, that is why I'm responding. If you can't see how utterly ridiculous your claims are, then there is no reason not to mock you.

But, he created that evil as he created all things. He is all-knowing, and should have known he would be creating the evil things people do.

It is Allah Who created the seven heavens and of the earth the same number, the Command descending down through all of them, so that you might know that Allah has power over all things and that Allah encompasses all things in His knowledge. (Surat at-Talaq: 12)

You do not engage in any matter or recite any of the Qur'an or do any action without Our witnessing you while you are occupied with it. Not even the smallest speck eludes your Lord, either on earth or in heaven. Nor is there anything smaller than that, or larger, which is not in a Clear Book. (Surah Yunus: 61)

What is in the heavens and in the earth belongs to Allah. Allah encompasses all things. (Surat an-Nisa': 126)

He knows what is in front of them and behind them. But their knowledge does not encompass Him. (Surah Ta Ha : 110)

Never forget that Allah has everything under His control. As is stated in the Qur'an, "No leaf falls without His knowing it" (Surat al-An'am: 59)



Then, your interpretation must be exactly the same as the fundamentalists, or else I wouldn't have mentioned it most likely wasn't.

Currently zak, I am seeing absolutely no logic whatsoever in your posts, that is why I'm responding. If you can't see how utterly ridiculous your claims are, then there is no reason not to mock you.

Fantastuc stuff (Q), i mgoijn gn home now!!!

God knows all bad as well and allows you to do it, that is why muslims in the west are better muslims and are more free to be muslism htan theyare imn the socalled muslims states!!!!!!

Bye Zak; now that I know you are going home I will stop you from doing it as knowledge equals the desire and ability as well as the necessity to control. :crazy:

Sometimes people are so busy checking out other peoples logic that they fail to see any absence of their own.

Fantastuc stuff (Q), i mgoijn gn home now!!!

In other words, when the going gets tough, you run and hide?

God knows all bad as well and allows you to do it

You're wrong, he created the evil and the people to commit it. He then put into motion the evil and followed through to the end, all the time knowing the exact results. That is what must be concluded directly from scriptures.

You're wrong, he created the evil and the people to commit it. He then put into motion the evil and followed through to the end, all the time knowing the exact results. That is what must be concluded directly from scriptures.

not exactly!!!!! good try though!!!

you see i'm not gone yet, i just knew you;d miss me to much:D

not exactly!!!!! good try though!!!

The scriptures are right in front of you. You are free to be a hypocrite and deny them if you wish. That is your prerogative as a follower of that cult.

The scriptures are right in front of you. You are free to be a hypocrite and deny them if you wish. That is your prerogative as a follower of that cult.

Alternatviely you could just pick and chose what you want to read and what suits your opinion and idea!! Hey (q) just like the fundies do!!!!

Alternatviely you could just pick and chose what you want to read and what suits your opinion and idea!! Hey (q) just like the fundies do!!!!

I am reading scriptures. They do not suit my opinion or idea. I am interpreting them just as you do or as the 'fundies' do.

The problem here exactly is that YOU are claiming to know the correct interpretation over me and the 'fundies.'

Therefore, if we were to go by YOUR logic, YOU are also interpreting them to suit YOUR opinions and ideas.

Isn't it hilarious how you keep trying to turn this around and keep ending up the hypocrite?

More Israli propaganda.

That's from the National Post/Canada; Link expired and I found a secondary link only later... 'jewishtoronto'.

Funny, whenever I post something they don't like on ARAB boards (I post on a few) they Idiotically and Kneejerkingly call it "Zionist Propaganda" no matter what the topic.

What a Coincidence S.A.M. does the same.

BTW you never answered on what S.A.M. stood for.
Whether it had anything to do with your admitted residence in Saudi Arabia. Or perhaps that you were also by previous admission, a Muslima?

I am reading scriptures. They do not suit my opinion or idea. I am interpreting them just as you do or as the 'fundies' do.

The problem here exactly is that YOU are claiming to know the correct interpretation over me and the 'fundies.'

Therefore, if we were to go by YOUR logic, YOU are also interpreting them to suit YOUR opinions and ideas.

Isn't it hilarious how you keep trying to turn this around and keep ending up the hypocrite?


hi (q)

thank you for your apparsal fo the situation.

i was just wodnering why you are trying to prove what you are trying to prove

have a gtreat weekend

~~~~~~~~~
take care
zak

Casualties are down because patrols are down. Bombing from the air is up dramatically, perhaps to give Bush the appearance the "surge" is working? ...and at the expense of the counterinsurgency.

Air Force and Navy aircraft dropped 437 bombs and missiles in Iraq in the first six months of 2007, a fivefold increase (http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/071507Y.shtml)over the 86 used in the first half of 2006, and three times more than in the second half of 2006, according to Air Force data. In June, bombs dropped at a rate of more than five a day.

hi (q)

thank you for your apparsal fo the situation.

i was just wodnering why you are trying to prove what you are trying to prove

I was merely pointing out your claim that un-born babies or newborns aren't Muslims or Christians or anything else. They have neither the capacity to understand the claims of these religions, never mind the capacity to reject or accept those claims.

You might dress up a newborn in a burkha, but that doesn't make them a Muslim.

I was merely pointing out your claim that un-born babies or newborns aren't Muslims or Christians or anything else. They have neither the capacity to understand the claims of these religions, never mind the capacity to reject or accept those claims.
.


Hey Q

I hope you ahd a good weekend

I undertsand what you are saying but i have probably explained things very badly.

from my point of view (and of course thjis is only my understanding) If God created everything then he created nature which therefore means nature is governed by God, and therefore does God's wishes, if you submitt to the wishes of God yoh are a Muslim, so as Christians can not deny that Jesus (PBUH) and all the biblical prohets (PBUT) did not submit to the will of God therefore makes them muslim too....

This is from theist point of view.

I know you are going to give me pelters for this but i am not arguing with the atheists but i was trying to explain to clusteringFlux, how similar Islam and Christianity are, and in fact their shoudl not be any fights betweeen them etc...


I probably still havent explained it properly!!



You might dress up a newborn in a burkha, but that doesn't make them a Muslim.


you are absolutely correct with this statement

~~~~~~
take care
zak