Do you think so?

Winning together is definately moral

but winning make loser painful.

Like everything, it depends on time and place. Nothing is ever good or evil by its own power, it first needs to be put in a situation. Is winning bad WHEN it makes people feel bad? Again, it depends on the circumstances.

yeah, too vague

in a fair game, maybe?

Winning is not immoral. The method of victory is what can be subject to categories of moral vs immoral, and even those are subject to cultural mores.

Only if i win.

Life is about winning. Death is about losing.

Winning is neither moral or immoral.

Winning has nothing to do with morals whatsoever. All it is is doing better than someone else with respect to a predetermined set of rules and criteria. It's completely objective, and the "decision" to win has nothing to do with right and wrong.

what in the freaking world are you talking about are you asking that seriously?

there is no such thing. it depends. if it is being moral, i would assume?

winning what. wtf

For there to be a winner there must be a loser, in everything. [This can require some adept use of words to demonstrate for all case.] Losing is often seen as negative, as bad, as undesirable and consequently as unpleasant, demeaning. Is it right, through our act of winning, to force these unpleasant experiences on the losers?

It's not whether you win or lose, it's how you play the game :)

Do you think so?
Depends on who is winning. If I am winning, yes. If my enemy is winning, then no.

Winning is not immoral. The method of victory is what can be subject to categories of moral vs immoral, and even those are subject to cultural mores. How come U won getting a bigger Avatar, Thats not fair, Whats the secret Old Cow ?

the secret is that he is an old cow, so stop your whining

the secret is that he is an old cow, so stop your whining
So after how long will I get my promotions ?

You know, I have no idea why my avatar is bigger than everyone else's except that I got mine when they were first available. Maybe Dave was using larger parameters for avatars at the time. It was just a matter of being in the right place at the right time. If Dave was to ask me to select a new avatar that would better fit the parameters he's using for newbies, I certainly would have no problem with it. I hardly consider the size of an avatar an adequate yardstick for measuring an individual's worth or potential.

Either that or Dave just likes me better. :p

Is winning moral?

You'll never get an answer form a logician, since everyone has their own conception of morality (including a minority who have nothing against murder: they're usually called "psychopaths" and no-one takes their views seriously) and there's no basis for considering anyone's view "better" than anyone else's.

I propose that any question of the type "Is xyz moral?" be automatically accompanied by a poll, since what's accepted as morally right or wrong is usually decided by the majority.

Flipping the human switch back on, I'd take a step back and ask "Is competition moral?" since competition automatically results in a winner and loser. Personally I don't like competition very much, except in circumstances where I'm sure I'll win and I don't like the people I'm competing with a lot...

Competition is not moral or immoral.

A competition could be.

A competetor could be.

But competition in and of itself, depends on the parameters that define the particular contest. Without those parameters, how can it be something to be judged?

Could defining those parameters always be immoral?

Let's see the argument.

Of course, give the relativity of morality - your argument can stand for no more than your opinion, or your impression of a common cultural practice.

Competition is not immoral or wrong. Competition is a part of human nature, and really, all animal's natures. It is what drives any species to excell and survive. It is what placed our species at the pinnacle of evolution.

He he, maybe surviving, excelling, and being at the pinnacle of evolution is immoral...

Just because everyone does it...

Dave sounds like God.

It is what placed our species at the pinnacle of evolution.Get a grip. You usually make sense - even if it is convoluted and emotional. Who told you humans were the peak of evolution? Evolution doesn't have pinnacles or peaks. We aren't as succesful as rats or cockroaches, and don't mention the bacteria.

Singularity- Dave sounds like God? Dare I ask what you mean? As far as I know he still runs this site, so it would only be polite to acquiesce to a simple request if I insist on using it.

Do you think so?Some battles must be lost.

It depends on what you are fighting for.

To loose by effort may be just as immoral.

Some people like to give themselves complete rule over another one, *that* may be immoral, since we should swallow our pride in order for another person to grow. It isn't so much to give up if you haven't won, just wait until you think he has a match over you. We shouldn't fight with those smaller than ourselves (and if we do, not in a way that makes them smaller, but in a way that makes them grow), you pick your fights.

Wolf chases rabbit. Rabbit tries to evade wolf. Wolf catches, kills and eats rabbit. Rabbit loses and wolf wins. Damned wolfs are immoral. Rabbit should have caught, killed and eaten the the wolf.

But, what the hell. That's life. If you don't like it,http://www.fullsizebronco.com/forum/images/smilies/piss2.gifyou're welcome to leave it.

Singularity- Dave sounds like God? Dare I ask what you mean? As far as I know he still runs this site, so it would only be polite to acquiesce to a simple request if I insist on using it.

Oh Dear Dave,

I pray U thee,

For U to givmee,

An Options to shoew my beauty,

by having a 80x80 Avatar please.

And I will make U happy,

as a woman can do to a man.

Get a grip. You usually make sense - even if it is convoluted and emotional. Who told you humans were the peak of evolution? Evolution doesn't have pinnacles or peaks. We aren't as succesful as rats or cockroaches, and don't mention the bacteria.
True, but we have a higher sense of self than bacteria and roaches, and are more intelligent for our size than most other organisms that we know of.

Singularity No, no. You have to stick a dead black cat into a burlap sack and swing it over your head three times in a graveyard on a full moon at midnight. This will either give you a larger avatar or else will cure your warts if your name happens to be Tom Sawyer. :)

Singularity No, no. You have to stick a dead black cat into a burlap sack and swing it over your head three times in a graveyard on a full moon at midnight. This will either give you a larger avatar or else will cure your warts if your name happens to be Tom Sawyer. :) :rolleyes:

Thanks for the advice Grandma.

Who is Tom Sawyer

Who is John Galt?

Okay, I can no longer resist:

Who's your daddy?

Yeah pardon, but it's been bugging me all day. :P

Who is Tom Sawyer
What're you, a mental failure? You have to be joking. Tom Sawyer is a very famous iconic character from Mark Twain's story "The Adventures of Tom Sawyer and Huckleberry Finn".

Yeah, that pretty much says all we need to know about the name. "Singularity" must describe the number of brain cells.

What're you, a mental failure? You have to be joking. Tom Sawyer is a very famous iconic character from Mark Twain's story "The Adventures of Tom Sawyer and Huckleberry Finn". I live on a deserted island.

I live on a deserted island.
Then use wikipedia inbetween scrounging for coconuts. It's quite the informative site.

Now I get it, U think I am tryin to make U work for me and all this time I thought
Tom Sawyer is some one in SciForums just like Dave.

U win I loose.

Moron. Tom Sawyer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Adventures_of_Tom_Sawyer) and Huckleberry Finn (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adventures_of_Huckleberry_Finn) are characters (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_characters_in_the_Tom_Sawyer_series) in two of Mark Twain's (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Twain) books.

Moron. Tom Sawyer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Adventures_of_Tom_Sawyer) and Huckleberry Finn (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adventures_of_Huckleberry_Finn) are characters (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_characters_in_the_Tom_Sawyer_series) in two of Mark Twain's (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Twain) books.

U r such a kind person

http://www.answers.com/main/ntquery?s=Tom+Sawyer&gwp=13

Apparently this deserted island has internet access, if not a basic spelling course.

Most moral philosophers today agree that it isn’t always wrong or immoral to harm a person. For example, if I arrive at the store and buy the last gallon of milk moments before another person arrives who also wanted to buy milk, then I have definitely harmed him – but I haven’t acted immorally. So no, most philosophers would agree that winning isn’t wrong.

Also, if you are playing some sort of game in which there has to be a winner and a loser then it could be argued that the other party implicitly accepted the possibility that they would lose when they agreed to play.

Most moral philosophers today agree that it isn’t always wrong or immoral to harm a person. For example, if I arrive at the store and buy the last gallon of milk moments before another person arrives who also wanted to by milk, then I have definitely harmed him – but I haven’t acted immorally. So no, most philosophers would agree that winning isn’t wrong.

Also, if you are playing some sort of game in which there has to be a winner and a loser then it could be argued that the other party implicitly accepted the possibility that they would lose when they agreed to play.

uhm.....WOW..... *Aplause* Wow... now me and my anurism are going to chew on this

Apparently this deserted island has internet access, if not a basic spelling course. So U havent yet heard about the satellite phones.

So where'd you buy your access point? You did say "deserted". U doo no wut dat implys, rite?

What if I own a Helipad ?

You don't.

How about a highspeed boat ?

Winning is a brief form of liberation from the possessions of the great matrix called the mind, which by the way comes in many different forms like games. It is independent of morality because people win in games like poker for instance.

Gambling is a sin.

Competition in itself is not immoral. To win, at it's roots is to feel safe and comfortable in knowing what you can overcome. It can also be to feel too much pride and love to see people down or mad. To love or not mind losing is to lose a lust for life. Yet it can also be that you are more secure and don't mind others seeing your weak points, ie, you trust them. Either way can be wrong or right, depending on the intention. It's a fine line. It can be a melting pot of different emotions when either happens and our reasoning or lack thereof defines which way we take it.

How is gambling a sin?

I was employing irony because I was bored, mocking those who do say it is a sin. As a potential casino investor I could not view it that way.

Making money without work is a Sin for me. Because U r getting money out of other people working for U.

Thats is no different than robbing, except being leagally allowed.

So you don't have a savings account on your desert island. No pension fund. No deposits at the Credit Union.

So you don't have a savings account on your desert island. No pension fund. No deposits at the Credit Union.

I do and its mine, I worked for it and if I dont get interest rate on it
I might die in my old ages.

Giving money for others to use and built their future is good amount of work. BUT

I dont need any Shares,

I dont want to be owner of a company which I never visit and earn billions out of it without working on its products.

So, we are agreed, you are a hypocrite.

Making money without work is a sin, you say, yet you admit you make money from your savings account without work.

Making money without work is a sin, you say, yet you admit you make money from your savings account without work.

Inheritance is a sin, hm?

Winning is moral. Slice someone throat if he/she threatens you, win that battle. You see your friend's new mercedez...go silently trash it...size of the wallet matters so do all things you own and so does winning. Winning is moral, if you gotta survive then go kill them all just to breath that last oxygen molecule left in this world. Winning is moral. In fact everything that you do in this universe is moral, you are entitled to be the ruler of this universe and only you can be the winner, there are no others, there is no pity. Love if love is to win, hate if hate is to win, kill if killing is to win, by all sakes winning is moral.

I guess so is finding money on the ground.

I guess so is finding money on the ground.
And if someone else picks it up before you, you know it is moral to take that money, because they do not belong to that someone else, the money belongs to you only, you are the owner of the money, it is moral for you and you only to win, to get that money and use as you desire.

But if somebody gets to it before you, then it's in their possession. Possession being 9/10ths of the law, looks like they win 9 to 1. Sorry for any confusion. I was responding to the idea of not working for money being somehow sinful.

This reminds me of an old George Carlin bit where he said he liked shopping out of other people's carts at the store. They'd say something like "Hey! That's mine!" He'd say "Not yet it isn't!"

Inheritance is a sin, hm? No because My dad worked very hard all his life so that his children can have a good life.

He worked on individual products directly, not as an Investor.

Thats a family matter.


Investor = Manipulator

So, we are agreed, you are a hypocrite.

Making money without work is a sin, you say, yet you admit you make money from your savings account without work.

Is winning moral? Well that depends who you are, where you are and what year it is!

Morality (regardless of related to winning or not) is a cultural concept thing is it not?We civilised folk for example consider cannabolism amoral (most of us!) but cannibals don't!

You enter a race, you win by tripping your opponent before the winning post, was your win moral? is cheating to achieve a win moral? The answer is in culture, some cultures may teach that cheating in order to win is totally acceptable and hence moral others not so.

Morality is not a 'real' thing is a construct of our political/cultural/educational/philosophical learning. We are taught morals!


Would 'wild' humans have morality?

Ophiolite

I had already answered thoes questions, If U cant read, use specs.

Isn´t moral the way you practice your ethic? We dont all have the same ethics in life? Or do "we"?

Ophiolite

I had already answered thoes questions, If U cant read, use specs.Your answers with ambiguous, illogical, inconsistent and either hypocritical or foolish. I thought you would appreciate a second chance.

Your answers with ambiguous, illogical, inconsistent and either hypocritical or foolish. I thought you would appreciate a second chance.

your r such a Dumbo.

Large ears are a distinguishing feature of my family.