Is the U.S guilty of:




* paying movie stars and sports players astronomical amounts while millions starve.
* Wasting food constantly
*Taking resources from other countries often times inflicting pain (diamonds-Africa)
*Unrightfully trying to control other countries(Bully mentality)
*Don't help countries that don't benefit U.S. (Genocide-Rawanda)
*Was founded&has benefited deliciously upon slavery and blood-shed
*Hiring Osma Bin Laden to torment other small countries
*Stating that welfare was restitution for slavery
*Allowed the K.K.K.(terriorist orgainization) to give hate speeches at the Hall Of Justice.(Kentucky)
*Only cares about Oil not the Middle East conflict
*Manipulation (Media)
*Claimed to be a christian nation.(No proof in that pudding)
*Has mixed church&state(Roman Catholic)
*Purposely infected minorities with diseases(syphillis)
*abhorring most of the world's resources
*Cater to the rich(George Bush)

Listed above are a few crimes the U.S. is guilty of but is there anything the U.S. is guilty of concerning the muslim's?(speak now or forever hold your peace)

you forgot

*restricting constitutional rights to assembly (those stupid new anti-terrorism laws)
*imprisoning innocents (mumia abu-jammal)
*police brutality (this happened recently in my own state. recently in portland [the largest city in maine], an anti-war protest took place in which the police asked protestors to move away from the streets, which they did, and proceded to take "safety precautions" against them anyway. which means forcing innocent men to the ground and grinding their faces into the asphault.

what the hell is wrong with us? for more of America's injustice and a look at non-biased world news, check out http://www.indymedia.org

<a href="http://zap.to/twistednook" target="newwindow">http://zap.to/twistednook</a>

Indynews isn't exactly free of bias. It's actually insanely bias towards the left.

They are hugely against the evection of squatters in Toronto, for example. When confronting one of these people I advise you say "so I got a solution, just let the squatters all stay in your house and on your lawn." So far I haven't met one who says they'd be willing. But they want Home Depot to continue letting their land go to waste to let people who want free land sell crack and raise families in poor, poor conditions.

true, they may be a very left organization, but at least they let you read the stories that others wouldn't let you see. and they offer a different perspective than that of most news organizations.

but, point well taken nonetheless

"* paying movie stars and sports players astronomical amounts while millions starve."
So you don't want capitalism? You'd prefer maybe socialism? Communism?

"* Wasting food constantly"
I pay for the food I eat. Government enforced food eating laws is maybe the way to go?

"*Taking resources from other countries often times inflicting pain (diamonds-Africa)"
That was Britain.

"*Unrightfully trying to control other countries(Bully mentality)"
Sure, why not.

"*Don't help countries that don't benefit U.S. (Genocide-Rawanda)"
So the US should be required to help every country on earth? Do you have any idea how much money that would take? Of course we help countries that may have a potential benefit. You don't just go around throwing money at people at random on the street, do you?

"*Was founded&has benefited deliciously upon slavery and blood-shed"
Actually the US was among the first countries to outlaw slavery... middle eastern countries benefited from slavery for nearly a thousand years more than the US. BTW, name one major country that *wasn't* founded on bloodshed of some kind. Every country has blood in its history.

"*Hiring Osma Bin Laden to torment other small countries"
Bin Laden is on a US payroll??? :confused:

"*Stating that welfare was restitution for slavery"
Who says slavery needs restitution? I didn't enslave anyone, why should I pay restitution?

"*Allowed the K.K.K.(terriorist orgainization) to give hate speeches at the Hall Of Justice.(Kentucky)"
So you *don't* like freedom of speech, then?

"*Only cares about Oil not the Middle East conflict"
Well, people do like driving their cars...

"*Manipulation (Media)"
You forgot putting flouride in water as a mind-control agent.

"*Claimed to be a christian nation.(No proof in that pudding)"
Bah, I could care less if some politician claims the US is a christian nation.

"*Has mixed church&state(Roman Catholic)"
Aside from a few small cases, the US government is uninfluenced by the church. It's not like the pope is the president, or anything...

"*Purposely infected minorities with diseases(syphillis)"
The only case of this happening was smallpox with the native americans. Syphillis is *gasp!* possible to contract if you're white. That's like saying AIDS was engineered to get rid of gays.

"*abhorring most of the world's resources"
Mmmm, this oil tastes *SO* yummy...

"*Cater to the rich(George Bush)"
Money buys stuff. Rich people have money. Should we make it illegal to be rich?

Sorry, I was gonna stay out of this one, but I couldn't resist

So you don't want capitalism? You'd prefer maybe socialism? Communism?

Communism isn't such a bad idea. But it would have to be Pure Communism

Sure, why not.

I've already had this arguement, so no comment here

So you *don't* like freedom of speech, then?

Its more of the primative and barbaric things they stand for

You forgot putting flouride in water as a mind-control agent

Dude, cut down on the GTA3

Aside from a few small cases, the US government is uninfluenced by the church. It's not like the pope is the president, or anything...


Excuse me, where did you hear that? The US government is HEAVILY influenced by the church

People like bashing the US because it is in the spot light of the world right now. This thread is pointless.

Why don't you make one for France, Britian, Russia, India, Japan, Iraq, China, South Africa....especially the last one.

Lady

I'm confused about something:Listed above are a few crimes the U.S. is guilty of but is there anything the U.S. is guilty of concerning the muslim's?Well, what about the list you provided?

• Unrightfully trying to control other countries: While this is not limited exclusively to Muslim-populated nations, does this "crime" not extend to affect Muslims?

• Hiring Osma Bin Laden to torment other small countries: While this particular factoid has slipped by me as either insignificant or I simply haven't heard it, it is true that the US helped raise the Taliban to power in Afghanistan, and thus supported government-sponsored oppression of Muslim peoples.

• Only cares about Oil not the Middle East conflict: How can this not extend to affect the Muslim peoples of the Mideast? Remember that we aided and abetted the Shah of Iran in exchange for petroleum favors, and that the Shah's oppression led to a revolution which would install Ayatollah Ruollah Khomeni.

It seems to me that these issues negatively affect Muslims around the world, and by our American will.

Furthermore, there is one big one you seem to have missed::

• The US is contractually obliged, by its commitments to international bodies, to be the primary protector and advocate of the Israeli occupation of the Palestine. Americans, in effect, help suppress the Palestinians.

Aside from that, I'd say it's largely a matter of ideology. Just as George Bush stooped to meet Osama Bin Laden by saying that "God is on our side", so, too, do many Americans think poorly of Islam. There is a growing number of Americans voicing opinions similar to Jerry Falwell's, attempting to depict Islam as a violent philosophy, and this sets the stage for a standoff of paradigms.

In the end, it's a strange balance. There's a hullaballoo in Iran over public morality because a director and an actress made physical contact during an awards ceremony; physical contact 'twixt the genders is prohibited unless the parties are related. Sounds ridiculous to most of us. Yet at the same time, what sounds ridiculous to a Muslim? We, the US, may tout our morals and vaunt our principles, but we have the highest teen-unwed birth rate in the first world, we have a festering violent-crime epidemic, our politicians steal just as much, if not more, than the tyrants, our private sector is riddled with corruption--it doesn't really seem like that much better a shot when you get right down to it.

And in the end,it is true that the Muslims are wrong in this dispute. But so are the Christians, the Americans, the men, the women--draw any political grouping you want, and I guarantee you they're wrong. Many will have aspects of correctness, but none will be purely correct.

And that, frankly, is what most people in the world seem to miss.

The US has done much, though, to piss off the Muslim world. It's not worth two towers, or a war, or any of it, but more disturbing than the cost is the fact that it seems acceptable to Americans. They might wail and bemoan the tragedy and the loss, but they are not, generally speaking, willing to do anything about it that will reduce the perceived necessity of future violence.

Oil is worth more than life, money is worth more than life, dominion is worth more than life, and these principles are echoed time and again in American dealings in the Middle East.

I'd say the indictment is pretty damning.

Take Iraq, for instance. Saddam Hussein is a terrible person, from all appearances. Americans are right to be repulsed. But couldn't we, just maybe have thought of that in the 1980s when we were helping finance his struggle against an Iranian nut-case who came to power because the prior regime--with American and British support--abused the people to revolution?

A coincidence about Poppy Bush (Bush 41)--The two primary military actions of Poppy Bush's administration--Iraq and Panama--both sought to remove dictators who secured power with Poppy's assistance; Bush, as director of the CIA was a staunch supporter of Noriega, and as president assisted Hussein to the tune of billions of dollars.

While the irony of having to kill off one's own Frankenstein is, in its own right, amusing in the macabre sense, we can now check off four separate offenses by the US government against Muslims--Israel, Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan. Or, in other terms: displacement and suppression of Palestinians, aiding and abetting oppression and crimes against humanity in Iran, aiding and abetting oppression and crimes against humanity in Iraq, and aiding and abetting oppression and crimes against humanity in Afghanistan.

And, in addition to a malaise of ignorance and, therefore, superstition about Islam that affects many Americans, there is the fact that when we look at the crimes of our government against Muslim peoples, we, the people have endorsed these crimes.

And even I, who opposes such policies, am to a degree responsible. I do not prevent my government, and furthermore I support it with tax money. And, as necessity includes the deaths of Muslim civilians, so does necessity from the other perspective include the deaths of American civilians. The differences are, essentially rhetorical; the effect is the same.

I'll get off my soapbox now.

thanx,
Tiassa :cool:

* paying movie stars and sports players astronomical amounts while millions starve.

These are idividual people doing this, not our government.

* Wasting food constantly

Not the government just individual people. Are you going to mail my uneaten french fries to Africa?

*Taking resources from other countries often times inflicting pain (diamonds-Africa)

Not our fault, they had the diamonds and didnt want to share, greedy bastards.

*Unrightfully trying to control other countries(Bully mentality)

The British used to do it to us! And before that Romans ruled the world, blame them not us. So I can only guess that if Afghanistan had its chance then it would bully every single country around it.... oh wait it did.

*Don't help countries that don't benefit U.S. (Genocide-Rawanda)

They can deal with it themselves, its there mess. They started it and were not responsible for the whole planet.

*Was founded&has benefited deliciously upon slavery and blood-shed

Slavery was over a long time ago, look in a history book, blood-shed, every country does that.

*Hiring Osama Bin Laden to torment other small countries

At the time he was a good guy, let the government deal with people in ways that we the non-government people dont understand.

*Stating that welfare was restitution for slavery

Well all those african americans were asking the government for MONEY. They were asking for REPERATIONS for going though slavery. Sorry but no one in this century ever had to live through slavery.

*Allowed the K.K.K.(terriorist orgainization) to give hate speeches at the Hall Of Justice.(Kentucky)

Im from Kentucky so I can answer this easily. Im in no way racist. But if a racist doesnt have the right to stand up and say "Fuck the blacks." Then I probably wouldnt be able to say "Fuck George Bush." Its called freedom of speech.

*Only cares about Oil not the Middle East conflict

What else is there?

*Manipulation (Media)

I suppose thats why we have the internet. So that we can all post what we think is the truth. Ive seen enough UFO sites.

*Claimed to be a christian nation.(No proof in that pudding)

We are not all anglo saxton, are you mad because its not all christians?

*Has mixed church&state(Roman Catholic)

Ever hear of seperation of church and state?

*Purposely infected minorities with diseases(syphillis)

Prove it!

*abhorring most of the world's resources

Other countries would if they could to. And guess what? We PAY for those resources

*Cater to the rich(George Bush)

Bush has been rich, his dad was rich, being president did not make him rich. Like I said above Fuck Bush.


Listed above are a few crimes the U.S. is guilty of but is there anything the U.S. is guilty of concerning the muslim's?(speak now or forever hold your peace)

We are not guilty for everything, sometimes its not our fault and sometimes...wait...most of the time its other countries faults or individuals within the country.

Tiassa:
Originally posted by tiassa
Lady
• The US is contractually obliged, by its commitments to international bodies, to be the primary protector and advocate of the Israeli occupation of the Palestine. Americans, in effect, help suppress the Palestinians.


We might add supporting Israel at the expense of its own citizens:

www.ussliberty.com

To the git who suggested the KKK not have the right to speak: rights extend to everyone. Go fuck yourself. Or, give up the concept of "rights" (more accurate approach anyway).

I do not support the KKK or **********.com or related organizations that are Christian anti-Semites and Christian racists.

And oh, before I go:

Every one of you is a racist. It's natural programming. Quit being such pompous gits.

And second before I go:

Anyone of you that believes in God, feel free to die and meet 'im. Now.

Every one of you is a racist. It's natural programming. Quit being such pompous gits.Every one of us is also a rapist. It's just that we strive, as humans, to transcend the natural part of humanity that impels it toward self-destruction. ;)

But yeah, it is a good point.

In the meantime, strive for minimal effect. My mind pings me as much as others when something as obvious as skin color enters my frame, but I've learned to minimize the effect as much as possible. Anecdotal: one of my jobs when I was in college was to sell stupid gifts in a sector known as "specialty retail". 'Nuff said. But living in a politically active town (Eugene, Oregon) at the time, I got tired of people presuming that a store policy they were upset with had anything to do with race. Long story short, I had bent my conduct to be so accommodating that I realized I was now racist in a new way. I presumed that a black person would have a bone to pick, and was prepared for conflict. Now that isn't fair, is it?

thanx,
Tiassa :cool:

In the meantime, strive for minimal effect

Me to tiassa. See Im in kentucky if that werent bad enough. My family doesnt go out and burn crosses and no one else I know does that either. But I do know people who dont like Blacks and Mexicans and such. They really dont. I just try to ignore because some of these people, believe it or, are my friends. I always say if you hate a racist, your being racist against that person for there beliefs.

guilty of..............


*Purposely infected minorities with diseases(syphillis)

to be specific.....


"Tuskegee syphilis experiment, conducted by the United States Public Health Service (PHS) and the Tuskegee Institute, began in 1932 and was originally planned to last one year. Its founders intended to document the degenerative effects of syphilis, with the ultimate goal of appropriating state funding to treat Southern rural blacks. The study involved 399 syphilitic black males, all in the final stage of the disease, and a control group of 201 noninfected black males. PHS officials based the investigation in and around Tuskegee, in Macon County, Alabama, where severe poverty and insufficient medical care contributed to the highest incidence of syphilis in the South. Most PHS doctors ascribed high syphilis rates among blacks to sexual promiscuity and ignorance. They never considered that African Americans were systematically denied medical services, nor the overt moral and racial implications that overshadowed the experiment from the beginning.

In order to secure participants, PHS officials offered a series of incentives: free medical treatment for minor illnesses, occasional hot meals, travel to and from the study site, and burial stipends paid out to the deceased person's family. For men whose daily existence was harsh, such inducements were attractive, especially since the burial fee often represented their only life insurance. Not once did PHS doctors inform participants of their real diagnosis, nor of the true purpose of the study or the dangers to which it exposed them. The sick men were led to believe they were being treated for rheumatism, stomach disorders, or "bad blood," an umbrella phrase used by rural blacks to describe a range of maladies, including syphilis. They were subjected to an array of tests and medical examinations over the years, while the syphilis was deliberately left untreated.

When the use of penicillin as an antibiotic for syphilis became widespread in the 1940s, Tuskegee participants did not receive it. Indeed, PHS officials threatened to cut off the benefits of those who attempted to be treated elsewhere and advised local black doctors not to see them. By 1969 approximately 100 men had died from untreated syphilis, while numerous others suffered painful disease-related complications. Many unknowingly spread syphilis, which is highly contagious, to their wives and children.

Interaction between the researchers and their black subjects was facilitated by a black nurse and Tuskegee resident, Eunice Rivers. Fully aware of what the study involved, she kept track of the men and often chauffeured them back and forth between their homes and the experiment site. The men trusted her because she was African American and understood the men's cultural background. As Bad Blood author James H. Jones points out, the men came to see themselves as "members of a social club and burial society called 'Miss Rivers's Lodge.'"

The study was never a secret. Between 1932 and 1972, PHS officials published numerous scientific papers on the experiment in leading U.S. medical journals and gave presentations at medical conventions. At the same time, the civil rights movement was changing white society's perceptions of blacks, culminating in significantly improved ethical standards regarding the medical treatment of nonwhite patients. It was only when a PHS worker informed the Associated Press of the study that the U.S. Department of Health, Education, and Welfare (HEW) abruptly ended it in 1972. Some leading white doctors continued to defend the study publicly. What Jones refers to as the 19th-century legacy of "racial medicine," in which black study participants were seen as subjects to be experimented on, rather than as human beings, remained strong in many public health circles.

Compensation to victims of the Tuskegee experiment has come slowly. After the study became widely publicized in 1972, HEW, along with leading U.S. newspapers, decried the study as "ethically unjustified." Commentators condemned the fact that public health officials had failed to get formal consent from the men and had denied them penicillin. An out-of-court settlement guaranteed treatment and modest cash payments for the survivors and families of the deceased, while Congress enacted laws to protect people who participated in medical experiments. It was not until May 1997, however, that the government fully acknowledged its role in the Tuskegee experiment. In a public apology, President Bill Clinton admitted that the study was "racist" and "profoundly, morally wrong," and that "what the United States government did was shameful." He also announced government plans to found a memorial to the study's legacy: the Center for Bioethics in Research and Health Care. Yet the Tuskegee experiment cultivated a mistrust of the public medical establishment among many African Americans, and little has been done since 1972 to remedy the problem of high syphilis rates among rural Southern blacks."

http://www.africana.com/Utilities/Content.html?&../cgi-bin/banner.pl?banner=Education&../articles/tt_423.htm


as for the rest the stuff..hey nobody is perfect but since when is that a crime??


;)

Originally posted by reformedtopunk
you forgot

*restricting constitutional rights to assembly (those stupid new anti-terrorism laws)
*imprisoning innocents (mumia abu-jammal)
*police brutality (this happened recently in my own state. Hey! This is the land of the Free!
The bigger the stick …the bigger the freedom! Huuuurray!
:D

Originally posted by Microzoft
Hey! This is the land of the Free!
The bigger the stick …the bigger the freedom! Huuuurray!
:D why the hell are you bumping a two month old thread?

You know I only one answer to all of this.

God Bless America

Originally posted by The Ghost of Ace
You know I only one answer to all of this.

God Bless America


** How? And still be a just God

A lot of the things you say could be said about any number of countries world now and in the past. In fact, all could be said about other countries. As an example, remove the KKK and insert say the Freedom Party in Austria, Zhironovski in Russia, the conservatives in France, the former ruling party in Mexico. You get the drift.

Oh no. US is guilty. I guess we're going to jail. :rolleyes:

Originally posted by Kyle_S
why the hell are you bumping a two month old thread? As a service to the mentally impaired! :bugeye:

cool, she listed some things that are made up, some that are in no way wrong, and some that every other country on the planet has done, even some things that would be ridiculed any way handled.

aitrus,

cool, she listed some things that are made up, some that are in no way wrong, and some that every other country on the planet has done, even some things that would be ridiculed any way handled.l


Don't fret.. God will judge the world

Ghost of Ace

A lot of the things you say could be said about any number of countries world
now and in the past. In fact, all could be said about other countries. As an example, remove the KKK and insert say the Freedom Party in Austria, Zhironovski in Russia, the conservatives in France, the former ruling party in Mexico. You get the drift.
l

Grazzhoppa

People like bashing the US because it is in the spot light of the world right now. This thread is pointless.

Why don't you make one for France, Britian, Russia, India, Japan, Iraq, China, South Africa....especially the last one.l




** I don't mind if this thread goes haywire and we cast stones at which ever country or government we pleases. Freedom of Speech, right? one which America has at this point? So cast them

** Our government is guilty of mixing church and state,in particular, the R.C.C. :bugeye:

Don't fret.. God will judge the world

yes, and He will see all ends, not only what appears wrong at first glance.

1. Mascarading as an organization that stands for human rights, freedom and dignity for all, while...

...looking the other way while Mobster Dictators like Kim Ill Soon of N. Korea and Sadaam of Iraq murder, rape, torture and oppress their people, and hide their WMDs?

...ignoring the plight of the peoples of Rwanda and Burundi (Mandela, where were you with your army to prevent the holacaust there?)

...daily condemning the United States, whose Declaration of Independence is the basis for the United Nations Dec. on Human Rights, while the Mobster Dictator Qadafi heads the Human Rights Commission?

Originally posted by starhunter
1. Mascarading as an organization that stands for human rights, freedom and dignity for all, while...

...looking the other way while Mobster Dictators like Kim Ill Soon of N. Korea and Sadaam of Iraq murder, rape, torture and oppress their people, and hide their WMDs?

...ignoring the plight of the peoples of Rwanda and Burundi (Mandela, where were you with your army to prevent the holacaust there?)

...daily condemning the United States, whose Declaration of Independence is the basis for the United Nations Dec. on Human Rights, while the Mobster Dictator Qadafi heads the Human Rights Commission?

Moderator Goofyfish wakeup!!, ......are all these bullshits allowed???
:confused:

Originally posted by Microzoft
Moderator Goofyfish wakeup!!, ......are all these bullshits allowed???
:confused: disprove it.

Originally posted by Kyle_S
disprove it.

Crawl back in the hole you came from Kyle_S, ....You are not the Moderator!!

:p

YES the UN is 100 % guilty in these matters,

BECAUSE the USA government told them to look the other way if it would interfere with the interest of some lobbies they represent.

The UN never made a big deal about Noriega because he was a good servant for a long time, no but this khadaffi no good servant, he bad dude, let's complain about human rights in his country.....

Saddam, good servant gone bad, let's "politely suggests" the UN to put WMD and human rights on top of the agenda...

Let's forget about our own human rights situation and our own WMD, the millions of bouncing betties and landmines in third world countries.

Plz. do not wait to get drafted by some new law, volunteer!
Don't ask what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for the big companies!

Originally posted by Microzoft
Moderator Goofyfish wakeup!!, ...are all these bullshits allowed???Absolutely.

What would you like me to do? A moderator is not the judge of truth or accuracy in an individual's post. That is up to the participants in the discussion - my other hat. As a moderator, I merely keep thing moving forward, relatively on-topic and relatively civil.

:m: Peace.

Originally posted by goofyfish
Absolutely.

What would you like me to do? A moderator is not the judge of truth or accuracy in an individual's post. That is up to the participants in the discussion - my other hat. As a moderator, I merely keep thing moving forward, relatively on-topic and relatively civil.

:m: Peace.
Fair enough goofyfishy, point taken and thanks for the trouble, ...I guess anyone can start a thread about walking over water.;)