I'm interested in knowing whether or not you think the job you currently have is important or not. Do you only work for the pay or is there some satisfaction because of what you do. To help get things started below is a link to a rather amusing discussion some posters on another board made, I find the comments insightful.

http://www.dmt123.com/other-health/435-1-dmt123-1.html

PS I can't live on the wage I make, I get 11 dollars an hour and live at home. This is enough to keep me on my antidepressant (Zoloft), pay car insurance (when it comes up), pay rent (bi-weekly), and some other stuff. If I really wanted to live on my own it would likely cost around 13-14 an hour, which I fear I'll never make.

PS I can't live on the wage I make, ...

What you really mean is that you can't live in the manner that you WANT on that wage. There are millions of people in the USA living on $11/hour or less. You just don't want to live that way, right? You want "things" that you're accustomed to having ...which cost money.

Baron Max

I love my job. Most of you are probably use the results of my work at some point in your life, and it permeates throughout the world. Primitive tribes in the Amazon probably encounter items with my influence as among their first taste of industrial society (and I've seen pictures of this).

Baron Max, what I mean is that you can't live on 11 an hour peirod. How could I possibly pay rent of say 500 a month, then pay for travel to work in my car 60, then pay for my antidepressants (60 with insurance) then pay for my therapy + psychiatry (60 each month) then my insurance and buy food, then have my Roth IRA (55 a month) and 401K (35 a month). It's impossible, I'd be in a hell of a bind if my car broke down or they fired my ass, people that live on 11 an hour are homeless!

Chances are rent would be more then 500, probably 650 or so, that'd leave me with almost no money for food etc.. LOL

Baron Max, what I mean is that you can't live on 11 an hour peirod. How could I possibly pay rent of say 500 a month, then pay for travel to work in my car 60, then pay for my antidepressants (60 with insurance) then pay for my therapy + psychiatry (60 each month) then my insurance and buy food, then have my Roth IRA (55 a month) and 401K (35 a month). It's impossible, I'd be in a hell of a bind if my car broke down or they fired my ass, people that live on 11 an hour are homeless!

Chances are rent would be more then 500, probably 650 or so, that'd leave me with almost no money for food etc.. LOL

I guess social-darwinistic crowd would love to attack posts like yours, but probably they are spending precious time somewhere else.

Chances are rent would be more then 500, probably 650 or so, that'd leave me with almost no money for food etc.. LOL

Find a cheaper apartment or get roommates. What I find interesting is considering the millions and millions of people who ARE living on $11/hour ...yet you claim it can't be done.

Something's wrong, don't you think? And I'd suggest that it's with you, not the millions that are actually doing it and not complaining on an Internet forum.

Baron Max

barons right. my living costs are just under $15k/year before tax. and that includes spending about $80/weekend on beer. if you cant live on minimum wage(20K) then you need to sort out your finances.

What is the minimum cost of living for a single person?
-Own a decent home.
1 bedroom
1 kitchen/dining
1 bathroom
1 living room
1 yard
1 driveway

-1 Car (Ideally a Toyota Hybird)

-1 Desktop Computer

-1 Laptop

-1 Mobile Phone

-Supplies
Wardrobe
Accessories
Personal Care Supplies
Personal Fitness Supplies
Books and Study Materials
Bathroom Fittings
Furniture
Kitchen Appliances
Cooking/Dining Ware
Home Appliances
Linens
Food/Water Supplies
Medicine
Cleaning Supplies
Car Supplies
Computer Supplies
Laundry/Iron Supplies
Personal Administration/Finance Supplies
Luggage and Travel Items
Gasoline


-Services
Power
Internet
Mobile
Car Insurance
Barber/Beauty Salon
Doctor
Dentist


THIS IS THE MINIMUM STANDARD OF LIVING.
(Anybody that does not have at least this is living like crap. That goes for the majority of earth.)

How much should all this cost per year?
What about per month?

[SIZE="2"]What is the minimum cost of living for a single person?
-Own a decent home.
1 bedroom
1 kitchen/dining
1 bathroom
1 living room
1 yard
1 driveway

Why not a tiny, one-room efficency? And share that with another person?

-1 Car (Ideally a Toyota Hybird)

Why not an old, but still operating, Honda Civic or something like it?

Don't need a desktop computer or a laptop or a mobile phone in order to live!

Wardrobe? A very small, very inexpensive selection of clothes would be quite sufficient. And there are numerous second-hand stores that offer good quality clothes very cheap.

Books and study materials? No, you can't afford to go to school, so put that off until you've saved enough money to do it.

Personal fitness supplies??? You can do workouts in your apartment that are damned good and don't cost a single penny. Why pay for something that you don't need?

Furniture? Don't need it. A pad on the floor makes a good bed.

Cooking and dinnerware? Cheap at the second-hand stores.

And as to all the other items you've mentioned ...take the same attitude that I've given above and apply it to those items. You'll find that most of it you don't actually need, so why pay for it. Others you can find cheap if you just go searching for them.

If you don't have the money to pay for it, then you shouldn't have the luxuries that you've mentioned. A mobil phone??? C'mon, man!

Baron Max

Because a tiny one-room shares is substandard. Everybody has the right to at least their own place.

An old used car is not proper. People require adequate transportation in a first hand hybrid car. Not something used.

Desktop, laptop, mobiles are very important NECESSITIES for a decent lifestyle. Anybody without it is deprived and living like crap.

I agree about wardrobe, but nothing second hand. All people deserve first hand clothes.

School is never paid for in an educentric city design.

An adequate First World city has facilities for personal fitness. Other than that, there really is no need for personal fitness supplies.

A certain amount of furniture is needed. At least a matress on the floor. I do not believe in raised beds. A desk as well is important with a chair.

Cooking and dinnerware must all be first hand. No second hand provisions allowed. All people are entitled to first hand products.

These are not luxuries. These are all basic necessities. Luxuries are things like gold. What I mentioned is a minimum basic standard of living for the decent lifestyle all are entitled to.

ENTITLEMENT<--Learn this great word, and understand the concept.


All those things you suggested are completely pointless and unecessary. For example, why choose a second hand car when you are entitled to a first hand hybrid?

coolskill;

you are so full of bullshit that it is dribbling down your chin, hitting the keyoard and typing posts.

i dont even know where to begin explaining just how retarde you are. ive been stitting here for 10 minutes trying to phrase this so that it uses little enough profanity as not to get banned, but i cant. the only thing that can be said, is GO GET A FUCKING JOB!

cool skill: why go on about entitlement? No-one is going to give you these things. It would be lovely if the world worked like that but it doesn't and, even if it ever does, it won't be for a very long time - certainly not in your lifetime or mine. So the only way to get the things you mention is either to become a successful criminal (a high-risk activity); or to win the lottery (we'd all love that, wouldn't we?); or to start a successful business (another high-risk activity); or to get a job. Yes, work is exploitative - I completely agree - but it does provide many positive things as well. On the material side it's not about money per se, but about getting the money to do the things you want to do - whether that's buy a nice car, visit places you've always wanted to go, buy things for the people you care about or fund your candidacy at the next elections. Money gives you the means to do all these things and more, as well as providing a certain amount of protection from poverty - from a lack of money, and the stresses and troubles that come with not having enough. That's the thing with money - the less you've got the more time you have to spend worrying about it.

But jobs aren't just about money - or at least the better ones aren't. Admittedly there aren't many added benefits if you're working 40 soul-crushing hours a week in a factory or mopping toilet floors for a living but, with the right choice of job, there are all kinds of other hidden advantages.

For instance, do you have all the friends you need or could you use more? Work is a great way to broaden your social circle.

Have you met the love of your life yet? Many people meet their partners through work.

Are you shy? Do you lack confidence? Work provides many opportunities for asserting yourself; for putting your ideas or point of view across to others; opportunities for advancement - a chance to be rewarded for what you're good at; opportunities to develop as a human being.

Do you have any skills that you feel would be of benefit to the community, eg do you feel that you have anything to teach the young? Consider working in the social sector, which gives you the opportunity to have an impact on your local community and the wider society, whilst getting paid for it - what could be better than that?

It seems to me that you feel that you do have a lot to teach people. Why not put your personal skills to use, reach out and test yourself, and get rewarded for it?

And Sam? No, work isn't pointless. At least not always.

coolskill;

you are so full of bullshit that it is dribbling down your chin, hitting the keyoard and typing posts.

i dont even know where to begin explaining just how retarde you are. ive been stitting here for 10 minutes trying to phrase this so that it uses little enough profanity as not to get banned, but i cant. the only thing that can be said, is GO GET A FUCKING JOB!
Have I not explained many time what crabs are, and what they are for?
A slave is doing the work. The slave sees another slave that is working towards freedom. Instead of participating in efforts toward freedom, the crab slave wants to drag the other slave back into the pit with the rest of them.
Right?

even if it ever does, it won't be for a very long time
The rest of your post has nothing to do with this statement, but you cannot and will not ever be able to explain this belief based on TOTAL AND ABSOLUTE STUPIDITY. You are so ignorant it is not even funny. Only a total jack ass would presume something so absurdly idiotic. You might as well go shoot yourself, because such ignorant statements cannot be proven, and have no basis in reality whatsoever. I suggest you get lost for saying nothing because you are nothing.

The rest of the rant is simple slave mentality.
Slavery is not just about money?
Then you go onto all these things about how great it is to be a slave.
Yes we are all slaves. But yammering on about how it gives me so many opportunities to meet other slaves and blah blah blah just sounds totally pathetic.

Do you have any skills that
You already know my name, and therefore the answer to this question.
What is the point of asking?

Everbody has something to teach others.

For exampul:
The best skill is to sue people. Everything in this crappytalistic game of economics is based in the manipulation of the law. Be an expert at suing people, and squashing anybody that tries to sue you.

Have I not explained many time what crabs are, and what they are for?
A slave is doing the work. The slave sees another slave that is working towards freedom. Instead of participating in efforts toward freedom, the crab slave wants to drag the other slave back into the pit with the rest of them.
Right?

you are not working towards freedom, you are leeching from those who are. i am working towards freedom by saving 55% of my income to create farmland in africa, which will end poverty and create true freedom.

Everbody has something to teach others.

For exampul:
The best skill is to sue people. Everything in this crappytalistic game of economics is based in the manipulation of the law. Be an expert at suing people, and squashing anybody that tries to sue you.

you call me a crab and a slave? you are nothing but an aspiring slavedriver. you are a pathetic excuse for life.

All those things you suggested are completely pointless and unecessary. For example, why choose a second hand car when you are entitled to a first hand hybrid?

No one is entitled to anything except to be left alone. You have the attitude of a spoiled child.

I lived on far less than eleven bucks an hour while working my way thru school and supporting a wife and child. I didn't have a cell phone, a laptop, a new car, or nice clothes. I now have all those things, and more. You want a hybred, a laptop, new clothes, etc? Get off your lazy ass and earn it! No one owes you a thing. You are entitled to nothing. Grow up.

All those things you suggested are completely pointless and unecessary. For example, why choose a second hand car when you are entitled to a first hand hybrid?

so everyone on earth is entitled to a new toyota hybrid? who exactly is going to make 6 billion of these? or is it just american who are entitled to them? why are americans entitled to JAPANESE technology?

so everyone on earth is entitled to a new toyota hybrid? who exactly is going to make 6 billion of these? or is it just american who are entitled to them? why are americans entitled to JAPANESE technology?Everyone is entitled to whatever they want. Their fairygod parents will provide for them!

cool skill: thanks for the reply. it was everything i expected and more. more, because i wasn't expecting it to be quite so funny.

ps what 'cool skills' do you have exactly?

The rest of your post has nothing to do with this statement, but you cannot and will not ever be able to explain this belief based on TOTAL AND ABSOLUTE STUPIDITY. You are so ignorant it is not even funny. Only a total jack ass would presume something so absurdly idiotic. You might as well go shoot yourself, because such ignorant statements cannot be proven, and have no basis in reality whatsoever. I suggest you get lost for saying nothing because you are nothing.

And redarmy11 is wrong and stupid how?

You're supposed to refute people's statements in a grown-up, constructive fashion. Is only saying "you're so stupid!" the best you can do?

Also, judging by your list of "necessities", you are quite high-maintenance. I can live happily with maybe half of that stuff. One perfect example is that I don't need a desktop computer and a laptop computer. Furthermore, I only have a TracFone for a cell phone, and I'm just fine with that because I don't use my cell phone much anyway. Maybe your life would be crap if you didn't have all these things, but mine wouldn't. Some people are more concerned about life itself than about the material items you can acquire.

Also, judging by your list of "necessities", you are quite high-maintenance.
And what of all the poor wretches who lived before the 21st century? Little did they know that their life was crap without the cell phones and lap tops they were entitled to! And no hybred cars either! Oh, the humanity.

"ENTITLEMENT<--Learn this great word, and understand the concept."

LOL.

The worlds owes you eh?

Why?

Who says you're entitled?

What if someone disagrees?

Who grants "rights"... and what if people disagree on what those rights are or should be?

Throughout all your conversations that I've observed... you seem to infer that it doesn't matter what others think - they should just agree with you.

What leads you to believe you're right?

What if you're not, and the other people are?

What if there is no "right"?





Do you think you are entitled to the processing of raw materials into goods?

Do you know how complicated it is to get anything done, for real? Do you have a clue? It seems to me that you imply that food should magically appear on your table, cooked to your liking. Housing should build itself and ask of you so kindly to move in. Clothes, etc. You are "entitled to it". Okay, well then do you realize someone had to make it? Why are they not entitled to it? What if they disagree with you?

I'm interested in knowing whether or not you think the job you currently have is important or not. Do you only work for the pay or is there some satisfaction because of what you do. To help get things started below is a link to a rather amusing discussion some posters on another board made, I find the comments insightful.

http://www.dmt123.com/other-health/435-1-dmt123-1.html

PS I can't live on the wage I make, I get 11 dollars an hour and live at home. This is enough to keep me on my antidepressant (Zoloft), pay car insurance (when it comes up), pay rent (bi-weekly), and some other stuff. If I really wanted to live on my own it would likely cost around 13-14 an hour, which I fear I'll never make.

Do you realize you're lying to yourself?

You're overlooking the fact that you are the limit of your own welfare.

You're overlooking that most of you bills are voluntary.

You could have a roommate. You could get a second job. You could provide a service. You could do a lot of things to change your situation, yet you blame the system. You blame time. You blame circumstance, without taking responsibility for that circumstance. You play a victim, when you cast the role.

I'm interested in knowing whether or not you think the job you currently have is important or not. Do you only work for the pay or is there some satisfaction because of what you do. To help get things started below is a link to a rather amusing discussion some posters on another board made, I find the comments insightful.

http://www.dmt123.com/other-health/435-1-dmt123-1.html

PS I can't live on the wage I make, I get 11 dollars an hour and live at home. This is enough to keep me on my antidepressant (Zoloft), pay car insurance (when it comes up), pay rent (bi-weekly), and some other stuff. If I really wanted to live on my own it would likely cost around 13-14 an hour, which I fear I'll never make.


If you want a better job, go get a better job. If you want to move out, live with a roomate, or with a girlfriend.

1 bedroom
1 kitchen/dining - could be shared.
1 bathroom -could be shared
1 living room - could be shared
1 yard - luxury
1 driveway - luxury

-1 Car (Ideally a Toyota Hybird) - luxury: walk/bicycle/public transport.

-1 Desktop Computer - luxury

-1 Laptop -luxury

-1 Mobile Phone -luxury

-Supplies
Wardrobe
Accessories
Personal Care Supplies
Personal Fitness Supplies -luxury: just get a job.
Books and Study Materials - go to the library.
Bathroom Fittings -?
Furniture- 1 bed and a table and chair is all you need. Buy second hand if necessary.
Kitchen Appliances - can be kept minimal.
Cooking/Dining Ware
Home Appliances - like what? Vacume cleaner is ok. TV is not.
Linens
Food/Water Supplies
Medicine
Cleaning Supplies
Car Supplies - luxury
Computer Supplies - luxury
Laundry/Iron Supplies
Personal Administration/Finance Supplies
Luggage and Travel Items -luxury
Gasoline -luxury


-Services
Power
Internet -luxury
Mobile -luxury
Car Insurance -luxury
Barber/Beauty Salon
Doctor
Dentist


Most things on your list are luxury items that you do not need.

you are not working towards freedom, you are leeching from those who are. i am working towards freedom by saving 55% of my income to create farmland in africa, which will end poverty and create true freedom.
Yes working towards freedom.
All slaves HAVE to work towards freedom that is what slavery is about.
All humans are entitled to freedom. Freedom does not have to be earned. Therefore, it does not have to be worked for. Unless you are a slave.
But considering that everybody is a slave, you are not the only one working towards freedom. We all are.

Furthermore, you use of the term leeching is invalid. As I have stated over and over. SLAVES CANNOT LEECH. Anybody that is not free cannot possibly considered to be leeching it is logically impossible.
Only those that are free are capable of leeching off of slave labor, resources, and production.
When a human is unethically put into slavery, it is absurd to call somebody in captivity a leech.

1 bedroom
1 kitchen/dining - could be shared.
1 bathroom -could be shared
1 living room - could be shared
1 yard - luxury
1 driveway - luxury

-1 Car (Ideally a Toyota Hybird) - luxury: walk/bicycle/public transport.

-1 Desktop Computer - luxury

-1 Laptop -luxury

-1 Mobile Phone -luxury

-Supplies
Wardrobe
Accessories
Personal Care Supplies
Personal Fitness Supplies -luxury: just get a job.
Books and Study Materials - go to the library.
Bathroom Fittings -?
Furniture- 1 bed and a table and chair is all you need. Buy second hand if necessary.
Kitchen Appliances - can be kept minimal.
Cooking/Dining Ware
Home Appliances - like what? Vacume cleaner is ok. TV is not.
Linens
Food/Water Supplies
Medicine
Cleaning Supplies
Car Supplies - luxury
Computer Supplies - luxury
Laundry/Iron Supplies
Personal Administration/Finance Supplies
Luggage and Travel Items -luxury
Gasoline -luxury


-Services
Power
Internet -luxury
Mobile -luxury
Car Insurance -luxury
Barber/Beauty Salon
Doctor
Dentist


Most things on your list are luxury items that you do not need.
Spur has a certain good point that many idiots overlook, and refuse to understand about the science of advaced city design.

Food facilities are shared by the community.

Individuals are entitled to their own private quarters situated within an educentric community of progress.

Such quarters are equipped with a bathroom. They are connected to power, plumbing/sewage, and a communications network transfering data at hyper high speeds.

Household and personal care items, wardrobe, accessories, etc, are easily affordable.

Cars are completely out as standard transportation. Rather, motor vehicles are only used for industrial purposes.

Personal fitness is not a luxury. It is a necessity. While the food centers provie human essential meals catered to amplifying the enrgy and vitality of the human body as well as internal cleansing. Fitness facilities are available to all for physical development.

Desktop, laptop, pcu all are affordable. they are not a physical necessity, but a social necessity for the sake of personal administration, intellectual development, communications, and more. These items are part of the social structure.

Second hand is pointless.

As an educentric community, education is everywhere, and an integral part of life. From academics, to personal fitness, and human development. Bokstore/library etc.

Barber/beauty salon, massage, doctor, dentist are all available. These are not luxuries, but necessities for every single human on a regular basis.

Food facilities are shared by the community.

Who pays for the food? Who works in the fields? Who harvests the products? Who delivers the products? Who pays for the trucks to deliver the goods? How are the salaries paid? Who are the workers if no one works? And if they do work, who pays for them? At what wage? Who determines that wage?

Individuals are entitled to their own private quarters situated within an educentric community of progress.

Who pays to build and maintain those private quarters? Who cleans the toilets? Who works in the sewers and water and power companies? Who pays for the worker wages? Who determines the wages?

Such quarters are equipped with a bathroom. They are connected to power, plumbing/sewage, and a communications network transfering data at hyper high speeds.

Who maintains all this marvelous equipment? Who pays for it? Who cleans the sewers? What happens if some equipment breaks down ...who fixes it and who pays for it? How much do they pay? Who are the repairmen? What are their wages? Where does the money come from to fix and maintain it all?

Nope, I'm afraid you got a lot to learn about the world ...perhaps you should think a little bit before you post such idyllic dreams.

Baron Max

obviously it will be you who will have to do all the work.

ah but spurious, you forget 'it is extremely impractical and almost impossible to be self sufficient' he cant do all that work by himself, he is entitled to a slave to do it all for him.

Who pays for the food? Who works in the fields? Who harvests the products? Who delivers the products? Who pays for the trucks to deliver the goods? How are the salaries paid? Who are the workers if no one works? And if they do work, who pays for them? At what wage? Who determines that wage?



Who pays to build and maintain those private quarters? Who cleans the toilets? Who works in the sewers and water and power companies? Who pays for the worker wages? Who determines the wages?



Who maintains all this marvelous equipment? Who pays for it? Who cleans the sewers? What happens if some equipment breaks down ...who fixes it and who pays for it? How much do they pay? Who are the repairmen? What are their wages? Where does the money come from to fix and maintain it all?

Nope, I'm afraid you got a lot to learn about the world ...perhaps you should think a little bit before you post such idyllic dreams.

Baron Max
You're an idiot. What totally stupid questions you ask.
Nope. I'm afraid you got alot to learn about the world. Perhaps you are dumber than dirt.

Furthermore, refrain from using loaded terms such as "idyllic" when discussing intellectual practical science of advanced city design. Just because you are too dumb to comprehend it does not mean it is your loaded terminology is worth anything.

One BBC programm revealed that there are are employment agencies who "specialise" in finding work for immigrants in the uK, one had at least 3000 potential workers with skills and were willing to work for the minimum wage, and less!

I believe the USA has had similar problems with Mexicans

This in effect has brought down the relevant wage for a skilled worker.

Some steel erectors based in Scotland were earning £11 an hour and were layed off, but 3 days later they were all replaced by immigrant workers working for less than £6 an hour.

This is one example of what is going on in this country. It is going on with building trades and engineering trades. This is good for the economy as far as the UK government is concerned, but terrible news for anyone who wants to earn a fair wage for a skilled job. Skilled jobs are being paid at the same rate as unskilled, someone working as a skilled worker now is on the same earning level as someone working at Macdonalds.

The cost of living food, and taxes still soar, the price of homes still soar and are now out of reach for a first time buyer

Spur has a certain good point that many idiots overlook, and refuse to understand about the science of advaced city design.

Food facilities are shared by the community.

Individuals are entitled to their own private quarters situated within an educentric community of progress.

Such quarters are equipped with a bathroom. They are connected to power, plumbing/sewage, and a communications network transfering data at hyper high speeds.

Household and personal care items, wardrobe, accessories, etc, are easily affordable.

Cars are completely out as standard transportation. Rather, motor vehicles are only used for industrial purposes.

Personal fitness is not a luxury. It is a necessity. While the food centers provie human essential meals catered to amplifying the enrgy and vitality of the human body as well as internal cleansing. Fitness facilities are available to all for physical development.

Desktop, laptop, pcu all are affordable. they are not a physical necessity, but a social necessity for the sake of personal administration, intellectual development, communications, and more. These items are part of the social structure.

Second hand is pointless.

As an educentric community, education is everywhere, and an integral part of life. From academics, to personal fitness, and human development. Bokstore/library etc.

Barber/beauty salon, massage, doctor, dentist are all available. These are not luxuries, but necessities for every single human on a regular basis.


You have overlooked the thousands of housebound disabled people in this country. To have communication with the outside world with a mobile phone and internet are a must.

You cant get a dentist in the UK for love nor money, they have opted out of the NHS system and the majority have gone private

You have overlook getting a brain. The science of advanced city design actively does the best we can to take everything into consideration.
Stop claiming something is overlooked when you do not even know what you are talking about.

You have overlook getting a brain. The science of advanced city design actively does the best we can to take everything into consideration.
Stop claiming something is overlooked when you do not even know what you are talking about.


I wasn't nasty to you - you've got an attitude problem


There should be a tax for having a chip on your shoulder - you'd be paying thousands.

The science of advanced city design actively does the best we can to take everything into consideration.

Who pays for it? Who builds it? Who maintains it? How much are they paid? And who pays their salaries? And how are those salaries paid?

Who cleans the toilets? And who pays for their salaries?

Oh, and I forgot to add: Will all of those jobs be "pointless", too?

Dreaming is easy, Lix, but making those dreams a reality is ....a little tougher.

Baron Max

feeding the troll is not recommended.

feeding the troll is not recommended.
Yes. You are a troll.
1. Never not once ever contributing anything productive to any discussion.
2. Everytime you appear in a discussion you make idiotic comments that have nothing to do with the discussion.
3. You admitted many times that your sole purpose is to destroy the discussion and the thread.
4. Stop calling people a troll that actually participate and have no intention of trolling purposes when you are the very definition of TROLL. And you admit that your purpose is to destroy the discussion which is what the definition of a troll is.
5. Get lost TROLL.


Dreaming is easy, Lix, but making those dreams a reality is ....a little tougher.
Go get a life. Nothing you have yet said makes any sense. All you do is use loaded terms like "dreaming" which has nothing to do with advanced city design. You are clearly a blithering idiot. Otherwise you would post something that actually is related to anything being discussed instead of calling practical real world science "dreaming". I already stated that such loaded terminology belongs nowhere in a productive discussion. But that seems to be your entire focus. You obviously do not even know what your own point is otherwise you would have stated and defined it clearly without running around with loaded bland insipid statements.


I wasn't nasty to you - you've got an attitude problem
Bull crap. You are the one talking nonsense about I overlooked this and that. Advanced city design happens to be a very comprehensive science.


Advance city design is about assessing and studying city/social problems in order to devise and engineer practical methods for solving them.

Grow up child - you've got a bad attitude problem

You grow up loser.
You are the one that started with the attitude.
Who has the problem now?

B.. bu... you didn't answer my question!!

And it was the most interesting one!!




What 'cool skills' do you have?

You're an idiot. What totally stupid questions you ask.
Nope. I'm afraid you got alot to learn about the world. Perhaps you are dumber than dirt.

Furthermore, refrain from using loaded terms such as "idyllic" when discussing intellectual practical science of advanced city design. Just because you are too dumb to comprehend it does not mean it is your loaded terminology is worth anything.

calling the baron an idiot doesnt anwser his questions.

calling the baron an idiot doesnt anwser his questions.

He can't and won't answer my questions ....or anyone else's, for that matter. It's all his big day dreams of utopia, so any questions just fuck it all up for him. And that's why he goes into his ranting mode. Nobody likes their dreams and fantasies blown to hell ...it's irritating. :)

Baron Max

Unfortunately, baron's post is loaded and presumptuous. He has not posed any relevant question regarding interpretation of the postulates I laid out. Therefore, he's an idiot.

Unfortunately, baron's post is loaded and presumptuous. He has not posed any relevant question regarding interpretation of the postulates I laid out. Therefore, he's an idiot.

I admit to being an idiot, Lix, and that's why I'm hoping that you'll help educate me on your new plans. How can I support your new world order unless I understand it and how it works?

I mean, being an idiot, I wouldn't want to support your new system, then find myself cleaning out the sewers in your new city while you and all the other lie around drinking fine wine and fucking all the attractive women!

Baron Max

The first step is to stop using Slave Memes.
Slave Memes are used to keep people docile, and keep them from pursuing the betterment of their own lives as well as the betterment of civilization.

Examples:
1. Going into rants about "idealism", "fantasy", “utopia” every time people talk about practical methods for solving ALL of the world's problems. The Slave Meme is that the problems cannot be solved. Therefore, the solutions are never pursued. Ultimately, the slave gets to continue being a slave.

2. Terms such as "life isn't fair", "human nature", and others. All Slave Memes. Slave memes are nothing but a trap. Every time something bad happens, the meme is to state: "That's life". Nobody ever states "That's life" when something good happens because it threatens the Slave Meme.

3. The "There will always be X" statement. Whereas X is some sort of symptom or dysfunction.
"There will always be some idiot in class clowning around."
"There will always be poverty."

"There will always be X" statements are Slave Memes. They are used to perpetuate conflict which is important for the suffocation of human progress.

4. Perfect world equals boredom. This is a Slave Meme of utterly illogical proportions. The fact that a world is perfect implies the lack of boredom, suffering, and conflict. A perfect world is not boring, but exciting, and fulfilling. This is one of the most effective Slave Memes because it causes people to worship their shackles like the air they breath. Basically it is the paradigm that freedom equals a boring world of drones. Whereas slavery is freedom and fun. The contradiction is that the Slave Meme causes us to believe that being a slave is freedom, and being free is slavery. This is the lie and a misconception those that defend the Slave Meme abide by.


The hard science of advanced city design is approached as practical, necessary, and inevitable. It is a study of symptoms and dysfunctional trends, and the practical methods for solving them. It is the pursuit of understanding about what is functional, what is prosperous, and what is effective. The human environment of freedom and high aptitude human development is not to be approached under the Slave Meme paradigm. It is to be approached by the paradigm of absolute practicality, necessity, and inevitability. The faster and more efficient the understanding, the faster and more efficient its attainment. Such practicality is the paradigm of the scientist. The problem solver. It is not the Slave Meme paradigm that looks at all practical problem solving pursuits as futile and fanciful. The Slave Meme is naïve to say the least. It is not only impractical, it is the very destruction of the individual.

The state of our current society is characterized by one word. Mindless. We currently live in a dystopian nightmare of mindlessness.

Scientist of advanced city design understand that the only objective is to solve the problems, and to pursue the heightened state of human aptitude and earth vitality. All other pursuits are pointless results of the mindles slave mentality.

Our mindless slave mentality is 100% illusion. Delusion more like it. We believe Slave Memes govern reality. “This is how the world works. I am just being realistic. I’m a realist.” Unfortunately this total illusion is not the least bit realistic. It is a further elaboration on the description of the Slave Meme. It is not just a belief. We fight for it with all our might to protect it because it is the only paradigm that we are exposed to. All the problems are basically a result of a false paradigm. As long as we continue to believe these problems are inevitable, we will continue to perpetuate their inevitability. It is nothing but an illusion that keeps us enslaved. Try to convince the slave that the shackles are an illusion, and the slave will fight to stay in them. And furthermore, try to convince you to join in.

you still didnt answer the question. how to we escape slavery in the current system?

Lixluke, I hope you're a teenager. Then there's hope you'll grow out of this infintile mindset.

I mean... for instance, can you juggle?

Try to convince the slave that the shackles are an illusion, and the slave will fight to stay in them. And furthermore, try to convince you to join in.

So you're advocating that "we" force the "slaves" to do what they don't want to do?? That don't sound very nice of this wonderous new world order, does it? Seems the first thing you want to do, right out of the starting gate, is to become a dictator and force people to join your fight? Hmmm?

Baron Max

you still didnt answer the question. how to we escape slavery in the current system?
UNDERSTAND
DESIGN
APPLY
REPEAT


Everything can be improved. The system for improvement comes in 4 easy steps.
1. Understanding and studying all aspects of global civilization and our status.
2. Designing solution according to comprehensive understanding.
3. Applying solutions.
4. Repeating the process. Test the solutions, and understand the effects. Reconfigure and design accordingly. Apply again. repeat again.


This is not a "prefect world" in which everybody and everything is in their perfect ideal ‘form’ without suffering or decay. It is a design for a world to maximize human aptitude for the purpose of being an asset to the planet Earth environment. Are humans mammals or viruses? Mammals adapt to their surrounding environment. Viruses move into an environment, destroy all resources in order to multiply, and spread to the next area. This is the human effect on planet Earth.

There is meliorism.
There is apologism.

These 2 are direct opposites.
Melirosim: An individual humans can intentionally take his own behavior into his own hands for the sake of being an asset to the planet Earth environment.
Apologism: An individual human is incapable of altering his own conditions. What meliorists consider problems cannot be solved. Therefore, they are not problems at all, but inevitable human nature.


Advanced city design takes a meliorist perspective which is a perspective of problem solving, and a refusal to take problems up the ass. It is not only the individual human’s capability to accept the situation, and do something about it. It is in the individual human’s best interest to do so.
The apologist does indeed accept the situation, but does nothing about according to a belief that nothing can be done about it.

Metaphor:
Meliorists and apologists are stuck in the desert. Apolgist sit there and rot. Meliorists take action to move on to greener pastures.

The apologist is the supporter of inaction. The apologist believes he is practical with his feet on the ground. According the Slave Meme, the apologist believes that he is just being realistic.


Ignorance is not the lack of knowledge. It is the lack of desire for knowledge. Ignorants are good at one thing. Ignoring. They live in a face value world, and ignore anything deeper than what is presented to them as the face-value standard. Conformity. Anything beyond the face value standard is considered “crazy talk”. Here we move into the perfect condition for control. Those who do not think for themselves allow others to think for them. Without question. Do not tell the ignorant anything because the ignorant will invalidate you more the information you are providing. This is not intentional. Ignorants tend not to have the ability to separate the information from the individual providing the information.

It is a design for a world to maximize human aptitude for the purpose of being an asset to the planet Earth environment.

According to whom?

And does that give anyone the right to force others to do something which they don't want to do? At what point does "human rights" come into play in your grand scheme of things? And what if someone decides later that they don't like it and they want out?

Lix, as I see it, you're just trying or wanting to be the world's dictator and everyone else must follow your directives or pay the consequences. I don't like that attitude and I'd suggest that very few people would. Now what are you going to do? ...get out the big guns and tanks, and force us all to conform to your ideals?

Baron Max

[SIZE="2"]UNDERSTAND
DESIGN
APPLY
REPEAT


Lol. You forgot the implicit "agree with my retardation or suffer my trolling".

Pathetic.

www.galstown.ne.jp/ph_travel/dodo/nevada/129503464/forbidden.html

I have added an important more part of the slave meme.
4. Perfect world equals boredom. This is a Slave Meme of utterly illogical proportions. The fact that a world is perfect implies the lack of boredom, suffering, and conflict. A perfect world is not boring, but exciting, and fulfilling. This is one of the most effective Slave Memes because it causes people to worship their shackles like the air they breath. Basically it is the paradigm that freedom equals a boring world of drones. Whereas slavery is freedom and fun. The contradiction is that the Slave Meme causes us to believe that being a slave is freedom, and being free is slavery. This is the lie and a misconception those that defend the Slave Meme abide by.

According to whom?

And does that give anyone the right to force others to do something which they don't want to do? At what point does "human rights" come into play in your grand scheme of things? And what if someone decides later that they don't like it and they want out?

Lix, as I see it, you're just trying or wanting to be the world's dictator and everyone else must follow your directives or pay the consequences. I don't like that attitude and I'd suggest that very few people would. Now what are you going to do? ...get out the big guns and tanks, and force us all to conform to your ideals?

Baron Max
WTF are you talkling about?
Freedom equals having the choice.
The only obligation every individual has is the Triangle of Life.
All are bound to this obligation no matter how poor, desperate, incarcerated, rich, or powerful. All humans are bound to the Triangle.

You're a complete idiot moron.
SLAVE MEME: Freedom = Slavery and Slavery = Freedom. When you are a slave, you are actually being forced as you put it. You consider that freedom. When you are not being forced into anything, you go into a totally idiotic rant about how it is bad because you are being forced. Can you be anymore totally dumber?

Such stupid terms as "now what are you gonna do get out the big guns and tanks."

You are too damn stupid to understand that that is what is going on. You are calling the current circumstance of forced slavery with tanks and guns freedom. Then you accuse freedom of being foced with tanks and big guns. You are a slave minded moron loser idiot to the highest degree.


I explain freedom from forced guns and tanks. You equate that as forced guns and tanks.

I explain slavery as forced guns and tanks. You equate that as freedom.


Go find yourself a brain. You abide by Slave Meme stupidity which exactly views real freedom as forced gun/tank slavery and forced gun/tank slavery as freedom. Moron.

Lol. You forgot the implicit "agree with my retardation or suffer my trolling".

Pathetic.
GET LOST TROLL

Basically this is what you are saying:

CS wants to force others to abide by his belief that all people have the right to believe what they want, and to choose what they want to do.

CS believes that this belief should be enforced. It should be enforced that nobody may take away the right for all people to believe what they want, and to choose what they want to do.

CS brings out big guns and tanks to enforce his belief in protecting the right of all people to believe what they want, and to choose what they want to do.

Baron sees a problem with this because he does not believe in enforcing the protection of the right for all people to believe what they want, and to choose what they want to do.

CS wants to force others to abide by his belief that all people have the right to believe whatever CS tells them they should, even though CS is a mentally ill, megalomaniacal fool.

CS believes that this belief should be enforced. It should be enforced that nobody may take away the right for all people to believe what CS wants, and to choose whatever CS thinks they should choose.

CS brings out big guns and tanks to enforce his belief in protecting the right of all people to believe what he wants, and to choose what he wants them to do.

Baron sees a problem with this because his eyes are open.

CS wants to force others to abide by his belief that all people have the right to believe whatever CS tells them they should, even though CS is a mentally ill, megalomaniacal fool.

CS believes that this belief should be enforced. It should be enforced that nobody may take away the right for all people to believe what CS wants, and to choose whatever CS thinks they should choose.

CS brings out big guns and tanks to enforce his belief in protecting the right of all people to believe what he wants, and to choose what he wants them to do.

Baron sees a problem with this because his eyes are open.
GET LOST TROLL GO CRAWL BACK INTO YOUR HOLE OF IGNORANCE.

GET LOST TROLL GO CRAWL BACK INTO YOUR HOLE OF IGNORANCE.

But I have to look here to find the way. Only through your total stupidity and complete lack of intellect can I truly find the path to the hole of ignorance.

But I have to look here to find the way. Only through your total stupidity and complete lack of intellect can I truly find the path to the hole of ignorance.
GET REAL. YOU LIVE IN AHOLE OF IGNORANCE. GET LOST.
TROLL

GET REAL. YOU LIVE IN AHOLE OF IGNORANCE. GET LOST.
TROLL

My how I ponder the depths of psychosis that lead you to believe you have any authority in asserting what is or isn't "real".

How do you find yourself less ignorant than me, for instance?

Of course you do, and so I'm supposed to believe you according to you.

Which of course, adds support to my interpretation of your post above - and reveals your rather nefarious, megalomaniacal fantasy world to pretty much anyone but you - who, being part of and creator of your fantasy has no alternative perspective by which such a realization might be fostered.

Sad indeed.

A troll is not defined by their actions, but by their intentions. An individual with specific intentions to grief a thread or to grief other members.
A person may feel that they are griefed by somebody that does not have an intention to grief them. This is not a troll.
A troll specifically has the intention to grief members or threads.

Trolls such as your self are mad losers that sit there and cry about how they are incapable of getting their point across. So instead of using logical intelligence to do so, they go on mad griefing sprees that have nothing to do with any productive discussion.

Trolls never state their point or position because their inention is not to participate, but to grief others.

Yes indeed. It is sad. Pathetic more like it.

GET LOST TROLL AND GO ASK YOURSELF HOW YOU FIND YOURSELF LESS IGNORANT THAN ME WHICH HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE ISSUE.

Trolls are ignorants that cannot separate the issues at hand and circular arguments about who is more ignorant. They focus 0% on matters, and 100% on the chracters of those discussing the matters. PAAAAAAAATHETIC!

:)

No you see, trolls bait ridiculous arguments by stating the ridiculous over and over and over and over... like you do in every single post.

Trolls choose obviously contraversial positions, provide no support and insist that anyone who challenges the position is inferior.... like you do in every single post.

Trolls use all caps and bold fonts to assert their falsetto superiority, like you just did.

Get to know you why don'tcha.

:)

No you see, trolls bait ridiculous arguments by stating the ridiculous over and over and over and over... like you do in every single post.

Trolls choose obviously contraversial positions, provide no support and insist that anyone who challenges the position is inferior.... like you do in every single post.

Trolls use all caps and bold fonts to assert their falsetto superiority, like you just did.

Get to know you why don'tcha.
No they do not. You are confusing action with intention.

Certain trolls abide by the actions you specified. Certain people that are not trolls abide by the actions you specified. What makes you a troll is your intention.

TROLLS ARE NOT CATEGORIZED BY THEIR ACTIONS. THEY ARE CATEGORIZED BY THEIR INTENTIONS.


A person that is a real troll chooses a controverial position not because he believes it, but because it is a tool to grief others. Same with the caps and other tools for griefing intentions. Some people are just to ignorant and dumb that they do not know the difference between action and intention.
GET LOST TROLL.

From your actions, a sensible person can deduce simply that you are indeed a troll then.. by your own definition.

There is no such thing as baiting a rediculous argument becuase there is no authority to define rediculous. It is easy to say everything you disagree with is a rediculous argument, and therefore a troll. A troll baits people into arguments tehy do not necessarily believe in for the sake of griefing. Intentional purpose to grief. They create arguments even they do not believe in because it works to grief and destroy threads.

Your actions are specifically intended to grief. Every one of your post is a troll post for the sake of griefing. YOU ARE THE TROLL.

TROLLS SUCH AS YOURSELF GET ONE THING. IGNORED.

B.. bu... you didn't answer my question!!

And it was the most interesting one!!




What 'cool skills' do you have?

Nunchuck skills, bowhunting skills, computer hacking skills...

My guess, anyway.

Your actions are specifically intended to grief.

How is it exactly you think you understand my intentions?

It's obvious from your conclusion that you're incapable.

Yet you'll assert to the contrary... because you simply don't care to hear anything but what you think is true....

Which brings us full circle.

How is it exactly you think you understand my intentions?
You specifically stated you are here to grief and made an umprovoked post about me being a troll. Your intentions are clearly to grief and not participate.
"Oh but whatever I say never get's through your head. Boo hoo."

If you feel that way, you do not belong in a logical discussion. Get lost.
TROLL!

You specifically stated you are here to grief

That's a lie. Quote the text, liar. You can't because it doesn't exist. Yet your desperation for superiority fabricates a fantasy that you take for reality, in which you are irrefutable - as with all your commentary as far as I can tell.

and made an umprovoked post about me being a troll.

"unprovoked"? Lol. More of the same eh? I pointed out the truth, that you are a troll - after having witnessed you trolling most of the people in the thread. I do not need provocation to state what I deduce from observation.

Your intentions are clearly to grief and not participate.

Clearly you're mistaken. My first post in this thread was chalked full of honest questions which you conveniently pretended don't exist, so as to "support" your obvious lies. What's funny is that by responding to me in the manner in which you have, you expose yourself in support of my second post in the thread - that you shouldn't be fed. Your entire perspective on the world seems to be founded in this fantasy world in which you can lie and change everyone else. Tough luck for you.

"Oh but whatever I say never get's through your head. Boo hoo."

? You state that as if it's a quote from me. It isn't. It doesn't hurt me that you can't understand and damn thing that anyone else says, ever. I'd say if anything - it's at your own expense.

If you feel that way, you do not belong in a logical discussion.

If I felt you were in any way qualified to discern logic from the lack thereof, I might show some concern.

Get lost.
TROLL!

*sigh*

Yes, saying it over and over and over again... that will make it true. Quite telling as to how your fantasy world was created. Well done. Thank you for exposing an interesting mental disorder. For what were you diagnosed?

Oh, and you might note that I am not feeding the troll. I am dissecting it. You may find that to be "grief" but that is not my problem nor intention. Grief is often a side-effect of threat, and exposing your fantasy for the facade that it is....

That's a threat to you.

That's a lie. Quote the text, liar. You can't because it doesn't exist. Yet your desperation for superiority fabricates a fantasy that you take for reality, in which you are irrefutable - as with all your commentary as far as I can tell.



"unprovoked"? Lol. More of the same eh? I pointed out the truth, that you are a troll - after having witnessed you trolling most of the people in the thread. I do not need provocation to state what I deduce from observation.



Clearly you're mistaken. My first post in this thread was chalked full of honest questions which you conveniently pretended don't exist, so as to "support" your obvious lies. What's funny is that by responding to me in the manner in which you have, you expose yourself in support of my second post in the thread - that you shouldn't be fed. Your entire perspective on the world seems to be founded in this fantasy world in which you can lie and change everyone else. Tough luck for you.



? You state that as if it's a quote from me. It isn't. It doesn't hurt me that you can't understand and damn thing that anyone else says, ever. I'd say if anything - it's at your own expense.



If I felt you were in any way qualified to discern logic from the lack thereof, I might show some concern.



*sigh*

Yes, saying it over and over and over again... that will make it true. Quite telling as to how your fantasy world was created. Well done. Thank you for exposing an interesting mental disorder. For what were you diagnosed?

Oh, and you might note that I am not feeding the troll. I am dissecting it. You may find that to be "grief" but that is not my problem nor intention. Grief is often a side-effect of threat, and exposing your fantasy for the facade that it is....

That's a threat to you.
TROLLS SUCH AS YOURSELF GET ONE THING. IGNORED.