Deniers and disbelievers.
Believers and non believers.
Facts and fiction.
Psychologicial understanding and psuedopsychologicial understands.

In my opinion.
Telepathy is real. At least, the "something or so and so that has not been presented to the public in a correct fashion", I am sure, more than likly exists. That considering what has not been presented to the general public could be any range of possibilities which have not been seen and there is no apparent evidence for.

So that psuedopsciencicial (lol) statement. And if anyone cares to talk about any of it I am game, as well as I am sure many others..................

I have had to examine what some things are as far as dealing with things.
I have come to the ground that the people here say that telepathy is false or whatever ground has been presented, is that ... Well, what is it again? I do not remember the actual grounds which have been presented. Most of it ended in confusion, most of it ended how ever I am sure.

Anyway... Definately telepathy is something of a lot of controversy. The bit about the denial covers a lot.
The thing about dogs barking and it effecting people in such ways has a lot to do with telepathy or the psychic realm in my opinion. Someone could be an entire mute and yet totally and entirely control an entire house. How in the world can this not be considered as telepathy?

No further edit, have at it.
Or maybe a further edit, regardless I doubt it.. who knwos.

Telepathy is real.

No it isn't. :crazy:

More real than you like to admit unfortunately.

No, Brent, it not real. There have been thousands of tests and trials run by various universities and research groups in the past sixty years and NOT ONE shred of solid evidence ever showed it exists. The results were always the same - at or below what would be expected by pure chance alone. There were a few that seemed to show something but it later discovered that those tests were faulty.

Even CIA tried it for several years and eventually gave it up as a total loss.

The only people who believe in it are those who WANT to believe it - no one else.

I will believe that you think that this is so. That In point of fact, the universities have made valid tests and such. But can you show me anything about these tests? No. They did not have any material whatsoever which presents itself to me. It does not even present itself to you, unless you can present to me where it is precisely that you are getting this information from.

Tell me Read, so that I may infact change your mind... What is it that they seemed to show?

Of course guys, Telepathy is real, or, at least, there is some aspect which is capable of being uncovered to the ignorance of most every single sci-forum member (Likly James Randi included).

I will believe that you think that this is so. That In point of fact, the universities have made valid tests and such. But can you show me anything about these tests? No. They did not have any material whatsoever which presents itself to me. It does not even present itself to you, unless you can present to me where it is precisely that you are getting this information from.

Tell me Read, so that I may infact change your mind... What is it that they seemed to show?

Of course guys, Telepathy is real, or, at least, there is some aspect which is capable of being uncovered to the ignorance of most every single sci-forum member (Likly James Randi included).

Brent, sometimes what you type is so jumbled up that it's practically impossible to tell what you are saying/asking.

And I told you quite clearly that NONE of those tests showed telepathy to exist. It's nothing more than a fable - a wish that some people have for it to be real. It's no more real than Santa of the Easter Bunny.

You will never, ever be able to change my mind because I deal only in facts - not in wishful thinking.

Fine.

Deal in facts. The best way to go. But.
It is far likely that what you say is true, but also possible to find the source. The source is telling me... ... ... that the university tests are not appropriate because I have no evidence.

Is telling me... ... ... that even the randi foundation or whatever, is falty. If you were to say "Randi never got any ability to find anything out about telepathy being real- AT ALL!!
I would say. I see no evidence. Oh. There is the evidence. It exists at the randi foundation website. Damn. So telepathy does not exist. This is quite a statement. Telepathy does not exist. When I experience the shit every day. The stuff is denied and it isn't even proper to consider it. When someone considers or is at least somewhat empathetic with what you are trying to explain, then it would help dramatically.

Fine.

Deal in facts. The best way to go. But.
It is far likely that what you say is true, but also possible to find the source. The source is telling me... ... ... that the university tests are not appropriate because I have no evidence.

Then let's flip it around - you show us some SOLID proof from a relible source that telepathy exists. Not some shady website but a scientifically recognized source. Can you do it?

I know one thing.

And that is that I know a lot about some things about this... I don't want to say the big gun, or someone on this site would find it. Oh, I got that from Quantum Quack; of course it is not evidence. But it is at least something worth while. Besides. I have no scientific evidence from any reliable source. However I do have one source. My self. That tells me: I am at this moment ENTIRELY experiencing something ENTIRELY similar to telepathy; I have had a VERY GREAT DEAL of time experiencing and deciding what is up with this telepathic shit. Let me tell you that straight out. I've had to consider it, whilst Spidergoat would entirely dismiss and deny the idea. There is something fishy with that is there not? "Is this not somewhat at least proof for some of the statements that I have made above- like ''There are some things which have not been uncovered about 'telepathy' to the entire ignorance of sci-forums"... Oh sigh. Anyway Read, the point is simple. And it is this... there is a lot which is utterly faulted in the telepathic world. One is my own experience of it, and two... is that I cannot deny it whatsoever and especially three, no one will even test it and four! It's bobane to deny every single bit of it.

Especially the bit about ..
Well.. What is the mind capable of. I'll stop right there. I know that telepathy exists.
Before I make a complete fool out of myself..

Fool.. lol.

LOL ... You may have missed post 8.

The only shady website that I go to is sciforums.
But now that you mention shady websites, I am not at all tempted. Maybe I'll google telepathy? And find a bunch of bullshit. I doubt any of it will be true, the same as you do.

I am pretty concerned with it all, though, as it affects my life.
My family.
And my own perceptions of the thing.

The evidence to me is that there is no evidence that I am wrong.

Christ read how many telepathy threads you gonna ruin (j/k).

ANYWAY let's see what you got...

The only thing I have to say to the lack of evidence is that randi or anyone on this planet refuses to test my environment. And the conditions of a "psychic realm" involvement (which is denied by the public)--- etc..

Suddenly quite :o

The only shady website that I go to is sciforums.
But now that you mention shady websites, I am not at all tempted. Maybe I'll google telepathy? And find a bunch of bullshit. I doubt any of it will be true, the same as you do.

I am pretty concerned with it all, though, as it affects my life.
My family.
And my own perceptions of the thing.

The evidence to me is that there is no evidence that I am wrong.

You were right - I did miss post 8 so I went back and read it. :)

Brent, I do understand what you're thinking about all this. And there ARE some real and solid reasons why some people have experiences that they tend to group under the general heading of "telepathy." And we can talk about those if you wish.

Incidentally, I just saw a couple of very kind things you said about me and I appreciate them. :) I think perhaps you like me because I always try hard to be very open and honest about everything. I have no hidden agendas, no dark secret thoughts and I don't try to sugar-coat the facts nor attempt to dress up a dog in a fur coat and make it appear like it's a full-grown polar bear. Nor do I make any attempt to avoid issues - I think it's best to deal with everything head-on rather than trying to side-step them.

Sorry for that bit of off-topic there, it was just on my mind at the moment.:)

Meh... :D

I'll butt in if I may seeing as Bent has mentioned this handle.

Telepathy or communication across what appears to be space with out the use of Electromagnetic Emmissions or mediums that require time to transit is real and is indeed fact.

Unfortunately people tend to think of telepathy as being something simple, something really easy to use and do, something that people somehow develop with out proper support and training.
When entering infinte space with infinitre path ways and an infinite information source tell me how is it to be easilly navigated and controlled?

It is not easy to make sense of. Certainly very diffciult to predict or do in predictable ways.
To communicate a thought or a feeling or a nightmare or a believe or a will to someone with all the baggage of human skepticism to deal with makes it ultimately impossible to do unless one can work in a very hostile and confusing mental environment. If you want to know jsut how hostile visit a psychiatric institute/hospital or the Irak war front for a few hours and find out.

Some will claim ability and show how grounded they are by devoting themselves entirely to love conceptsto avoid the punishing aspects of more earthly desires. Such as faith healing, talking to the dead for charitable reasons, the laying of hands and even prayer meetingsat your local church group. After all what is praying any way but merely an attempt at telepathic transmission of desire to some thing or some one...usually a devine entity.

Now even though most athiest will deny they pray I know that it is a part of our every day nature to reach for inspiration when we need it and that my firends is an act of prayer. Telepathy is real abeit at this time very difficult to prove in a way that the tests do not destroy.

Best wishes,
love and light
and hows it hangin'
:D

Yeah.
Telepathy is real.

Hear that?

I'll butt in if I may seeing as Bent has mentioned this handle.

Telepathy or communication across what appears to be space with out the use of Electromagnetic Emmissions or mediums that require time to transit is real and is indeed fact.

Unfortunately people tend to think of telepathy as being something simple, something really easy to use and do, something that people somehow develop with out proper support and training.
When entering infinte space with infinitre path ways and an infinite information source tell me how is it to be easilly navigated and controlled?

It is not easy to make sense of. Certainly very diffciult to predict or do in predictable ways.
To communicate a thought or a feeling or a nightmare or a believe or a will to someone with all the baggage of human skepticism to deal with makes it ultimately impossible to do unless one can work in a very hostile and confusing mental environment. If you want to know jsut how hostile visit a psychiatric institute/hospital or the Irak war front for a few hours and find out.

Some will claim ability and show how grounded they are by devoting themselves entirely to love conceptsto avoid the punishing aspects of more earthly desires. Such as faith healing, talking to the dead for charitable reasons, the laying of hands and even prayer meetingsat your local church group. After all what is praying any way but merely an attempt at telepathic transmission of desire to some thing or some one...usually a devine entity.

Now even though most athiest will deny they pray I know that it is a part of our every day nature to reach for inspiration when we need it and that my firends is an act of prayer. Telepathy is real abeit at this time very difficult to prove in a way that the tests do not destroy.

Best wishes,
love and light
and hows it hangin'
:D

Very, VERY easy for you to say. I could just as easily say the Moon is inhabited by giant chickens.

BUT - can either of us substantiate what we've said? You first...

qq called me "Bent"

In my experience, the closest thing to telepathy is when our dogs want something, like food or a walk or whatever and they stare at you intently. I think they are definitely thinking about what they want and are trying to convey those thoughs to me, but the only reason I pick up on it is because I know them through experience, not because 'm reading their thoughts.

Yeah.
Telepathy is real.

Hear that?

Telepathy as in, my brain waves go out and affect your brain waves?
Unlikely.

But events that seemingly could be attributed to brain waves, but have other, cryptic reasons? Sure.

If you're using telepathy as a catch-all for an organism's mysterious behavior that seemingly lacks external cues, yet predicts a real event, then absolutely- it's occurring all the time.

Just recently we discovered that birds may actually be able to visualize magnetic fields. It's commonly known that pets behave strangely before an earthquake. There was a cat that knew when people would die in an old folk's home. There have been other accounts of pets detecting when people are about to get sick. There's a man who has epileptic fits when he tilts his head the wrong way, so he has a dog that will watch him and let him know if he's about to have a seizure. The man then readjusts his posture.

Are these cases of "telepathy", or simply that animals are sensitive to minutiae that we don't know exists, and is it valuable to attribute these things to an unknown and untestable magical force?

Telepathy as in, my brain waves go out and affect your brain waves?
Unlikely.

But events that seemingly could be attributed to brain waves, but have other, cryptic reasons? Sure.

If you're using telepathy as a catch-all for an organism's mysterious behavior that seemingly lacks external cues, yet predicts a real event, then absolutely- it's occurring all the time.

Just recently we discovered that birds may actually be able to visualize magnetic fields. It's commonly known that pets behave strangely before an earthquake. There was a cat that knew when people would die in an old folk's home. There have been other accounts of pets detecting when people are about to get sick. There's a man who has epileptic fits when he tilts his head the wrong way, so he has a dog that will watch him and let him know if he's about to have a seizure. The man then readjusts his posture.

Are these cases of "telepathy", or simply that animals are sensitive to minutiae that we don't know exists, and is it valuable to attribute these things to an unknown and untestable magical force?

I personally feel that this is a classic case of denial:

Telepathy as in, my brain waves go out and affect your brain waves?
Unlikely.

But events that seemingly could be attributed to brain waves, but have other, cryptic reasons? Sure.

"Defense", Roman:

If you're using telepathy as a catch-all for an organism's mysterious behavior that seemingly lacks external cues, yet predicts a real event, then absolutely- it's occurring all the time.

Before I go any further.
What are you denying?

It is absolutely true that it is possible to control other people. As I have experienced it myself. This control is also related of course, with understanding exactly what it is that you are controling, or that they are thinking... It starts to get really confusing and messy/heated or what not, and yes. You were denying precisely this in your post. When .. I do not want to incite the denial. But I will leave it at that..

Sigh.
I'll stop there.
Too much stress for me!

The question is, has it been proven by science?
No.

...

When I was a little kid, me and one of my friends would sit in my room or hers and send each other random digits mentally. It was fucking scary because this process worked 90% of the time.

So yeah...I'd say it is real.

If it is it isn't good to even consider it.

Are these cases of "telepathy", or simply that animals are sensitive to minutiae that we don't know exists, and is it valuable to attribute these things to an unknown and untestable magical force?

sort of ironic this statement.
Unknowable, untestable magnetic force, maybe inspiring animals to behave as if experiencing telepathic communications of some sort....hmmmmm

Firstly science doesn't even know what magnetism is except by it's effects. They don't know what creates a magnetic field except to state that it is probably electically induced which is also something they do not know what makes it so.

Secondly, electricity and magnetism, and gravity are all determinable by their consistancy of effect, in that they are constant when "environments" are maintained. However when it comes to animated field producers such as humans or other life forms these so called fields are inconsistant and variable depending on many factors from mood to attitude to emotional aspects, to thoughts and fantasy and imaginings.

Obviously it is virtually impossible to test for consistancy something that is constantly variable and subject to significant changes.

Watching a flock of birds in flight circling as they do say 400 of them you can not ignore the effect that birds on the outer of the group can move "if they choose to" in perfect synch with birds maybe 200 metres away, but of course they have choices to make as to whether to move in synch or not which makes the testing impossible as the birds will inevitable prove the hypothesis wrong as they exercise their choice or not.
people are exactly they same.
People link up to, so to speak, across vast distances with out even realising it and make choices about those links, which leads to inconsistancy of testing as the person moves from one link to another as they navigate their way through life.

A bit like watching the Berlin Phil. orchestra playing Brahms Violin concerto in D maj, all 120 or so musicians including the soloist performing in amazing synch without any lag or time needed to interpret magnetic fields or other emmissions.

How is it so?

That a player, one conductor in view and another player 50 metres away unseen by the first player and not even heard , can play in perfect synch and in the same mood and attitude?

There is only one real explanation and that they voluntarilly decide to entangle their minds and bodies for the sake of the performance [the group] A form of empathy or affinity if you like. [ resorting to "Hive" behaviour coul dbe a more negative way of looking at it]

Negitive for certain.
Gotta go eat... I hope my parents don't jump down my ass :D

Very, VERY easy for you to say. I could just as easily say the Moon is inhabited by giant chickens.

BUT - can either of us substantiate what we've said? You first...

Ha
Typical....chickens on the moon....ha

I bet I can prove to others besides myself, telepathy is real a lot faster than you can prove chickens on the moon and a liot cheaper too I might add.....might take 30 years of statistical data but I bet if I devoted 30 years to trying to prove telepathy I will still come in cheaper and quicker than proving chickens on the moon....[chuckle]

QQ.
Wanna talk. Don't have anything to lose by posting right now if you know what I mean. It's time. ... If you want to, I have just a short while.
Will however PM you first.

Telepathy is real.
Prove it.

Oh. Wait. That's why this is in pseudoscience. No proof required, only opinions.

Laughable.

...might take 30 years of statistical data but I bet...[chuckle]
You'd lose QQ.

Have you ever wondered why such a powerful human trait has never been shown to exist, under even simple controlled conditions?

it

dosen't

exist.

Charlatains, sensation seekers, hoaxers, and the deluded.

Ha
Typical....chickens on the moon....ha

I bet I can prove to others besides myself, telepathy is real a lot faster than you can prove chickens on the moon and a liot cheaper too I might add.....might take 30 years of statistical data but I bet if I devoted 30 years to trying to prove telepathy I will still come in cheaper and quicker than proving chickens on the moon....[chuckle]

That's pretty dumb - both facets of it. Obviously, I don't intend to try and prove my silly statement - and you couldn't begin to prove yours in 100 years. Very earnest people, some with large sums of money, have been trying for DECADES and have absolutely NOTHING to show for it all. Zip. Nada. Zero.

So what make the Great Quantum Quack better than all of them? The same - zip, nada, zero!

bah!

lol

You guys advoid even the simplest of observations.
It's no wonder i've been raped.

I think there is some limited ability in this area. Under certain states, I can pick up what people are thinking just by looking at them. I suspect it's merely the subconscious mind creating an accurate model of another's thought patterns based on our own experience and the non-verbal cues that people give off.

Ever tried riding in a car?

In the back seat.

Other people are in the front, who happen to be your sister and sisters to be married dude. Named ... Joey. That's it.

You happen to think that the ride is going to utterly be a nightmare and a half.
When all of the sudden!
Do you realize that it is beginning already!
Tuduh!
Sit in the steat and you are immediately effecting people. It's as if all of the rays you sought out to destroy are now being your destroyer (or such).
Things are supposed to be fine, however, in entirety.
But they are? Are they?
Of course not.
Riding along in the car you start to pick up many things. These are all natural of course. But do the others realize them 'as much'-- of course they don't. Especially when you start to examine potentials and thoughts and control words spoken. You start getting wound up in this so called psychic realm which indeed has many determining features. I swear, that "they were speaking my words"- without me saying a clue and trying infact to die in movementless etc.
I do imagine that this does not count what so ever, towards a "whatever" of psychic or anything related. But when there is "self determination" "in" the psychic realm, you start to realize, that indeed, you are watching other people on surely more than one level, if not two.

This of course is not "psychic"
It is crazy and insane, and any good doctor would believe the same to be true.
But how much does he understand about this such.
How much does he realize that "I" do not wish to have such?

Does he realize the stresses involved in the attempting to rid of such a thing, or all of the detail that goes in to it? No, I am sure infact that he does not.

But, what is the proof of such. Is it entirely limited?
You guys decide.
Tell me.
I have no idea.
I do think that it may not be but I also do think that it may be. Of course, "telepathy" is what again? Thoughts being transmitted without the use of sensory perception. What the hell?

I was trying to die?
Proof of telepathy?
What more do you want

Telepathy should not be confused with the illusion of telepathy that happens in the mentally ill.

Right.
You tell me one thing I said that was an illusion.

I wouldn't know where to begin. I know that a symptom of schizophrenia is the tendency of our pattern recognition abilities to see patterns that aren't really there. It's in "overdrive", so to speak. This leads to hallucinations that people know what others are thinking, or you can read their minds, or they are putting messages into your mind.

I would say telepathy does exist...but it is a very weak occurance...

Good point spidergoat, it's also something that "they can do to you"