But they also hate whites and they are white, would they be racist?

Yes.

Yes.

yes

Any time you hate an ethnic group as a whole it is racist hating your own kind just means you are unappetizing.

Any time you hate an ethnic group as a whole it is racist hating your own kind just means you are unappetizing.
Damn you, you broke the yes chain. *shakes fist*

So are you saying that it not OK to hate another race but it is OK to hate your own race?

Also say I like Blacks but I hate whites and I am white, does this make me racist?

So are you saying that it not OK to hate another race but it is OK to hate your own race?
Racism is racism. It doesn't matter which race(s) you are or which race(s) you hate – it's still wrong.

Also say I like Blacks but I hate whites and I am white, does this make me racist?
Yes.

So are you saying that it not OK to hate another race but it is OK to hate your own race?
Who said that? :bugeye:

Also say I like Blacks but I hate whites and I am white, does this make me racist?
Yes.

Do me a favor.
Define the term "racist".

Also say I like Blacks but I hate whites and I am white, does this make me racist?
yes, if it i for the mere fact that they are white

So are you saying that it not OK to hate another race but it is OK to hate your own race?

that wasn't the question.

yes, if it i for the mere fact that they are white
If someone "hates whites" that would imply all white people.
What reason, other than simply because they are white, could there be unless that person has met every white person in the world?

If you say, "I hate whites", regardless of what race you may be, it is a racist statement because you are necessarily basing your hatred on no other factor than race.

I think the most common general description of "Racist" is:

1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.

Surely being racist is very much a "my race is better than your race" mentality?

Surely being racist is very much a "my race is better than your race" mentality?
In most cases, yes. However, look again at the definition:
The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
A particular race, as in, not necessarily a race you are not.

To look at it from another angle, another definition of racism is "discrimination or prejudice based on race". On race, as in not just on the races you are not.

Exactly, Athelwulf.
I'm curious...
Does this hypothetical white person who hates white people hate him/herself?

But they also hate whites and they are white, would they be racist?
Yes.

how do you guys feel about black people being able to call other black people "nigga", but white people - unless you are in there - can't because it's considered a grave faux pas. and how do you feel about african americans claiming they were oppressed even though they missed most of that by a couple of years and slavery by a few generations?

Define the term "racist".Definition of "racism" from Merriam-Webster.com

"A belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race." (Do you guys know how to use the internet? :))

Alex got it right but assumed there's more to it, which there isn't.

It is quite possible, and not at all uncommon, to believe that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race, but that one's own race does not happen to be the superior one. Racism at its worst, when practiced by a majority in power to hold down a minority, can create a "Stockholm Syndrome" attitude among the downtrodden. If your people spend generations at the bottom of a system, without accomplishing much, a few of you might jump to the conclusion that you are inferior, rather than realizing that lack of education and other opportunities prevents you from fulfilling your potential.

But in the era since the Enlightenment, particularly since the nearly unbelievable zenith of racism in the Third Reich, and more recently since the social and intellectual upheaval of the 1960s seemed to find racism everywhere, we see the reverse. Some members of the race in power are so ouraged by its historical pattern of oppressive behavior, that they believe themselves to be the inferiors.

Statistical sampling is used all the time in respectable fields. It is unnecessary to meet all Arab terrorists, for example, to conclude that one doesn't like them. The same is possible for an ethnicity or musical genre.

That said, it still isn't very smart to make too many conclusions about someone you don't really know.

Okay, your posts are moving my thinking along.

Okay so I am racist to my own race (whichever it may be). Is this more or less wrong than being racist to another race?

At the very heart of the anti-racist movement is the beief in equality. So surely it should be the same?

But on the other hand isn't it my right to dislike my own race?

I read in the Times that people against racism don't so much love all races as hate whites. The same goes for animal rights activists, they don't love animals, they just hate humans.

Okay, your posts are moving my thinking along.

Okay so I am racist to my own race (whichever it may be). Is this more or less wrong than being racist to another race?

At the very heart of the anti-racist movement is the beief in equality. So surely it should be the same?

But on the other hand isn't it my right to dislike my own race?


The problem with your thinking here is that you are generalizing; why do you hate all whites?

You should judge people on an individual basis based on mutual respect. Judging someone for a reason like skin or hair color indicates irrationality as there is no valid basis for your dislike.

The problem with your thinking here is that you are generalizing; why do you hate all whites?

You should judge people on an individual basis based on mutual respect. Judging someone for a reason like skin or hair color indicates irrationality as there is no valid basis for your dislike.


what if phobic-like behavior is introduced? say a person is traumatized by someone of color. would it be irrational for that person to fear others of that race?

what if phobic-like behavior is introduced? say a person is traumatized by someone of color. would it be irrational for that person to fear others of that race?

Is there any evidence of such? :confused:

So if I hate everybody that makes me a defacto racist?
Guess I'd be sexist, ageist and down on the disabled to boot.

Sounds silly to me.
Dee Cee

So if I hate everybody that makes me a defacto racist?
Guess I'd be sexist, ageist and down on the disabled to boot.

Sounds silly to me.
Dee Cee

No but you would be lonely, I think

Everyone's racist.

This argument is pretty stupid because everyone does it. It doesn't matter what they say (or are made to say), everyone is inherently racist.

Adolf Hitler was racist.

Nelson Mandela is racist.

Martin Luther King was racist.

Your grandmother is racist.

Now let's talk about something else.

what if phobic-like behavior is introduced? say a person is traumatized by someone of color. would it be irrational for that person to fear others of that race?Yes, of course it would be irrational! That's what "irrational" means! If you fear all people of one race because one person of that race harmed you, that's pretty darn irrational.

However, it doesn't seem to precisely satisfy the dictionary definition of "racism." If you're afraid of an entire class of people, and you admit that your fear is irrational, then I suppose that you're admitting that you don't necessarily believe they are inferior because of their racial characteristics. In which case you're not a racist, you're just a guy who needs a couple of sessions with a good fear therapist.

But legally you'd probably be lumped in with the racists. If you'd be unable to work in harmony at a company side by side with people of this other race, it doesn't matter to the company whether it's because you hate them or because you have an irrational fear that you haven't worked out. You'd be a disruption to the workplace and they'd be in violation of a number of laws.

But they also hate whites and they are white, would they be racist?

'cmon you really dont know? they would be a miserable bastard. too rapped up in labels (racist) clouds judgement.

Okay so I am racist to my own race (whichever it may be). Is this more or less wrong than being racist to another race?It is not more or less wrong, but equally wrong. Assuming for the sake of argument that the two people who feel the two different types of racism feel them to the same degree, the consequences will be similar.

If a white person dislikes black people and tries to avoid giving them jobs or other opportunties, that's causing damage to them. If a black person dislikes black people and tries to avoid giving them jobs or other opportunities, that is causing the same damage to them.

Is is equally wrong.But on the other hand isn't it my right to dislike my own race?Your "right"? If you live in the USA, you fortunately live in a country where the government has not yet figured out a way to punish you for your feelings. So yes, you have a "right" to dislike anyone you want, including whole races of people, for any reason or for no reason.

But you'd better stop far short of letting your dislike for any race affect your behavior. The government will punish you for treating people unfairly because of their race.

Naturally, since white heterosexual males have been in power in our Greco-Roman civilization for thousands of years, the laws have been slow to catch up with the possibility of racism against us. So actually, if you hate white heterosexual males and you avoid giving us jobs or other opportunities, you might get away with it. Particularly if you're white yourself.

In fact, we just lived through about thirty years of that. We Libertarians called it "affirmative discrimination" but in government-speak the term was "affirmative action." We were actually turned down for jobs, housing, school admissions, and other programs in which the government was able to insert its slimy tendrils, in order to increase the percentage of women and other races. I guess the program started to fizzle out before they began to give preference to gays; that would have been a lot of fun to watch concurrently with the resurgence of fundamentalist Christianity.

You have to take things philosophically and it served a purpose. We white heterosexual males got a taste of what the other people on earth have been living with for a long time. Perhaps it made us wiser. Since it only lasted for one generation we can just write it off as a blip in the timeline.

I remember the episode of "King of the Hill" when Hank Hill said, "What kind of country is this, where I can only hate a man if he's white?"

I read in the Times that people against racism don't so much love all races as hate whites. The same goes for animal rights activists, they don't love animals, they just hate humans.

White monopoly on racism is a lie handed down through generations, fostered by those with the mentality of cub scouts sitting around a campfire.

Schleeberhooorst is right though, to some degree the beast lives inside all of us.

As far as animal rights activists i would say there is much truth to that satement.

Alex,
You are white.
Do you hate yourself?

back to the questio i asked earlier...
is it racist if one group of people can call each other what began as a racial slur but others can't? and why if a black person calls a white person a cracker does nothing happen but if a white person calls a black person a nigger is it bad?

Calling a black person "Nigger" was always seen as a derogatory term meant solely to demean, oppress and control blacks.
To take that power away from whites, blacks claimed ownership of the term.
If your master beats you with a whip, take his whip away from him, and he can no longer beat you, therefore he can no longer be your master.

Furthermore, “Nigger” is based on the Latin word “Niger”, meaning black.
Since there is nothing to be ashamed of or embarrassed about in being black, someone calling you black should not be offensive.
In fact, it can very well be a term of camaraderie - especially when people have a common ground of being oppressed.
Oppression breeds strength through perseverance. Common oppression breeds camaraderie.
You are brothers in arms fighting against a common oppressor.

However, when used by whites with the intention of it being an insult or derogatory term, then it is, of course, wrong because the point was for it to be offensive, so why should they not take offense?
It all comes down to intention.

Does that help clear it up?

By the way, nubianconcubine...
I am curious.
Are you a black woman?

By the way, nubianconcubine...
I am curious.
Are you a black woman?

i am mulatto. do you know what that means? :p

and i understand that using any insult with the intent to insult is bad. but what if you have that one token white guy? why can't he say it without risk of trouble? that's what i meant. :)

Blacks have earned ownership of the term.
They have paid for it with their suffering.
Whites, on the other hand, have no right to it.

Black have earned ownership of the term.
They have paid for it with their suffering.
Whites, on the other hand, have no right to it.

so in essence that one token white guy will never be able to share in the relationship as much as the other black guys because he's white? what i mean is, if only the black guys are allowed to say it to each other it seems it would somehow strengthen the bond between them. prohibiting the white guy from saying it would seem like an exclusion.

i am mulatto. do you know what that means? :p
Yes.

and i understand that using any insult with the intent to insult is bad. but what if you have that one token white guy? why can't he say it without risk of trouble? that's what i meant. :)
You mean the white guy that hangs out with a group of black guys and wants to be part of the group and have all its privelages, such as referring to the other members of the group as "my nigga"?

That is a privelage that he has to earn and has to be granted by the group, and often times it is.
I am white and spent most of my time growing up with blacks.
They used to always refer to me as "my nigga" but I would never call them that, because I saw it as a sign of disrespect, even though it would have been OK with them.
I felt I hadn't earned it (see above post) and it would be disrespectful for me to use without having earned the right.
I considered them brothers, but we were not brothers in arms with regard to that struggle.

That is a privelage that he has to earn and has to be granted by the group, and often times it is.
I am white and spent most of my time growing up with blacks.
They used to always refer to me as "my nigga" but I would never call them that, because I saw it as a sign of disrespect, even though it would have been OK with them.
I felt I hadn't earned it (see above post) and it would be disrespectful for me to use without having earned the right.
I considered them brothers, but we were not brothers in arms with regard to that struggle.

...i must say i like you and i very much like the way you put that. i have to agree.
my brother and i grew up as opposite as two siblings can get. i went more toward the retro, outcast, white group while he drifted off toward the thugs and gangstas. however, more times than not, his group of friends accepted me as i was than my friends would accept him. when i look back on it, i find that i think of them with more fondness than i do my own group.
it was strange at first because there were rules that i had to learn and i railed against them at first. but as time went on i learned them and the structure of the relationships. it's not exactly having to "earn the right". it's learning the rules of engagement.

Okay so I am racist to my own race (whichever it may be). Is this more or less wrong than being racist to another race?
I wrote the answer to this earlier...

But on the other hand isn't it my right to dislike my own race?
Yes, your right to dislike, but not to harm anyone based on your dislikes.

what if phobic-like behavior is introduced? say a person is traumatized by someone of color. would it be irrational for that person to fear others of that race?
Seeing as a phobia is an strong, irrational fear or dislike of something, and also seeing as that was a single person who traumatized them, then yes.

and i understand that using any insult with the intent to insult is bad. but what if you have that one token white guy? why can't he say it without risk of trouble? that's what i meant. :)
He can't usually say it without trouble because some people are idiots about racism. I do believe he should be able to, though, if the person he uses the term with fully understands his intent and is okay with it.

Actually, Hitler was one of the greatest military tactician on the planet that ever lived. But he made one big mistake of attacking Russia too early.

Actually, Hitler was one of the greatest military tactician on the planet that ever lived. But he made one big mistake of attacking Russia too early.
No, Hitler was insane. Rommel and Donitz were the great tacticians.

No, Hitler was insane. Rommel and Donitz were the great tacticians.

yeah, hitler was insane.

To slide off topic for a moment.... (unless the topic is actually just a matter of semantics)

Are children who have sexual encounters with other children paedophiles?

Just a thought.
Dee Cee

To slide off topic for a moment.... (unless the topic is actually just a matter of semantics)

Are children who have sexual encounters with other children paedophiles?

Just a thought.
Dee Cee

that particular topic is being discussed at this very moment <a href="http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=55817">here<a/>.
go on and bring it up. that should get it started once more. :)

No, Hitler was insane. Rommel and Donitz were the great tacticians.


No he wasn't Hitler was very good.

No he wasn't Hitler was very good.
Now you are just trolling.

No he wasn't Hitler was very good.

what are you? crazy?
*sigh!* the insane ones can never see it... :p

What a terrible thing to say, sarcastically or not.. I hope that the majority of 'your people' don't think this way, Muslim.

What a terrible thing to say, sarcastically or not.. I hope that the majority of 'your people' don't think this way, Muslim.

i thought i saw a post regarding "sand n****rs". i was going to say something about it but you already did xerxes...damn... :(

I was trying to prove a point through sarcasm myself, but then thought... nah, Muslim has trouble understanding subtleties. And promptly edited. I have a good feeling Muslim was being literal to begin with.

i theorize that one day soon, everyone will look like me and racism will be reduced to hating people for the quality of their hair. :D

i theorize that one day soon, everyone will look like me and racism will be reduced to hating people for the quality of their hair. :D
You there! Your hair is slightly lighter than mine! You must die!

Actually, what else might happen is that we all blend together and become the same color – maybe that of Indians – but then people become shadist.

You there! You're a different shade of gray! You must be burned at the stake!

No he wasn't Hitler was very good.
Oh man... Thanks for the laugh, Muslim.

Ah... Good thing you weren't serious, eh? ;)

What a terrible thing to say, sarcastically or not.. I hope that the majority of 'your people' don't think this way, Muslim.


Some would say hail Amin al Husseini! :D

I said Hitler was a great man in terms of his swift military victories in Europe.

Apprarently Mein Kampf, written by Adolf Hitler, is a best-seller in the Muslim world!

Which do you think is worse, black people calling themselves niggas or white people calling themselves rednecks?

Who gives a SHIT REALLY?

Apprarently Mein Kampf, written by Adolf Hitler, is a best-seller in the Muslim world
to be honest im not too surprised, your little buddies are probably using it for tips, which would explaine a lot

Which do you think is worse, black people calling themselves niggas or white people calling themselves rednecks?

i think white people calling themselves crackers is pretty bad. but not as bad as jews calling themselves christkillers. :p

I said Hitler was a great man in terms of his swift military victories in Europe.

I'm sure your more secret valuing of Hitler extends farther. Hey - he was quite a bit like you, you know.

He, too, got a sexual disease and starting writing nonsense.

Apprarently Mein Kampf, written by Adolf Hitler, is a best-seller in the Muslim world!

It is.

http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=44727
http://www.windsofchange.net/archives/006690.php
http://www.nationalreview.com/29july02/pryce-jones072902.asp
http://www.homocon.com/archives/2005/03/booksellers_in.html