Some say that we evolved from apes. Well, if this can be proved as fact, then how come modern apes don't evolve at all? Some speculate that Extraterrestrials may have some how edited their own DNA in a form of cloning to continue their race in the form of humans. Then there is God. God, in my personal opinion, may have created us in a way that we can't understand. For example, God could have possibly given us message, split it up into millions upon millions of puzzle pieces, and scattered them across a table that we can call Science. We just have to put the pieces together, and we'll find out that what we believe to be true, what we read about in our Science books and Encyclopedias, may be false because the puzzle pieces are in the wrong spot.

WHOA...i just flashed on an image of God being some ol' double-stranded helix up in the sky. ..just sitting there all twisted up like that and flashing on and off ...in neon colors. :eek:

:D ..either that...or Watson and Crick are running the show.:D

Welcome to the wide world of utter stupidity.

- Warren

all life evolves, including modern apes. why do you think modern apes don't evolve?

With the right selecting agent, the Apes might become dominant like in "The Planet of the Apes". Hope not... ...

You mean our world could turn into a bad movie??? NOOOO!!!!!

It's highly possible!!! There is even evidence that some people are evolving backwards, such as the reduced size of the jaws from eating food that doesn't require chewing and so on. But I don't think we well go back to apes, but some event may wipe out human and so other animals can dominate Earth.
[edit] With the production of transgenic species, maybe Apes can made talking the way we do. Of course I highly oppose this idea, maybe in the short run, we can see an increase in biodiversity, but really we are supporting convergent evolution and that is not good.

Originally posted by DNA
Some say that we evolved from apes. Well, if this can be proved as fact, then how come modern apes don't evolve at all? Some speculate that Extraterrestrials may have some how edited their own DNA in a form of cloning to continue their race in the form of humans. Then there is God. God, in my personal opinion, may have created us in a way that we can't understand. For example, God could have possibly given us message, split it up into millions upon millions of puzzle pieces, and scattered them across a table that we can call Science. We just have to put the pieces together, and we'll find out that what we believe to be true, what we read about in our Science books and Encyclopedias, may be false because the puzzle pieces are in the wrong spot.

God shuffled the evidence to confuse us? Is this what you think.
First of all your idea isn't testable and, therefore, it's not scientific. Second what we call science actually works: internet works, nuclear bombs works, cell phones works, hell we put a man on the moon based on our knowledge about gravity.
You must be a post modern bullshiter always trying to cheat everyone.
:D

Human Life was not random....


that is good news, since evolution is not a random process...imagine if human life had been random, then we had to start looking for a new theory that constitutes the backbone of modern biology...

a close call this one.

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If evolution isnt happening where do fossils come from? How do we develop new varieties of dogs? Why do bacteria develop resistance to antibiotics?

Evolution has happened and is happening,religion was inspired for those who can not comprehend science to is fullest. At the time religion came into play there was a great movement called the Great Forgetting, in which we have been taught ever since in church, this is some of the story of Adam and Eve. But the truths to our evolution lies in our DNA and our universe, I believe that this information search is what living is all about.

Originally posted by DNA
Some say that we evolved from apes. Well, if this can be proved as fact, then how come modern apes don't evolve at all? Some speculate that Extraterrestrials may have some how edited their own DNA in a form of cloning to continue their race in the form of humans. Then there is God. God, in my personal opinion, may have created us in a way that we can't understand. For example, God could have possibly given us message, split it up into millions upon millions of puzzle pieces, and scattered them across a table that we can call Science. We just have to put the pieces together, and we'll find out that what we believe to be true, what we read about in our Science books and Encyclopedias, may be false because the puzzle pieces are in the wrong spot.

Some populations branch, and develop, while others remain stable and at a different stage of development.

This explains African history and behavior as an immigrant group, anyway.

To me, "God" is an offensively ignorant concept, but that's for another debate board. However, the reason I bring this up is thus: most people when pressed about their beliefs are willing to leave behind the anthrocentric nature of "God" and agree on a mystical force; this to me is much healthier than putting a personality on it.

yes, a mystical force,simply NATURE(female gender of course) that is why the logic of evolution is so hard for some to see. they are still caught up in a world ruled by the male gender.

- or with things associated with the male gender, such as linearist quantitative logic :)

or the thought that we all may have once been hermaphrodites is distressing to some.

The particular breed of ape we evolved from is no longer around. Because they became us. Voila, there's your explanation!

The problem is not that evolution is random or not random, but rather that people model it according to randomness at a higher level. If we could observe every subatomic particle and predict its position (I'll get to quantum mechanics in a bit.), then it's no longer "random".

think about it this way: Suppose I flipped a coin. An ignorant observer would call it random and say that it has equal chance of coming up heads or tails. But suppose I knew how to flip a coin so that it comes up whichever way I wanted it to. Then it's no longer random. The observer only "models" the coin flip by probability because he can't observe every single factor that goes into it.

In the same way, when we're talking about apes evolving into humans, let us not say that it is "random" or "not-random" until we realize that biological evolution is just a way of MODELING an extremely complicated process. We use the theory of probability to model something we can't measure. That's the whole point. You can't disprove God by saying evolution holds, because evolution is a TOOL for SIMPLIFYING some complicated process God could have set into place. It's not REALLY probabilistic, but merely a probabilistic model.

Ok, so now there is an argument about quantum mechanics being probabilistic. That is true, but we only know that in context of interaction with other quantum systems. Does a non-quantum system exist? Only God knows (at this point in time at least), so in effect, all that is "pertinent" to nature is the probabilistic reality, but that doesn't rule out the possibility of there being a non-quantum/"supernatural" cause for evolution. That's more a question of how God works, assuming He exists. I could not claim to know how He works at the physical level, but that's due my own ignorance and the limitations of science.

Hope I'm not just spewing random ideas here. o.O

Yes indeed, I like that! A model for an extremely complicated process of survival. Human life has to survive, because we have to destroy. Chaos theory, not random theory.

Originally posted by axonio98
God shuffled the evidence to confuse us? Is this what you think.
First of all your idea isn't testable and, therefore, it's not scientific. Second what we call science actually works: internet works, nuclear bombs works, cell phones works, hell we put a man on the moon based on our knowledge about gravity.
You must be a post modern bullshiter always trying to cheat everyone.
:D

I'm by no means a biblical scholar, but I know somewhere in Romans 1 (I think?) it says that all knowledge is hidden in Christ. I believe science works and is applicable for many things. That's what we've learned from experience. But Romans 1 seems to suggest that there is still knowledge hidden from people. For example, what is the meaning of life? What is love? Where can I find happiness? It's "unscientific" because it can not be fully tested by non-subjective means, and most people discount such questions as being useless, partly because they can't figure out the answer. I consider them useful because despite the hubris of scientists and engineers (like myself), they are such silly yet important, simple yet difficult questions.

I'm glad to be "humbled" in this aspect. =P

Yes, it does make things a bit more enjoyable.

Note that humans did not evolve from apes. Humans and apes had a common ancestor and they both evolved independently of each other.

Neither is evolution random, although there is a significant random component. Mutations do occur largely randomly but most mutations result in unfavorable and unsuccessful outcomes. A tiny minority of mutations result in a favorable outcome and a species will then evolve forward. This is just one example of how a species will undergo a change.

In addition a species that can adapt to a changing environment will tend to survive, and those that can’t will die out.

These are all features of survival of the fittest. And these are just a part of natural selection.

Randomness has played a part in the evolution of humans but is only one part of the evolutionary processes.

Discussion of an alleged supernatural realm is just idle speculation and is very poor science, if it science at all.

What is transgenics? Is would a transgenic species be an ape crossed with a human? And is that possible with the similarity of our DNA? I was thinking that and I thought it was crazy until we had a sex-ed class. One of my friends also asked that. The teacher was a Christian and said that we were meant only to reproduce with other humans, but I'm still wondering. Interesting concept, Hevene!

Try it see what happens!

they put mouse genes in drosophila (fruitfly) and vice versa and they saw no effect, so there is no reason why a chimp gene wouldn't work in humans.

however, if we are talking about the development of an individual the most important thing would probably be the promotor region of a gene.
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