I've got a bone to pick with nature, whats the deal with grizzly's being able to run so fast?
It seems to defy the laws of physics. Watching one chase down a deer that was obviously built for speed feels like you're watching a cartoon.
How is this possible? they can run faster than racehorses for christ's sake.
When was it required that they run this fast for starters? They are intelligent opportunists, and seem to be able to find ample food without hunting fast game. Like sure it helps but I always would have thought bears were the kind of animal that would make it through without adapting the ability to run such fast speeds.
Like with cheetahs it was absolutely required for survival, their main food source's speed would have increased from being chased and hence cheetahs had to catch up or starve.
And then look at all the speed adaptations cheetahs have, bears are on the absolute other end of the scale, but really aren't all that much slower. Cheetahs have long tails that act like rudders to make sharp turns, but tailless bears can turn on a dime at 60 clicks, cheetahs also have special flexible spines and this and that blah blah blah. There is nothing about a grizzly that is designed for speed, its just a side affect or byproduct of god knows what.
Plus all the weight gained over the spring and summer and autumn doesn't seem to affect them. I've seen gigantically fat grizzly bears at their absolute peak after gorging themselves for months in preperation for hibernation still run down sleek hooved running machines with ease.
How does this all work? Is it just another mystery of nature?
I mean seriously look at a racehorse and a grizzly, one has adapted its ass off to be the fastest it can be, the other just sort of be'd a bear but can for some reason kick the others ass at its own specialty.
Is this a glitch in the matrix or what?

A bear is a giant weasel.

Maybe that is all muscle and not fat, or mostly muscle. If it is all that muscle then or most of it then Bears don't have to be so aerodynamic to be fast...as long as a car has a beefy motor it could generate surprising amount of power in a boxy body, i am guessing that is the same with a bear.

By the end of summer ALOT of it is fat, but I see what you are saying sarge and thats what I was thinking.
They are just so strong that they over power gravity and wind resistence. Its still rather amazing.
I think what really makes me scratch my head is how fast they can turn at high speeds.
It must feel amazing to be that physically capable.
I can totally relate of course, I mean it would feel amazing for normal people to experience, aah yeah:cool:

Yeah. Its all about the muscle. You don't need to be skinny to run and, sometimes being light makes it more difficult as you loose your center of gravity which is the most important thing to bears.

Take me as an example: Years ago, at the age of 14, when I was *fat* (165 pounds at 5'6") and none of my classmates could beat me at the 100m dash. I had way more testosterone than anyone my age (deep voice, huge muscle mass in the legs, zero masturbation leads to crazy amounts of excess testosterone) an excess of creatine (which the bears really need,) and a low center of gravity which kept me leaning forward and also from slowing down against resistance. Then there was my upper body strength which was also a great contributer..I ate like a bear, I ran like a bear and I was bear (well...ermm...actually not.) But thats what I remember about how my out-of-place talent was even possible.

Turning corners on the 300m dash with such a low center of gravity is good fun too.
edit to add:
It must feel amazing to be that physically capable.
It *does* feel amazing. Showing everybody up with raw power. The 'feelilng' you have right before it's your turn to run. The simplest way I can explain it is a feeling of massive amounts of untapped energy in the legs. You want to release it. When the race is done, its like having an orgasm.

Then there's the low self-esteem and other health problems that come with being overweight. Nowadays I can run even faster though I'm much leaner. What I dont have anymore is that 'feeling' in the legs.

Originally posted by Dr Lou Natic
And then look at all the speed adaptations cheetahs have, bears are on the absolute other end of the scale, but really aren't all that much slower.

Are u joking me?!

My favourite animal since I was about 2 was the cheetah so don't get me started! A cheetah can run on average, more than twice the top speed of a bear. In very short bursts it can run nearly 3 times the bears speed. I also believe racehorses have average speeds at least 10 mph faster than bears. Where did u hear this and is it specififc to one species of bear?

Seriously, a bear is a giant frickin' weasel. That's why they're fast.

Let someone tell us here how grizzlies <i>accelerate</i>..... I think that's what is a hidden question here....

I can put a good bet bears don't have the endurance of a horse or deer. I bet if you were 12 feet tall, weight 1600lb in muscle and had four legs you could also run at 40mph for at least 100meters.

Cheetah's do wreck grizzlies. Cheetah's top speed is over 70 mph and Grizzlies top out at about 30 mph. The human speed record is 28 mph, so we're actually not that much slower.

Lion's (50mph), greyhounds (45 mph), horses (40 mph), and reindeer (32 mph) all can outrun grizzlies as well. So it might just be slower one's you've seen getting caught. I don't know about manueverability, but I would imagine grizzlies are not the state of the art ... certainly not comparable to cheetah's.

Endurance at top speeds is certainly a question as well, power driven speed consumes energy at very high rates. Predators only have be fast enough to catch an animal ... prey needs speed to escape whenever they're chased even if they've been chased by another animal just before.

Originally posted by curioucity
Let someone tell us here how grizzlies <i>accelerate</i>... About as fast as an American Quarter Horse. Zero to 30 in about a second and a half.

General horsepower to weight ratio will decide how fast a given animal can accelerate, and what it's top speed is. As a former (failed) drag strip racer, I can tell you that acceleration is definately what wins the race in a quarter-mile duel. If the grizzly is quicker off the mark, the deer is definately at a disadvantage.

:m: Peace.

Are you sure you got your numbers correct scilosopher?
I'm sure I've heard it said many times that grizzly bears are faster than the fastest race horses.
And I'm not sure about acceleration but I've seen a grizzly run way faster than I've ever seen a lion run, and I pretty much live for lion documentaries.
I guess it could have just seemed like that because lions never seem to run long enough for you to get an idea of how fast they're going.

Thats the thing, bears should have good acceleration but no lasting power, being large and muscular they should be like short distance runners. But they aren't, check the "opportunists" episode of the life of mammals, a bear chases a deer up and down a hill swerving trees etc for ages and never slows down. It seems to just get faster.
I know that any cat in the same situation would have given up long before that bear did.
I've just seen it so many times, they can't chase like that, even though they have all the special adaptations for the chase.
And they are lighter built than bears, aren't marathon runners usually lightly built and sprinters heavily built?
Well from what I have seen big cats are lightly built(compared to bears) but can only run short distances, while bears are more heavily built but can run long(er) distances(than cats).
How does that work?

Then why don't people ride them?

goofy.....
*stares at the screen with mouth open...*
Never know that......
Okay. For animals, what are the factors that determine how quickly an animal accelerates?

Factors for acceleration:
Muscular cross-sectional area
Tendon thickness
Body weight
Arrangement of leg bones (with respect to length and mechanical advantage)

Originally posted by Dr Lou Natic
I'm sure I've heard it said many times that grizzly bears are faster than the fastest race horses.Some animal speeds from the Encyclopedia Brittanica - Squirrel: 12 mph
Turkey (wild): 15 mph
Elephant: 25 mph
Human: 28 mph
Cat (domestic): 30 mph
Grizzly bear: 30 mph
White-tailed deer: 32 mph
Giraffe: 32 mph
Reindeer: 32 mph
Greyhound: 39 mph
Hyena: 40 mph
Zebra: 40 mph
Elk: 45 mph
Quarter horse: 48 mph
Lion: 50 mph
Cheetah: 70 mph:m: Peace.

gosh...a hyena is quite fast.

It has to do with their streamlined body and graceful flowing gait.

I love hyenas... those spotted dudes are the best.

Hyenas are cool, they get a bad rap from assholes:(

Thanks for those speeds goof, this thread was a huge waste of time then, seems I was misinformed.
Am I the only one that has heard it said many times that grizzlies are faster than racehorses?
Its something I've heard all my life, just random people saying it all over the place. I guess it was a load of shit.

But they do run seemingly too fast for their build and for too long.
Dogs over 200lbs can't run for shit. Even if they're pure muscle. 1000lbs grizzlies with a layer of fat can still run like maniacs.
Dogs and bears are fairly closely related no?

Dogs are not very closely related to bears.

Oh come on! :confused:
I thought it was a monkeys and apes kind of deal.
I don't like finding sources but I might have try this time.
I'm sure I've read it numerous times reading up on dog history.
As far as I'm concerned, bears and dogs share a common ancestor that nothing else shares. Thats pretty closely related if its true.
I'm off to find a source!

Common ancestor was Miacis - about 50 million years ago. But I'm not sure that they are all that closely linked on the evolutionary tree. I cannot find a timeline.

:m: Peace.

Now the 25 mph elephant is what should scare you should you try to attack one and run away!

Bears, weasels, and canines are all members of the order Carnivora, an entire large related group of mammals adapted for eating meat. But they are all in different families within that order. They are no more closely related to each other than they are to the other families in that order, such as felines and hyenas.

(All right, some zoologist is going to jump in and talk about sub-orders. I think bears are slightly more closely related to weasels than they are to dogs and cats. But otters and skunks are closer kin to weasels than bears are, if I'm not mistaken.)

Dr. Lou don't feel badly about thinking bears are faster than horses. I remember going trail riding with my aunt in the Colorado Rockies, she told me that if we saw a bear not to try to run from it, that the bear would outrun the horses.( This is a woman who ran a guide service in AK for 15 years.)A horse is usually carring a 100+ lb person and most horses aren't as fast as racehorses.
I also read recently that bears don't lose muscle when they hibernate. People, if they sit around awhile become flabby as their muscle is converted into fat; bears could spend all winter hibernating and then come out and run a triathalon if they wanted to.

Originally posted by Dr Lou Natic
Hyenas are cool, they get a bad rap from assholes:(

Thanks for those speeds goof, this thread was a huge waste of time then, seems I was misinformed.
Am I the only one that has heard it said many times that grizzlies are faster than racehorses?

No, I have heard it to. Exaggerations I guess. For instance, I think I heard they can be as fast as horses and as time goes on it turns into "faster then horses". It's probably easier to make more out of there speed because it doesn't look like they should be fast at all. Let's just say those dudes are seriously fast for their size

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Either that or they're magical

I also read recently that bears don't lose muscle when they hibernate. People, if they sit around awhile become flabby as their muscle is converted into fat; bears could spend all winter hibernating and then come out and run a triathalon if they wanted to.

Bullshit. Real muscle is never converted to fat.

Some bodybuilders, offseason, loose shape because their muscle fibres aren't alway true muscle, but they never loose the muscle.