My whole life I've grown up in a catholic environment. My parents sent me to private schools and I went to church occasionaly. Yet I still feel this emptyness. I try harder everyday but when I try to find God in my heart I see nothing. So I called myself an agnostic for some time. I was tired of searching and recieving no response or sign. I was plagued by questions such as why God does this or that. I would look for guidence in those around me such as theology teachers but they all gave me some half baked answer. I felt alone with no one to bring sense to my questions. However no matter how much I reject my religion I still felt emptyness. I told myself by forgeting it I would be free, but all I feel is a thirst for answers. Im in confusing point in my life being only 16. It is what I do and believe in now that will shape the man I will become. So I ask myself what would I rather be, agnostic(remain passive the rest of my life doging the questions of life) or remain a christian ( living a life according to the laws of God). I would appreciate any guidence from religious members of this site. And tell me, when you found God, was it more like a point of relization, or something else. I thank you all in advance for your help.

http://theempiricalchurch.blogspot.com/

As the "Empirical church" maybe considered the mind, it is the brotherhood that embodies the heart and therefore acts, literally as the body, in that all efforts put forth by the church are manifested by the will and effort of the members of the Brotherhood.

The Brotherhood is founded on a simple understanding : religions have served to suggest that we humankind are all Gods children. And if this is the case then we are all one family, and therefore brothers and sisters… and well… I do not know about your family, but in my family we do not let our brothers and sisters eat out of trashcans and sleep in the gutter.


Our Reasons Why: First: When any intelligent human being reads the scriptures of the many religions, one is struck by the clarity of the concepts of love, compassion for others, of family, and sharing which abounds in page after page, and we find that Jesus speaks over and over about how we should love each other, live and work together, and care about each other as one big family, as did Moses, and Krishna, and Mohammed etc…


Therefore it is with this reference to all the world religions that we become aware of the realization that if all of this scripture is to be believed, even a little, then clearly, God, our father in heaven, does not like for any of his children to suffer, and more importantly, it is literally the duty and job of those more fortunate to care for those who are not.


What has been missing, is the "intrinsic" understanding of family, where in we all work together as a family, and pool our money for the benefit of the whole. Where we are all permanent members so long as we do our share… Or in the case of the disabled… That they try. Like true brothers and sisters, we take care of each other. Each of us.. Each day… That is what all people want…. Family… Security… To belong to something good, and greater than themselves… Something Important… Something that Matters. They need love. The love of family. The love that humanity, as a family under God should be showing to them… These are simple Christian concepts which no one can deny, yet most find impossible to make workable. All it requires is faith. A faith not specifically in any form of religion, but in realizing that each of us is more valuable than all the gold within all of space, for it is only our souls which may have value to God and be preserved forever, and it should be our duty to insure that each and every soul has as many good memories as possible before death takes them, and as few cold lonely sad painful moments as possible. Thus, the overall quality of our souls is improved.


Seventh : The church is fundamentally founded on one belief that should be acceptable to people of all faiths and cultures. "Where there is charity and love, God is there!"
Such that it should be the daily effort of all humanity to, by their will and effort commit acts of charity and love when ever possible, for in doing so we increase the level of good and joy and prosperity in our world, and so, it can be imagined that the level of Gods presence is directly increased, and is thus directly a function of our will to be Godly.


Twenty three : One of the founding beliefs of the church is that it is not enough to worship God and Jesus, instead we as human beings should make it our daily effort to be Godly, to be like Jesus, and build Gods kingdom now, in our lifetime. Why wait? Calm, rational, adult thinking gives humankind a potential limited only by our imagination.

-MT

I've been atheist or agnostic, depends on the time in my life, up until a year ago. I'd say it was more of a realization for me. More info...read my previous posts on why I believe. Got any questions specifically pertaining to science and religion, feel free to ask.

AND iF your interest is purely along the lines of study.. then again..
the Empirical Church... studies all sciences and all scriptures.. specifically with an eye towards understanding creation in an effort to understand the creator... i.e. GOD.
it is all we can do... and if mankind survives.. it is what we will do for the next 10 billion years...

-MT

Thanks, I really appreciate your intellegent response Mosheh Thezion. And that empiracle church is pretty cool.

Why would one want to find god when there are much more worthwhile and more useful things to find, like internal happiness and self-sufficiency.

Find god ? Hello... Gods are myths.

- As Atheism cures tithing, you’ll get an instant 10% raise in take-home pay.
- You’re inoculated against Christian suicide cults like People’s Temple or Heaven’s Gate.
- Those "voices in your head" claiming to be God can now be cured with a pill.
- Hell becomes as phony as the boogie man.
- The celestial “Peeping Tom” who watched as you wiped your a** ceases to exist.
- You realize there are no ghosts or goblins- really!
- There are not, nor ever have been, any “evil spirits” hiding under your bed at night.
- Masturbation now cures more anxiety than causes.
- Premarital sex no longer causes “guilt hangovers” the next morning.
- You can be honest and really hate those you hate- no more pretend Christian “love”.
- You can now sleep in on Sunday mornings.
- If born gay, you no longer have to lie to yourself.
- Money & hope are not wasted on faith healers.
- Families are no longer divided over petty religious squabbles.
- You no longer have to stay married to people you’ve grown to hate.
- Women don’t have to become “brood mares for Jesus” pumping out those kids.
- If Catholic, you can now use condoms to prevent infection & death if your spouse has aids.
- Girls can now abort pregnancies caused by drunken fathers or football teams.
- If Catholic, you can now intelligently plan your family size via birth control.
- If Mormon, you can now drink tea, coffee, and coke.
- If Mormon, you can now give & receive oral sex, and trash the goofy magic underwear.
- If you were a Fundy, you can now drink a toast with friends at weddings.
- If you were a Fundy, you’re now allowed to dance and see movies.
- If you were a Liberal, you can now be honest about your Atheism.
- When you hit your thumb with a hammer, you can now swear like a sailor.
- As science advances, you don't have to “circle the wagons” to defend Biblical cosmology.
- If mugged, rather than turn the other cheek, you’re now allowed to fight back.
- You can lust as nature intended you to without apologies or self-induced guilt.
- You can now be rightfully proud of your accomplishments- no more false humility.
- If you were a Fundy woman, you can use makeup & clothing to look stylish & sexy.
- You’ll never miss another NFL game due to long winded preachers.
- If you’re a Catholic priest, you can now have sex with people other than choir boys.
- If you’re a “nun” you can now get “some”.

And you’re now free to think & question without fear of pissing off some insecure deity.

excellent post, mythbuster, very true, and very funny, lol.

in answer to the original poster, inside your subjective mind, thats the only place you'll find a god.

My whole life I've grown up in a catholic environment. My parents sent me to private schools and I went to church occasionaly. Yet I still feel this emptyness. I try harder everyday but when I try to find God in my heart I see nothing. So I called myself an agnostic for some time. I was tired of searching and recieving no response or sign. I was plagued by questions such as why God does this or that. I would look for guidence in those around me such as theology teachers but they all gave me some half baked answer. I felt alone with no one to bring sense to my questions. However no matter how much I reject my religion I still felt emptyness. I told myself by forgeting it I would be free, but all I feel is a thirst for answers. Im in confusing point in my life being only 16. It is what I do and believe in now that will shape the man I will become. So I ask myself what would I rather be, agnostic(remain passive the rest of my life doging the questions of life) or remain a christian ( living a life according to the laws of God). I would appreciate any guidence from religious members of this site. And tell me, when you found God, was it more like a point of relization, or something else. I thank you all in advance for your help.

The patiarchal concept of 'God' and experience of 'God' IS empty. it is all dogma and words and dry empty ritual. they made SUREof THA over the centuries.

The deeper much more anceint understanding of religious experience is ACTUAL ecstatic experiences as inspired with psychedelic sacraments.

Whathappenes when inspired with sacrament?

Your sense of self expands, and you wil feel union as organism with Nature, the environment, and these ecstatic insights intelligently integrated bond you with Nature and community

Thing is. because of patriarchal proaganda, may people have lost this connection. not only with the sacred plants/? but also feel alienated as organisms and from Nature

This is because patriarchal ideology makes us feel bad about our natrual selves.
The Christian religion guilts the individual sbeing some kid of struggle between 'good' and 'bad', and stresses the need to escape Nature to go to their 'heaven'

and secular doga makes out that you are a merer biochemical machine and tat there is no meaning

s see how both ways suck the life out of the individual!

THAT is te sense of emptiness many people feel who follow them. all meaning is taken from us via their oppressive beliefs

See, we (theists) could argue back but if we did, we'd get the same old thing, give scientific arguments. And all I see here is philosophical debate and mockery against religion. But there is nothing wrong in having written rules in which to live by. He was mainly looking for members who have found God, as he stated, and look who shows up. Don't you guys hate it when the theists show up in your preferrably atheist threads? Jeez, you guys are so adament on spreading your beliefs. Isn't it for these things also that you criticize the theists? I smell hypocrisy.

See, we (theists) could argue back but if we did, we'd get the same old thing, give scientific arguments. And all I see here is philosophical debate and mockery against religion. But there is nothing wrong in having written rules in which to live by. He was mainly looking for members who have found God, as he stated, and look who shows up. Don't you guys hate it when the theists show up in your preferrably atheist threads? Jeez, you guys are so adament on spreading your beliefs. Isn't it for these things also that you criticize the theists? I smell hypocrisy.

A very inertesting point, these peeps are religious science fanatics, and fear religion! boot on other foot now ay

A very inertesting point, these peeps are religious science fanatics, and fear religion! boot on other foot now ay


That would make sense if science had anything to do with faith. Perhaps you are confusing science with Tom Cruise's Scientology (http://www.scientology.org/)? I'm sure Tom Cruise welcomes you, and will probably purchase a penguin in your honor. :m:

My whole life I've grown up in a catholic environment. My parents sent me to private schools and I went to church occasionaly. Yet I still feel this emptyness. I try harder everyday but when I try to find God in my heart I see nothing. So I called myself an agnostic for some time. I was tired of searching and recieving no response or sign. I was plagued by questions such as why God does this or that. I would look for guidence in those around me such as theology teachers but they all gave me some half baked answer. I felt alone with no one to bring sense to my questions. However no matter how much I reject my religion I still felt emptyness. I told myself by forgeting it I would be free, but all I feel is a thirst for answers. Im in confusing point in my life being only 16. It is what I do and believe in now that will shape the man I will become. So I ask myself what would I rather be, agnostic(remain passive the rest of my life doging the questions of life) or remain a christian ( living a life according to the laws of God). I would appreciate any guidence from religious members of this site. And tell me, when you found God, was it more like a point of relization, or something else. I thank you all in advance for your help.

It's a misconception that People Find God. No what happens is people serch for God with genuine thirst and the God comes along and taps them on the shoulder. The deep emptiness you feel is the knowledge that God is and you are missing out on something central to your life.

I went down a similar path, I was once a catholic and empty like you. I was given a NKJV bible and filled the empty space with the Word. I got out of catholicism and got into a relationship with God though the Messiah Jesus. And that thing that was missing is with me now. :) So Get yourself a real Bible and ask God to guide you in your reading.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

PS: And get out of this forum and seek a good Christian forum, they are hard to find but even the bad ones you probably will find a true Christian lurking around in the background :D

It's a misconception that People Find God. No what happens is people serch for God with genuine thirst and the God comes along and taps them on the shoulder. The deep emptiness you feel is the knowledge that God is and you are missing out on something central to your life.

I went down a similar path, I was once a catholic and empty like you. I was given a NKJV bible and filled the empty space with the Word. I got out of catholicism and got into a relationship with God though the Messiah Jesus. And that thing that was missing is with me now. :) So Get yourself a real Bible and ask God to guide you in your reading.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

PS: And get out of this forum and seek a good Christian forum, they are hard to find but even the bad ones you probably will find a true Christian lurking around in the background :D

hah....says te dude who dodges deep questions i have asked him about his myth and beiefs in the past!

notice how literalist religiosists do not like yo askin questions, which is same fo all authortarian systems.. .....they will either punish you for doing so, or do a runner.......(whereze go??????!)

So you want to find God by persuing a false organised religion? I sincerely find this funny. But the answer to this question is easy - If you want to find God, simply believe in him and do not allow yourself to think too much.

Oh, and why do you think agnostics or non-believers 'dodge questions on life'? If anything, this accusation is better directed at the religious who have fundamentally closed their mind off to anything outside their false religion. What also makes you think religious people are more qualified to answer 'questions on life'?

If you are actively searching for 'God' then you are a bit of an idiot and you deserve him. I hope you find your imaginary friend.

PS: And get out of this forum and seek a good Christian forum, they are hard to find but even the bad ones you probably will find a true Christian lurking around in the background :D

Typical christian. Run away to that little place where everyone will tell you what you want to hear. Ignore facts. Ignore reality. Ignore your own inner voice, or whatever the hell you want to call it. Hell, even ignore the christians that don't tell you what you want to hear.

Arete, I think you need to stop. Stop looking for a god that isn't there. Stop looking for a god that, if he/she/it is there, doesn't give a shit about you, at least not in a human way.

Think about all the things that you think are good about Man. You will not find them in any god. You've said it yourself, elsewhere, god's logic is not man's logic, or something to that effect. If there is a god, I agree that we can't understand it. However, in my experience, it doesn't understand man at all either.

With regard to filling that void inside you. You have several options:

1.) Accept and make your peace with the void, realizing that you will probably never know the truth about god, at least not in this life, and that that is ok.

2.) Try to believe in him/her/it in order to fill the void. I think you suspect that there are no answers in this life about god, however, and in time you will find this option to be just as hollow as all the others that are used to fill the void.

3.) Try to fill the void with alcohol, drugs (prescription or not), food, sex, shopping, fancy cars, expensive houses, mistresses, boy toys, whatever. However, the void is a bottomless pit with regards to these things, and you will never fill it with them.


For me, I'm an agnostic, looking to find real answers to the real questions. I haven't found a single good answer yet to a single real question. 99% of what you read in this forum, other forums, books, newspapers, etc. is utter bullshit. Take your pick of the above three options, or add a few more if you like. I can guarantee you that number three is by far the worst way to go and number 2 led me to number 3. Good luck.

Here's how you find god:
Think... if the universe was designed, what characteristics would that person have?
obviously it can't be someone truly belevolant... with parasites and all, etc.
Then once you've figured it out, call it god and start believing in it. That's what everyone else did.


I'll leave you with a quote by my idol (Ok, maybe not my IDOL, but he rocks), David Attenborough:
"My response is that when Creationists talk about God creating every individual species as a separate act, they always instance hummingbirds, or orchids, sunflowers and beautiful things. But I tend to think instead of a parasitic worm that is boring through the eye of a boy sitting on the bank of a river in West Africa, [a worm] that's going to make him blind. And [I ask them], 'Are you telling me that the God you believe in, who you also say is an all-merciful God, who cares for each one of us individually, are you saying that God created this worm that can live in no other way than in an innocent child's eyeball? Because that doesn't seem to me to coincide with a God who's full of mercy."


What I'm trying to say is... what makes you think anyone has the answers? They don't. People are people, they lie, they decieve, they can be brainwashed, they believe in stupid things, and they're stupid themselves. The religious ones don't know shit about anything. They just believe because they like the idea, not because they know anything. Grow up, you will never know it all, and don't start living in your own fantasy world just because you can't accept the fact that you will never know it all. If you truly want answers, go with science. Science is the only way to find answers. The others are just guesses, based on absoultely nothing, made by stupid people in order to feel warm and fuzzy inside.

My whole life I've grown up in a catholic environment. My parents sent me to private schools and I went to church occasionaly. Yet I still feel this emptyness. I try harder everyday but when I try to find God in my heart I see nothing. So I called myself an agnostic for some time. I was tired of searching and recieving no response or sign. I was plagued by questions such as why God does this or that. I would look for guidence in those around me such as theology teachers but they all gave me some half baked answer. I felt alone with no one to bring sense to my questions. However no matter how much I reject my religion I still felt emptyness. I told myself by forgeting it I would be free, but all I feel is a thirst for answers. Im in confusing point in my life being only 16. It is what I do and believe in now that will shape the man I will become. So I ask myself what would I rather be, agnostic(remain passive the rest of my life doging the questions of life) or remain a christian ( living a life according to the laws of God). I would appreciate any guidence from religious members of this site. And tell me, when you found God, was it more like a point of relization, or something else. I thank you all in advance for your help.

Dude, 'God's a fantasy. Focus on the real issues.

A) Feeling empty inside
B) Quest for knowledge

A) might be resolvable by learning how to have a strong relationship with yourself and others.
B) might be resolvable by taking up a field of research scholastically and professionally.

so. let me get this straight....an example of a worm eating a child's eyeball is being used to turn the kid onto science and nuthin BUt science??

PS: And get out of this forum and seek a good Christian forum, they are hard to find but even the bad ones you probably will find a true Christian lurking around in the background :D[/QUOTE]

I would never want to be in a religious forum. The great thing about sciforums is that there is a mixture. While I disagree with atheist, I still respect their opinion. There are many intelligent people on this sight who you can learn a lot from. But next time read my thing more carefully atheist. I specificly asked for people who have found God to reply.

How about people who at one time in their lives (18 years' worth for me) thought they had found God, but have subsequently come to believe that they were wrong, misguided and/or deluded? Shouldn't you like to hear from them as well?

But next time read my thing more carefully atheist. I specificly asked for people who have found God to reply.

Well if everyone were to take that literally, you would never get any reply since nobody has found the creator of the universe. Although many claim to have done so.

If you had worded it differently and said "...if anyone has created an imaginary friend which they have called 'God'..."

By 'finding God' you have created a God... That is all you have done. :rolleyes:

God is supposedly omnipresent, does God have a website ? :D

I would never want to be in a religious forum. The great thing about sciforums is that there is a mixture. While I disagree with atheist, I still respect their opinion. There are many intelligent people on this sight who you can learn a lot from. But next time read my thing more carefully atheist. I specificly asked for people who have found God to reply.
when I found god it looked like an old grey haired man sitting on a cloud,
this was in xian bible and I was about 5 years old.
right then I knew that church is feeding us one BIG LIE,and I wasnt going to fall for it.
and when they pass around the hat for people to put money in I saw what religion is for,,,;
to scam the gullible morrons out of their money,its that simple.

eventualy I listened to all these philosophical arguments for and against gods and realized that gods just arent needed because universe most likely always existed in some form or shape,as you cant destroy or create matter/energy which everything is made of,it can only be changed.

coming here youre on a right track imo.

My whole life I've grown up in a catholic environment. My parents sent me to private schools and I went to church occasionaly. Yet I still feel this emptyness. I try harder everyday but when I try to find God in my heart I see nothing. So I called myself an agnostic for some time. I was tired of searching and recieving no response or sign. I was plagued by questions such as why God does this or that. I would look for guidence in those around me such as theology teachers but they all gave me some half baked answer. I felt alone with no one to bring sense to my questions. However no matter how much I reject my religion I still felt emptyness. I told myself by forgeting it I would be free, but all I feel is a thirst for answers. Im in confusing point in my life being only 16. It is what I do and believe in now that will shape the man I will become. So I ask myself what would I rather be, agnostic(remain passive the rest of my life doging the questions of life) or remain a christian ( living a life according to the laws of God). I would appreciate any guidence from religious members of this site. And tell me, when you found God, was it more like a point of relization, or something else. I thank you all in advance for your help.

I have a bachelor's degree in physics and almost had a minor in philosophy. Philosophical arguments for the existence of God did not prove anything. I used the scientific method of experimentation to determine the truth of wheather or not there is a God. My experiment to test for God yielded results. Jesus appeared to me and paraphrased King James version scripture to me as it applied to me. There were also other evidences given to me. I have been a born again fundamentalist Christian ever since.
I know this: God does exist, He is the God of the bible and Christianity from the New Testament is the only true religion on the planet. [King James bible is the real bible. The market is full of fake bible versions with the words changed.]
I believe and know that because of my experiment to test for the existence of God. - Done in 1974-75.
You may find God in the Words of the King James New Testament; it is the Word of God because God showed those authors, that were yielded to His will, what He wanted them to write.
You can listen to the New Testament being read by someone else, online at this website: You can read along with it.
http://www.audio-bible.com/bible/bible.html Start with Matthew and go all the way through to Revelation.
It is good to ask God to teach you what the New Testament really means before you read it or listen to it.

Hebrews 9:27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
This website describes it fairly well; allow the page to load.
http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/0001/0001_01.asp
When you meet Jesus Christ on the judgement day, He will be sitting on a white throne; you will be judged according to the words of the New Testament. Eternal happiness in heaven, will be your reward; or eternal suffering in hell, and the lake of fire, will be your punishment. Choose where you will spend eternity, in one place or the other.

True Christianity is based on the New Testament. Roman Catholicism does not teach true Christianity. Roman Catholicism has pagan religious ideas and rituals mixed in it, that originally came from the old pagan religion of ancient Rome.
Try baptist, or lutheran or methodist, or church of God in Christ (black) or Assemblies of God -- find a church that has the bible as the final authority.

http://www.chick.com/reading/books/160/160cont.asp
That website shows some of the many ways roman catholicism does not come from the bible.

Trying to find god is like trying to find a duck made out of plutonium that eats nothing but rabbits and lays cubes of ham. In other words, it's im-fucking-possible as neither exist.

I used the scientific method of experimentation to determine the truth of wheather or not there is a God. My experiment to test for God yielded results. Jesus appeared to me and paraphrased King James version scripture to me as it applied to me. There were also other evidences given to me. I have been a born again fundamentalist Christian ever since.

I am still waiting for that scientific evidence you claim to have... :rolleyes:

All evidence points towards you being a complete dunce.

King James bible is the real bible. The market is full of fake bible versions with the words changed.]

LMFAO do you think the King James version is any different? I can't read Hebrew, but apparently the ORIGINAL version of the bible doesn't say anything about Jesus being born to a virgin...

Don't you just love it when people completely miss the point of something?:
"so. let me get this straight....an example of a worm eating a child's eyeball is being used to turn the kid onto science and nuthin BUt science?? "

Don't you just love it when people completely miss the point of something?:
"so. let me get this straight....an example of a worm eating a child's eyeball is being used to turn the kid onto science and nuthin BUt science?? "
maybe i HAVE got the point. is it saying that the world has bad things happen so that must mean only science is the truth?what about MEANING? from what i am learning about materialistic science, it devalues meaning. its emphasis is measurement.

no, it means god isn't nice/that he created all organisms in the earth as they are right now.
the point that science is the only way to truth was separate than from the point of the parasite.
And I disn't say science can lead to ALL the answers, but it's the only way we humans have to the real answers. The others aren't answers... or at least not the correct answers. If they somehow happen to be right, it's because of mere coincidence and nothing else.

I would never want to be in a religious forum. The great thing about sciforums is that there is a mixture. While I disagree with atheist, I still respect their opinion. There are many intelligent people on this sight who you can learn a lot from. But next time read my thing more carefully atheist. I specificly asked for people who have found God to reply.

And you do not think Christian forums have a "mixture" of thought?? :) I can tell you they do. As for intellegance it never beats The Wisdom of God. You would be better seeking God by yourself then come and seek Him among the anti-christs here.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

Personally, I'm still finding God. About two years ago (and before that i just followed God blindly without knowing ANYTHING about religion) I went into a deep depression, staying away from anyone and everyone most of the time. A few months after, it just hit me what i was doing and I wnated to oick myself up and make my life better. At first I didnt turn to God, but when I did, i started researching religion, dogma, teachings, the bible, scholars, ect. I began to go to Mass voluntarily instead of being forced, and I began to acctually listen in Mass. I began to acctually see what we were praying, instead of just repeating words blankly as if they had no meaning. I examined most of the prayers and saw their message, and I asked myself if I agreed with them. Those that I agreed with i said, those I didnt, I didnt. Then I started listening to religious arguments, news, events, started joining a few religious clubs, started paying attention in Christianity class. I began to google several arguments, looking at all the answers given. I began to pray every night and every morning. Now I consider myself very close to God, but i know i can always get closer and Im still trying!

provita: so what your saying is, you hav'nt come to terms with your own mind yet.
it sounds strange that your own imagination is'nt allowing you to be more imaginative.
anybody else could/would stick like glue to their god, as it is their own personal delusion, but you say your not close enough yet, WOW! strange.

no, it means god isn't nice/that he created all organisms in the earth as they are right now.

me))so are you presuming a 'creator God', and/or rejecting your IDEA of a 'creator God'?

the point that science is the only way to truth was separate than from the point of the parasite.
And I disn't say science can lead to ALL the answers, but it's the only way we humans have to the real answers.

me))that sounds like a bit of a contradiction. what are not-right answers then. what are answers got not verified by materialistic science which you consider wrong?

The others aren't answers... or at least not the correct answers. If they somehow happen to be right, it's because of mere coincidence and nothing else.
but how do you KNOWif science can't answer them??

How do I Find God?

Look in the mirror!. :)

Look in the mirror!. :)

god is the creator.

did you create your body?
did you create the earth?

you did.
when you know your true self.
you are god.
there is only one self, in many forms.

but never have i seen myself in the mirror.
i only see two eyes from which i look at the world.

http://www.doesgodexist.org/Phamplets/WhoCreatedGod/WhoCreatedGod.htm

something interesting to read?

quoted from above link

"WHO CREATED GOD?

It is easy to make an argument for God’s existence from a cosmological standpoint. As the years have gone by, a growing amount of scientific data has accumulated which negates atheistic assumptions about how matter and the cosmos came into existence and how it has arrived at its present condition. As a science teacher and public lecturer on the compatibility of belief in God and science, I have, been impressed with an increasing awareness on the part of many scientists and theologians that science and religion are symbiotic disciplines.One question which inevitably comes up in a discussion of this nature is what is the origin of God? If God created matter/energy, and designed the systems that have propelled matter into its present arrangement, who or what accomplished that for God? Why is it any more reasonable to believe that God has always “been” than it is to say that matter has always “been”? As Carl Sagan has said, “If we say that God has always been, why not save a step and conclude that the universe has always been?” (Cosmos, p. 257).

From a purely scientific standpoint, it is easy to demonstrate that matter cannot be eternal in nature. The universe is expanding from what appears to be a beginning point in space/time, which appears to be a one time event. Hydrogen is the basic fuel of the cosmos, powering all stars and other energy sources in space. If the fuel of the universe has been used eternally, that fuel will eventually be depleted, but the evidence is that the cosmological gas gauge, while moving toward “empty,” is yet a long way from being there—a condition incompatible with an eternal universe. The second law of thermodynamics insists that the cosmos is moving toward a condition of disorder, sometimes referred to as “heat death.” Even in an oscillating universe, things ultimately run out of energy and “die.” All of these evidences, and several others we have not made reference to, show that matter cannot be eternal, as Dr. Sagan and his associates would like to believe. However, this does not mean that we automatically accept the hypothesis that God is the Creator. Why is it not equally invalid to suggest that God has always been?

The problem here is that many people have a mistaken concept of God. If we conceive of God as physical, anthropomorphic (like man) being, the question of God’s origin is valid. However, such a concept of God is alien to the Bible and to common sense. Consider the following descriptions of God from the Bible:


John 4: 24
God is a Spirit:...
Matthew 16:17
...for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my father which is in heaven.

Numbers 23:19
God is not a man, that He should...;


Obviously, the descriptions and concepts of God given in these passages are that God is a spiritual entity. He exists outside of the three-dimensional, physical world in which we live.
The Bible further supports this concept of God in the following passages:


Jeremiah 23:23-24
Am I a God at hand, saith the Lord, and not a God afar off? ...Do not I fill heaven and earth? saith the Lord.
2 Chronicles 2:6
But who is able to build a house, seeing the heaven and heaven of heavens cannot contain Him?...

Acts 17:28
For in Him we live, and move, and have our being;...


Not only is God described as being outside space, but He is also described as being outside of time. Consider the following:

2 Peter 3:8
But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
Psalm 90:4
For a thousand years in thy sight are but as yesterday when it is past, and as a watch in the night.

Psalm 102:27
But thou art the same, and thy years shall have no end.

Acts 1:7
...It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in His power.


If God is a being that is unlimited in time, and if He has access to every piece of time as if it were now, the question of who created God is an invalid question. The problem is like asking a student to draw a four-sided triangle. The terminology is self-contradictory.
When asked “Who or what created God?,” we are making the assumption that God was created. If God exists outside of time and space, and if He is the Creator of time and space, He obviously was not created! God began the beginning! This is why He says, “I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.”

God created time. The statement of Genesis, “In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth,” is making reference to the creation of time. The reason that things like heat death, the expansion of the universe, and the depletion of hydrogen do not apply to God is because He is outside of time. God has always been. He not only began time; He will also end it. When time ends, all matter and all mankind will enter eternity—a timeless condition free of the negative things that time brings upon us now.


2 Peter 3:10-11
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,...
Revelation 21:4
And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

The bible? Your still using the bible as a source to support your madness?

cooton bud can't read apparrantly, I myself have NEVER read the bible, this was quoted from the web

Dog, you're annoying.

http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/2131/righteouslysmitingourenemies7d.gif

Arete,

Welcome to sciforums,

I try harder everyday but when I try to find God in my heart I see nothing. Religions are emotionally oriented not factual. If you tend towards reason rather making decisions based on emotions then religious ideas will always seem unreal to you.

I told myself by forgeting it I would be free, but all I feel is a thirst for answers. Then try science since that is a proven method for providing answers, but don’t expect to find answers to everything, we are still seeking and learning. Also expect to do some hard work understanding the answers. Religion does not provide answers only speculative baseless imaginary fantasies. Try testing any religious assertion and you will be unable to show it has any truth, or basis in truth.

Im in confusing point in my life being only 16. I remember it well, it was when I committed myself to Christianity, but that was nearly 40 years ago. But no matter how hard I tried my tendency towards logical thought prevented me from accepting the baseless emotionally charged assertions of Christianity. From my early twenties onwards I steadily moved towards atheism and have been there ever since.

Finding real meaningful answers to ultimate questions is hard work and you will unlikely achieve many insights until you have lived some life, I’m afraid that at 16 you have yet to have experienced very much. Give it some time.

It is what I do and believe in now that will shape the man I will become.Nope, that is highly unlikely. Most of us go through many changes to our outlook and beliefs before we settle on something.

So I ask myself what would I rather be, agnostic(remain passive the rest of my life doging the questions of life) or remain a christian ( living a life according to the laws of God).I don’t think you understand the meaning of being agnostic, which is primarily a logical position regarding the question of whether a god is possible. To admit we simply don’t know is fully rational and there is never any need to commit to a certain belief for or against. An absence of evidence for a god or against is the current position and to accept we don’t know should be acceptable to any rational thinker.

I would appreciate any guidence from religious members of this site. And tell me, when you found God, was it more like a point of relization, or something else. I thank you all in advance for your help.Those who claim to have found their god do so without any ability to demonstrate their emotional condition is any different from simple self delusion. They must all disregard any claim to rational behaviour when they assert their beliefs.

You will need to ascertain what criteria is important to you personally for deciding if something is true or not or even whether the question has been answered. When considering religionist assertions look to see if their claims are born out of desire for a god to be true or whether there is anything of real substance.

Have fun in your search.

Cris

Arete,

Welcome to sciforums,

Religions are emotionally oriented not factual.
Then try science. - Religion does not provide answers only speculative baseless imaginary fantasies. Try testing any religious assertion and you will be unable to show it has any truth, or basis in truth.

I remember it well, it was when I committed myself to Christianity, but that was nearly 40 years ago. But no matter how hard I tried my tendency towards logical thought prevented me from accepting the baseless emotionally charged assertions of Christianity.

Heres the Main thing you missed Chris.........

As far as we have record in history or the Bible, none of it ever gives one day that Jesus ever attended school. Never did it says anything about His diploma, says nothing about His education. Now, but His wisdom at the age of twelve just confused the teachers of theology. They couldn't understand that how this Boy, twelve years old, why, would just unroll the Scriptures there in such a way and prove to them things that they didn't know nothing about. See, they were teaching it from a intellectual standpoint, and Jesus knew it by direct revelation.
Now, look at Cain in the garden of Eden. Cain, when he come back to Eden, he was just as religious as he could be. He brought flowers and so forth, and put them on the altar. He brought the fruits of the field and laid them down. He believed in God; he worshipped God; he sacrificed to God; he built a church to God, just as religious as he could be.
But when Abel come, he, by faith... Faith isn't something that's imaginary thing. I want you to get it. Faith is a direct revelation.
See, if you only accept Christ as your Saviour by a intellectual, you haven't got it yet.
You cannot say that Jesus is the Christ, until the Holy Spirit has revealed it to you.
Now, how would Abel ever know to bring a lamb? And he was taught by the same father and mother, and Cain was. The only way, the Bible said it was by faith that he offered a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, showing that he was just. In other words, he was justified in the sight of God, and God gave him a revelation what the plan of salvation was. That was through the shedding of blood, not the offering of building churches, and coming with great intellectual faith, and saying, "Certainly..."
Cain said, "God, I believe in You. Certainly, I will bow down here." No man facing eternity could ever come falsely, when he knowed that his eternal destination rested upon him finding favor with God. So the man come up with a true heart before God and said, "Lord, I believe in You. And I offer unto Thee this beautiful altar, this beautiful church. And I bring of my substance, and I tithe, and I kneel on my knees, and raise my hands to worship You, Jehovah. Will you receive me?" Just as religious as he could be. But he failed to have the direct revelation.
But Abel, being in favor with God, brought a lamb, not beautiful, pulling the little old fellow with a grapevine around his neck up to be killed. It was bleating and carrying on. Throwed it up on the rock, and took a sharp rock, and chopped its little neck until it bled to death. But by faith he did it, having a spiritual revelation of what God required. You get it?
Now, when they come off of Mount Transfiguration, Jesus of Nazareth asked His disciples, said, "Who does man say that I, the Son of man, am?"
And some said, "Well, You're Elias, and some say You're the prophet."
He said, "But Who do you say I am?"
And Peter, speaking right out, said, "Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God."
Listen, He said, "Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona (by Jona, rather, his father)," said, "for flesh and blood has not revealed this to thee, but My Father which is in heaven. And I say unto thee, 'Thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church, and the gates of hell cannot prevail against it.'"
Now, the Catholic church wants to say it was built upon Peter, the little stone. The protestant church says it's upon Christ the Cornerstone. But look at the Scripture; it wasn't upon either. It was upon the spiritual revelation that God gave Peter. The same thing he gave Abel at the rock, the altar. He gave Abel spiritual revelation of what the plan of God was. And He gave Peter, not by flesh and blood, not by saying prayers, or going to church, but by spiritual revelation, "Blessed art thou, Simon, for flesh and blood has not revealed it to thee, but My Father which is in heaven has revealed it to you. Upon this rock I will build My church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it."
Now, you see why we have so many different denominations? You see why we have so much confusion, one believing this and the other one believing that? Because the spiritual revealed Truth has to come through God alone. The Word's hid from the eyes of the wise and prudent. God said so. And He reveals it to babes such as will learn. So be a baby, humble yourself, and say, "Oh, God, here I am. Just make Yourself known to me. I love You." God will reveal Hisself to you; He will make Hisself known. You see it?

TheVisitor,

Now, but His wisdom at the age of twelve just confused the teachers of theology. They couldn't understand that how this Boy, twelve years old, why, would just unroll the Scriptures there in such a way and prove to them things that they didn't know nothing about. See, they were teaching it from a intellectual standpoint, and Jesus knew it by direct revelation.Interesting myth. I believe it was plagiarised from an earlier myth.

Now, look at Cain in the garden of Eden. Cain, when he come back to Eden, he was just as religious as he could be. He brought flowers and so forth, and put them on the altar. He brought the fruits of the field and laid them down. He believed in God; he worshipped God; he sacrificed to God; he built a church to God, just as religious as he could be.
But when Abel come, he, by faith... Uhhh that’s just more fiction.

Faith isn't something that's imaginary thing.For sure. Faith is very real. It is simply an entirely unsupportable and irrational position. It is the subject of the faith that is imaginary.

I want you to get it. Faith is a direct revelation. No, it is simply a conviction that something is true in the total absence of any supporting evidence.

See, if you only accept Christ as your Saviour by a intellectual, you haven't got it yet. It would be nice if the claim is both intellectually appealing as well as emotionally. All you can offer is the emotional angle and we know very well that emotionalism is the worst way to determine truth of anything. To be Christian one must abandon intellect and logic, a reason that most of the best educated and intelligent tend not to be religious.

You cannot say that Jesus is the Christ, until the Holy Spirit has revealed it to you.Riiiight! Basic propaganda.

Now, when they come off of Mount Transfiguration, Jesus of Nazareth asked His disciples, said, "Who does man say that I, the Son of man, am?"
And some said, "Well, You're Elias, and some say You're the prophet."
He said, "But Who do you say I am?"
And Peter, speaking right out, said, "Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God."
Listen, He said, "Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona (by Jona, rather, his father)," said, "for flesh and blood has not revealed this to thee, but My Father which is in heaven. And I say unto thee, 'Thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church, and the gates of hell cannot prevail against it.'"I hope you realize no one can confirm Jesus actually existed and certainly no one can confirm any of the scriptures refer to an actual events. You appear to be simply quoting popular fictional mythology as if somehow it is truth.

humble yourself, and say, "Oh, God, here I am. Just make Yourself known to me. I love You." God will reveal Hisself to you; He will make Hisself known. You see it?Yup. Tried it. It didn’t work.

You began disecting before you even let what I said have a chance to digest.
You haven't "proved" or "disproved" a thing...except you've revealed your own confusion.
But....you have honestly raised some good points I must admit.
Faith is a kind of revelation thats an individual thing, thats how God keeps his real treasure from falling into the wrong hands.
If you witnessed a crime and were the only witness, you alone could identify the criminal.
That doesn't mean because you can't convince everyone of what you saw it didn't happen...
A revelation from God to you is the same way....you don't have to "prove" it to anyone , as a mater of fact you aren't supposed to...it was for you from God, to increase your faith...and not meant for others at that time, see?

40 years is a long time, and like you said.... we keep learning.
Try again with your life experience now....only try getting your "self" out of the way.

Shut the fuck up, you brainwashed dolt.

You began disecting before you even let what I said have a chance to digest.
wrong, duh!
when you break down a statement to it's componant parts you edit it and read it more thoroughly, so you tend to digest it the more.

Shut the fuck up, you brainwashed dolt.

At least he has a brain and can contribute more than name calling and insults....oops sorry cottontop3000, Qm? QM? where are u QM?

TheVisitor,

You began disecting before you even let what I said have a chance to digest.It wasn’t knew. I’ve seen the same argument made many times before.

You haven't "proved" or "disproved" a thing...except you've revealed your own confusion.I have no confusion. I left that behind when I was able to dismiss Christianity for the sham that it is.

Faith is a kind of revelation thats an individual thing, thats how God keeps his real treasure from falling into the wrong hands.And indistinguishable from wishful thinking. Which is more credible?

If you witnessed a crime and were the only witness, you alone could identify the criminal.But unless there is some other evidence of the crime it will not be possible to show the crime occurred. So how would we know the alleged witnes actually witnessed anything or just imagined it.

That doesn't mean because you can't convince everyone of what you saw it didn't happen…But more importantly you can’t demonstrate it did happen.

A revelation from God to you is the same way....you don't have to "prove" it to anyone , as a mater of fact you aren't supposed to...it was for you from God, to increase your faith...and not meant for others at that time, see?Yes I understand that well. It is basic propaganda used to convince the proponents that their faith has meaning. Examined objectively it remains indistinguishable to self delusion.

40 years is a long time, and like you said.... we keep learning.
Try again with your life experience now....only try getting your "self" out of the way. Oh, I’ve long since dismissed Christianity as a worthless idea. In my research over these past few decades Christianity has clearly become just a silly notion.

wrong, duh!
when you break down a statement to it's componant parts you edit it and read it more thoroughly, so you tend to digest it the more.

When it's a statement meant to be read as a whole, you may loose the meaning breaking it down, mister geeser...
But I'll give you that if it were done for the right intentions, ...not just to argue or "prove" something wrong, it might help someones' understanding to do so, yes.

So how would we know the alleged witnes actually witnessed anything or just imagined it.
because YOU are the witness

god is the creator.

Prove it!

did you create your body?

Mom and dad did!

did you create the earth?

Nature did

you did.
you are god.

I already know that.

TheVisitor,

because YOU are the witness Same question then. How do you know the event is not just your imagination? Without any objective indepenent evidence you won't know.

TheVisitor,

Same question then. How do you know the event is not just your imagination? Without any objective indepenent evidence you won't know.
Maybe, You never had it at the beginning.
If it was in your heart, all devils in hell never root it out of there.
How can you be anything but a human being when you was borned a human being?
How can you ever be anything but a Christian if you're borned a Christian?
But to reject the truth, then the devil seals the ear. Faith cometh by what?
And if your ear is sealed, you don't hear it anymore.
"Aw, nonsense. I don't believe in that stuff."

I'm not saying this is your situation, just carefully evaluate what could be happening....
Your life is reflecting something.
You don't want to be influencing people the wrong way, or reflecting the wrong thing.
They say...."the way a tree leans, is the way it falls."

Here's what happens when you hear the word of God....

It's a type of the "jubilee year"
In the end time the wheat are seperated from the tares....He does this with His word.

Now, at the going forth of this jubilee year, it was to be sounded throughout all the land. A trumpet was to sound. And this trumpet would make the distinction... For the trumpet was the fiftieth year sound that led every slave that had been bought, or become poor--poor and could not care for his own...
He had fell beneath the load. And his master for his debt had bought him and had placed him into the field as a slave. And he had to serve him, for he was too poor to redeem himself. But God said, "Remember, you were one time slaves yourself and down in Egypt. And I have freed you.
Therefore, at the sounding of the trumpet, every slave, no matter how long he's been in or how short a time, he's at liberty to return to his family, to return to his people and be free of every debt, for it is a time of jubilee.
You shouldn't trim your vineyard or anything. The poor of the land was to eat of it: a very beautiful type of the millennium.

Notice, every slave, when he heard that trumpet sound, he could throw down his hoe, whatever he's working with and say, "I am a free man. I couldn't redeem myself. But God, through His grace has declared a year of jubilee. Therefore, I believe God. And I don't have to work anymore." And the laws of the land claimed him free. What a beautiful type of today.

If a man said, "I want to stay the way I am. I don't want to go.
I just want to stay right here," that man was taken to the temple with his slave master. He must put his ear against a post, and an awl was bored in his ear. And it was a sign that he could never be free. He had to serve his master as long as he lived, because he rejected the news of the good news.

If that isn't a perfect type of the marking of the beast...
The good news is the Gospel. To reject to hear the Gospel, your ears are sealed up that you'll always call it fanaticism, and there's nothing to it. And you'll be serving sin in forms of godliness as long as you live. No matter how religious you are, you're sealed off from the Presence of God.

Yes, the churches are wrong...don't blame God for that.
He said it would be that way.
Revelations the 17th chapter said that the Catholic church was a whore and the Protestant churches was prostitutes.
But God's people was the called out of that, of the whole thing.
"Come out of Babylon." said the last warning angel's message. "Be not partakers of her sins. Come out." Separate yourself and be different, not from just a logical standpoint, not because you think it's right to do, but pray until that thing's in your heart.

Prove it!

i mean that is the definition of god. creator.

Mom and dad did!

ok, but in order to know what created your body you have to ask what created your parents.

it's like saying that gravity 'causes' things to fall on the ground, it's not the whole truth cuz it doesn't say what causes gravity.

Nature did

what created nature?

Arete, this part of what Adstar said is very important.

...The deep emptiness you feel is the knowledge that God is and you are missing out on something central to your life. I went down a similar path...got into a relationship with God though the Messiah Jesus. And that thing that was missing is with me now.

This is a commonality between all 'believers' who find 'God'. They seek a relationship to fill some void. The relationship they discover is beyond fulfilling and they attribute it to a fantasy charcter without realizing the relationship is with their own ego. A few of these folks can have really intense relationships with their ego's and can alter the blood flow and thusly the electrical activity in their brain. The area that gets affected more often than not is their sense of self (i.e. the ability to distinguish between self and other). Hallucination tends to also result at this point and these folks effectively have an intense relationship with everything for small periods of time with some euphoric hallucination. Its a real physical cycle of positive reinforcement which is utterly misunderstood and mis-attributed to a fantasy life form.

.these folks effectively have an intense relationship with everything for small periods of time with some euphoric hallucination

Not even close crunchy.....

HEBREWS 4:12
For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

God knows not only what your thinking, but eveything you've done,, what's in your heart and what you plan to do...and he can reveal it to those servants of His with the gift of discernment.
Ever see that happen...? it ain't some euphoric hallucination.

Not even close crunchy.....

I would say its so close its scary. I think a brushup on the results of transcranial magnetic stimulation need to viewed. The intense euphoria of loosing one's sense of self can be replicated in a lab bud.


HEBREWS 4:12
For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.


Preaching is not evidence.


God knows not only what your thinking, but eveything you've done,, what's in your heart and what you plan to do...and he can reveal it to those servants of His with the gift of discernment.
Ever see that happen...? it ain't some euphoric hallucination.

Nobody has ever nor will ever see that happen because the subject of the whole thing, 'God', doesn't exist.

PS: And get out of this forum and seek a good Christian forum, they are hard to find but even the bad ones you probably will find a true Christian lurking around in the background :D

I would never want to be in a religious forum. The great thing about sciforums is that there is a mixture. While I disagree with atheist, I still respect their opinion. There are many intelligent people on this sight who you can learn a lot from. But next time read my thing more carefully atheist. I specificly asked for people who have found God to reply.

The empty feeling you mention is the part of man that has a spiritual need. Every human is born with it and many try to fill it with other things -- money, power, fame, sex, substance abuse, and even with another person -- they fulfill for a while but these eventually fade and all that is left is yourself and the empty feeling again.

I believe that God made humanity to need fellowship with other people and with God himself. If this fellowship is not met then the empty feeling remains. It's loneliness. With the Lord, you are never alone.

Atheists will say it's all a fantasy -- well good then -- the fantasy meets the real need. The cool thing about it is that life can really get crappy and you can turn it around with faith. It turns the world model upside down.

As Paul said: 2 Cor 12:2

Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong.

Your average nonbeliever has no concept about how this works -- but it does.

what created nature?

Nature is uncreated.

'What created god?'

Nature? LOL..

ok, but in order to know what created your body you have to ask what created your parents.


My grandparents, add finitum!. To the begining of the human race. Nothing created it, but nature. That is why I'm god. Cause I understand that!. Understanding the self, is being a god in itself. Not a mythological god, but non-the-less a god of my own enviorenment, decisions, and ultimate my own destiny.

Godless

Your average nonbeliever has no concept about how this works -- but it does.

I have every idea how it works. Don't forget most people get taught this at school when at an age they believe it and don't question it. But it's your implication that such emotional benefits are exclusive to religion. This is what annoys me with you idiots: To get emotional benefits you must first believe in the irrational and false.

Nature is uncreated.

So there is no answer to the question: why something instead of nothing? A universe without a cause is a universe without an explanation.

Understanding the self, is being a god in itself. Not a mythological god, but non-the-less a god of my own enviorenment, decisions, and ultimate my own destiny.

the belief in a god is a subconscious belief in oneself.
all religions say that god is the self, but it's hidden.

'What created god?'

"i am", the existence, the self, was never created. 'nothingness' needs no cause because it's not an effect.

god is nothing where everything comes from. in god, nothing and everything is an indistinguishable oneness.

why something instead of nothing? A universe without a cause is a universe without an explanation.

Bingo kido ;)

the belief in a god is a subconscious belief in oneself.

There you go!

all religions say that god is the self, but it's hidden

OOOPS! you screwed this one up.

All religions don't say the same thing, we wouldn't have conflict of religious differences if they did. now would we?

"i am", the existence, the self, was never created. 'nothingness' needs no cause because it's not an effect.

Lost this one too!.

"I am" an existent, in a place called the universe that exists, my self is the comprehesion of my ego, and my enviorenment. I comprehend my existence, in an existing universe, in a planet called earth. Nothingness is just that, there's no effect in nada!. There's no cause to the universe, however there is a cause for your existence, and that is plainly to live it!.

god is nothing where everything comes from.

This is non-sequirtus.

You claim that "G"od is an entity. that's got to be something! And supposedly this entity with supernatural powers created everything. Riiiiight?

No! "g"od your own ego, is an entity with an identity, that perceives existence and the self, thus you are god, amongs animals of other forms, your god, because you own destiny can be created by your own self.

in god, nothing and everything is an indistinguishable oneness.

More non-seguirtus!

Nothing and everything can't combined in the same senteces, to be indistiquishable oneness. Nothing is just that! nada! silch, nilch, whatever..Nothing is nothing. Everything is all that you perceive that exists. Your Oneness comes from self realization, and one's own knowledge of self.

Godless

TheVisitor,


Maybe, You never had it at the beginning. If it was in your heart, all devils in hell never root it out of there. This is the part of the argument that reveals Christianity as arrogant and condescending, that one group is special and selected by a God while the others are doomed. And can never hear him. It is an attempt to rationalize a nonsense.

How can you ever be anything but a Christian if you're borned a Christian???? No one is born a Christian. Christianity is post birth indoctrination.

But to reject the truth, then the devil seals the ear.No truth is being rejected because nothing verifiable is being presented that can be rationally accepted.

Faith cometh by what?Again, faith is not something mystical but simply an irrational thought process, it has no value. You have no choice but to resort to irrationality because you cannot demonstrate any factual basis for your claims.

And if your ear is sealed, you don't hear it anymore.My mind is entirely open to rational arguments. Christianity hasn’t presented one yet.

"Aw, nonsense. I don't believe in that stuff."You imply my conclusion is arbitrary and off-hand, it is not; instead it is the result of decades of thought and research looking at many potential concepts. Given the big picture of religious belief, the 20,000+ different Christian cults, the commonality of death as a root of religious belief, and the fiction of souls revealed via neuroscience, then Christianity and religions have zero credibility.

Your life is reflecting something.Yes, careful analysis.

You don't want to be influencing people the wrong way, or reflecting the wrong thing.
They say...."the way a tree leans, is the way it falls."Through a lifetime of experience I have little problem seeing that religious belief is harmful to the survival of the human race and as such I believe it is my responsibility as a member of that race to primarily assist in my own survival and that largely depends on the survival of others. To that end it is important that people be reflected away from religious indoctrination and related nonsense.

Woody,

Atheists will say it's all a fantasy -- well good then -- the fantasy meets the real need. The cool thing about it is that life can really get crappy and you can turn it around with faith. It turns the world model upside down.Otherwise known as the placebo effect. The power of positive thinking. Fortunately many successful people manage this quite nciely without any recourse to religions.

Why would you want to find god when you can go and find gold instead. Material possessions are much more valuable than, as Han Solo put it, 'hokey religions and mystical forces'.

Quote Visitor:
“Faith is a kind of revelation thats an individual thing, thats how God keeps his real treasure from falling into the wrong hands.”

* Oh … so he doesn’t love us all? He’s picky? You must be special. What exactly are the “wrong hands”?

I have every idea how it works. Don't forget most people get taught this at school when at an age they believe it and don't question it. But it's your implication that such emotional benefits are exclusive to religion. This is what annoys me with you idiots: To get emotional benefits you must first believe in the irrational and false.

A nonbeliever telling a beliver that he understands faith is like a blind person from birth telling me that he understands what it's like to see. Faith isn't taught in school, it comes from within.

Why would you want to find god when you can go and find gold instead. Material possessions are much more valuable than, as Han Solo put it, 'hokey religions and mystical forces'.
shit Hapsburg...next you'll be singin 'Diamonds Are Forever' already....go an listen to te Kanye West version!

Woody,

Otherwise known as the placebo effect. The power of positive thinking. Fortunately many successful people manage this quite nciely without any recourse to religions.

Yeah, every atheist has his own version of it. And are people willing to die for a placebo effect? Are you willing to die for your atheism?

A nonbeliever telling a beliver that he understands faith is like a blind person from birth telling me that he understands what it's like to see. Faith isn't taught in school, it comes from within.

The point I made was I understand what it is like to believe as I once did. If faith and belonging to a particular religion isn't taught, then why is a childs tendency to be part of the same religion as that of their parents?

With 9 out of 10 theists, I'm sure the likelihood and nature of a persons religion is inextricably linked with their parents and school. IE. it is taught/brainwashed from an early age in most cases.

Unless you are suggesting that true faith is that which is not taught, in which case most religious folk are bogus anyway.

Yeah, every atheist has his own version of it. And are people willing to die for a placebo effect?

How is willing to die for your religion a good thing? I thought we had a major problem with idiots like those in the world today.

I would say its so close its scary. I think a brushup on the results of transcranial magnetic stimulation need to viewed. The intense euphoria of loosing one's sense of self can be replicated in a lab bud.



Preaching is not evidence.



Nobody has ever nor will ever see that happen because the subject of the whole thing, 'God', doesn't exist.

I've seen and heard it a hundred times, too late to say it isn't real.
Bury your head in the sand all you want but that won't make it go away.

How do I Find God?Straight down the road for a couple of blocks. Hang a left. At the next junction (about a block) turn left again. Two more blocks and then a turn to the left. God will be waiting for you at the next junction.

I've seen and heard it a hundred times, too late to say it isn't real.
Bury your head in the sand all you want but that won't make it go away.

You've seen what you've seen or think you've seen. It's the conclusion that is incorrect. Oh look a tree? It's so beautiful, so complex, it must have been designed; therefore, "God exists". Ooh look a hemmroid! Therefore "God exists". Oooh 1+1 = 2; therefore, "God exists". Looky here paint on my cornflakes; therefore, "God exists". Joe bob is having a euphoric experience; therefore, "God exists".

well its like this isn't it: No proof either way, so each to his/her own, live and let live, never say never.

The end

well its like this isn't it: No proof either way, so each to his/her own, live and let live, never say never.

The end

the problem is, the religious dont adhere to the live an let live strategy. more often than not with them its "live and let live as long as you live my way". you know its true.

well its like this isn't it: No proof either way, so each to his/her own, live and let live, never say never.

The end
So I'm through playing your little game - believe that Jesus has his fucking cock up your ass, for all I care, just don't try to get me to believe absurdities because you, or some ancient bedouins, said to.

I've seen and heard it a hundred times, too late to say it isn't real.
Bury your head in the sand all you want but that won't make it go away.


apparently though, believing in it wont make it show up either.

Quote Visitor:
“Faith is a kind of revelation thats an individual thing, thats how God keeps his real treasure from falling into the wrong hands.”

* What exactly are the “wrong hands”?

How do I Find God?
Don't look.

Straight down the road for a couple of blocks. Hang a left. At the next junction (about a block) turn left again. Two more blocks and then a turn to the left. God will be waiting for you at the next junction.
So, the next junction leads to Bill Gates' house? :D :p