While watching the Colbert Report, a thought popped into my head. He was interviewing, well, a gay man, and the argument was that there were physical signs that point to homosexuality. The signs point to homosexuality being something that develops in the womb.

So if you're born with a homosexual mindset, if that's how it really goes down, what would that do the Christian (or any other religions) look on homosexuality as a sin? If you really are born gay, then it's no fault of your own and you shouldn't be punished for it, right?

Thoughts? Ideas?

So if you're born with a homosexual mindset, if that's how it really goes down, what would that do the Christian (or any other religions) look on homosexuality as a sin? If you really are born gay, then it's no fault of your own and you shouldn't be punished for it, right?

Christians also believe that having sex outside of marriage is a sin, and there's no denying that heterosexual people are definitely genetically programmed to want to have premarital sex - so I don't see why it would matter. It's just one more sinful thing that you're genetically programmed to want to do.

Christians also believe that having sex outside of marriage is a sin, and there's no denying that heterosexual people are definitely programmed to want to have premarital sex - so I don't see why it would matter. It's just one more sinful thing that you're genetically programmed to want to do.

Well, if you are born gay, you don't have as much of a choice as having premarital sex.

My thought is that if you have no choice, if you're gay or not, then what becomes of you when you die, proving any sort of god or afterlife actually does exist.

Just a hypothetical.

Most Christians don’t believe that being gay is a sin in and of itself. Actually committing homosexual acts is a sin.

So if you're born with a homosexual mindset, if that's how it really goes down, what would that do the Christian (or any other religions) look on homosexuality as a sin? If you really are born gay, then it's no fault of your own and you shouldn't be punished for it, right?

Thoughts? Ideas?There is much proof that people are born with a violent mindset if that's how it really goes down, what would that do the Christian (or any other religions) look on violence as a sin? If you really are born violent, then it's no fault of your own and you shouldn't be punished for it, right?

Check it out:
http://www.happinessonline.org/MoralCode/LiveWithTruth/p3.htm

There is much proof that people are born with a violent mindset if that's how it really goes down, what would that do the Christian (or any other religions) look on violence as a sin? If you really are born violent, then it's no fault of your own and you shouldn't be punished for it, right?
See my above statement about premarital sex. Being genetically predisposed toward wanting to do something isn't an excuse in Christianity.

There is much proof that people are born with a violent mindset if that's how it really goes down, what would that do the Christian (or any other religions) look on violence as a sin? If you really are born violent, then it's no fault of your own and you shouldn't be punished for it, right?

Check it out:
http://www.happinessonline.org/MoralCode/LiveWithTruth/p3.htm

Well as far as I'm concerned, you won't be punished for anything after death. You're dead, that's it.

I was hoping to get a solid Christian outlook on this.

Most Christians don’t believe that being gay is a sin in and of itself. Actually committing homosexual acts is a sin.
I'll go along with that.

Anybody here believe that homosexuality in itself is a hell worthy sin?

Anybody here believe that homosexuality in itself is a hell worthy sin?
I doubt you're going to find any takers on that.

I doubt you're going to find any takers on that.

Sandy?

Most Christians don’t believe that being gay is a sin in and of itself. Actually committing homosexual acts is a sin.

Isnt that actually kind of the same thing... ? :confused:
I mean, how would you like it to be forced to go through life without having any sex.. or be forced to having sex with people of your own sex ?? Just curious..
Dont get me wrong.. i have a bit of a problem with looking at gay men doing the stuff in public or on tv or whatever. But isnt that actually my problem? Nobody in their right mind can forbid them to.

Isnt that sctually kind of the same thing... ? :confused:

What if you're not gay, but you wanna know how taking it up the pooper feels? You know, an experimentation thing.

Isnt that sctually kind of the same thing... ? :confused:No. It's not a sin to want to have sex with someone of the same sex, just like it's not a sin to want to have sex with someone of the opposite sex before marriage. It is only a sin if you actually do it. At least, that's the view that most christians take.

There is much proof that people are born with a violent mindset if that's how it really goes down, what would that do the Christian (or any other religions) look on violence as a sin? If you really are born violent, then it's no fault of your own and you shouldn't be punished for it, right?

Check it out:
http://www.happinessonline.org/MoralCode/LiveWithTruth/p3.htm

Thats a matter of public safety, being gay isnt.

Isnt that actually kind of the same thing... ? :confused:
I mean, how would you like it to be forced to go through life without having any sex.. or be forced to having sex with people of your own sex ?? Just curious..
Dont get me wrong.. i have a bit of a problem with looking at gay men doing the stuff in public or on tv or whatever. But isnt that actually my problem? Nobody in their right mind can forbid them to.

Nasor and Gondolin, i specified what i meant later in an edit.

I know its not the same thing. Duh.
Please read quoted text.

II mean, how would you like it to be forced to go through life without having any sex.. or be forced to having sex with people of your own sex ??
It would suck. No one ever said that it doesn't suck bigtime to have to follow the rules of Christianity.

It would suck. No one ever said that it doesn't suck bigtime to have to follow the rules of Christianity.

..Ok....
:crazy:

..Ok....
:crazy:
What? I'm not a Christian, but I used to be one and I went to a catholic school for years (which means that I know a hell of a lot more about the history of christianity than most christians). I'm not here to convert people to Christianity, or even defend it. I’m just telling you what they believe.

While watching the Colbert Report, a thought popped into my head. He was interviewing, well, a gay man, and the argument was that there were physical signs that point to homosexuality. The signs point to homosexuality being something that develops in the womb.

So if you're born with a homosexual mindset, if that's how it really goes down, what would that do the Christian (or any other religions) look on homosexuality as a sin? If you really are born gay, then it's no fault of your own and you shouldn't be punished for it, right?

Thoughts? Ideas?
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M*W: Exactly. Some research has been done linking homosexuality to the function of the hypothalamus. Other research has been done in male twins where one is gay and the other is not. The most recent research I've heard about regards male siblings in a family where there was a higher statistical significance of homosexuality in older male siblings.

I've always believed that the conditions in the womb which is bombarded with massive estrogen plays a role in homosexuality. Then of course the food we eat is ridden with antibiotics, hormones, pesticides, etc. Cows are given hormones to make them produce more milk and beef cows are given hormones to bulk them up for greedier sales. The only way to avoid the probable hormonal influence to one's fetus is to eat organic foods only. Then, again, the mother's hormonal health is important.

With all these possibilities for hormonal influence, we have been seeing a higher incidence of homosexuality (male and female) since 1970. I also think that prenatal ultrasound plays a role that influences untoward conditions in the fetus. It can damage speech and hearing and cause blister like lesions in the fetal brain. Prenatal ultrasound is for the most part unnecessary. It's mostly used for the convenience for the doctor's scheduling purposes. However, genetic defects can be detected with ultrasound, so it can play an important role in fetal outcome.

After the infant is born, it is also bombarded with hormones from its food supply. I don't think things will change anytime soon. We are products of our environment, and homosexuality is a natural born characteristic. It's not a sin, and they shouldn't be shunned nor discriminated against anymore than you would shun and discriminate someone with blue eyes.

Most Christians don’t believe that being gay is a sin in and of itself. Actually committing homosexual acts is a sin.
*************
M*W: I'll tell you what's not normal, and that's christianity. Christianity is an abomination against nature. Christianity discriminates against all sexual activity, even heterosexuality. Homosexuality is more normal than religion.

*************
M*W: Exactly. Some research has been done linking homosexuality to the function of the hypothalamus. Other research has been done in male twins where one is gay and the other is not. The most recent research I've heard about regards male siblings in a family where there was a higher statistical significance of homosexuality in older male siblings.

I've always believed that the conditions in the womb which is bombarded with massive estrogen plays a role in homosexuality. Then of course the food we eat is ridden with antibiotics, hormones, pesticides, etc. Cows are given hormones to make them produce more milk and beef cows are given hormones to bulk them up for greedier sales. The only way to avoid the probable hormonal influence to one's fetus is to eat organic foods only. Then, again, the mother's hormonal health is important.

With all these possibilities for hormonal influence, we have been seeing a higher incidence of homosexuality (male and female) since 1970. I also think that prenatal ultrasound plays a role that influences untoward conditions in the fetus. It can damage speech and hearing and cause blister like lesions in the fetal brain. Prenatal ultrasound is for the most part unnecessary. It's mostly used for the convenience for the doctor's scheduling purposes. However, genetic defects can be detected with ultrasound, so it can play an important role in fetal outcome.

After the infant is born, it is also bombarded with hormones from its food supply. I don't think things will change anytime soon. We are products of our environment, and homosexuality is a natural born characteristic. It's not a sin, and they shouldn't be shunned nor discriminated against anymore than you would shun and discriminate someone with blue eyes.

I do agree with most of that. I don't know about the ultrasounds all of that. I thought that was pretty harmless. But the hormones in food and all of the other additives is pretty ridiculous when you look at it. I'm suprised we're all not effed up somehow.

*************
M*W: I'll tell you what's not normal, and that's christianity. Christianity is an abomination against nature. Christianity discriminates against all sexual activity, even heterosexuality. Homosexuality is more normal than religion.
Okay...

What? I'm not a Christian, but I used to be one and I went to a catholic school for years (which means that I know a hell of a lot more about the history of christianity than most christians). I'm not here to convert people to Christianity, or even defend it. I’m just telling you what they believe.

Ok, sorry for the misunderstanding then.

"Born with sin"? Presupposes it to be a sin. That's very, VERY subjective.

~String

if it's a sin. everything else is too. anything remotely selfish is sinful according to the good book

Too bad one can argue that everything, even claimed "Selfless acts", are, indeed, selfish in some way or another.

lol agreed provita. i've thought that too.

Most Christians don’t believe that being gay is a sin in and of itself. Actually committing homosexual acts is a sin.

Not exactly. Take into consideration that Jesus once said that merely thinking hatefuly thoughts about someone is, to him, just as worse as the action of murdering or beatin the shit out of them. I guess that could aply to this, making homosexual thoughts just as much a sin has gay butt sex.

Most Christians don’t believe that being gay is a sin in and of itself. Actually committing homosexual acts is a sin.

Not exactly. Take into consideration that Jesus once said that merely thinking hatefuly thoughts about someone is, to him, just as worse as the action of murdering or beatin the shit out of them. I guess that could aply to this, making homosexual thoughts just as much a sin has gay butt sex.

Not to mention that some christians also believe that we are all born with the "original sin". The logic is something along these lines; Adam and Eve sinned, therefore we are all sinners because we are their descendants.

So, there are a whole lot of sinners out there:


People who were born into Adam & Eve's family tree
People who have unholy thoughts
People who commit unholy actions


So maybe gay people aren't really any different to the rest of us geezers.

No. It's not a sin to want to have sex with someone of the same sex, just like it's not a sin to want to have sex with someone of the opposite sex before marriage. It is only a sin if you actually do it. At least, that's the view that most christians take.

In jesus' mind you were an adulterer if you LOOKED AT A WOMAN and felt lust. Any married male or female christain who claims they are not adulterers
and any single Christian who claims they are not performing premarital sex IN JESUS' way of looking at things is a liar.

They should work on cleaning out their own eyes and leave gays alone.

*************


With all these possibilities for hormonal influence, we have been seeing a higher incidence of homosexuality (male and female) since 1970. .

Or is it simply a higher incidence of reporting since the stigma and the danger of violence has been waning?

Further there are animals homosexuals and many animals that form homosexual pairs and even more animals that on occasion engage in homosexual acts. Homosexuality has been with us as far back as recorded history will show it. It is simply a part of life.

Behavior where one person victimizes another, that seems like a more important focus.

Or is it simply a higher incidence of reporting since the stigma and the danger of violence has been waning?

Further there are animals homosexuals and many animals that form homosexual pairs and even more animals that on occasion engage in homosexual acts. Homosexuality has been with us as far back as recorded history will show it. It is simply a part of life.

Behavior where one person victimizes another, that seems like a more important focus.
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M*W: Yes, I agree that the reporting (coming out) has increased. Also, homosexuality has been around since the beginning of time. It was accepted in many cultures and elevated to a high status in Egyptian, Roman and Greek societies (maybe in other groups as well, but I've only read about these).
Studies were done back in the 50s or 60s with mice. There was a higher incidence of homosexuality with overcrowding in the lab cage.