http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2007/7/10/154812.shtml

When the the defendants are finally cleared, it will be because of Don's son, Capt. Jeff Dinsmore. As the intelligence officer of the battalion he followed every second of the day's action on Nov. 19. In eight hours of grueling testimony videotaped before he left for another tour of duty in Iraq, he provided solid and irrefutable proof of the innocence of all the accused Marines.

He did so at the risk of his 20 year career in his beloved Marine Corps, standing firm in defense of the truth.

I'll let his dad tell you the story.

"My eldest son, Capt. Jeff Dinsmore called me immediately after his people were charged in December 2006. He asked Dad what he should do.


"I said, 'You know what you have got to do; you are a Marine.' But, I asked, 'Do you understand what it will cost you?'"

"He said, 'Yes, probably my career.' He then said, 'We went over there together as Marines, we watched each other's backs like Marines, we were ready to take a hit for each other, because we are Marines. If I had taken that hit for any of them it would have wrecked my career. They are innocent and I can prove it, and I'm a Marine and I will leave no man behind.'"


Three fathers and one son — four brave men who know the meaning of loyalty to family and to country.





L. A Times (on line) ^ | July 11, 2007 | Tony Perry, Times Staff Writer
Snip-CAMP PENDLETON — A hearing officer recommended Tuesday that murder charges be dropped against Marine Lance Cpl. Justin L. Sharratt in the fatal shooting of Iraqi civilians in the western town of Haditha in late November 2005

AP ^ | July 10, 2007 | AP
SAN DIEGO, California (AP) -- An investigating officer has recommended dismissing murder charges against a Marine accused in the slayings of three Iraqi men in a squad action that killed 24 civilians in Haditha, according to a report released Tuesday. The government's theory that Lance Cpl. Justin L. Sharratt had executed the three men was "incredible" and relied on contradictory statements by Iraqis, Lt. Col. Paul Ware said in the report, released by Sharratt's defense attorneys. "To believe the government version of facts is to disregard clear and convincing evidence to the contrary, and sets a dangerous precedent that, in...

NewsMax ^ | July 11, 2007 | Philip V. Brennan
Lance Cpl. Justin Sharratt is a Marine hero. In the horror of the bloody battles of 2nd Fallujah in 2004 and Haditha on Nov. 19, 2005 his actions were in accord with the highest traditions of the United States Marine Corps. By any standard, his father Darryl Sharrat is a hero too. Faced with accusations that his son is guilty of murdering innocent civilians in Haditha he has devoted almost every living moment to defending his son against what he knew to be false charges at great cost to himself and his family. "I don't want to paint Justin in...


N C Times ^ | 9 July 07 | Mark Walker
Marine Cpl. Trent Thomas The case against Cpl. Trent Thomas is the first to reach the full trial stage since he and seven other members of a Kilo Company platoon from Camp Pendleton's 3rd Battalion, 5th Marine Regiment were charged in June 2006 with the killing of 52-year-old Hashim Awad. Thomas pleaded guilty in January to his role in Awad's death and said during an interview with CNN earlier this year that he took part in the plot. But three days into his sentencing hearing in early February, he withdrew the guilty plea, telling the court that he was...

What a surprise!

What a surprise!


The truth is a surprise to you? tells a lot about your veracity.

On March 19, the U.S. military officials confirmed that contrary to the initial report, 15 civilians were accidentally killed due to the U.S. marines and not Iraqi insurgents.

Staff Sergeant Frank Wuterich, the squad leader, was investigated. Several official investigations were instigated. The first, under United States Army Maj. Gen. Eldon Bargewell, investigated how the incident was reported through the chain of command. A second investigation, headed by the Naval Criminal Investigative Service, saw into the criminal aspects of the incident. [14] A third investigation was launched by the Iraqi government.

On June 2, 2006, news outlets had reported that 24 Iraqis were killed, none as a result of the bomb explosion.[15] The news came in anticipation of the results of the military's investigation, which found that the 24 unarmed Iraqis—including children as young as two years old and women[16]—were killed by 12 members of Kilo Company in the 3rd Battalion, 1st Marine Regiment, 1st Marine Division.[17]

The first investigation, under U.S. Army Maj. Gen. Eldon Bargewell 2006, The Times published the result of its investigations and interviews with eye witnesses. It noted that the "official investigation has already resulted in the removal of Lieutenant Colonel Jeffrey Chessani, the commanding officer, and Captain Luke McConnell and Captain James Kimber, two company commanders, from their duties. Bargewell's investigation found that:

"Statements made by the chain of command during interviews for this investigation, taken as a whole, suggest that Iraqi civilian lives are not as important as U.S. lives, their deaths are just the cost of doing business, and that the Marines need to get 'the job done' no matter what it takes. These comments had the potential to desensitize the Marines to concern for the Iraqi populace and portray them all as the enemy even if they are noncombatants.[18]

In addition, the Associated Press reported on June 1, 2006 that the Iraqi government decided to launch its own probe into the alleged killing of 24 unarmed Iraqi civilians by U.S. Marines last year. Adnan al-Kazimi, an adviser to Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki, said the decision was made during a Cabinet meeting and the probe will be carried out by a special committee made up of the Justice and Human Rights ministries along with security officials.

Its a surprise that it took them so long to realise the marines are "innocent"


The US Marines investigation has avoided public pronouncements. Nonetheless, in June 2006, the New York Times reported that, "Investigators have also concluded that most of the victims in three houses died from well-aimed rifle shots, not shrapnel or random fire, according to military officials familiar with the initial findings."[28] Many of those killed have wounds from close-range fire, and their death certificates record "well-aimed shots to the head and chest" as the cause of death.[28]

Video shot by the founder of the Hammurabi Human Rights Group, Taher Thabet, which instigated Tim McGirk's original Time Magazine article, and cellphone photos reportedly taken by one of the Marines[29] the day after the killings have been put forth as evidence that the killings were methodical and without resistance.[2][30] The term "execution-style" has been used by anonymous U.S. military officials to describe the killings.[citation needed] In particular, the video shot by Thabet shows the bodies of the children and women with gunshot wounds, bullet holes in the interior walls of the house, and bloodstains on the floor.

Its a surprise that it took them so long to realise the marines are "innocent"

Ah yes sam can't believe that all of the propaganda that was put in to print failed to comport with the fact as proven with video from drones that recorded the whole action, and the investigation at the site of the ambush which shows that there was no massacre, the propaganda that was printed didn't match the facts of the legal investigation.

What you posted was speculation before all the facts were known, and not the facts as they were found to be, ands the facts as they were found to be are supported by video and on site investigation, now which of these citations have video and on site forenic evedence as part of their fact base for the accusations against the Marines? what they printed was speculation and gossip, which was found not to be true.

We're not holding our breath, or expecting any justice.

After all Guantanamo is still open

http://www.goalsforamericans.org/gallery/d/277-2/LibertyVictimJPG.jpg

We're not holding our breath, or expecting any justice.

After all Guantanamo is still open

http://www.goalsforamericans.org/gallery/d/277-2/LibertyVictimJPG.jpg

And as usual sam changes the subject, her post of reports made from word of mouth interview that are worthless, in a court of law, as to the subject of the Haditha Marines, they had no investigational facts, forensic investigation back up, and video support of the accusations, which the G-2 Capt. Jeff Dinsmore had and place in evidence at the Court.

Now as to Abu Grieb, there was a investigation that found criminal behavior, which resulted in charges, and prison terms for those who were responsible, so tell me S.A.M. were are the investigations and charges and prison sentences for the Islamic Terrorist who kill hundreds of innocent Iraqis weekly,

http://www.kxma.com/getArticle.asp?ArticleId=141789

Insurgents have apparently been squeezed north where they continue to carry out massive attacks. A truck bombing yesterday in a Shiite village marketplace 100 miles north of Baghdad killed at least 115 people, most of them women, children and elderly. The toll has been climbing because most of the victims were buried in the rubble of shops and homes. The police chief from a nearby town says 150 people were killed.

87 killed in Baghdad mosque bombing | Iraq Updates
He said his office and the room above collapsed but that he was not in the mosque at ... In southern Iraq, police and hospital officials said the death toll ...
http://www.iraqupdates.com/p_articles.php/article/18528

Murdering 3rd World civilians whether directly or covertly is an American past time. There's Always justification for US war crimes. Naturally BR would see absolutely nothing an American soldier can do wrong, especially regarding non Christians.

Moderator's note:
Thank you guys for moderating yourselves. I'm so proud! :D

Murdering 3rd World civilians whether directly or covertly is an American past time. There's Always justification for US war crimes. Naturally BR would see absolutely nothing an American soldier can do wrong, especially regarding non Christians.

And if I was a third world Moslem I'd be hunting your butt down and remove your offending presence from the world for the Glory of Allah, if you think that it isn't the Soldiers of the United States that have guaranteed your freedom of expression, just move to Iran-Iraq-Saudi Arabia-Pakistan any of the middle east Islamic countries and see what would happen to you Offending Life Style to Allah.

I was one of those Soldiers that made sure that you have the life you live here, and that you have the right to live it.

The Soldiers of the United States are not permitted to be gay. Besides, why are you discussing Genji's sexuality instead of the topic?

Murdering 3rd World civilians whether directly or covertly is an American past time. There's Always justification for US war crimes. Naturally BR would see absolutely nothing an American soldier can do wrong, especially regarding non Christians.
----

----

That's related to the topic.

The same way your response was.

And if I was a third world Moslem I'd be hunting your butt down and remove your offending presence from the world for the Glory of Allah, if you think that it isn't the Soldiers of the United States that have guaranteed your freedom of expression, just move to Iran-Iraq-Saudi Arabia-Pakistan any of the middle east Islamic countries and see what would happen to you Offending Life Style to Allah.

I was one of those Soldiers that made sure that you have the life you live here, and that you have the right to live it.God Bless IED's, the weapon of the masses. Those soldiers are getting their asses kicked still in 3rd World Iraq. Your self righteous pride is thoroughly unfounded and unearned. The whole world is watching the US defeat by the rebels of Iraq. I'm proud of them.

The same way your response was.

Yup, united states soldiers are not permitted to be gay; however they are excused for torture and murder.

Yup, united states soldiers are not permitted to be gay; however they are excused for torture and murder.

In the same manner of the Islamic Terrorist, Please show were we don't bring to trial the people who break the UCMJ, and then please post the arrest and trials and sentences of the Moslem Terrorist who rape, main, torture, murder, behead hundreds of Iraqis every week, show us were justice has been met out to your brothers in Islam who kill innocent men, women, and children, like the attack on Tuz Khurmato, The Terrorist manage to kill 8 U.S. troops in 2 days, but kill 150 Iraqis out shopping for their supper supplies, and will any of the Terrorist who planed this ever be charged by the Islamic Councils of the Terrorist al Quaida net work? or will they be told that they did a good job and Allah will reward them in Paradise.


Officials: Iraq truck bomb death toll may be 150
Attack comes after U.S. military reports 8 American soldiers slain in 2 days

Updated: 2:00 p.m. CT July 7, 2007
BAGHDAD - The death toll from Saturday’s truck bomb attack in a market in the northern Iraqi town of Tuz Khurmato may be as high as 150, local officials said on Sunday.

Local police and the mayor, Mohammed Rasheed, said the confirmed death toll was 130, with 250 wounded. But police said 20 people were still missing and presumed dead.

Rasheed said the truck bomb destroyed about 50 small shops and 50 houses in the largely Shi’ite Muslim town. On Saturday night, Rasheed had put the death toll at 115.

A death toll of 150 would make it one of the single deadliest insurgent bombings in Iraq since the U.S.-led invasion in 2003.

Iraqi officials have blamed Sunni Islamist al Qaeda for the attack.

Many of the victims, women and children who were out shopping at the time, were buried under rubble and it took rescuers hours to dig out their bodies.

More blather. Most of the "insurgents" are Sunnis and the US is arming them to the teeth.

Haditha is pretty cut and dried murder.

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article13452.htm

Yup, united states soldiers are not permitted to be gay; however they are excused for torture and murder.


And what does this have to do with the Haditha Marines, they were not excused, the evidence doesn't support the charges, unless you have some evidence that contravenes the Investigations report.

I was one of those Soldiers that made sure that you have the life you live here, and that you have the right to live it.

Dang, I don't want to make this sound like I'm disrespecting soldiers, but don't use that "freedom isn't free" BS in regards to war. I'm so sick and tired of that being tossed around. There hasn't been a war since WWII where our freedoms were in jeopardy, so soldiers haven't protected us from it since. If anything, our wars have put us more in jeopardy by having the world hate us. The War on Terror has created more terrorists, not protected us better. Most of our conflicts are about interests for the corporations that control our leaders with blood money, not what's best for this country and our people.

"Freedom isn't free" is about defending our freedoms by putting them to use, or the rare time we actually do have to wage war for it. You know, like voting out these corrupt politicians which nobody is doing. Soldiers aren't gonna save us from that. Right now you're pawns to our corrupt politicians. You guys will be dumb enough to follow the president's orders when Posse Comitatus gets enacted during the next terror attack on our homeland.

Fuck Al Qaeda, our government is more of a threat to us than they are. Right now, nobody is defending our freedoms which is why we have politicians and this administration tossing aside our Constitution. Fuck the president. Fuck congress. Fuck our politicians. We don't have allegiance to them, our allegiance is to the Constitution of the United States of America. Our politicians are supposed to represent our needs yet all they do is pass laws that better serve their personal needs by whoever puts more money into their own pockets, not ours. The Constitution is the most perfect document to have ever existed, better than the friggin' Bible. However, it means nothing when the people won't stand up and put the Constitution to use, the same way the Bible means jack shit when you have Christians picking and choosing what to follow then try and use Jesus' message of love to spew hatred to various groups of people they're not tolerant of.

The people are the power, not our politicians who couldn't give two shits about this country, but rather who pays them better. The Bush family are little bitches to Saudi Arabia because they make millions from their royal family. And you fools that look to Guilliani as your savior to keep republican power in '08, as you continue to complain about the Immigration Bill that just recently failed, his personal firm is the one behind the NAFTA Superhighway. And Clinton? I don't even have to go there.

If you want a true democrat in power, vote Kucinich. If you want a true conservative in power, vote Paul. All other candidates (ie: all leading ones) are pawns to big business and don't care about you. You're all just a bunch of flippin' morons that are slaves to the boob tube. In a democracy, you get the government you deserve, so as America starts to crumble, you have only yourselves to blame, not some average joe evil liberal or conservative that politicians and TV loves to have us fight amongst ourselves while nobody does a damned thing about our corrupt politicians in power. Gotta love capitalist America, we have the best government money can buy -- literally.

- N

We are pretty much screwed no matter how this trial ends. If they are found not-guilty, Iraqis will percieve a great injustice. If they are found guilty and don't recieve a death penality, ditto.

More blather. Most of the "insurgents" are Sunnis and the US is arming them to the teeth.

Haditha is pretty cut and dried murder.

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article13452.htm

And still what does that have to do with anything, and as for cut and dry, please post the proof that it was, show your point by point investigation of the site, the forensic evidence that you have in your possession, and the Video tapes of the action as it took place and in those tapes shows that murder was committed, or are you like the fish wife?

Dang, I don't want to make this sound like I'm disrespecting soldiers, but don't use that "freedom isn't free" BS in regards to war. I'm so sick and tired of that being tossed around. There hasn't been a war since WWII where our freedoms were in jeopardy, so soldiers haven't protected us from it since. If anything, our wars have put us more in jeopardy by having the world hate us. The War on Terror has created more terrorists, not protected us better. Most of our conflicts are about interests for the corporations that control our leaders with blood money, not what's best for this country and our people.

"Freedom isn't free" is about defending our freedoms by putting them to use, or the rare time we actually do have to wage war for it. You know, like voting out these corrupt politicians which nobody is doing. Soldiers aren't gonna save us from that. Right now you're pawns to our corrupt politicians. You guys will be dumb enough to follow the president's orders when Posse Comitatus gets enacted during the next terror attack on our homeland.

Fuck Al Qaeda, our government is more of a threat to us than they are. Right now, nobody is defending our freedoms which is why we have politicians and this administration tossing aside our Constitution. Fuck the president. Fuck congress. Fuck our politicians. We don't have allegiance to them, our allegiance is to the Constitution of the United States of America. Our politicians are supposed to represent our needs yet all they do is pass laws that better serve their personal needs by whatever puts more money into their own pockets, not ours. The Constitution is the most perfect document to have ever existed, better than the friggin' Bible. However, it means nothing when the people won't stand up and put the Constitution to use, the same way the Bible means jack shit when you have Christians picking and choosing what to follow then try and use Jesus' message of love to spew hated to various groups of people they're not tolerant of.

The people are the power, not our politicians who couldn't give two shits about this country, but rather who pays them better. The Bush family are little bitches to Saudi Arabia because they make millions from their royal family. And you fools that look to Guilliani as your savior to keep republican power in '08, as you continue to complain about the Immigration Bill that just recently failed, his personal firm is the one behind the NAFTA Superhighway. And Clinton? Good luck, I don't even have to go there. If you want a true democrat in power, vote Kucinich. If you want a true conservative in power, vote Paul. All other candidates (ie: all leading ones) are pawns to big business and don't care about you. You're all just a bunch of flippin' morons that are slaves to the boob tube. In a democracy, you get the government you deserve, so as America starts to crumble, you have only yourselves to blame, not some average joe evil liberal or conservative that politicians and TV loves to have us fight amongst ourselves while nobody does a damned thing about our corrupt politicians in power. Gotta love capitalist America, we have the best government money can buy -- literally.

- NWELL SAID Neildo. That BS "But thar a fightin fer yer free speech in Eyerak" is so stupid it's embarrassing. The Hussein regime never threatened America or my rights as a citizen to dissent from the one party state flavor of this inept and criminal administration. Unless BR is a WW2 vet that shit just doesn't work on people with an IQ higher than 9.

And still what does that have to do with anything, and as for cut and dry, please post the proof that it was, show your point by point investigation of the site, the forensic evidence that you have in your possession, and the Video tapes of the action as it took place and in those tapes shows that murder was committed, or are you like the fish wife?

Was this girls testimony used in the case? After all, she is a survivor of the massacre

Here this link works:

http://www.searchforvideo.com/watchclip.php?title=Eyewitness+Reportage+About+Had itha+Massacre+Lonelygirl15&link=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2F%3Fv%3DvSTySN2 cHyM&description=Here+you+can+hear+the+eyewitness+girl+ who+survived+American+killings+in+November+2005&source=YouTube.com&image=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.youtube.com%2Fvi%2FvSTySN2c HyM%2Fdefault.jpg&category=directory&searchterm=%2Fcountries%2Firaq%2Fhaditha%2F

We are pretty much screwed no matter how this trial ends. If they are found not-guilty, Iraqis will percieve a great injustice. If they are found guilty and don't recieve a death penality, ditto.

So are you saying convict them? no matter what the evidence show? that is what S.A.M. has already done, that is what a lot of people have already done, and what do you expect? look at the comments from Murtha, Pelosi, Reid, Boxer, ALGORE, Kerry, Durban, and a hundred other Demorats, they are the ones who leaded the lynch mob before the investigation was ever completed, and their words are the ones reported in the Middle East with in moments of their saying them, So much as to being Innocent until proven Guilty.

Any officers convicted for this yet?

http://www.mindfully.org/Reform/2004/Abu-Ghraib-Prison-Photos11jun04p02.jpg

Was this girls testimony used in the case? After all, she is a survivor of the massacre

Here this link works:

http://www.searchforvideo.com/watchclip.php?title=Eyewitness+Reportage+About+Had itha+Massacre+Lonelygirl15&link=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2F%3Fv%3DvSTySN2 cHyM&description=Here+you+can+hear+the+eyewitness+girl+ who+survived+American+killings+in+November+2005&source=YouTube.com&image=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.youtube.com%2Fvi%2FvSTySN2c HyM%2Fdefault.jpg&category=directory&searchterm=%2Fcountries%2Firaq%2Fhaditha%2F


All of the evidence was collected and used in the reaching of the request for dismissal of the charges, it was stated that the survivors were interviewed, and their reports were matched to the times and videos that were in the reports and after action reports, the biggest thing was that there were UAV over the site, providing real time intelligence to the headquarters so they could make command decisions as to how the troops were used and to send support to the area, the UAV tape is real time, as the fight was taking place, the individual troops can be identified as to their position minuet by minuet, and if the maneuver and fire in attacking enemy positions were justified by the fact that they were receiving fire from the building that they were a bringing under fire, and the tapes show the terrorist moving out of and into the houses as they maneuvered to bring the Marines under fire, so the UAV video would tie the whole thing together, and show if the actions were consistent with the shots fired and explosions, and the attacks taking place, and be able put a time line to each individual and action of that individual.

Any officers convicted for this yet?

http://www.mindfully.org/Reform/2004/Abu-Ghraib-Prison-Photos11jun04p02.jpg


The same evidence will apply to the Officers as to the enlisted men, and the evidence don't support the charges. They are requesting that the Charges against the Officers to be dropped to.

The drones could see inside the houses? The girls testimony is very clear.

The drones could see inside the houses? The girls testimony is very clear.



And so is the time line of the video from the UAV, and the sequences of the attack and counterattacks, and the maneuvers of both the terrorist and the Marines, now some of the information from the UAV tapes are classified, and I would suspect that it has to do with advanced capabilities of the drones observation capabilities.

So are you saying convict them? no matter what the evidence show? that is what S.A.M. has already done, that is what a lot of people have already done, and what do you expect? look at the comments from Murtha, Pelosi, Reid, Boxer, ALGORE, Kerry, Durban, and a hundred other Demorats, they are the ones who leaded the lynch mob before the investigation was ever completed, and their words are the ones reported in the Middle East with in moments of their saying them, So much as to being Innocent until proven Guilty.

No, I'm talking about the political implications of the case. In a broader sense, the political implications of the kind of military actions that you seem to advocate. I have often heard you or Baron Max say that the "lily-livered Democrats" won't let us win the war with overwhelming force. Well, overwhelming force kills civilians, the same people we are supposed to be helping, and it's counterproductive.

Trends: Seeing through walls
This New Radar Can See Through Walls. "...a radar system, based on UWB (ultra wideband) technology, that can produce three-dimensional pictures of what lies ...
http://www.byz.org/~rbanks/movableType/webLog/trends/archives/001066.html

No, I'm talking about the political implications of the case. In a broader sense, the political implications of the kind of military actions that you seem to advocate. I have often heard you or Baron Max say that the "lily-livered Democrats" won't let us win the war with overwhelming force. Well, overwhelming force kills civilians, the same people we are supposed to be helping, and it's counterproductive.

And the non use of over whelming force kills civilians, we are chasing the Terrorist out of their hiding hole and havens, and they are looking to find new places to hide, this is the type of force that I was talking about we move into contact, and saturate the area, over whelming force, and if they stand and fight we kill them, but they run and in their need to retaliate who do the go after the Troops--no-- they go after the innocent Iraqis, and we are starting to win the hearts and minds, the Iraqis are seeing that the Foreign al Quaida terrorist are killing more Iraqis than they are Americans, and their purpose isn't the welfare of the Iraqi people.

Violent weekend in Iraq claims 220 lives - Conflict in Iraq ...
Abbas Mohammed Amin — said 150 people were killed. Other officials out the death toll ... Matthews: Internal struggle over Iraq is at heart of CIA leak case ...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19659430/

Iraq truck bombing kills over 100 - Conflict in Iraq - MSNBC.com
Officials: Iraq truck bomb death toll may be 150 ... BAGHDAD - The death toll from Saturday’s truck bomb attack in a market in the northern Iraqi town of ...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19640140/

And so is the time line of the video from the UAV, and the sequences of the attack and counterattacks, and the maneuvers of both the terrorist and the Marines, now some of the information from the UAV tapes are classified, and I would suspect that it has to do with advanced capabilities of the drones observation capabilities.

Technology can be manipulated.

Technology can be manipulated.

So if it doesn't lead to the result that you demand it was manipulated?

Yes lynch'em cries sam, burn them at the alter of sams justice, justice be dammed sam, hang'em high, to the god of sams Quran, all to satisfy sams demands.

Trends: Seeing through walls
This New Radar Can See Through Walls. "...a radar system, based on UWB (ultra wideband) technology, that can produce three-dimensional pictures of what lies ...

That only has a range of 65 feet. Heck, the predator drone's wingspan is half that. ;)

- N

That only has a range of 65 feet. Heck, the predator drone's wingspan is half that. ;)

- N

And the Black Budget?

The thermal scanners can locate heat source from humans behind walls and through roofs, and that can be done from satellite.

http://ndsn.org/sepoct94/thermal.html

Thermal imagers don't see through walls in the sense that a telescope sees through a window. But the devices provide visual images of varying clarity that allow the operator to draw, or claim to draw, conclusions about what is happening on the other side of the house wall. ... So, it is disingenuous for the government to argue that thermal imagers do not reveal what is happening inside of a home (Slip op. at 28-29).


Buckman disagrees with the court's assessment of the technology. He said that thermal imaging could be extended for other purposes. "It is even possible for a highly skilled operator, given the right conditions and equipment, to detect whether individuals are engaging in sexual activity," he said.

So if it doesn't lead to the result that you demand it was manipulated?

Yes lynch'em cries sam, burn them at the alter of sams justice, justice be dammed sam, hang'em high, to the god of sams Quran, all to satisfy sams demands.

I believe the girl who lost her family, not the liars who covered their own asses from the get go.

I believe the girl who lost her family, not the liars who covered their own asses from the get go.

And I have to go with the techknowledgy, and the fact that the Military has when warrented by the facts and evedence charged tried and convicted soldiers who have crossed the line, with the political enviroment in this country today to do other wise would get the Conviening Authorities in the Article 32 Investigation, and Courts Martial charged with deraliction of duty and end their carriers with them in the Brig themselves.

Now I believe the girl really believes what she thinks she saw, and the order in which it happens is correct, and that was that her parents were killed, now by who and what the exact circumstances were that is what is in question, and that is were the video, and the surveillance technology comes in, it establishes a time line, of movements, the location of the individuals both terrorist and marines, the movement of those persons, and the firing of the weapons, when and were, and a machine gun or a grenade going off will have a flash signature that will be visible through the windows, and the grenade will also have a dust signature and glass blow out from the windows, and as I know from experience there is more than visible light capability in the surveillance systems of UAV's, Synthetic Aperture Radar can read through solids and identify what is behind them.


Millennium Sensor, LLC, a Colorado-based company that has been making force protection systems since 2000 developed the P3 mobile remote sensing system (MRSS). Although the P3 was designed to provide sensor information to users, the company did not specifically create the device to see through walls—that function was discovered by customers on their own.

“What we found is that a lot of our customers who use these things have discovered that microwaves can also see through normal construction material—plywood, drywall and a little bit of brick, depending on how thick it is,” said Mike Roberts, the company’s CEO and chief technical officer. “It’s just like any microwave system can look through general materials, these will do the same exact thing.”


http://www.physorg.com/news70539481.html

Stealth radar system sees through trees, walls -- undetected
Ohio State University engineers have invented a radar system that is virtually undetectable, because its signal resembles random noise. The radar could have applications in law enforcement, the military, and disaster rescue.

Like traditional radar, the "noise" radar detects objects by bouncing a radio signal off them and detecting the rebound. The hardware isn't expensive, either; altogether, the components cost less than $100.

The difference is that the noise radar generates a signal that resembles random noise, and a computer calculates very small differences in the return signal. The calculations happen billions of times every second, and the pattern of the signal changes constantly. A receiver couldn't detect the signal unless it knew exactly what random pattern to look for.

The radar can be tuned to penetrate solid walls -- just like the waves that transmit radio and TV signals -- so the military could spot enemy soldiers inside a building without the radar signal being detected, Walton said. Traffic police could measure vehicle speed without setting off drivers' radar detectors. Autonomous vehicles could tell whether a bush conceals a more dangerous obstacle, like a tree stump or a gulley.

The radar is inherently able to distinguish between many types of targets because of its ultra-wide-band characteristics. "Unfortunately, there are thousands of everyday objects that look like humans on radar -- even chairs and filing cabinets," he said. So the shape of a radar image alone can't be used to identify a human. "What tends to give a human away is that he moves. He breathes, his heart beats, his body makes unintended motions."

These tiny motions could be used to locate disaster survivors who were pinned under rubble. Other radar systems can't do that, because they are too far-sighted -- they can't see people who are buried only a few yards away. Walton said that the noise radar is inherently able to see objects that are nearby.

So much believable technology from far away, but no one believes the girl who was there.

If it was an American girl who saw Iraqi soldiers, who would you believe, the girl or the technology?

So much believable technology from far away, but no one believes the girl who was there.

If it was an American girl who saw Iraqi soldiers, who would you believe, the girl or the technology?

And the technology is not swayed by terror of the individual who may not see everything that is happening around them, the visual range of a human is just a little over 180 deg, it is affected by the light level, flash, brightness, and target fixation, under stress the human tends to fix on a object and go into tunnel vision and concentrate on what is immediately in from of them and never see any thing to the side and in range of their vision, I have seen this reaction get trained soldiers killed, and you have a little girl in the middle of a ambush initiated by terrorist from her house, at night, now what did the girl really see? did she really see anything, it would take a remarkable child to not cover their head and curl up into a frighten ball, and then report that the first person she saw was the ones who killed her relatives, and it is possible that the relatives were killed by the action of combat with the terrorist, but it was the terrorist who initiated the ambush, and from the houses of the civilians, and moved from civilian house to civilian house all the while maintaining contact in combat with the Marines, the UAV, was a disinterested eye to the action, it recorded what went on with out emotion and with out deflection of what it was looking at, and if I remember correctly their were more than one UAV over the site, I will look that up and post citation, but the camera doesn't flinch and it doesn't lie, it records.

"If it was an American girl who saw Iraqi soldiers, who would you believe, the girl or the technology?"

That depends- Was the girl a little brown, doe-eyed Muslim? Case adjourned, dismissed, and stricken from the record in accordance with Presidential Order 90297343.2098.

Still doesn't change the facts; her father, grandmother and mother, and four other members of her family including a two year old child were shot at close range (head and chest wounds) and she is a surviving witness who says the shooters were American troops.

She's been brainwashed by dead-ender Sodomites. Stockholm, China- one of them syndromes. Poor little waif got in the way of some of our boys just lettin' off steam.

She's been brainwashed by dead-ender Sodomites. Stockholm, China- one of them syndromes.

Jihad!:spank:

Still doesn't change the facts; her father, grandmother and mother, and four other members of her family including a two year old child were shot at close range (head and chest wounds) and she is a surviving witness.

Fact not in evidence on your part, and can you conclusively state that it was the Marines who did this? Remember there was another group of people with guns, grenades, and RPG, shooting at any thing that moved, and they have a disturbing habit of killing innocent civilians, the Euphrates is awash with their victims corpses, and they say their prayers 5 time a day when it doesn't interfear with the killing of innocent Iraqis.

I'm betting an Iraqi girl can tell when people are not speaking Iraqi.

I'm betting an Iraqi girl can tell when people are not speaking Iraqi.

Have you ever tried to hear after a gunfight in a room?, a grenade detonation in a room? I just thought of something, to use a grenade in a room if you don't have hearing protection you rupture your ear drums, and the same for rifle fire, I have sever hearing loss because of a burst of rifle fire in a enclosed room, it ruptured my right ear drum, and the girl didn't seem to have any hearing problems, a curious thought, but a valid one, and one other question? if she was in the room, and saw the Marines Kill her relatives? and if the Marines were in a killing mood?, why is she still alive? what would they have to gain by not killing her? what would they have gained if they did kill her? no witness right? If the Marines were as cold blooded as you say they were why didn't they kill her? and they were accused of killing a 2 year old, why was the girl still alive?

You didn't watch the video did you?

"why was the girl still alive?"

Because those assholes were finished with her. RTB.

"why was the girl still alive?"

Because those assholes were finished with her. RTB.

Really? if they were finished with her as you say why is she still alive? they had just killed a two year old baby according to the story, so why spare a 15 year old girl?

hype you are the one who I would be afraid to have on my team in a fire fight, because you go off half cocked, you claim to have been in the military? well you don't sound like it, tell me if sonar can here a wale fart?

Ever eat a bird's wing, and then cast aside the bones and sinew? She was a barely existential skin of a gang-raped little girl, and they thought less of her than a chicken wing. They thought less, were thoughtless, and heartless too. They left it lying with its dead family.

"tell me if sonar can here a wale fart?"

Yes. It can also make the whales beach themselves and die as a result of excruciating pain in their ears and skulls. If that's still classified, then I don't care. I'm out.

Ever eat a bird's wing, and then cast aside the bones and sinew? She was a barely existential skin of a gang-raped little girl, and they thought less of her than a chicken wing. They thought less, were thoughtless, and heartless too. They left it lying with it's dead family.


Were in the hell did you come up with that? dam your losing it, and again if they did all of this why didn't they kill her? If you had just done all of this, and you had seen and known from the news that other soldiers had been charged, tried and convicted, why in the hell would you leave a witness behind? when you can explain that then you will have a case, they were thorough enough to kill everything down to a 2 year old, why would they leave a living eye witness, in your belief these were stone cold killers, so why is the girl alive? they had nothing to loose by not killing her, and everything to loose by letting her live.

The wonderful US troops

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=456_1177473318

"why in the hell would you leave a witness behind?"

That broken virgin? Easier to break than these illusions, but I'll try again:

These soldiers were not the 3 Wise Men.

"why in the hell would you leave a witness behind?"

That broken virgin? Easier to break than these illusions, but I'll try again:

These soldiers were not the 3 Wise Men.

And if they were as you described they weren't stupid either, so now why was the girl left alive? they had just wiped out her family, and she was a witness, even if these guy were as dull as butter knives why would they leave her alive?

"why in the hell would you leave a witness behind?"

That broken virgin? Easier to break than these illusions, but I'll try again:

These soldiers were not the 3 Wise Men.

Please post citation of the charge of rape agains the Haditha Marines.

My apologies, I was thinking of Mahmudiya (http://jurist.law.pitt.edu/jurist_search.php?q=mahmudiya). I'd try harder to keep each rampage separate in my mind, if it didn't involve such strong emotions of ugliness and shame.

My apologies, I was thinking of Mahmudiya (http://jurist.law.pitt.edu/jurist_search.php?q=mahmudiya). I'd try harder to keep each rampage separate in my mind, if it didn't involve such strong emotions of ugliness and shame.

You probably got distracted by the rape/suicide of this 15 year old

http://www.sciforums.com/showpost.php?p=1470078&postcount=55

I think I've thought all that I want to think about this subject for now.

Yes your true colors are showing.

And I have to go with the techknowledgy, and the fact that the Military has when warrented by the facts and evedence charged tried and convicted soldiers who have crossed the line, As far as I can discover, the military charges, tries, and convicts soldiers for serious atrocity that has already been covered up

when said military has been cornered by the evidence like a rat in a trap, and has discovered a way to isolate the guilty and limit the scope of the judgment, and not before.

And I can understand that: soldiers should not have to worry about second guessing when they are in combat.

But if you have evidence from drones that exonerates these soldiers, lets see it. Until then, claims that a girl the killers missed or left can't tell Iraqis from American soldiers are not the most likely explanations.

As far as I can discover, the military charges, tries, and convicts soldiers for serious atrocity that has already been covered up

when said military has been cornered by the evidence like a rat in a trap, and has discovered a way to isolate the guilty and limit the scope of the judgment, and not before.

And I can understand that: soldiers should not have to worry about second guessing when they are in combat.

But if you have evidence from drones that exonerates these soldiers, lets see it. Until then, claims that a girl the killers missed or left can't tell Iraqis from American soldiers are not the most likely explanations.


when said military has been cornered by the evidence like a rat in a trap, and has discovered a way to isolate the guilty and limit the scope of the judgment, and not before.

And you don't know shit about the subject, your a frigging wanta bee, thinking that your the great adjudicator, well in every case that I know about the Military is already investigation the charges, and is doing so under our laws and the UCMJ, and all of a sudden the news media come in and starts to make all kind of wild charges, report unconfirmed stories that are not vetted in the investigatory process, and the politicians start pronounce conviction and sentence before the trial has even begun, even in the Military the presumption of Innocence is a right of the accused, and here again the evidence was not fully in play, and there were thing that were not known at the time of the sensational Headlines that had the Marines Tried and Convicted in the News, like the existence of the UAV videos, the full transcripts of the radio traffic, the forensic reports, and a full interview of all the witness's.

So tell me were do you want your trial, in the News Media? or in the Courts? How do you want your guilt or innocence determined, by the Sensational News Stories? or by the Evidence? What do want as Evidence the unvetted stories?, or careful investigated, backed by Forensic, and Interviews by trained investigators, video tapes of the action, evidence? or the News Mans version that is meant to sell papers and back up his political agenda? How do you want you trial, in the News? or in the Courts.


Until then, claims that a girl the killers missed or left can't tell Iraqis from American soldiers are not the most likely explanations.

And please tell me what the tapes really tell? you have a interview of a Young Girl, who is telling a story. True from her point of view maybe yes, maybe no, but lets look at the interview of the Girl, does she ever break down when tell her story of the horrors of that night? How many people do you know who would have the composures to tell a story like that with out breaking down? She is continually looking off to the left? why? there is something off camera that is defiantly keeping her attention, some one coaching her?, she tells of coming into the rooms and seeing the Marines Killing everybody in her family from the Grand Father right down to the 2 year old Baby, and the Marines never touch her? she tells of grenades being used, and no injuries to her? indiscriminate fire and she isn't even touched, and the she says that the Marines killed every body in cold blood? If they are that cold, why is she still alive? what would it cost them, to leave the Girl alive? Would they be on trial now if they had killed her, a potential witness, that under the UCMJ could bring them the Death Penalty at most, and Life in Prison at the Least, she described premeditated murder, so why would they have left her alive to finger them?

well in every case that I know about the Military is already investigation the charges, and is doing so under our laws and the UCMJ, and all of a sudden the news media come in and starts to make all kind of wild charges, That's not what happened with the Bagram, Abu Ghraib, Fallujah (WP), or Pat Tillman incidents

just to mention four that I know you know about, from this forum.

And if you were around during Vietnam, Panama, Grenada, etc, you might recall that that is not what happened with the many,many incidents and situations in those places either.

The military lies to civilians. Period. By reflex, by strategy, by habit, by prudence, to protect the mission, to protect the ass, for whatever reason, it lies. There is absolutely no reason for any civilian to accept the unsupported word of any official military spokesman about anything the military has done, if there is any solid reason to doubt it.

Trials are one thing. Assessing what is actually happening in another. As civilians, we require evidence for our assessments. If there is exonerating evidence from drone cameras, what's wrong with letting us see it?

1.That's not what happened with the Bagram, Abu Ghraib, Fallujah (WP), or Pat Tillman incidents

just to mention four that I know you know about, from this forum.

2.And if you were around during Vietnam, Panama, Grenada, etc, you might recall that that is not what happened with the many,many incidents and situations in those places either.

3.The military lies to civilians. Period. By reflex, by strategy, by habit, by prudence, to protect the mission, to protect the ass, for whatever reason, it lies. There is absolutely no reason for any civilian to accept the unsupported word of any official military spokesman about anything the military has done, if there is any solid reason to doubt it.

4.Trials are one thing. Assessing what is actually happening in another. As civilians, we require evidence for our assessments. If there is exonerating evidence from drone cameras, what's wrong with letting us see it?



1. If it is like the Abu Ghraib situation, the Military was already looking into the Matters, just because it don't match the news medias or your time schedule has little to do with it. The reason that most of these stories are splashed is that some News Reporter hears something from some one he knows in the Military about a investigation in progress and then the Reporter make a big story about the incident and the fact that the military isn't lynching the accused fast enough to satisfy the reporter.


From what I can see the Military was already looking into the situation before the New Story broke, and the News Reporter was a Johnny come lately to the Story, The Army had already started a ARTICLE 15-6 INVESTIGATION in January 2004, just because they don't splash it in the news doesn't mean that they aren't doing their job, the Reporter has a interest to make money, and a splash, ( it strokes their ego)the Military has a job to do.


Investigative journalist Seymour Hersh spills the secrets of the ...
And in April of this year, he broke the story of how U.S. soldiers had ... The several articles he wrote for the New Yorker about Abu Ghraib have been ...
http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/2004/10/11_hersh.shtml

If you would care to notice the story broke in the News in April 2004,
http://news.findlaw.com/cnn/docs/iraq/tagubarpt.html

ARTICLE 15-6 INVESTIGATION OF THE
800th MILITARY POLICE BRIGADE

BACKGROUND

1. (U) On 19 January 2004, Lieutenant General (LTG) Ricardo S. Sanchez, Commander, Combined Joint Task Force Seven (CJTF-7) requested that the Commander, US Central Command, appoint an Investigating Officer (IO) in the grade of Major General (MG) or above to investigate the conduct of operations within the 800th Military Police (MP) Brigade. LTG Sanchez requested an investigation of detention and internment operations by the Brigade from 1 November 2003 to present. LTG Sanchez cited recent reports of detainee abuse, escapes from confinement facilities, and accountability lapses, which indicated systemic problems within the brigade and suggested a lack of clear standards, proficiency, and leadership. LTG Sanchez requested a comprehensive and all-encompassing inquiry to make findings and recommendations concerning the fitness and performance of the 800th MP Brigade

2. Yes I was around during those time and as a insider you are dead wrong, again just because the new made a big story of claiming to find a story, that didn't mean that the Military wasn't investigating the situation before the News Media went hunting for the next Pulitzer, if you really want some fun look up all the times that the New Agencies have printed known lies and false stories, they are not known for their veracity now are they;

Reutergate - Reuters Publishes Doctored Photos « Lightshiner
This is scandalous; at least one other picture has been been doctored and another couple of ... Reutering the photos of Lebanon during Israeli warplaning, ...
http://josephnadir.wordpress.com/2006/08/06/reutergate-reuters-publishes-doctored-photos/

So Just Who Is Capt. Jamil Hussein? - The Lede - Breaking News ...
Add to that several other doctored/staged photos, for instance making defensive flares look like missiles or taking pictures of the same destroyed building ...
http://thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2006/11/30/so-just-who-is-capt-jamil-hussein/

"It Didn't Start With Dateline NBC" (National Review 6/21/93)
And he played a key role in assuring NBC the truck fire had been set off by a .... the way the robots yanked on the steering wheel of the rigged Jeep. ...
http://www.walterolson.com/articles/crashtests.html

Power Line: Old dog, old tricks
How could CBS run a story that is so utterly false. Neither th... [Read More] ... Embattled CBS News has been caught with its pants around its ankles again. ...
http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/008003.php

Gateway Pundit: AP Is Busted! Uses BOGUS Source For Months in ...
The AP is caught lying through their teeth...and lefties are not at all .... And how many people were killed in riots sparked by these false stories? ...
http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2006/11/ap-is-busted-uses-bogus-source-for.html

CBS, Rather admit Bush military documents may be false - Silver ...
CBS News President Andrew Heyward admits that CBS rushed the story, .... its about time that rather got caught, this time I think he must go and anyone else ...
http://silverchips.mbhs.edu/inside.php?sid=3889

Post 47 and RaTHergate - The story of how CBS was caught ...
The story of how CBS was caught perpetrating a hoax on the American People. ..... There is no God named Allah, and Muhammed is his False Prophet") ...
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1219050/posts

Rathergate.com » CBS Does It Again: Network Uses Phony Documents ...
Three years later, RatherBiased.com caught CBS News doing it again with a number of women on .... Organized propaganda by Students for Kerry, CBS’ story… ...
http://www.rathergate.com/?p=257

Another WND Retraction
This is the second article WND was forced to retract in the past two months; in April, WND printed a false story about a purported TV movie production of ...
http://conwebwatch.tripod.com/stories/2005/wndretract.html

3. No the Military doesn't lie to Civilians, you forget that it is the Military and it operates under a different set of Laws that were set up by the Congress of the United States.

Most nations have a separate code of law which regulates both certain activities allowed only in war, as well as provides a code of law applicable only to a soldier in war (or 'in uniform' during peacetime).

For example, in the United States, the statutory laws set down by Congress to apply to the individual conduct within any military force of the United States are known as the Uniform Code of Military Justice, ( U.C.M.J. ). The code includes specific articles under which a soldier or sailor would be tried for infractions ranging from minor (Late Return, petty theft) to severe (Rape, Murder) or with thing that are Classified, and have to be handled in a manner so as not to expose intelligence assets.

Now as to your demand to see the Video, there are even cases in civilian courts were the Video evidence isn't released to the News Agencies, to protect the innocent.

4. Because you are not part of the Trial Board or the Jury, and the situation seems to be resolving into the fact that a trial isn't needed, as to a second point, the video may involve national security capabilities that would damage intelligence gathering if the true capabilities were known in open publication, show me were in the Constitution that there is a right to know everything, even the Supreme Court has ruled that there are certain National Secrets that are not required to be exposed to the public, and weren't you one who was screaming about Scooter Libby outing a secret operative? well surveillance capabilities are just as secret and vital to National Security as keeping a operatives name a secret.

Actually under the Freedom of Information act, if a citizen asks to see the evidence, they are bound to release it.

Is that not right?

Actually under the Freedom of Information act, if a citizen asks to see the evidence, they are bound to release it.

Is that not right?

Not all the time. And when the documents are finally released, they tend to be edited.

- N

Had a good week end, I had a chance to talk to one of the People in My Civil War Reenactment Group, He is a Agent with the FBI, and he confirms that the police have equipment that can monitor and identify individuals inside a building, and that the Military has equipment that is far more sophisticated then the Law Enforcement Agencies, he indicated that is was very possible for the UAV's surveillance equipment to have been able to show what was taking place inside the houses.

Everyone ignore the 800 lb gorilla (aka the girl) in the room

Everyone ignore the 800 lb gorilla (aka the girl) in the room

And the 800lb. gorilla's story doesn't match the recorded evidence, the 100,000 lb, Video of what actually took place is what counts, I would love it if they would release the tape, because S.A.M. would still find a way to discount it, as it is, the site has been investigated by Forensic Investigators, interviews have been made of any witness, time lines have been established, and the 100,000 lb. gorilla of the video tape has tied it all together, and there is no evidence to support the charges.

And there is still the 800 lb. gorilla of the fact that the Girl in alive, why if they were is a killing frenzy, and the girl is standing right their in plain sight is she still alive? the fire fight wasn't over yet, the fight continued on for quite a time, it is still the biggest piece of evidence that there was no massacre that the Girl was alive when the Marines left that house, and continued the mission, until the fire fight was over.

http://www.liberallyconservative.com/?p=1966

Retractions and Corrections

Sunday, Mar. 19, 2006 By Tim McGirk - Baghdad

In the original version of this story, TIME reported that “a day after the incident, a Haditha journalism student videotaped the scene at the local morgue and at the homes where the killings had occurred. The video was obtained by the Hammurabi Human Rights Group, which cooperates with the internationally respected Human Rights Watch, and has been shared with TIME.” In fact, Human Rights Watch has no ties or association with the Hammurabi Human Rights Group. TIME regrets the error.

Time had originally reported that it was Human Rights Watch who had provided the tape. They then retracted that and claimed that it came from Hammurabi, which works with Human Rights Watch. They have since backed off that claim.

Time still does not correct the intentionally false portrayal of the source of the videotape that they gave in all of their original stories and interviews. Time’s source, Thaer Thabit al-Hadithi, is not a “young man” nor is he a “budding journalism student.”

Al-Haditha is not separate and apart from the Hammurabi Human Rights Group nor is he a man who wanted to remain anonymous because he feared for his safety.

Al-Haditha is 43 years old and is one of Hammurabi’s only two members serving as its “Secretary General” while the only other member, Abdul-Rahman al-Mashhadani, performs as its “Chairman.”


Accuracy in reporting is necessary and sources must be credible. Because of false reporting at Time Magazine and editorializing at The New York Times and many other news outlets the Marine may not receive a fair trial, they have already been condemned and found guilty by the press.

Eighty-four years after it’s first magazine the founders would not be proud.

1. If it is like the Abu Ghraib situation, the Military was already looking into the Matters, just because it don't match the news medias or your time schedule has little to do with it.
Here's a simple, unbiased timeline of Abu Ghraib: http://www.scvhistory.com/scvhistory/signal/iraq/abughraib-timeline.htm

Notice that Amnesty International and the Red Cross, as well as the lefty press, had been making noise about prisoner abuse at Abu Ghraib clear back in the fall of 2003 - even before the worst of the photographed abuses. The circumstances of the prison were known to Geoffrey Miller - who recommended them - and quite a few other military officials at that time, as well as all the interrogators and doctors and contractors and so forth.

But the military denied the allegations of prisoner abuse, lied to the press, misled the Red Cross, and closed the investigations into the "fitness" of the 800th, in '03.

It was the discovery that there were photos, and that these photos had spread widely on computers and were not under control, that launched the damage control investigation. That was on January 14th, '04, several months after the Red Cross and Amnesty International and the lefty press had been blown off with lies, long after the lefty press had begun running articles about prisoner abuse in Iraq and Afghanistan and Gitmo.

The military is lying to this day about Abu Ghraib, claiming that the blame rests with rogue soldiers, the incidents were isolated, and that the higher command, contractors, unphotographed soldiers, etc. ahve all been investigated. None of that is true. Instead, the military has persecuted those who disclosed the crimes. Taguba's career was ruined, even by his toned down and carefully circumscribed report from his limited powers of investigation. Joseph Darby was deliberately outed by Donald Rumsfeld in a press conference, and AFAIK is still in a witness protection program, hiding for his own safety.

And similarly with the WP and napalm use in Iraq, the interrogation procedures at Gitmo, the friendly fire killing of Tillman, the circumstances of the abuses at Bagram, the checkpoint killings in Iraq, and so forth and so on.

The official military lies to civilians.
Now as to your demand to see the Video, there are even cases in civilian courts were the Video evidence isn't released to the News Agencies, to protect the innocent. OK. But let's have at least a description of the exonerating circumstances revealed in that video, with some independent verification of the content. Because it would be completely irresponsible of us to just take a military official's word that such a video exists, and that it completely exonerates soldiers who have admitted some guilt and been implicated in more by eyewitnesses and other circumstance.

iceaura

Here's a simple, unbiased timeline of Abu Ghraib: http://www.scvhistory.com/scvhistory...b-timeline.htm

Notice that Amnesty International and the Red Cross, as well as the lefty press, had been making noise about prisoner abuse at Abu Ghraib clear back in the fall of 2003 - even before the worst of the photographed abuses. The circumstances of the prison were known to Geoffrey Miller - who recommended them - and quite a few other military officials at that time, as well as all the interrogators and doctors and contractors and so forth.

And this is the fall of 2003, your own post shows that Maj. Gen. Ryder was in the process of investigating the conditions at Abu Ghrib, and again you have just shown that you want a Lynching, instead of a Trial, it take good documentation to get a Conviction, and that is what happened, step by step the investigators built the case, and with the evidence, the Course of Justice was followed and served.

From your own post;

Oct. 13-Nov. 6: Maj. Gen. Donald Ryder, provost marshal of the Army, investigates conditions of U.S.-run prisons in Iraq, including Abu Ghraib. He finds problems throughout the prisons.