Former Nazi charged w/ 29K counts of murder

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29633400/

My personal thoughts on this is that this is rediculous.

The man is 88 years old for christ sake, he really doesn't have all that much time left to live. Leave him alone. He didn't exactly do kindest things in the world, but you can tell he has left it in his past and is trying to live his life. Why can't other's leave it in the past as well.

I think they should have some kind of time limit on this crap.

 

Log in or Sign up to hide all adverts.

I don't exactly disagree with your sentiments, but where do you draw the line? Can we, as a modern civilization built upon laws, allow a murderer to go free just because he stayed in hiding long enough? That doesn't sound right, either, does it?

Baron Max

 

Log in or Sign up to hide all adverts.

I don't think 'hiding' is the best word to describe his condition. I think, more or less, he is simply getting by, not necessarily avoiding anything.

I see things from a very neutral point of view in this case. Having been in the military myself, and having done some things that I'm not exactly happy with, I understand that I was just doing my job. And thats what this guy was doing 60+ years ago, just doing his job. I really don't think that individuals should be punished like this. Go after the ones that made the decisions to put him in that position, the ones that ordered him to kill.

 

Log in or Sign up to hide all adverts.

On that part of the issue, I think I'm in more or less agreement. I will, however, state that the individual soldiers do have a responsibility above and beyond that of "...just obeying orders" ideal. So that would also be a case that should go before a judge and jury ...all legal and above board.

I agree with your sentiments, but sentiments are difficult to justify in a court of law or in writing laws.

Baron Max

 

My question is that they accused Him once and were absolutely wrong, and cost him 7 years of His life, so now they come up with another camp and accusation?

Time to let Mr. Demjanjuk, alone, this look exactly like what it is, a witch hunt.

 

Agree'd.

 

Depends on what he thinks he did was right or not.

At some point you have to decide if you want to follow orders no matter what they are.

 

This isn't the first time he's been accused.

He may not even have 7 more years. If proving he killed 29,000 people is a difficult task, or that he was there at all...then it's unlikely he's a monster.

 

I wonder? when this falls appart, and if Mr. Demjanjuk is still alive, will they fall back to another charge, at another camp?

They were absolutly sure on the first charge, and they had 7 years to investigate, and then they cleared Mr. Demjanjuk, so now after all that they charge Him again?

Yah, sure.

 

That fucking murderer got to live a full and long life, and so he reached the ripe age of 88 without paying a dime for his crimes, so now he looks like a frail harmless old man that evokes pity from people who are from a completely different generation and for whom the crimes he has committed are now irrelevant and are just some shit they learned in history class, whatever they remember from it.

He deserves the most severe of punishments. I hope he rots in hell.

 

There are plenty of Israelis from Deir Yassin who went on in a similar way. Its all about perception.

 

Did you even read the damn article? He spent years in prison. And I wouldn't say his life has been easy. There are a number of countries who will not allow him to live within their borders. On top of that, he's been extradited so many times because of this.

I don't sympathize with him because he is old. I sympathize with him because he made a mistake, if infact it's even him, and that he has done nothing but try to move on a live a descent life and leave the past in the past.

Fact is we all do shit we're not proud of. How about you get thrown in jail for a mistake that was made 60 years ago, a mistake that you regret and that you've learned from.

Chances are the guy is barely getting by as it is, he's a freakin auto mechanic for christ sake. Leave the poor, old guy alone. I'm sure he's been through enough bullshit to make up for whatever mistakes that may have been committed, again, if infact it's even the right guy.

Doesn't this world have more important things to do then to spend money and time worrying about shit that happened that long ago?

Your attitude is that same kind of crap that so many African Americans throw around today regarding slavery. Shit happens. People make mistakes. They move on as the rest of the world does. So move on too or get left behind.

And if were going to go out of our way to prosecute this guy, why not prosecute everyone that killed the 100 MILLION Russians in WWII? Prosecute the Russians for raping thousands of German women IN ONE NIGHT when they arrived in Germany. Or prosecute everyone involved in the American Civil War? Or hell, lets go back even further and prosecute all the Brits that killed American Colonists? Fuck it, lets prosecute all American soldiers for killing people in Iraq, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, Vietnam, Korea, Japan, Haiti, Mexico, Spain, Native American tribes, African Americans, and every other possible war we've been in.

Shit happens. Move on.

 

You're right, I did not read the article. I am assuming he is guilty of what he's been accused of doing. (And if in his case the allegations are false, then what I say applies to those 88 year olds in whose cases the allegations are true.)

Not being allowed to some countries is not punishment.
Him being a "poor" mechanic is not punishment or redemption.
What he's done is not "just some mistake 60 years ago." It's the murder of tens of thousands of people. Some mistake, huh.

Where it is feasible, where post-war agreements did not cover these criminals (i.e. we won't prosecute yours, and you won't prosecute ours), and where the accused are STILL ALIVE, go right ahead and prosecute until all these fucks are brought to justice. By the way, Soviet casualties were less than a quarter of what you said (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties#Casualties_by_country).

You don't have a single functioning brain cell do you. American Civil War? These people have all been dead for a very long time. Who the hell are you going to prosecute?

Move on? MOVE ON???

Who the fuck are you to tell people to move on? I have relatives who have fought and were maimed in WW2 - some are still alive. I have friends whose relatives are survivors of Nazi camps - some are still alive. I have relatives who are STILL traumatized by the suffering that the Nazis had made them endure - personal traumas. THE VICTIMS ARE STILL ALIVE you ignorant dolt. You got people suing and winning millions of dollars from McDonalds for not putting "coffee is hot" warning on a mug in frivolous lawsuits, and yet you're telling me to MOVE ON re: this adorable grampa's murder of over twenty thousand human beings?

Fuck you.

 

Ironic.

 

1) Calm down.

2) Reported.

3) You act as if I don't have relatives that are still alive and that both served and observed and were affected by the war.

4) How does his actions affect us today as a whole? Nada, zilch, zip. The consequences of his actions are carried on by a VERY small number of people, most of which will be dead within a matter of a few years anyway, AS WILL HE. It's done, over with, etc. Let the man die. Nobody even knows if its the right guy or not!

 

Nice logic, idiot. Why don't I go find myself a lonely old granny with no living relatives and murder her. No one will miss her, and no one will be affected. That way I won't have to go to jail!

 

What? That has nothing to do with anything in this thread. Where did that come from? What are you even referring to? :bugeye:

Jesus, do I have to spell it out for you?

I T I S U S E L E S S T O P R O S E C U T E S O M E O N E F O R A C R I M E W H I C H H A S N O R E L E V E N C E T O D A Y, E S P E C I A L L Y S I N C E I T H A P P E N E D S O L O N G A G O.

If he is even guilty they should have thrown him in jail 60 years ago when it would have mattered to him and the victims. What the hell is the point of throwing him in jail now? What good is it going to do for anyone? If the remaining victims were affected by his crime, surely they've moved on by now and that throwing this guy in prison won't affect the victims current condition one lick. They've already moved on, lived their lives as he, and everyone else in this world has. The guy will spend a year or two in prison then probably die. Really, why are we even wasting time with this guy?

 

You can do many studies on why we put people in jail, and what we try to get out of it, and you'll still be looking for answers. There are a few commonly accepted reasons. One is rehabilitation, another is to isolate the damaged portion of society from the healthy portion of society, and another reason is good ol' punishment, which is nothing but revenge. Eye for an eye, without having to gouge the eye out. I don't care about any rehabilitation. I want my revenge. I want him hanging off the edge of a rope.

BTW, it's not [just] "my" revenge. You, being young and very stupid, are probably not aware of millions of people still very deeply affected and traumatized by the crimes of criminal animals like ol' gramps here.

 

Young and stupid? Seems you are the ignorant one here, my friend. I was in Iraq in 2004 when we discovered the third largest mass grave/burial done by Hussein. You think I am unaware of the effects of crime? Try stumbling over a skull, and then having to unearth hundreds of decomposed bodies in the sand. And then deal with the anger and hostility of the families that are left over to deal with it. But I can guarantee you that in 60 years from now, it won't make a difference to them. They will always have the memory, but they won't look back with the same hostility that they had immediately. Shit fades with time. Always has, always will.

PS. Dude, you're two years older than me. LOL!

 

So you have irrefutable proof that Mr. Demjanjuk is guilty of the crime?

Please post it.

They already have once proven wrong in their accusation, and cost the man 7 years of his life, whats to say that they are now right?

Remember, Innocent Until Proven Guilty.

ps: I have realitive, who fought, died and were wounded in WWII, and what they fought for was the rights of Men to be Not Guilty, until Proven by Evidence to Be So.

The Evidence so far show that they accused the wrong Man, and are just going for the "Do Over"
which usually can be described as the "Fuck Over" BOHICA