so ahh
i scarf down my bagel with animalistic hunger and was struck by the notion that any frikkin meal, ritualized beyond the essentials, is a stinking food fetish.

My tastes buds and olfactory glands disagree. They are hardly impressed by rituals, but ooH. I had this Thai Curry the other night. Divine.

Eating is one of our most primitive activities. It goes deep down into our brains. Remember on top of that that we're pack-social animals by instinct so we get extra enjoyment out of sharing our "kill" with the people close to us.

I suggest you post the best items you had in a specific place.

Like: Best Gyro - North Salt Lake City, Utah
Best Lobster - Bookbinders Original, Philadelphia, USA
Best Goulash - Midland Texas
Best Sugar Cookie - Amsterdam
Best spicy candy - London, UK
Best crab dinner - Hungry Tiger, Phoenix, Arizona
Best Peking Duck - Beijing, China

etc....

...Remember on top of that that we're pack-social animals by instinct so we get extra enjoyment out of sharing our "kill" with the people close to us.

ja
pretty much what i was getting at. the standing on ceremony, the ritual. the etiquette. for instance... elaborate tea cermonies as fetishized by the japanese.

anymore come to mind?
a food fetish is not just associated with sex.
it is a everyday occurrence

ja
pretty much what i was getting at. the standing on ceremony, the ritual. the etiquette. for instance... elaborate tea cermonies as fetishized by the japanese.

anymore come to mind?
a food fetish is not just associated with sex.
it is a everyday occurrence

Ah, now I understand. I like the getting together part, that does not seem fetishistic to me. But anything that is trying to make me seem better than other people or animals or requires looking serious or involve pinkies having specific placements I would consider part of an obsessive compulsive disorder, however endemic.

Fresh oysters,
exaggerated lip smacking prior.
exaggerated groans of pleasure during and after.
Hedonism not fetishism.

Fresh oysters,
exaggerated lip smacking prior.
exaggerated groans of pleasure during and after.
Hedonism not fetishism.

I think if the groans are exaggerated it's fetishism, but I stand behind this part of your personality much as a love Gustav.

Ah, now I understand. I like the getting together part, that does not seem fetishistic to me. But anything that is trying to make me seem better than other people or animals or requires looking serious or involve pinkies having specific placements I would consider part of an obsessive compulsive disorder, however endemic.When you're a pack-social species one of the instincts that comes with that is social hierarchy. You have alphas and alpha-wannabes, etc. You also have some packs being dominant over others. Elaborate formalities are a way of identifying yourself as a member of the dominant pack.

Herd-social animals have very little hierarchical behavior because herd-mates are anonymous. As mankind slowly evolves from pack-social to herd-social, in our cities teeming with millions of anonymous neighbors, we're losing a lot of those formalities.

When you're a pack-social species one of the instincts that comes with that is social hierarchy. You have alphas and alpha-wannabes, etc. You also have some packs being dominant over others. Elaborate formalities are a way of identifying yourself as a member of the dominant pack.

Herd-social animals have very little hierarchical behavior because herd-mates are anonymous. As mankind slowly evolves from pack-social to herd-social, in our cities teeming with millions of anonymous neighbors, we're losing a lot of those formalities.

Interesting, thanks. Just started reading a book on the evolution of dogs. Let you know if it fits this thread in some way.

However. There's is something I find rather offensive about the human version of what you are calling pack-social behavior. It is often a denial of itself. Being refined, rather that snarling and someone one considers lower down in dominance. A group of wolves, it seems to me, is relatively honest and unpretentious about their dominance behavior. The human version seems to me to have been an effort to deny the animal in us and be better than those who are more crude.

As I write this I realize that I am reacting to upper class based behaviors, rather than say the way frat boys assert dominance over each other. I dislike both, but I prefer the latter since it is honest and direct. It is what it is.

Herd-social animals have very little hierarchical behavior because herd-mates are anonymous. As mankind slowly evolves from pack-social to herd-social, in our cities teeming with millions of anonymous neighbors, we're losing a lot of those formalities.

I would not say we "evolve from pack-social to herd-social". Rather, every one of us is pack-social within a fairly small group (often, within several groups that may or may not overlap), and herd-social with everybody else.

If you know their name and they know yours, it's a pack. If not, it's a herd.

It's the same with war. Preparation for war is a fetish.

best prime rib w/ yorkshire pudding - Great Lakes Shipping (Kalamzazoo MI)

and that's about all that sticks out. I think it was the yorkshire because you don't see it that often around here.

1 a: an object (as a small stone carving of an animal) believed to have magical power to protect or aid its owner; broadly : a material object regarded with superstitious or extravagant trust or reverence b: an object of irrational reverence or obsessive devotion : prepossession c: an object or bodily part whose real or fantasied presence is psychologically necessary for sexual gratification and that is an object of fixation to the extent that it may interfere with complete sexual expression
2: a rite or cult of fetish worshipers
3: fixation

Well, I can't speak for anyone else, but if I don't eat on a more or less regular basis, I don't do as well. I've heard it rumored I might even starve to death. It has always been taught to me 'eating' has survival value.

I also find eating to be pleasurable on several levels. The flavor and texture of some foods are sensually pleasurable without involving any sexual element. Sharing a meal with a friend is also pleasurable without involving a sexual element.

I suppose it may be so for some, but I cannot catagorize my eating - even the pleasurable facet - as a fetish in the dictionary sense.

Perhaps one might consider a better fitting word or admit to this being a personal problem.

I would not say we "evolve from pack-social to herd-social". Rather, every one of us is pack-social within a fairly small group (often, within several groups that may or may not overlap), and herd-social with everybody else. If you know their name and they know yours, it's a pack. If not, it's a herd.Well I didn't go very far into that on this thread; there's much more to it than that. Pack-social animals are wary or downright hostile to other packs because they see them as competitors for territory. So there is always the spectre of potential violence and often actual violence between packs as their territories expand toward each other. Add to that the internal violence among the alphas that comes with the hierarchical structure of a pack... well maybe now you see why I say we simply have to evolve out of that!

In America (and certainly other places) we're heading toward the reverse of what you say, which gets us the worst of both worlds. We treat our neighbors and colleagues like anonymous herd-mates, missing out on the joys of companionship. While at the same time we treat the people a few hundred miles away like a competing pack that must be dominated by intimidation or actual force, missing out on the relative tranquility of herd life!

It's the same with war. Preparation for war is a fetish.

This is similar to the food rituals of the rich. With food the idea is to emphasize how unanimalike the rich are. With war you want to add honor, tradition, bravery etc. to the mythos, so people don't get overwhelmed but the simple fact that it is killing strangers.

perhaps we can return "fetish" to its conventional connotation. the usage was mostly tongue in cheek and whatnot

my gripe is obviously most suited for the proposition presented by this....

This is similar to the food rituals of the rich. With food the idea is to emphasize how unanimalike the rich are.


social divisions into classes and modes of behaviour

ps: i was gonna offer victorian england but bewigged and urchin were both unwashed and lice infested

/cackle

perhaps we can return "fetish" to its conventional connotation. the usage was mostly tongue in cheek and whatnot

my gripe is obviously most suited for the proposition presented by this....




social divisions into classes and modes of behaviour

ps: i was gonna offer victorian england but bewigged and urchin were both unwashed and lice infested

/cackle

Well, let's broaden the bitching again. What is the fetish with ties? Oh, let's tighten fabric around our throats. The whole male 'professional' outfit - office, management especially. I mean mashochism - albeit mild - control, anal retentiveness, and the tiniest wiggle room for 'self-expression':

each of the dots is actually a Harley

....admit to this being a personal problem.

alright
since you insist

i have a serious and debilitating animus towards cutlery

there
happy?

perhaps a saving grace....

as of late, i have noticed a softening of attitude toward chopsticks

...?

garcon!
gustav is the name
chopsticks, por far fucking vor!
wood not plastic

Nothing beats a quick trip to.... CHUCK'O'Rama!

best food is:

roast chicken, roast potatoes, yorkshires, jullienne carrots, peas, gravy

desert:

home made apple pie, with fresh whipped cream, or ice cream

garcon!
gustav is the name
chopsticks, por far fucking vor!
wood not plastic

Yesss! nice form!

alright
since you insist

i have a serious and debilitating animus towards cutlery



There is nothing wrong with a midsized spoon. And a knife seems like a useful tool. Spaghetti is nicer with a fork and I have tried it the other way more than most humans. But there should be no rules. And I think the spoon is underused. I see a good spoon with a sharp edge as a 75% er. Unless you've got a steak in front of you or the aforementioned pasta, the other tools are suplus, and fetishistic.

A nice wooden or ceramic bowl and you can throw out all the other china, plates, etc. Low maintenance. Short clean up time.

A wok and you are set.

Fine dining:Eating sushi right at the sushi bar, with the chef performing for you. Eating dim sum from the carts. Almost anything my wife makes, but especially her pizza and her chocolate truffles.

I think post meal belches are de rigeur.
Hiccups are not rude, but a sign of hurry or over spicing.

Elbows on the table are a must for corn on the cob, lobster, and one elbow a nice support for many a meal.

Why are tables so low?

Are we afraid of looking like children?

so ahh
i scarf down my bagel with animalistic hunger and was struck by the notion that any frikkin meal, ritualized beyond the essentials, is a stinking food fetish.

Yeah. Yeah it is.

so ahh
i scarf down my bagel with animalistic hunger and was struck by the notion that any frikkin meal, ritualized beyond the essentials, is a stinking food fetish.

You are clearly lacking in social graces. It's no news day, again.

I think post meal belches are de rigeur.That goes in and out of fashion. But generally it's a symptom of eating too quickly and swallowing a lot of air.Hiccups are not rude, but a sign of hurry or over spicing.One of the things a hiccup does is generate strong downward pressure in the esophagus. It can augment peristalsis to help clear food that is stuck or passing too slowly. There's also a hypothesis that it's an evolutionary relic of the amphibian breathing reflex, since during fetal development it forms long before the mammalian breathing physiology.Elbows on the table are a must for corn on the cob, lobster, and one elbow a nice support for many a meal. Why are tables so low?You're the first person I've ever heard complain about the standard height of dining tables. If they were any higher you wouldn't be able to rest your elbows comfortably :) It seems to me that they're at a level that puts your forearm at a comfortable angle. If they were higher you might get carpal tunnel syndrome from eating. :)