View Full Version : Feral children


iam
01-05-07, 10:03 AM
I always was fascinated by feral children being raised by wolves, bears, dogs, gazelle, ostrich, monkeys etc etc. I think its interesting why they would adopt a human child in the first place. In many cases it is evident they also know compassion not just from loss of their own cub or maternal/paternal instinct. But then that instinct can be considered compassion.

They don't recover and remain mentally on a retarded level. It proves how much our environment shapes us.

http://www.feralchildren.com/en/children.php?tp=0

on second thought,i think this should be moved to human science.

IslandofParadise
01-05-07, 10:57 AM
I always was fascinated by feral children being raised by wolves, bears, dogs, gazelle, ostrich, monkeys etc etc. I think its interesting why they would adopt a human child in the first place. In many cases it is evident they also know compassion not just from loss of their own cub or maternal/paternal instinct. But then that instinct can be considered compassion.

They don't recover and remain mentally on a retarded level. It proves how much our environment shapes us.



on second thought,i think this should be moved to human science. Well if its the right animal ts possible. But isn't this thread pseudo fictional. I mean when was the last time an animal adopted a malawan baby?

G. F. Schleebenhorst
01-05-07, 11:20 AM
What's more interesting is how feral children physically develop without society and in the wild. It shows us partially how humans used to be before widespread civilisation. Feral children although deformed by having never learned to walk and having tendons too short on their leg joints to stand upright, can jump six feet in the air and run naked in the snow without any ill effects or apparent discomfort. They can also smell raw meat from across a huge outdoor space.

Baron Max
01-05-07, 06:46 PM
I always was fascinated by feral children being raised by wolves, bears, dogs, gazelle, ostrich, monkeys etc etc. I think its interesting why they would adopt a human child in the first place.

Even if they did adopt a human baby, few animals in the world are equipped to raise a human child. Animals mature in months, humans take forever to mature. Few animals would have the patience to put up with and care for a human child for very long.

Baron Max

Baron Max
01-05-07, 06:48 PM
Feral children although deformed by having never learned to walk and having tendons too short on their leg joints to stand upright, can jump six feet in the air and run naked in the snow without any ill effects or apparent discomfort.

Where did you get that kind of info? I've never heard of such happenings, even with some actual feral children that I've read about. Never learn to walk? Hmm? Please provide some info on that, if you would.

Baron Max

Search & Destroy
01-05-07, 07:39 PM
Baron Max, I too have heard those things

Although I think they could all learn to walk at one point (maybe not I don't know, but walking on all 4 your whole life def. has impact on tendon/joint/bone etc. development) some were still more comfortable going two legged. Some were even faster than most two legged runners on 4. Alot are good climbers and very agile - which is quite understandable...

I've also heard they're more resistant to certain environments that they grew up in. I'm not sure if that's true, but it's not out of the realm of possibility at all.

And if a kid grew up eating only raw meat, I'm sure they would adapt to a better sense of smell towards it than a normal omnivore human.

Those claims aren't too outlandish. But there are a lot of myths surrounding the feral guys, for obvious reasons.

Ayodhya
01-05-07, 07:42 PM
So the story of Romulus and Remus could be true!

Baron Max
01-05-07, 08:27 PM
Baron Max, I too have heard those things

Well, I also heard that Santa Claus lives at the North Pole, but...?

I really would like a bit more of an authoritative article on the subject.

For one thing, the idea that a kid could or would grow up and not begin to walk on two legs is pretty damned farfetched for me to believe. If you've ever tried walking on all fours, then you know damned well that it's not only terribly difficult, but one can't even see very well!

Baron Max

Baron Max
01-05-07, 08:29 PM
The last feral child that i've ever heard about was one in France a few years ago ...maybe longer(?). But he walked on two legs just like a human. He also was more or less "normal", tho' he couldn't talk or understand anything. But that's the only one that I've heard about except in fiction.

Baron Max

John Connellan
01-07-07, 02:27 PM
But he walked on two legs just like a human.

Just like a human? :rolleyes:

spuriousmonkey
01-07-07, 03:41 PM
or like a chicken.

Bells
01-07-07, 05:03 PM
The last feral child that i've ever heard about was one in France a few years ago ...maybe longer(?). But he walked on two legs just like a human. He also was more or less "normal", tho' he couldn't talk or understand anything. But that's the only one that I've heard about except in fiction.

Baron Max
There was a girl by the name of Oxana Malaya (sp?), from the Ukraine, who spent most of her formative years with the dogs in her yard. She lived in the kennel from the ages of about 3 to 8 (or so) with the dogs. Her parents were both alcoholics and basically neglected her. As a result, when she was discovered in 1991 (I think), she walked on all fours and immitated a lot of the noises the dogs made, as in she barked and growled. She apparently could barely speak when she was discovered because the years when language is formed in a child's brain was spent with dogs.

I remember watching a documentary about her a while ago.

RoyLennigan
01-08-07, 09:25 AM
They don't recover and remain mentally on a retarded level.

i always hate how arrogant we sound when we say things like this (no offense, i am). in this case, its not retardation. retardation would be an inability to increase cognitive ability when given the best (or most diverse) environments. in this case, the child doesn't "remain mentally on a retarded level" but rather is so imprinted with such a different personality and perspective, that the child would not want to change. if we were all presented with a wildly different lifestyle that was purported to be vastly better for us, the majority of us would just stay the same because we're used to it.

iam
01-08-07, 09:48 AM
i always hate how arrogant we sound when we say things like this (no offense, i am). in this case, its not retardation. retardation would be an inability to increase cognitive ability when given the best (or most diverse) environments. in this case, the child doesn't "remain mentally on a retarded level" but rather is so imprinted with such a different personality and perspective, that the child would not want to change. if we were all presented with a wildly different lifestyle that was purported to be vastly better for us, the majority of us would just stay the same because we're used to it.

You are right. It has a different view of the world due to its experiences and adapted to it. I was using retardation as a general reference.

I saw a documentary about a boy who was being taught to adjust to socalled civilized society. When he didn't perform or didn't understand he was scolded and he started to cry and you could tell how alone he felt. It was so sad. His sponsor observed he was so much happier being outside and being with nature and animals. He smiled, laughed and played, that was his home and where he felt most comfortable. His sponsor then understood he couldn't be anything else than who he was. Though we can deceive, he had no deception at all. He was just being honest.

Oniw17
01-08-07, 06:26 PM
OMFG! Feral children are real?!?!?!?!

Baron Max
01-08-07, 06:42 PM
There was a girl by the name of Oxana Malaya (sp?), from the Ukraine, who spent most of her formative years with the dogs in her yard. She lived in the kennel from the ages of about 3 to 8 (or so) with the dogs. ..., when she was discovered in 1991 (I think), she walked on all fours...

To 8 years old? Okay, maybe I'll buy that. But I don't think she'd have continued that into adulthood, it's just plain too hard on all of the joints in the human body to do that ...and that's in even counting the internal organs which are designed to function properly in an upright position.

Baron Max

Bells
01-08-07, 06:57 PM
To 8 years old? Okay, maybe I'll buy that. But I don't think she'd have continued that into adulthood, it's just plain too hard on all of the joints in the human body to do that ...and that's in even counting the internal organs which are designed to function properly in an upright position.

Baron Max

When I saw the documentary, she was living in a home for the mentally disabled I think and was walking upright. Her speech was quite stilted however and because she had lost the ability to learn to communicate with other human beings, it was as if she were severely autistic, but I am not sure if she actually is autistic. She just could not communicate well since she had missed out on learning those communication methods as a child. Was really sad and a sad reflection on just how some parents simply don't care.

I think at one point the parents went away and she just stayed there, not too sure. I do know her father had remarried and had other children and he'd brought his daughter from his new marriage to meet Oxana. The girl and her upbringing with the dogs was intriguing, but the underlying fact of the story was that she was neglected and the only care she received were from the dogs. So I guess she was feral in how she was brought up through her childhood, but she was not found wandering the woods as some other feral children you hear about. Her 'feralness' came about out of neglect from her parents.

Baron Max
01-08-07, 07:21 PM
..., but the underlying fact of the story was that she was neglected and the only care she received were from the dogs.

I'd bet that she loved dogs and animals almost as much as me, huh?

But humans took her away from the very source of love and care that she'd ever known, and put her in a fuckin' home for crazy people, huh? ...where there ain't no love and only minimal care (mostly from people who don't care!). Ain't we a nice bunch of creatures?

Baron Max

Bells
01-08-07, 07:55 PM
I'd bet that she loved dogs and animals almost as much as me, huh?

But humans took her away from the very source of love and care that she'd ever known, and put her in a fuckin' home for crazy people, huh? ...where there ain't no love and only minimal care (mostly from people who don't care!). Ain't we a nice bunch of creatures?

Baron Max
Well she does still have contact with animals at the clinic.


In 2006 at the age of 23, Oxana Malaya still resides at a home for the mentally handicapped, the Baraboy Clinic in Odessa, where she helps look after the cows in the Clinic's farm.
Link (http://www.feralchildren.com/en/showchild.php?ch=oxana)




23-year-old Oxana Malaya from a village in Ukraine is a feral child, one of only about 100 known in the world. When she was three, her alcoholic parents left her outside one night and she crawled into a hovel where they kept dogs. No one came to look for her or even seemed to notice she was gone, so she stayed where there was warmth and food.

Five years later, a neighbor reported a child living with animals. When she was found, at the age of eight in 1991, Oxana could hardly speak and ran around on all fours barking.

Judging from the complete lack of documentation about her physical and psychological state when found, the authorities didn’t want to record her case — neglect on this scale was too shameful to acknowledge — even though it has been of huge and continuing interest to psychologists who believe feral children can help resolve the nature-nurture debate.

-------------------------------------------------------

After a series of cognitive tests, Ms. Fry concluded that Miss Malaya had the mental capacity of a six-year-old and a dangerously low boredom threshold. She can count but not add up. She cannot read or spell her name correctly.

Experts agree that unless a child learns to speak by the age of five, the brain misses its chance to acquire language, a defining characteristic of being human. Miss Malaya was able to learn to talk again because she had some childish speech before she was abandoned. At an orphanage school, they taught her to walk upright, to eat with her hands and, what was most crucial, to talk.

Now, although she knows it is socially unacceptable to bark, she certainly can.

--------------------------------------------------

Currently, Oxana seems to be happy looking after cows at the Baraboy Clinic’s insalubrious farm, outside Odessa.
Link (http://www.mosnews.com/news/2006/07/20/feralchild.shtml)


That poor girl is a sad reality of the failures of some human beings.

spuriousmonkey
01-09-07, 02:47 AM
I've been reading through the feral children reports a bit and two things struck me as interesting.

1. feral children do not learn to smile.

2. Feral children raised by dogs learn to be dogs. Dogs raised by humans never learn to be humans. This simple fact shows the enormous capabillity to soak up and learn by humans. We are not a blank slate, but our development is categorized by the enormous potential to learn and to adapt. This point is comes forward in the problem feral children have to learn to speak if they never did so at an early age. It virtually becomes impossible to get back on the right track after a certain age.

Bells
01-09-07, 05:07 AM
The interesting thing with Oxana is that she had the beginings of rudimentary language or the basics if you will when she had begun to live with the dogs. So they were able to teach her how to speak. I guess if the child is with the animals or outside of human communication and contact before the basics are learnt by the child, then nothing can be done.

The learn to smile thing is also really interesting. I wonder if the same could be said of babies who grow up with parents who never smile at them or communicate with them?