Ok, i know this sounds stupid, but please bear with me :

can someone explicitly explain differences between the following (define them individually please and try to explain them in truest form possible)...

1.)Rock music
2.)Progressive Rock
3.)Psychedelic Rock
4.)Soft Rock
5.)Rock' n' Roll
5.) Hard Rock
6.) Grunge
7.)Metal
8.)Heavy Metal
9.)hard than Heavy metal (death gothic etc.)

thanks.
Rick

Wow! people know their Rock music here :D

Ok, i know this sounds stupid, but please bear with me :

can someone explicitly explain differences between the following (define them individually please and try to explain them in truest form possible)...

1.)Rock music Banging 2 rocks together

2.)Progressive Rock banging 3 rocks together as you juggle them

3.)Psychedelic Rock rock painting while high on shrooms

4.)Soft Rock this is a misnomer; it's not actually a rock, more like a hard cushion

5.)Rock' n' Rolla piece of fish in a breadroll

5.) Hard Rock granite, or a piece of candy that you can buy at seaside resorts in England, the most famous of which, is Brighton Rock; damn' it's hard

6.) Grunge the stuff you find between your toes when you haven't washed your feet for a week or 2

7.)Metal stainless steel or Titanium if you want to be flash

8.)Heavy Metal lead

9.)hard than Heavy metal (death gothic etc.) lead dropped from a great height

thanks.
Rick

The author is not responsible for the authenticity of these explanations

Very funny, tablariddim!

I listen to all kinds of rock music, but I can't determine what characterizes each genre. I can name artists from each one, though.

Go to www.wikipedia.org and search for any of these and it will give you a detailed explanation.

1.) Rock music: A type of jazz originally called Rock and Roll which evolved in the early 1950s from bebop, blues, and country & western music. It is generally composed as popular songs and characterized by a prominent, steady, heavily syncopated rhythm with a powerful backbeat; a blues modality; guitar, drums, and bass instrumentation; loud singing and overall high volume; and lyrics about rebellion and other topics often calculated to offend non-fans. As rock music has become the dominant form of jazz and, in much of the world, the dominant style of music, it has grown under the direction of its own spirit and many other influences so that fifty years after its debut much of it would be unrecognizable to its early performers and fans. The only element that is still universal is the backbeat (stress on the second and fourth beats of each measure). For examples of the original rock music, listen to Little Richard, Elvis Presley, and Chuck Berry.

2.) Progressive Rock: A type of rock music developed in the very late 1960s to mid 1970s, primarily in the U.K., that expanded the form with classical influences, longer songs with intricate dynamics, non-traditional instruments and synthesized sounds. Many songs had movements, some of which dropped the essentials such as the backbeat and the blues modality. Examples: Yes, Genesis.

3.) Psychedelic Rock: Also known as Acid Rock, a type of rock music developed in California and the U.K. in the mid 1960s to mid 1970s (the era called in retrospect, inaccurately, "the Sixties"), which added Middle Eastern modalities and instruments such as the sitar, long improvised sections, abstract or even nonsensical lyrics, and other motifs which were said to appeal to listeners who took drugs, to enhance the drug experience, to be more accessible during a drug experience, or to encourage drug use. Examples: Jefferson Airplane, Jimi Hendrix.

4.) Soft Rock: Rock music stripped of its harsher attributes such as loudness, driving rhythms, and rebellious themes. The term was coined in the 1970s by radio stations trying to appeal to listeners in their thirties and has since fallen largely into disuse.Examples: James Taylor, Carly Simon.

5.) Rock' n' Roll: The original name of Rock music, also spelled Rock and Roll.

6.) Hard Rock: Rock music with the original harshness intact. The term was coined in the 1970s to contrast with "soft rock," but it is still in use for music thought to embrace the original spirit of rock and roll. Examples: Ozzy Osbourne, Korn.

7.) Grunge: A type of rock music developed in the 1990s in Seattle. It does not stand out today as more than an interesting variety of harder-edged rock. At the time it was touted as a reaction to some of the softer, keyboard-dominated rock that was prominent in the 1980s, with its gruff-sounding vocalists and its return to lyrics of rebellion and the basic guitar-drums-bass configuration. Examples: Nirvana, Stone Temple Pilots.

8.) Heavy Metal (or just "Metal"): A type of rock music that arose in the very late 1960s, achieved its definition in the 1970s, and continued into the 1980s, using intricately syncopated repeating guitar figures, virtuoso guitar solos, distorted sounds, and lyrics often about depressing or shocking subjects. Examples: Black Sabbath, Metallica.

9.) Harder than Heavy Metal (death, gothic etc.). (I'm not as familiar with all of these. Their defining characteristics tend to be the lyrics rather than the instrumental music.) Examples (I think): Tool, Type O Negative.

Some important genres you omitted:

Rockabilly: With a name derived by combining "rock and roll" with "hillbilly", one of the prominent forms of early rock music, with a bebop twelve-beat instead of the eight-beat that has become almost universal. With a rhythm similar to the Western Swing rhythm that dominated Country & Western music during the 1950s and generally performed by American Southerners, rockabilly songs appealed to fans of both rock and country & western music. This unifying power of rock music was overlooked by older critics who decried its iconoclastic spirit. Examples: Bill Haley & the Comets, the Everly Brothers.

Folk Rock: Traditional folk music and folk-inspired original compositions in traditional styles became popular during the 1950s and reached their peak in the mid 1960s. Amid great controversy, folksingers and rock musicians came together and fused the two styles, peforming more-or-less traditionally inspired melodies with lyrics about contemporary social issues on amplified instruments backed by the ever-growing rock drum kit. Examples: Bob Dylan, Simon and Garfunkel.

Soul: The original unifying power of rock music began to dissipate in the mid 1960s. Black American musicians and audiences were drawn to a type of rock music that drew less from its country & western roots and added a strong influence from gospel music but directed that energy into songs about secular themes, prominently love and sex. Examples: Aretha Franklin, James Brown.

Southern Rock: Rock music influenced by the motifs of country music, with lyrics about life in the American South and its issues. One of the hallmarks of Southern Rock is the "twin guitar solo," actually a duet in harmony by two guitarists. Examples: the Allman Brothers, Lynyrd Skynyrd.

Funk: An intricately syncopated form of rock music using sixteenth-notes. Funk was originally a motif of soul music but has since become more widespread, most ironically in Southern Rock. Examples: Stevie Wonder, the Black-Eyed Peas.

Reggae: A type of rock music deliberately invented by Jamaican musicians in the 1960s to stop Jamaica from being identified with calypso, the music of Trinidad. It has a loping, doubly syncopated beat with lyrics that tend to speak of world peace and harmony, the Rastafarian faith, and the smoking of ganja. Examples: Bob Marley, Burning Spear.

Disco: Short for "discotheque," a type of dance club which arose in the late 1960s that played only recorded music. Disco music was a stripped-down form of soul-flavored rock music crafted in the early 1970s for dancing, with a steady beat almost devoid of syncopation and with a barely audible backbeat. The lyrics of disco songs tended to be about dancing and night life. Passionate rock fans regarded disco as a sign that rock was dead. Examples: The Bee Gees, the Village People

Punk: A type of rock music that arose in the mid 1970s, arguably largely as a reaction to disco, a shout that rock was not dead. It reverted to the roots of rock in instrumentation and attitude, and was often very simple with only three chords and no solos, as if the musicians were barely trained. The lyrics were generally about youth rebellion, although the genre also produced songs about deeper issues. Examples: The Sex Pistols, the Ramones.

New Wave: A type of rock music that arose in the late 1970s almost as an adjunct of Punk. However, New Wave music was extremely disciplined and often complex, relied on keyboard synthesizers, and its lyrics were often nonsensical. Examples: Devo, the B-52s.

Rap: A type of rock music developed in the late 1970s in which the vocals are not sung but spoken rhythmically, similar to the "talking blues" of an earlier era. Rap has a loud, prominent rhythm, but the instrumentation is often spare and often derived from "sampling" recorded music. The lyrics are often rebellious to the point of seeming to condone extremely antisocial or downright criminal behavior. Examples: Snoop Doggy Dogg, Eminem.

Hip-Hop: An offshoot of rap music with melodic interludes and less aggressive lyrics. Examples: MC Hammer, Linkin Park.

Techno-Funk: An evolution of New Wave in the early 1980s as the musicians became more skillful, adopting funk rhythms. Although Heavy Metal, Soft Rock, Soul, and many other types of rock music were popular in the 1980s, Techno-Funk was and is often regarded as the era's defining musical style. Examples: Duran Duran, Eurythmics.

Fusion: By the late 1960s, rock music had become well established, earned respect, and developed a substantial library of motifs and techniques. Jazz and rock musicians began to collaborate to rejoin this offspring of jazz to its parent genre. The resulting "fusion" typically incorporates the following elements of rock: instrumentation anchored by electric guitar, electric bass, and huge drum kit; longer compositions with complex harmonic structure and chord patterns; prominent, steady, danceable eight-beat rhythm with a strong backbeat; fade-out endings; and the following elements of traditional jazz: diverse instrumentation such as horns and woodwinds; modalities not primarily limited to blues; purely instrumental compositions. The term "fusion" is no longer in wide usage and this music is now often categorized simply as jazz.

Fraggle, I disagree with your definition of rap. It is not a type of rock music at all. And I wouldn't consider Linkin Park to be Hip-Hop. They are what most people consider "Nu-metal"

Also, to add to your definition of "Harder than Heavy Metal":
Regular heavy typically has clear chords, riffs, and guitar solos, all with some distortion on the guitars. Death metal on the other hand, has extremely distorted guitars, with simple chord progressions. Usually there is no guitar solo. It relies mostly on lyrics and rhythm. And the vocals of death metal are more of an angry growl/scream than singing. They are usually about death, hate, or other negative ideas. Examples: Cradle of Filth, Sepultura.

OK, I'm not going to quibble. I haven't kept track of Linkin Park too well since "In the End" reminded MTV that it's not impossible to still make good videos. I thought that song was clearly hip-hop: rap with a sung bridge, or vice versa. As an "old metalhead," to me "nu-metal" is Korn. I guess I just don't listen to death, black, goth, and the other hyphenated new forms of metal. I assumed that "Freaks of Nature" by Drain Sth with its lyrics about leeches, zombies, and necrophilia is a nicely done spoof of death metal and tried to imagine what the real stuff would be like. It doesn't sound like I was too far off, although their chord charts are more complex than you speak of and they have rather nice (all female) voices. It's amusing that your definition of death metal is pretty close to how parents would have described Black Sabbath in 1975, Judas Priest in 1980, or Metalllica in 1985. So Tool would simply have to be less talented musicians to qualify? ^_^

As for rap, it seems that its mention always stirs controversy. But I stick by my definition. If we can call rap music at all, and I believe that question has been settled at least on SciForums, then its roots are funk and funk is rock and roll. The only musical component left in pure rap is the rhythm, which is loud, steady, danceable, and intricately syncopated, has a prominent backbeat, and fades out at the end. That is a rock and roll rhythm and nothing else. Oh yeah, the iconoclastic lyrics are almost deliberately crafted to offend non-fans. That is also rock and roll!

Anyway, I hope I helped Zion get an A on his class paper. ^_^

If it is needed, I can offer my overview of the Industrial genre.

Please do.

some fuckwad:

"And the vocals of death metal are more of an angry growl/scream than singing. They are usually about death, hate, or other negative ideas. Examples: Cradle of Filth, Sepultura."

It's always good to use as examples of a genre things that aren't PART OF THAT FUCKING GENRE, retard.
Please go drown yourself in a public men's bathroom.

Could some of us opt for drowning in a WOMEN'S public bathroom instead?

Baron Max

Call Cradle of Filth death metal and you won't be given a choice.

I think rap is an offshoot of hip hop instead. Hip hop is described, by followers, as a culture. So that break dancing can be considered a part of hip hop, just like rap. In music terms, you might call rap the mainstream stuff you loathe so much and hip hop the underground stuff you never get to hear.

Sorry! Don't be so harsh! So I don't listen to death metal. Oh no! I should be killed for making a mistake. You know what, Xev? You've made mistakes in your life, too. How would you like it if I ridiculed and mocked you for one simple mistake?

I could respond with a big "FUCK YOU" but I'm too nice a person to do that. Instead, I'll give you some friendly advice. If you don't stop acting like a pompous ass, you're never going to make any friends. Calling someone a "fuckwad" for making a simple, harmless, mistake is no way to live.

When I disagree, I state it kindly, like this:
Fraggle, I disagree with your definition of rap. It is not a type of rock music at all. And I wouldn't consider Linkin Park to be Hip-Hop.
Notice I didn't tell him to kill himself. Nor did I call him a fuckwad.

Take a lesson from that, Xev.

If you just hate me because of my relatively low post count, then I suggest you go get a life.

I think rap is an offshoot of hip hop instead. Hip hop is described, by followers, as a culture. So that break dancing can be considered a part of hip hop, just like rap. In music terms, you might call rap the mainstream stuff you loathe so much and hip hop the underground stuff you never get to hear.Except that rap came first. The industry logs the first rap recording as one by Blondie in about 1977. Rap is street poetry. Kids had been rapping in the streets for at least five years before that.

Hip-hop is entertainment. More melody and harmony than rap (like any at all), lyrics about lighter stuff than rap. It took the exposure of music television for hip-hop to really come of age, in the early 1980s.

Parallel to American rap or perhaps as a precursor to it, were the West Indian blues Toasters of the very early 70's or even late 60's, where the DJ would 'rap' whatever ganja inspired stuff would come into his mind over long intros of album tracks or during 'dub' breaks in the songs.

rap is a mainly vocal music backed by repetive drum/bass tracks with no more than 8 beats performed by those with little musical talent and no ability to write lyrics with meaning.

1.)Rock music= the genre in its most general form. This encompasses a lot of other genres, from The Beatles, to System of a Down, to Pearl Jam, to Bob Marley, to Elvis...

2.)Progressive Rock= Music that appears to be more progressive (perhaps "intelligent" one could say) than most music around it. Tends to be more experimental, such as Incubus, Tool, and other bands that are less oridinary.

3.)Psychedelic Rock= anything that is 'trippy', or sounds like it was written on acid, or should be listened to on acid. Think funky.

4.)Soft Rock= Same rock instruments, but not heavy. Perhaps like Garth Brooks, or Nickelback, or Creed.

5.)Rock' n' Roll= stereotypical rock music, really. Blue jeans, simple beats, maybe sunglasses. Plenty of solos. Beatles, George Thorogood.

5.) Hard Rock= Heavier rock music, but not necessarily metal. Three Days Grace, Linkin Park, Disturbed, perhaps also called Alternative rock

6.) Grunge= early 90's, late 80's. Dirty, antisocial music. Nirvana, Pearl Jam.

7.)Metal= fast guitars, grumbly bass. Angry. There is some debate as to whether post-grunge bands like KoRn, Deftones, SlipKnot, Mudvayne, etc, should be considered Metal or Nu Metal.

8.)Heavy Metal= Earlier metal is usually put under here I believe. Metallica, Black Sabbath.

9.)hard than Heavy metal (death gothic etc.)=Death Metal/Black Metal is usually fast, with lots of double-kick drumming and screaming. Cradle of Filth, Dimmu Borgir

Except that rap came first. The industry logs the first rap recording as one by Blondie in about 1977.

Rats...

There goes my theory that AC/DC invented rap in 1980, with Back In Black

Back in black
I hit the sack
I've been too long I'm glad to be back
Yes, I'm let loose
From the noose
That's kept me hanging about
I've been looking at the sky
'Cause it's gettin' me high
Forget the hearse 'cause I never die
I got nine lives
Cat's eyes
Abusin' every one of them and running wild

CHORUS:
'Cause I'm back
Yes, I'm back
Well, I'm back
Yes, I'm back
Well, I'm back, back
I'm back in black
Yes, I'm back in black

Back in the back
Of a Cadillac
Number one with a bullet, I'm a power pack
I'm in a bang
With a gang
They've got to catch me if they want me to hang
Cause I'm back on the track
And I'm beatin' the flack
Nobody's gonna get me on another rap
So look at me now
I'm just makin' my play
Don't try to push your luck, just get out of my way

CHORUS


I can almost hear some jamoke goin' wiki - wiki with a turntable in the background...

;)

Rats...

There goes my theory that AC/DC invented rap in 1980, with Back In BlackWhat are you talking about??? Every single one of those words is sung, not spoken, which is the essence of rap. Check out the sheet music, it's got real notes. Admittedly Brian Johnson has a vocal range comparable to James Hetfield or Johnny Cash, about half an octave on a good day, but he's still singing.

I suppose you're noting the slippery slope from the Caribbean dub style of rapping to Brian Johnson's singing. It can be argued that dubbing is at least "tonal" rather than pure speaking. But doing seven or eight syllables in a row on one note and then rising exactly one whole tone and doing the next seven or eight syllables there before dropping back down is not exactly "singing." There's no melodic or harmonic structure there. If that's singing, then speaking Chinese is performing grand opera.

Sorry, I call "Back in Black" a song, not a rap. Of course I have heard the funky guitar intro sampled into a rap song. It works pretty well.

Rhythmically spoken words over a musical background are of course nothing new. It's just an update on the old "talkin' blues" style of the mid-century. As recently as 1970 Kris Kristofferson had a popular talkin' blues: "To Beat the Devil."

------------------

It was wintertime in Nashville down on Music City row,
And I was lookin' for a place to get my ass out of the cold.
To warm the frozen feelin' that was eatin' at my soul,
And to keep the chilly wind off my guitar.

My thirsty wanted whiskey and my hungry needed beans,
But it'd been a month of paydays since I'd heard that eagle scream.
So with a stomach full of empty and a pocket full of dreams,
I left my pride and stepped inside a bar...

--------------------

It had a sung bridge but the verses were spoken. I suppose today that would make it hip-hop instead of rap. ^_^

Actually, looking back on it, I think much of Bob Dylan's early songs were really talkin' blues. In some of his hits like "Mister Jones," he varied the pitch of his voice more pronouncedly than one would usually do in speech, but the tones weren't really melodic and it would be a real stretch to call it "singing." In fact there were millions of people who insisted that it wasn't. ^_^

Variations of Punk, in very simple terms:

Punk Rock: The stuff explained before, 1970's, Sex Pistols, Ramones, that type of stuff. Also refered to in the punk scene as "77' punk" or "old school punk".

Street Punk: Very fast, aggressive punk, often with more screaming than your average punk rock. Comprises a lot of "gang vocals" in which the whole band chants anthemic choruses and bridges together. Often times lyrics are about working class roots, rebellion, or brotherhood, (but not to be confused with it's first cousin, Oi). the casualtis, the unsee

Oi: A variation of Punk Rock, developing slightly after the original in Britain. Named for it's characteristic chanting of "OI!" in the songs. Very closely related to streetpunk, but usually slightly less fast. Oi is generally associated with the Skinhead Culture, thought this is not always true. The Business, Sham 69

Hardcore: Agro vocals, somewhat similar to street punk, but with more shouting and less screaming (very vague, but i'm trying as hard as i can). Song length usually varies between 30 seconds and 1.5 minutes. "chugga-chugga" style guitar riffs, few solos. Also characterized by "breakdowns", dancable portions of songs that show a noticable change in beat structure to the rest of the song. Hardcore is usually seen as being born in Washington D.C. as an outcry of repulsion for what kids there saw as the selling-out of your average punk rock to fashion and money.Black Flag, Gorilla Biscuits, Minor Threat

Straight-Edge: More a genre of message than of sound, straight-edge was supposedly started by Minor Threat with their song "out of step". Straight-edge is typically hardcore with an emphasis on a lifestyle that is chemical free. "hardliners" take the philosophy even further, to include vegetarianism/veganism, and absolutely no casual sex. Interestingly enough, the otherwise healthy lifestyle that straigh-edge (sXe) promotes is often augmented by a violent outlook on life, typically a violent approach to non-straightedgers. This is a stereotype, of course. Minor Threat, Most Precious Blood

Pop Punk: A style of punk that started in the late 80's to the early 90's with a cleanere image and sound. Song structure remains pretty simple, but more easily accesible to the common ear and more catchy, thus the name "pop punk". Usually involves more melodic singing, and possible even vocal harmonies, previously unknown to punk rock. Green Day, The Offspring, Screeching Weasel, The Queers

What are you talking about??? Every single one of those words is sung, not spoken, which is the essence of rap. Check out the sheet music, it's got real notes. Admittedly Brian Johnson has a vocal range comparable to James Hetfield or Johnny Cash, about half an octave on a good day, but he's still singing.

I suppose you're noting the slippery slope from the Caribbean dub style of rapping to Brian Johnson's singing. It can be argued that dubbing is at least "tonal" rather than pure speaking. But doing seven or eight syllables in a row on one note and then rising exactly one whole tone and doing the next seven or eight syllables there before dropping back down is not exactly "singing." There's no melodic or harmonic structure there. If that's singing, then speaking Chinese is performing grand opera.

Sorry, I call "Back in Black" a song, not a rap. Of course I have heard the funky guitar intro sampled into a rap song. It works pretty well.


Mostly, I was being sarcastic...
Still, it seems to me that it's right on the edge of singing if that's what it is - and not because BJ seems more like he's shreiking than doing a Bee Gees falsetto.

LoL

The chorus is sung, of course, but that's comparable (vaguely, I admit) to some of these fellas out there rapping who have background singers that can actually sing doing a chorus or bridge-type thingy...

.

Fraggle Rocker:

Great classifications, but two problems:

Funk: An intricately syncopated form of rock music using sixteenth-notes. Funk was originally a motif of soul music but has since become more widespread, most ironically in Southern Rock. Examples: Stevie Wonder, the Black-Eyed Peas.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Funk

James Brown, Parliament Funkadelic, et cetera, are all better examples, and what you referenced isn't very Funkish.

Hip-Hop: An offshoot of rap music with melodic interludes and less aggressive lyrics. Examples: MC Hammer, Linkin Park.

Linkin Park, as noted by someone else, is Nu-Metal, which fuses metal with some rap influences and is usually geared towards teenagers and young men.

Well I'm not very funkish. It's my worst weakness as a bass player. Not something I can talk about with much authority. I wouldn't recognize a Parliament Funkadelic song if I heard one. Techno-funk maybe. I love Duran Duran and the Thompson Twins.

But I do know my metal. I remember Iron Butterfly before they wrote "In-A-Gadda-Da-Vida." You can call Korn nu-metal if you want, but Linkin Park???? No way! Not enough power chords, no intricate vamps. But they're okay anyway. If the hip-hoppers won't claim them, just call them rock and roll.

But I do know my metal. I remember Iron Butterfly before they wrote "In-A-Gadda-Da-Vida." You can call Korn nu-metal if you want, but Linkin Park???? No way! Not enough power chords, no intricate vamps. But they're okay anyway. If the hip-hoppers won't claim them, just call them rock and roll.

Hoom - Haroom...

Wasn't Iron Butterfly's clam to faim before Inna-Gadda-Da-Vida something like Flowers and Beads...
I seem to recall something by them which went "Flowers and beads are one thing, honey..."
eh... could be wrong...
Been a long time since I heard 'em.

I thought Linkin Park fell into a seemingly wee category called "rap-metal", wherein a perhaps few "wiki wiki's" on the old turntable, and for sure a smidge of rap was tossed into some otherwise pretty vanilla disaffected white boy suburban type stuff about how miserable existence is, or whatever it is that's ailing 'em.

Don't get me, wrong. I think it's at least an attempt at a new twist, which not a lot of outfits seem to be trying these days.

How's that skinny nerd on lead throat howl like that, though...?

;)

Iron Butterfly's first hit was called "Unconscious Power." It was real metal, with a very complicated vamp.

But frankly, even though the term hadn't been coined yet, I thought that Cream and Jimi Hendrix were the pioneers of heavy metal. "Sunshine of Your Love" had everything that the songs on the first Led Zeppelin and Black Sabbath albums would have three years later.

I don't remember if anybody called Deep Purple heavy metal, but songs like "Smoke on the Water" and "Space Truckin' " certainly fit the definition. I think the genre was actually pretty well established before it had a name.

So is Linkin Park rap-metal, like MSI or Limp Bizkit?

I call groups like Korn and Limp Bizkit (in their more metallic turns, certainly not "Behind Blue Eyes") Infra-Red Metal because so much of their sound is at the very bottom of our hearing range. You have to buy a five-string bass with a low B string (30hz) to even play it. It makes all the chords pretty muddy and that's just not heavy metal. Heavy metal has crisp, well defined chords so you can hear the intricate progressions.

But sure. Faith No More started rap metal, or perhaps the Beastie Boys. Linkin Park gets into it.

1.)Rock music - general term for all below.
5.)Rock' n' Roll - Country+blues=rock and roll. basically, this is the fun stuff from the fifties and early sixties.
2.)Progressive Rock - A movement from the seventies where people sought to bring rock up to par quality wise with classical and jazz music, but ultimatly just became a bunch of nerds who think they are all that and that their music is superior to other types of rock when it really isn't that much. A lot of it is just music that tries to seem intellegent by writing long songs, having lots of solos, ect. There are exceptions, though, like pink floyd and king crimson. Another definition is music which pushes the envelope, but almost all good music does that, so the definition is stupid.
3.)Psychedelic Rock - drugs+music. A lot of catchy melodies, wierd instruments and plain fun. try listening to the beatles to get the hang of it.
4.)Soft Rock - consumer friendly media creation.
5.) Hard Rock - rock that uses more distortion and sounds louder and more intense then regular rock.
6.) Grunge - A movement that originated in seattle, and is most famous for the band nirvana. It is an offshoot of the punk genre, which is an anti-authority sort of genre, and is loud and intense and very emotional.
7.)Metal - a more rythmic form of rock with an emphasis on solos and fast pace.
8.)Heavy Metal - Hard to explain, try listening to metallica to get the idea of it. Fast, loud, riff oriented, solos emphasised, and very high on the head banging quotient.
9.)extreme metal (death gothic etc.) - Very abrasive music which takes attributes of metal and amplifies them to the extreme. A ton of distortion, incredibly fast or crushingly heavy or both. The vocals are often unintelligable because they are screamed or growled. The lyrics are often about "extreme" subjects such as killing, although this is changing more recently. The music is often incredibly difficult to play.

I call groups like Korn and Limp Bizkit (in their more metallic turns, certainly not "Behind Blue Eyes") Infra-Red Metal because so much of their sound is at the very bottom of our hearing range. You have to buy a five-string bass with a low B string (30hz) to even play it.

Or, those eight string guitars. Sort of ruins the bass players job...

8.)Heavy Metal - Hard to explain, try listening to metallica to get the idea of it. Fast, loud, riff oriented, solos emphasised, and very high on the head banging quotient."Fast" was never one of the characteristics of heavy metal. Metallica started out as speed metal. They eventually slowed down, and some of their later songs like "Enter Sandman" fit the heavy metal formula pretty well. But real heavy metal was the stuff from the late 1960s and early 1970s: Iron Butterly, Deep Purple, Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath. Even AC/DC was heavy metal but (bless their hearts) they were so humorous when all the other bands took themselves so seriously, nobody called them that. Very slow by today's standards, each song built on a signature vamp. Nobody's really doing old-fashioned heavy metal these days, it's all hyphenated. Death-metal, rap-metal, etc. System of a Down has the spirit as much as any of the contemporary bands, and they do take themselves way seriously, but they play it twice as fast. We didn't bang our heads as fast and as hard thirty years ago as the kids do today. Most of our brains survived. ^_^

As for the diatribe about progressive rock, well sure. It was by its nature very difficult to compose and play so a lot of it was composed and played earnestly but not very well. The best bands in the genre were either classically trained like Gentle Giant or just astoundingly accomplished musicians like Yes. Much of it was sophomoric but it was still a breath of fresh air after the suffocating formula pop-rock tunes that had dominated the Top Forty for twenty years. Even the most lightweight prog rock tunes had DYNAMICS, something we were starved for. Changing tempos, evolving themes, rich instrumentation, even (gasp) intermittent abandonment of the by-then constraining rock and roll beat.

"Aqualung" by Jethro Tull, "Can You Hear Me" by Renaissance, "The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway" by Genesis, "Benedictus" by the Strawbs, "Stairway to Heaven" by Led Zeppelin (even the metal bands got into the act and were pretty good at it), "Carry On Wayward Son" by Kansas (a few Americans tried their hand at it too). These were really good songs and many of them have become staples of the "classic rock" stations and bar cover bands.

My take on progressive rock is that it overall degenerated after the first few years. Progressive rock then was an adventurous movement, and definitly a great genre, but once it became an established genre it lost all of its steam. My main peeve about progressive rock is the snobbishness. I used to be a huge prog fan, and I still am a fan of the earlier stuff and select albums, but while I was a fan I started to see how shallow it was. Progressive rock is no greater then any genre, and Close to the Edge is certainly not the epitome of rock music. I think that progressive rock is best noted for its impact on rock in general. Without some sort of progressive movement, a lot of today's music would be quite tame.

As for heavy metal, I really don't know a ton about it. I guess I got heavy mixed up with speed/thrash.

But sure. Faith No More started rap metal, or perhaps the Beastie Boys. Linkin Park gets into it.

'We Care a lot' ('85 ish?) I guess had a lot to do with the start of it, and Kerry King playing on 'Licensed to Ill' lent a bit of metal to rap, but for me, it was Aerosmith and Run DMC that really nailed it. Then Anthrax released the 'I am the Man' EP it punted the whole rap/metal thing into the mainstream, and spawned a whole host of imitators, and metal/funk and rap/metal fusion stuff took off quite a bit.

Breathed a bit of life into Metal for a while, and made 'Rock City' (Nottingham, England) an interesting place to be a teenager in the 80's.

My take on progressive rock is that it overall degenerated after the first few years. Progressive rock then was an adventurous movement, and definitly a great genre, but once it became an established genre it lost all of its steam. Close to the Edge is certainly not the epitome of rock music... I guess I got heavy mixed up with speed/thrash.It seemed to me at the time that the problem was that the musicians were becoming more sophisticated and "progressive" just when audiences were getting back to basics. In the late 1960s and early 1970s a lot of us were listening to music with our heads. Every third person could play an instrument. We could tap our feet in 11/4 time, follow intricate chord progressions, and understand musical references to Chopin and lyrical references to Cervantes. A song that actually had dynamics and spent twenty or thirty minutes developing, like a concerto, was something we were all willing to sit still and listen attentively to.

And then suddenly the general population just wanted to get back on their feet and dance. Disco was born. All the prog-rock groups had to dumb it down in order to stay in business.

The singers made the best of the transition. Peter Gabriel, Bryan Ferry and others were able to keep writing lyrics that went a little deeper than "YMCA" but still got the crowds dancing. Roxy Music's "Dance Away" and Pink Floyd's "Another Brick in the Wall Part III" (We don't need no education) are two of the finest songs of the last century, and they're both blatantly straight-up disco.

I agree that there were a lot of one-album wonders. Groups who produced one Magnum Opus (to point at Kansas, one of the few American progressive groups and a perfect example of the phenomenon) and just didn't have any progress left in them. But then there were groups like Genesis and Pink Floyd, Renaissance and Rush, who made album after album and could have kept it up forever if the audience hadn't shifted out from under them.

Rush is still hanging in there, so is King Crimson. Frank Zappa stayed out in front of the curve until the day he died. And there are new groups who slip huge swaths of progressive sounds between the radio-friendly hits on their albums, like Radiohead, Green Day, and The Mars Volta.

I didn't mention Yes because people were really polarized about them. Some thought they WERE progressive rock, others dismissed them as hopelessly middlebrow. Nobody had a moderate opinion about Yes. Personally, for me they were/are a live band. I've seen them in concert a few times and those were some of the most powerful musical experiences I've ever had. But I pull out their albums and find myself listening to the same two songs I hear on the radio. Very much like the Grateful Dead. Now if you want to pull out the individual members, bassist Chris Squire is my hero. His solo work is uncompromising and he has enough creativity for ten people.

As for speed metal, thrash metal, etc. They've got the credentials to be called metal, and they're certainly heavy. But the new metal is for the post-disco crowd: People who want to dance. The first wave of heavy metal was slower and more cerebral, and a lot of it blurred the boundary with progressive. Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, and Rush were prominent in both camps.

Great post. I totally get what you are saying, and I agree about yes. They are sweet live, but their studio stuff doesn't cut it. Nowadays, no one thinks that they are hopelessly middlebrow, I guess all those people moved on and don't talk much about prog because they are more intrested in new music. I feel lonely on a progressive internet forum because all people do is talk about yes elp and genesis. To me there has always been two sides to the progressive music world, the crowd pleasers and the real cerebral stuff. King Crimson, for example, now that is the real shit. All those underground and foriegn prog groups totally rock. Nowadays this progressive comeback includes bands that I prefer to a lot of the older ones. Radiohead, tool, the mars volta, a perfect circle, to them I say rock on! Green day is not progressive at all though :bugeye: . I really don't get what you are saying there.

As for metal though, I disagree that the newer stuff isn't cerebral. Listen to lateralus by tool, Prometheus: the discipline of fire and demise by emperor, and Orchid by opeth and see what I mean. It is faster, but still just as intellegent.

Green day is not progressive at all though. I really don't get what you are saying there.Play the entire "American Idiot" album in one sitting and pay attention to the tracks they don't play on the radio.As for metal though, I disagree that the newer stuff isn't cerebral. Listen to lateralus by tool, Prometheus: the discipline of fire and demise by emperor, and Orchid by opeth and see what I mean. It is faster, but still just as intellegent.I'm only familiar with the Tool album but I agree with everything you say about it... except I've never thought of it as metal. I would have thought that if anybody qualifies as "goth," it would be Tool. :)

I would have thought that if anybody qualifies as "goth," it would be Tool. :)
Some goths would disagree, particularly the older ones.

Anyway Tool's Aenima is brilliant.

When groups as disparate as Evanescence and The Cure are both called goth, I don't think I have any idea what the term means and I wonder if anybody else does either! Is it just a look and an attitude?

That's a good question.

I think there is more than one type of goth. It is a culture that has evolved over the last 20 odd years so that is not surprising.

To be very technical, gothic music has nothing to do with the current alternative rock groups. Bands like Siouxsie and the Banshees and Bauhaus are gothic. Some of The Cure stuff may be part of that as well.

However today's goths seem to have incorporated a wide range of music into the culture such as EBM, industrial, nu metal and alt rock. All dark of course ;)

I know of goths who want nothing to do with Marilyn Manson and see him as sort of being the opposite of what the goth scene is about.

So to answer your question - I think you are right, it is a look and an attitude but the subject of gothic music is something even goths argue over.

Same thing happened to emo. It used to be something, and then the mainstream called something comepletly different emo, and now it is shitty wanna-be pop punk music (lol, beat that insult :P) Tool goth? Green Day Progressive? I don't blame you for being a little genre confused given today's attitude towards genres ("who cares what it is called, it's just music" is a horrible viewpoint btw. You had better know genres if you truly wan't to understand music). But let me clarify, just because green day gets a little more ambitious and experimental at times then the average pop band, they are far from progressive rock. The farthest you can call them is "sometimes borderline art rock". Progressive implies that the whole purpose of the music is progress beyond whats already been done, that the artist sat down and said to himself "I will take my music farther then other musicians". As for tool, they kind of transcend genres, but you could call them progressive drone metal if you have to apply a genre name, but nothing really does them justice. They are more out there then they sound, they found a niche that sounds perfectly normal but is really different from anything out there. One of my favorite bands, Tool are.

I don't understand Green Day being called punk the way you don't understand them being called progressive. Depends on which song you hear.

green day I wouldn't call punk either. pop-punk is solidly what green day are. Green day is the band that helped make pop-punk what it is today. punk is completly different then the shit on the radio.

As far as progressive rock goes, I hate the snobiness of the fans as well, but the genre is still alive and well in Tool, whom another poster labelled as metal. Not entirely incorrect, as Tool does have its metal moments, but in my opinion, Tool is an evolution of progressive rock acts like Rush. Dredg is another band I would consider progressive rock.

There is a pretty big following of progressive metal acts as well like Dream Theater, Fates Warning O.S.I., etc.

There are so many genre bending acts out there nowadays, for example Opeth who at first listen are clearly in the death catagory with its many subgenres, but on further listens there are clearly many progressive elements in it.

edit: and hello, im new to this board :)