Did Tesla Create UFOs? - SciForums.com

Jozen-Bo

10-08-08, 01:23 PM

I am half serious asking this question. I wanted to ask others on SciForums what their thoughts were on the following:

http://books.google.com/books?id=NwEKAAAACAAJ&dq=William+R+Lyne&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=6&ct=result

I don't really suspect that Tesla is responsible for what is all UFO sightings by any means, but is it really possible that Tesla developed a very similar technology and that organizations "beyond" what are typical government agencies have been using and developing this technology for sometime now?

It's my personal suspicions that events like the Phoenix Lights were in reality this type of technology in practice. Thoughts please:

Hello Electrafixtion!

Tesla was one of the greatest geniuses who ever lived. He gave us electricity and one needn't think hard to consider how different our world would be today without it (hint: no computers, no cars, no cell phones, no radios, no TV...and on and on).

I read a book solely about him.

He worked on hundreds of inventions and his papers where confiscated by the government as top priority. Some of the projects he had a hand in where...HARP...the philadelphia experiment...flying structures that manipulated electromagnetic energy...a pulse generator that could send massive amounts of energy over tremendous distances very quickly...and still much more.

He left words that would strongly indicate that he intercepted communications coming from outer space. As time went on, more and more scientists ridiculed him, he died a poor man in his small apartment in New York city...I think it was 1946? Despite the jealousy (which made so many blind and stupid) in silence I am convinced most innerly knew he was WAY AHEAD OF HIS TIME. The government has spent billions upon billions trying to work out his incomplete papers...after taking over 20 boxes full of his workings and notes. Why?

Hmmmmm?

Yes, in my opinion it is exactly that, that organizations "beyond" the government (secret government...?) have been working very hard to unravel the mysteries of this genius mind, and they have most likely came a long way. It would appear that somehow this ties into...chemtrails!

You should read the book "The lost journals of Nikola Tesla" by Tim Swartz. Lots of very interesting things there to find out...;)

On the side, I have been working on a new form of technology that goes beyond anything he did, as it is based on internalized helix beacons of information patterns tweaking the physical manifestation of life at the core where energy whirls into the void. I haven't ever truly discussed the limits, how can I? I can easily say this, my work has attracted attention that is...out of this world!:eek: I am now entangled in so many realities I don't even know where to begin...I don't want to say too much...

It would be so nice to talk to Tesla about my work, he is probably one of the only people who could grasp it clearly all the way to the roots, only problem is he's dead. NO ONE...NO ONE in this world has any answers, most don't even know where to begin themselves. I am unsurpassed and alone because of this...though I have tossed a big stone into the time waves and the ripples will swell for thousands of billions of years expanding through time and outward into the Universe.

This is a cool thread...if any questions come to mind, ask. I will be happy to partake in the unfolding of this thread!

Thank You Electrafixtion!

Respectfully,
Jozen-Bo
:)

Jozen-Bo

10-08-08, 01:26 PM

Nope - just more typical BS in an effort to sell a stupid book. Period.

Don't worry about this one electrafixtion, he calls everything not of his opinion BS, and people are taking him less and less seriously because of it. He's like a fly...bzzz...bzzzz...(he also likes to call everyone stupid who doesn't think like him...rather childish and pathetic...).

Read-Only

10-08-08, 02:00 PM

Don't worry about this one electrafixtion, he calls everything not of his opinion BS, and people are taking him less and less seriously because of it. He's like a fly...bzzz...bzzzz...(he also likes to call everyone stupid who doesn't think like him...rather childish and pathetic...).

Ha-ha-ha!!

You're the big joke kid - you'll believe just about anything! :D (Viacom controlling all the TV broadcasts, one family controlling all the media, etc.) And that's just for openers.:bugeye:

Incidentally, Tesla did NOT give us electricity - he gave us A.C. and quite a few other things - but not electricity. You need to study a LOT more!!!

And by the way, I'm not stating my opinion either - I'm expressing facts, something that you seem to know very little of.

Oh, yeah - where's the PROOF of your stupid, childish claims that neo-Nazis are marching in the streets of the U.S.? You still haven't shown any!!!!

Jozen-Bo

10-08-08, 02:28 PM

Ha-ha-ha!!

You're the big joke kid - you'll believe just about anything! :D (Viacom controlling all the TV broadcasts, one family controlling all the media, etc.) And that's just for openers.

Your laughter reveals that you are hiding frustration from yourself. What a pity.

Also, I never said a single family owns all the media. Your twisting words, deceitful behavior shows your inability to make a good argument.

Viacom split up in 2005:

You can read more about it here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viacom

Incidentally, Tesla did NOT give us electricity - he gave us A.C. and quite a few other things - but not electricity. You need to study a LOT more!!!

I am amazed at how poor your history is. It IS common knowledge and FACT that Tesla was the one who figured out how to harvest electricity.

Here we go again, only this time, there is even more here on Tesla then there is on Viacom:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikola_Tesla

Though, for amusement, why not give us your false version of history...you know...for laughs and giggles...;)

And by the way, I'm not stating my opinion either - I'm expressing facts, something that you seem to know very little of.

FACT?

What is your favorite thing to say?...PROOF IT!

Oh, yeah - where's the PROOF of your stupid, childish claims that neo-Nazis are marching in the streets of the U.S.? You still haven't shown any!!!!

:rolleyes:

You are going off topic, this is flat out rude, showing a lack of class, consideration, and a desperate attempt to side wind and troll this thread by diverting, a common tactic that is more and more losing its kick, because we are getting more and more familiar with it. Can't you do better then that? If you want to discuss this topic, go to where it is and that isn't here.

draqon

10-08-08, 02:50 PM

well this UFO stuff with saucer-like shaped vehicles had to come from somewhere...

Jozen-Bo

10-08-08, 02:59 PM

well this UFO stuff with saucer-like shaped vehicles had to come from somewhere...

:)

Right you are Draqon!

Funny, I was just wondering...what happened to Draqon? Hey, when I learn to speak Russian, maybe we could talk...I am now actively learning...GOOD TO HEAR FROM YOU...I hope everything is going well in your life!

:)

electrafixtion

10-08-08, 05:21 PM

First off: THANKS Jozen-Bo! I always enjoy reading your posts and recently learned for the first time ever about dimensions beyond the first 4 via yourself and one of the other more so conformed academics here on SciForums.

I cannot help but think that there must be more minds like Tesla's out there presently. I realize that so much of what is the commonly held scientific knowledge of tomorrow, is all too often considered the pseudo science of today.

I have read some of those bastardized science books in the link I originally posted and where as there is obvious correct information contained there in, there is some pretty crazy stuff there as well.

I agree that energy brokers have kept us successfully enslaved via our dependence on petroleum and metered electricity for nearly the last 100 years. I don't think anyone would much disagree with that with all the alternate energy sources that could be harnessed and used.

But to say that Einstein's findings (Relativity) were a mask of deceit used to intentionally manipulate and turn the scientific communities attentions away from Ether based Physics...I just don't know about all that. Is there reality with respect to Occult Ether Physics?

I will say this. It's all just a business within the halls of the highest levels of capitalism. Are we honestly in the middle east for any other reason than to insure the securities of the oil corporation's investments there?

There have been MANY reliable reports of these "men in black" manipulating UFO witnesses. Some are described as being pasty in color and always wear dark sun glasses. Could these be members of a secret society that forwards this esoteric technology? The incredible thing is that many times these reported MIB visit known charlatans and frauds in efforts to get them to continue perpetrating their hoaxes!

Read-Only

10-08-08, 09:55 PM

Your laughter reveals that you are hiding frustration from yourself. What a pity.

Not even remotely close. I'm laughing because I'm highly amused at your lack of ability to discern fact from fiction and your child-like naive attitude towards several things.

Viacom split up in 2005:

You can read more about it here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viacom

Ok, I've read it. And there's not ONE single thing there to back up your claim that they controlled 90% of any type of media at any time!

I am amazed at how poor your history is. It IS common knowledge and FACT that Tesla was the one who figured out how to harvest electricity.

Here we go again, only this time, there is even more here on Tesla then there is on Viacom:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikola_Tesla

Though, for amusement, why not give us your false version of history...you know...for laughs and giggles...;)

Once again ,you are simply deluded. DC and DC motors were in existance and in use (and DC is electricity, too) long before Tesla ever got involved with it. As I said earlier, Tesla gave us AC and many very other fine advancements - but he was FAR from the first that figured out how to "harvest" (as you crudely put it) electricity. Edison was producing and shiping DC around before he ever hired Tesla.

FACT?

What is your favorite thing to say?...PROOF IT!

I've never once mangled the English language so badly as to say "proof" it. I've said many times "prove" it or show "proof" of it but have never said "proof" it. That's just plain stupid and ignorant.

You are going off topic, this is flat out rude, showing a lack of class, consideration, and a desperate attempt to side wind and troll this thread by diverting, a common tactic that is more and more losing its kick, because we are getting more and more familiar with it. Can't you do better then that? If you want to discuss this topic, go to where it is and that isn't here.

No, it's not off the topic - which is YOU! You mangle facts with fiction and just make up things as you go - and refuse to stand up like a real man when your nonsense is directly challenged. And that's the mark of a child and a very small, inadequate mind.

kmguru

10-08-08, 10:41 PM

Talking about Tesla...he did a lot of experiments on high voltage, other electromagnetics...including multiphase generation hoping to reduce transmission line loss. We can duplicate everything he did today. We also understand the applications too. One thing that has not been tried (that we know of) is the ariel propulsion using lorentz forces which is what allegedly drives the UFOs. But spy submarines already use this technology.

One good thing about high voltage is that the motors get smaller in size and that is why new hybrids are going to use I think 144 volts as opposed to 24 or 48 volts.

Tesla was trying to use multiphase high voltage to send power wirelessly to a distance.

EndLightEnd

10-09-08, 12:01 AM

Following Tesla’s death in 1943, the US government seized his papers and research notes, placing them under national security lock and key. An undoubted genius during his life, Tesla’s papers curiously remain highly classified today - 68 years later.

Today one is able to gain access to the plans of the H-bomb, but none of Tesla's highly classified papers. Thats a bit strange hmmm? Especially considering that in his journal he had himself described a "perfect" flying machine capable of acceleration "up to 9000mph in a matter of seconds"

Another thing to consider is Tesla died in '43, Roswell happened in 1945. Maybe after two years the technology was still in its infancy. The whole "alien crash" was nothing more than a disinformation spin to make it seem incredulous. It also provides an easy avenue to discredit anyone looking into the subject because aliens are a socially unacceptable subject for most people, and especially on these forums. Aliens = "woo woo" = wont even bother listening. (Its called social conditioning)

EndLightEnd

10-09-08, 12:07 AM

Read-Only

10-09-08, 12:18 AM

EndLightEnd

10-09-08, 12:27 AM

...your stupid, childish claims that neo-Nazis are marching in the streets of the U.S.?

That's just plain stupid and ignorant.

And that's the mark of a child and a very small, inadequate mind.

You call this composure?

And about the papers...
"In 1979, when I tried to gain access to Tesla papers held at the J. Robert Oppenheimer Study Center, at LANL ("Los Alamos National Lab), the government admitted possession, but denied access for lack of the appropriate "badge" (security clearance). Tesla's papers are now held at least in part, in Los Alamos, New Mexico. On that same day, I found the hydrogen bomb plans on the public access shelves, yet was denied access to Tesla's papers. What could be more sensitive than the hydrogen bomb..."

An excerpt from: Occult Ether Physics
by William R. Lyne

from http://www.members.tripod.com/~lyne4lyne/tesla.htm

So Ive provided proof, you have to take this at face value unless YOU can prove that they ARE accessible.

kmguru

10-09-08, 12:52 AM

Just what is known is very impressive....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikola_Tesla

Read-Only

10-09-08, 12:53 AM

You call this composure?

And about the papers...
"In 1979, when I tried to gain access to Tesla papers held at the J. Robert Oppenheimer Study Center, at LANL ("Los Alamos National Lab), the government admitted possession, but denied access for lack of the appropriate "badge" (security clearance). Tesla's papers are now held at least in part, in Los Alamos, New Mexico. On that same day, I found the hydrogen bomb plans on the public access shelves, yet was denied access to Tesla's papers. What could be more sensitive than the hydrogen bomb..."

An excerpt from: Occult Ether Physics
by William R. Lyne

from http://www.members.tripod.com/~lyne4lyne/tesla.htm

So Ive provided proof, you have to take this at face value unless YOU can prove that they ARE accessible.

Har!! That site is no more reliable than this one for use as proof of anything.

In other words, you've accomplished nothing more than just providing another rumor source. In fact, it would take someone with serious mental defects to accept anything presented on that site.

Care to try again? Really - if you can come up with something that contains a degree of credibility, I'd like to read it.

And yes, those statements of mine that you quoted display composure - I could have easily said things MUCH, MUCH stronger - just as I could now at your extremely lame effort to show that Tesla's papers are out of the public's reach. That was absolutely pitiful!!!:bugeye:

darksidZz

10-09-08, 03:15 AM

Hi,

I've looked into this for some time. The story goes that Tesla faked his own death so he could join a group of select scientists in developing his space travel tech in secrecy. Thus the increase in sightings, etc. after his demise. It sounds pretty nice but I don't think he'd have had so much pull in the field at this time since he'd been struggling with so many peoples angry boasts about how insane he was...

There's 2 possibilities:

1. He did fake his own death and developed UFO tech in secret
2. He did die and his papers were taken, perhaps some contained UFO data

Take a look here http://www.thelosthaven.co.uk/NikolaTesla.htm

So anyway this seems cool in my IMO but we have a problem, what about the mysterious air ships

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mystery_airship
http://www.angelfire.com/ma4/oddities/page4.html

phlogistician

10-09-08, 05:06 AM

Oli

10-09-08, 08:57 AM

Read-Only

10-09-08, 09:42 AM

Why does everybody revere Tesla so much? Why do they think that the millions of scientists around the world now, could not achieve whatever they think he did?

Einstein was Einstein, and we know of him because he published first. If he hadn't somebody else would have. This is why we see arguments about who discovered or invented certain things first, many people working in the same field get to similar points in their research at similar times, but either the one that gets there first is remembered, or the one that makes the biggest broohaha, like Edison, who is credited with inventing the lightbulb, but actually created the first practical, mass produced bulb.

Tesla was not the only person working in his field, and modern scientists easily surpass his knowledge, so I don't get this 'cult of Tesla' thing.

Yeah, that bugs me too.

But facts are facts - and the fact is that all the members of the "cult of Tesla" are either 'know-nothings' or know-littles.' Meaning that they have SO little knowledge of science in general, and electromagnetism in specific, that they are prone to believe almost anything.

And I suppose that's partly due to the fact that such weak - and usually immature - little, undereducated minds are fascinated by conspiracy theories and the like. It's very sad, really.

Read-Only

10-09-08, 09:47 AM

That particular book (which I've had a copy of for a year or so) is pure crap.
The author has little connection to reality. Whether talking about Tesla's work, its application or the author's own life - that quote about hydrogen bomb schematics being a good example.
The man is a delusional conspiracy freak with a vastly inflated sense of his own abilities and importance.

How true. And that latter part becomes very apparent when he starts talking about his direct involvement with the CIA and the president of the U.S. And that's only a small part of his overall self-provided evidence that he's practically insane.

And as for Tesla's papers, a thread in this very subforum a year or two back discussed them and showed that ALL of his papers were returned.

Thank you! I had a vague memory of that being the case but wasn't totally sure.:)

electrafixtion

10-09-08, 11:11 AM

Read-Only your such an angry person.

If you had any actual interest in genuinely showing why someone is wrong you would not do so in such a immature manner.
For an old man your childish behavior can only make me think you are senile.

Why dont you lay off the name calling and your belittling remarks and have some composure.

You know, I have had a decent amount of time to reflect on "the thing about UFOs thread" and I must say that I am disappointed in myself for my participation to the degree that I made some stupid assumptions there about other posters. Really just one poster.

For what I stated/wrote/asserted about Read-Only being plagued by drinking at 10:00am and such, I APOLOGIZE for that here and now. That was flat out wrong and believe you me, I HAVE MY REASONS for feeling guilty about that. About 14 years worth of those reasons actually.

Thing is, I honestly suspected that was the case because of the bitter and exaggerated nature of Read-Only's responses. I could tell the man was intelligent, but I just could not fathom the overtly angry obstinacies to basic purposed reason. I had ZERO right to make any such specific personal judgments, so I do hereby publicly apologize to Read-Only for that unethical mistake of accusing him of alcoholism.

Read-Only, you might just be the epitome of happiness and health, I don't know. But man, you sure do "come off" like you have a broken bottle up your azz sideways. You could actually make worthwhile posted contributions in the form of skeptical rebuttal here based on your intelligence and years of real experience. Why not? I gotta ask because I just don't see how being a hard azz about everything helps or entertains anyone.

Sorry for the divergence from my own thread, but this has plagued my conscience a bit. So it's done.

We now return control of your television set to you.

Read-Only

10-09-08, 11:34 AM

You know, I have had a decent amount of time to reflect on "the thing about UFOs thread" and I must say that I am disappointed in myself for my participation to the degree that I made some stupid assumptions there about other posters. Really just one poster.

For what I stated/wrote/asserted about Read-Only being plagued by drinking at 10:00am and such, I APOLOGIZE for that here and now. That was flat out wrong and believe you me, I HAVE MY REASONS for feeling guilty about that. About 14 years worth of those reasons actually.

Thing is, I honestly suspected that was the case because of the bitter and exaggerated nature of Read-Only's responses. I could tell the man was intelligent, but I just could not fathom the overtly angry obstinacies to basic purposed reason. I had ZERO right to make any such specific personal judgments, so I do hereby publicly apologize to Read-Only for that unethical mistake of accusing him of alcoholism.

Read-Only, you might just be the epitome of happiness and health, I don't know. But man, you sure do "come off" like you have a broken bottle up your azz sideways. You could actually make worthwhile posted contributions in the form of skeptical rebuttal here based on your intelligence and years of real experience. Why not? I gotta ask because I just don't see how being a hard azz about everything helps or entertains anyone.

Sorry for the divergence from my own thread, but this has plagued my conscience a bit. So it's done.

We now return control of your television set to you.

Thank you. Apology acknowledged and graciously accepted.

The thing is, you misunderstand me and my intentions completely. I'm not bitter in the least - in fact, I have a very happy and rewarding family and personal life that also involves a couple dozen close, good friends.:) I have no debts as my home, vehicles and everything I own is fully paid for. My time is my own and I spend it doing the things I enjoy.

Here's where the rub comes in. I'm strongly opposed to anyone who attempts, through ignorance or whatever, to spread misinformation and untruths. Intentionally or otherwise. I actually don't mind ignorance at all since it really means just "not knowing." There are many things that many of us do not know.

But whenever ignorance refuses to learn, it turns into something quite different - a monster commonly called stupidity. And I will make every attempt possible to point out AND stamp out stupidity anywhere it appears. And not only me, there are numerous other people here that feel exactly as I do about it and make the same efforts.

Ignorant people should ASK questions so that they might gain information and learn. But it's stupidity that causes people to STATE things that they know little or nothing about. And I object to to that on the strongest possible level.

This very thread is prime example of that in action. All the "Tesla cultists" have very, very little understanding of what they are talking about. Yet they don't hesitate for a moment to make claims about Tesla's abilities and accomplishments that are TOTALLY absurd!

I believe at this point I've explained myself quite clearly and shall leave it at that.

Thanks for reading.

EndLightEnd

10-09-08, 12:06 PM

Har!! That site is no more reliable than this one for use as proof of anything.

In other words, you've accomplished nothing more than just providing another rumor source. In fact, it would take someone with serious mental defects to accept anything presented on that site.

Care to try again? Really - if you can come up with something that contains a degree of credibility, I'd like to read it.

The quote wasnt from the site you buffoon, its from the published book from william lyne, which I cited right underneath. I just provided the site because it had the quotation without me having to go through the entire book looking for it.

Dont go jumping to conclusions or anything.:rolleyes:

This just goes to show that you "skeptics" wont even consider a published book as evidence for the possibility. So essentially you guys discount all forms of proof no matter the medium to protect your reality bubble from popping.

Youve made up your mind already.

Oh and you still havent provided proof to the contrary Read-Only, please provide an example where someone WAS allowed access to Tesla's papers please.

SkinWalker

10-09-08, 12:16 PM

Surely we can engage in discourse without referring to others as "buffoons," eh?

electrafixtion

10-09-08, 12:19 PM

How true. And that latter part becomes very apparent when he starts talking about his direct involvement with the CIA and the president of the U.S. And that's only a small part of his overall self-provided evidence that he's practically insane.

Thank you! I had a vague memory of that being the case but wasn't totally sure.:)

I would not be so quick Read-Only. In Oli's post which I can see quoted in your response, it states very ambiguous sources for this information at best. I just watched a 90 minute PBS documentary last night entitled Tesla: Master of Lightning. On a scale of 1-10 I would honestly give this documentary no better than a 4 because it just seemed like a more or less surface level history lesson. I am not implying that it lacked juicy conspiracy info, it just sort of "dragged" along. It made a specific reference to secret papers that were seized via the guise of 'national security" and also seems to me (I will go back and check this evening) that some of the papers were still classified.

I currently have two other documentaries in route to me about Tesla & free energies (The Secret of Nikola Tesla 2003) and one other Free Energy: The Race to Zero Point 2008.

I have previously read a biography on Tesla and am reading (entertaining the ideas of) Occult Ether Physics.

One thing is for certain, like most of those that are routinely chastised and made fun of in the good ol' pseudoscience section of SciForums, Tesla was considered a complete quack in the beginning, and as well, at the end. Very few comprehended the man's tremendous genius in the beginning and I am certain that an equal number of mainstream scientists understood and appreciated it in the end no better. At the time of his death,(he was hit by a car) Tesla had almost completely went over to metaphysics for his ongoing research purposes although he was still attempting to pedal his death ray to various countries around the globe. Bare in mind that Tesla was "marketing" the invention as a means to prevent war as it was a defense application.

EndLightEnd

10-09-08, 12:22 PM

Surely we can engage in discourse without referring to others as "buffoons," eh?

Why dont you spend time harassing the people who insult others on a regular basis rather than pointing out my one insult, or is this your style of moderation?

EndLightEnd

10-09-08, 02:08 PM

Haha I got a warning for my previous that post.... so I guess to avoid warnings I should use more vulgar and condescending words?

Is that the lesson here Skinwalker?
I sure hope everyone else who is calling people names got a warning as well, but something tells me that isnt the case.

Maybe you didnt notice that the warning you gave me for being off topic stemmed from the post you originally made, which was also off topic. Did you give yourself a warning too?

But to stay on topic, Tesla did invent UFOs essentially.

Read-Only

10-09-08, 03:55 PM

Stryder

10-09-08, 04:27 PM

"...On that same day, I found the hydrogen bomb plans on the public access shelves, yet was denied access to Tesla's papers. What could be more sensitive than the hydrogen bomb..."

An excerpt from: Occult Ether Physics
by William R. Lyne

Very simply reason for the Hydrogen bomb being present, It's not exactly a secret a number of governments learnt about it and the knowledge was shared. It wasn't a BlackOps project thanks to it's actual use.

As for accessibility to Tesla's work, it's renowned that some people were against Tesla's work for a number of reasons, either because they didn't think he was paying enough attention to what he was attempting, or he was going slightly mad etc. I'm sure it was enough of a worry to cause his papers to be seized since any self-respecting government wouldn't want someone picking up the gauntlet on work that cuts corners, as well as their might have been sensitive referrals in regards the countries enemies or allies at the time. Obviously wouldn't look good if it was public knowledge either.

Read-Only

10-09-08, 04:44 PM

Very simply reason for the Hydrogen bomb being present, It's not exactly a secret a number of governments learnt about it and the knowledge was shared. It wasn't a BlackOps project thanks to it's actual use.

A small but crucial point here since the above statements imply something that's not true: the hydrogen bomb has never even once been actually used. Tested, yes, but used - never. (And the atomic bomb (uranium/plutonium-based as opposed to hydrogen) has only been used twice.)

As for accessibility to Tesla's work, it's renowned that some people were against Tesla's work for a number of reasons, either because they didn't think he was paying enough attention to what he was attempting, or he was going slightly mad etc. I'm sure it was enough of a worry to cause his papers to be seized since any self-respecting government wouldn't want someone picking up the gauntlet on work that cuts corners, as well as their might have been sensitive referrals in regards the countries enemies or allies at the time. Obviously wouldn't look good if it was public knowledge either.

Then that automatically calls into question what you think about those papers today - do you believe they are still sealed away?

electrafixtion

10-09-08, 05:17 PM

Very simply reason for the Hydrogen bomb being present, It's not exactly a secret a number of governments learnt about it and the knowledge was shared. It wasn't a BlackOps project thanks to it's actual use.

As for accessibility to Tesla's work, it's renowned that some people were against Tesla's work for a number of reasons, either because they didn't think he was paying enough attention to what he was attempting, or he was going slightly mad etc. I'm sure it was enough of a worry to cause his papers to be seized since any self-respecting government wouldn't want someone picking up the gauntlet on work that cuts corners, as well as their might have been sensitive referrals in regards the countries enemies or allies at the time. Obviously wouldn't look good if it was public knowledge either.

I bolded the portion of your quote above to affirm my agreement with the obvious, however I think pretty much everything else in your post is hearsay or basically an interpretive analysis of second hand information at best. There is no question that Tesla was eccentric and somewhat disturbed, but I sure as hell don't believe the government seized his papers because of a heart felt need to protect anyone from their carelessness. That's silly.

Oli

10-10-08, 08:22 AM

This just goes to show that you "skeptics" wont even consider a published book as evidence for the possibility. [/B]
I have two or three of Lyne's books.
The man is totally divorced from the real world.
According to him, at the age of four or so he discovered a "nazi spy" radio and upon reporting it was allowed to keep it...
Um, really?
US intelligence allows a a child to have an enemy transmitter during wartime?
They didn't need it for anything?

Then, again according to him, he discovered another a year later...

And during his army career he "exposed" a trio of KGB agents in the the US Army.
He "knew" they were KGB because they had similar facial features to some of his childhood pals, who were of Bulgarian extraction.:rolleyes:
Completely beside the point, of course, is that Bulgaria didn't even have the KGB.

Anything and everything Lyne says should be taken with a very heavy side order of salt, if not dismissed out of hand.
He is a grade-A fruitcake.

phlogistician

10-10-08, 09:28 AM

According to him, at the age of four or so he discovered a "nazi spy" radio and upon reporting it was allowed to keep it...
Um, really?

Ah, I bet if anything like that actually took place they were just saying 'yes, well done little man' and laughing to themselves about the innocuous item he'd found as they made their way back to base.

It was probably just a bail of wire in a old crate or something.

Stryder

10-10-08, 10:37 AM

I bolded the portion of your quote above to affirm my agreement with the obvious, however I think pretty much everything else in your post is hearsay or basically an interpretive analysis of second hand information at best. There is no question that Tesla was eccentric and somewhat disturbed, but I sure as hell don't believe the government seized his papers because of a heart felt need to protect anyone from their carelessness. That's silly.

Your neglecting that not everyone understood his work and therefore feared it.

electrafixtion

10-10-08, 11:31 AM

As of 1999/2000:

2 days after Tesla died the government officially appointed a specific FBI task force to secure Tesla's belongings. This was in response to what his nephew publicly reported 1 day after his uncle's death having just found out about the fact. To give you an idea of how vitally important Tesla himself was considered by the "powers beyond", his nephew Sava Kosanovic rushed to his room the morning after his death. He reported that not only was Tesla's body already gone (!?) but his papers were partially missing as well as his personal notebook with his most important latest findings & research which Tesla kept regularly and had for quite some time. The events relating to the death of Tesla are indeed very suspicious. The PBS documentary makes clear reference to a car accident. Other reports indicate he died of a heart attack in his hotel room with no reference to a car accident whatsoever. Maybe he got hit by a car and then later died of heart attack. I don't know. The motivating reason for all the potential secrecy concerning Tesla's papers and his demise was Tesla's "Death Ray or Beam" which was a particle beam weapon of great interest to the US government. Tesla literally had an appointment at the Pentagon to discuss and subsequently pedal the device at the time of his death. His papers were all initially microfilmed and studied in overview by an electrical engineer with the National Defense Research Committee of the Office of Scientific Research and Development. After 3 days it was "officially" determined that the papers were of little interest. That's precisely why they remained completely classified and hidden from the public for the next several years! Right after WW2 there was a renewed interest in particle beam weaponry and all the papers containing references and R&D themselves were sent to Wright-Patterson to a specific top secret section apart from any other research dept. This being for further analysis that lasted officially for several years after which time it supposedly was discontinued. It is a known fact that something incredibly suspect happened at this time however. That being that the copies from the original particle beam papers that were sent to Wright-Patterson disappeared without a trace and no, they were never officially destroyed. After which, in 1952, in cooperation with Tesla's nephew Sava Kosanovic who had been actively pursuing his uncles effects and papers, the REMAINDER of his estate was given over to Belgrade, Yugoslavia where all his personal belongings remain to this day on exhibit. During the cold war years there was zero public access to this museum exhibit by anyone other than the European countries in the surrounding area.

There is so much espionage BS that happened during this time that no one is publicly certain whether the Russians actually started Particle Beam research first via leaked information, or whether the US did via Tesla's papers themselves. Tesla's nephew was connected to the Communist party so that's specifically where the spin was linked, but it is suspected that this is just more politically based cover up to dodge the USA's theft of Tesla's papers and subsequent research.

The thing is, we will NEVER unquestionably know how much of Tesla's research has never been disclosed to the public. Because of the SDI HARP project that references Tesla's research in detail, much of those original papers and subsequent research and invention remain classified.

This was as of the year 2000. I will be able to comment further soon when I acquire newer research materials.

electrafixtion

10-10-08, 11:44 AM

Your neglecting that not everyone understood his work and therefore feared it.

Stryder
I should have been clearer. I just mean that I don't believe that the classification and secrecy involving Tesla's papers had anything to do with "protecting anyone from themselves". I believe that albeit a few, they well understood the potential of Tesla's work and were making certain no other government agencies got a hold of it.

Read-Only

10-10-08, 12:16 PM

electrafixtion

10-10-08, 03:04 PM

Yadda, yadda, yadda. All I see here are a bunch of worthless claims unless you can come up with something to substantiate them...

This is a great place to start. Good Luck!

http://www.pbs.org/tesla/

Read-Only

10-10-08, 04:07 PM

This is a great place to start. Good Luck!

http://www.pbs.org/tesla/

Yes, that's a good reliable source (in my opinion) but nowhere does it mention the specific part of your claim that I was concerned about. This:

"The thing is, we will NEVER unquestionably know how much of Tesla's research has never been disclosed to the public. Because of the SDI HARP project that references Tesla's research in detail, much of those original papers and subsequent research and invention remain classified. "

Because neither HARP nor H.A.A.R.P - which is probably what you really meant - has nothing at all to do with Regan's SDI. There was never a connection between either of them and any part of SDI. That's nothing more than your over-active imagination at work.

There has also been PLENTY of high-frequency research done in the decades following Tesla's death and there was no reason to fall back on his efforts which were simply crude compared to what had been developed independently of his early efforts. And I worked with some of it myself, personally.

electrafixtion

10-10-08, 05:19 PM

Yes, that's a good reliable source (in my opinion) but nowhere does it mention the specific part of your claim that I was concerned about. This:

"The thing is, we will NEVER unquestionably know how much of Tesla's research has never been disclosed to the public. Because of the SDI HARP project that references Tesla's research in detail, much of those original papers and subsequent research and invention remain classified. "

Because neither HARP nor H.A.A.R.P - which is probably what you really meant - has nothing at all to do with Regan's SDI. There was never a connection between either of them and any part of SDI. That's nothing more than your over-active imagination at work.

There has also been PLENTY of high-frequency research done in the decades following Tesla's death and there was no reason to fall back on his efforts which were simply crude compared to what had been developed independently of his early efforts. And I worked with some of it myself, personally.

I ask you this Read-Only: How could we possibly know? The papers were completely withheld from anyone other than the agencies they were in possession of for 9 years! Who is to say that some papers were not withheld permanently? I must have gotten it wrong when watching the documentary. The had a key person on/in the documentary that is involved in the haarp project. The project is very classified so the man could not say that much other than to state emphatically that several agencies around the globe were working to bring the particle beam technology up to weapons grade. Does Haarp have nothing to do with the particle beam? That is SDI reference I was making. The HARP as opposed to HAARP was just a dumb mistake. I don't mind being wrong when I am attempting to be correct. How else can you learn?

Read-Only

10-10-08, 05:34 PM

I ask you this Read-Only: How could we possibly know? The papers were completely withheld from anyone other than the agencies they were in possession of for 9 years! Who is to say that some papers were not withheld permanently? I must have gotten it wrong when watching the documentary. The had a key person on/in the documentary that is involved in the haarp project. The project is very classified so the man could not say that much other than to state emphatically that several agencies around the globe were working to bring the particle beam technology up to weapons grade. Does Haarp have nothing to do with the particle beam? That is SDI reference I was making. The HARP as opposed to HAARP was just a dumb mistake. I don't mind being wrong when I am attempting to be correct. How else can you learn?

I can overlook a mistake like that, no problem.

And no, HAARP has nothing at all to do with particle beams. It's strictly HF electronics (and really not that HIGH, either) - no particles in anything like that. If you'll do just a bit of serious research on HAARP you'll find that it's not as classified as you think. In fact, there's a TON of info on it right here: http://74.125.45.104/search?q=cache:ZOtxEqQgZ0wJ:en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HAARP+HaARP+wikipedia&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us read and learn.;)

Oli

10-13-08, 05:39 AM

The motivating reason for all the potential secrecy concerning Tesla's papers and his demise was Tesla's "Death Ray or Beam" which was a particle beam weapon of great interest to the US government.
Except that, according to Tesla's own papers the "particles" were particles of metal - i.e. they may as well have been bullets, they certainly weren't sub-atomic particles.
In other words Tesla's vaunted "particle beam weapon" was NOT what is genearlly accepted to be a particle weapon these days.

electrafixtion

10-13-08, 09:27 AM

Except that, according to Tesla's own papers the "particles" were particles of metal - i.e. they may as well have been bullets, they certainly weren't sub-atomic particles.
In other words Tesla's vaunted "particle beam weapon" was NOT what is genearlly accepted to be a particle weapon these days.

OK, I have decided to get "real" and not avoid anything or anyone in my pursuit of the truth concerning occult sciences. I was insanely busy over the weekend and didn't get half of what I wanted to get done, done. (boo frickin' hoo) I did rewatch the PBS video documentary section on H.A.A.R.P. and according to one of the key developers, Tesla's work is referenced as being key in it's development. Even more so via the SDI/BMDO and Star Wars. I am reading and studying several other sources of information however and as I stated, I just didn't get nearly enough accomplished over the weekend to make an intelligent assessment. So in retrospect I am not contending anything officially at this point.

Now, Oli, are you saying that Tesla's "Death Ray" was basically akin to a "shotgun blast"???? Or are you referring to much smaller particles?

Jozen-Bo

10-13-08, 04:04 PM

Once again ,you are simply deluded. DC and DC motors were in existance and in use (and DC is electricity, too) long before Tesla ever got involved with it. As I said earlier, Tesla gave us AC and many very other fine advancements - but he was FAR from the first that figured out how to "harvest" (as you crudely put it) electricity. Edison was producing and shiping DC around before he ever hired Tesla.

OK...then who gave us DC! I don't trust you further then I can spit...so please provide a few good links (I also wouldn't trust a single link from you...will need a few...). Your negativity makes you shifty and harder to trust.

No, it's not off the topic - which is YOU! You mangle facts with fiction and just make up things as you go - and refuse to stand up like a real man when your nonsense is directly challenged. And that's the mark of a child and a very small, inadequate mind.

I would bet money I would whip your ass all over and again...heck...I bet we could multiply you by 10 and I would still whip up. This is not threat...I am simply saying I would bet on myself giving that opportunity to. Since I don't normally go seeking physical fights, the chances are that this will never happen. Still, you are unusually insulting and snotty. What is your problem anyways, way are you so worked up? You could express yourself without resorting to becoming a total jack-ass you know, I recommend giving it a try.

I am here standing up...like a real man...perhaps you are simply projecting your own inner insecurities? OK...maybe I learned wrong (I think it was in school...?) regarding Tesla and electricity, though I do recall learning that he developed the means to harness electricity. If not, then who?

As to your rating my mind...this is very despicable and lowly of you to do. Since you feel that it is your duty to make an ass of yourself on the internet by telling people they are stupid like a parrot or a broken record, then perhaps you will "stand up like a man" and show your formal authorization to judge and rate the minds of others, their mental conditions, and their level of intelligence? Let's see that degree of yours stating your invested authority to rate and judge the soundness of other peoples mind! If you can't provide this...then why not *bleep* off (pardon me...stop with it)?

Jozen-Bo

10-13-08, 04:16 PM

As of 1999/2000:

2 days after Tesla died the government officially appointed a specific FBI task force to secure Tesla's belongings. This was in response to what his nephew publicly reported 1 day after his uncle's death having just found out about the fact. To give you an idea of how vitally important Tesla himself was considered by the "powers beyond", his nephew Sava Kosanovic rushed to his room the morning after his death.

He reported that not only was Tesla's body already gone (!?) but his papers were partially missing as well as his personal notebook with his most important latest findings & research which Tesla kept regularly and had for quite some time. The events relating to the death of Tesla are indeed very suspicious. The PBS documentary makes clear reference to a car accident. Other reports indicate he died of a heart attack in his hotel room with no reference to a car accident whatsoever. Maybe he got hit by a car and then later died of heart attack. I don't know.

The motivating reason for all the potential secrecy concerning Tesla's papers and his demise was Tesla's "Death Ray or Beam" which was a particle beam weapon of great interest to the US government. Tesla literally had an appointment at the Pentagon to discuss and subsequently pedal the device at the time of his death.

His papers were all initially microfilmed and studied in overview by an electrical engineer with the National Defense Research Committee of the Office of Scientific Research and Development. After 3 days it was "officially" determined that the papers were of little interest. That's precisely why they remained completely classified and hidden from the public for the next several years!

Right after WW2 there was a renewed interest in particle beam weaponry and all the papers containing references and R&D themselves were sent to Wright-Patterson to a specific top secret section apart from any other research dept.

This being for further analysis that lasted officially for several years after which time it supposedly was discontinued. It is a known fact that something incredibly suspect happened at this time however. That being that the copies from the original particle beam papers that were sent to Wright-Patterson disappeared without a trace and no, they were never officially destroyed.

After which, in 1952, in cooperation with Tesla's nephew Sava Kosanovic who had been actively pursuing his uncles effects and papers, the REMAINDER of his estate was given over to Belgrade, Yugoslavia where all his personal belongings remain to this day on exhibit. During the cold war years there was zero public access to this museum exhibit by anyone other than the European countries in the surrounding area.

There is so much espionage BS that happened during this time that no one is publicly certain whether the Russians actually started Particle Beam research first via leaked information, or whether the US did via Tesla's papers themselves. Tesla's nephew was connected to the Communist party so that's specifically where the spin was linked, but it is suspected that this is just more politically based cover up to dodge the USA's theft of Tesla's papers and subsequent research.

The thing is, we will NEVER unquestionably know how much of Tesla's research has never been disclosed to the public. Because of the SDI HARP project that references Tesla's research in detail, much of those original papers and subsequent research and invention remain classified.

This was as of the year 2000. I will be able to comment further soon when I acquire newer research materials.

I broke up your monster paragraph there so it would be more fun to read...now I will read it! (Note: I have worked hard to break this habit myself of making huge paragraphs, I find that I avoid reading them when I see them and, thus, assume others do to- so I try to keep them smaller and more compact)

Awesome topic, by the way!

Read-Only

10-13-08, 04:41 PM

OK...then who gave us DC! I don't trust you further then I can spit...so please provide a few good links (I also wouldn't trust a single link from you...will need a few...). Your negativity makes you shifty and harder to trust.

I'll provide you with exactly nothing.I'm not here to teach you the very basics of the history of electricity, dummy. You should have learned that very simple stuff in school. What happened - sleep all the way through OR didn't even finish as all???

I'll give you one big hint - Edison was already shipping DC around town (as I already told you earlier!) and he wasn't alone. Since you don't trust me (and I don't care one way or the other), just try searching for "History of Electricity." You'll learn LOTS!!!!!

I would bet money I would whip your ass all over and again...heck...I bet we could multiply you by 10 and I would still whip up. This is not threat...I am simply saying I would bet on myself giving that opportunity to. Since I don't normally go seeking physical fights, the chances are that this will never happen. Still, you are unusually insulting and snotty. What is your problem anyways, way are you so worked up? You could express yourself without resorting to becoming a total jack-ass you know, I recommend giving it a try.

I am here standing up...like a real man...perhaps you are simply projecting your own inner insecurities? OK...maybe I learned wrong (I think it was in school...?) regarding Tesla and electricity, though I do recall learning that he developed the means to harness electricity. If not, then who?

As to your rating my mind...this is very despicable and lowly of you to do. Since you feel that it is your duty to make an ass of yourself on the internet by telling people they are stupid like a parrot or a broken record, then perhaps you will "stand up like a man" and show your formal authorization to judge and rate the minds of others, their mental conditions, and their level of intelligence? Let's see that degree of yours stating your invested authority to rate and judge the soundness of other peoples mind! If you can't provide this...then why not *bleep* off (pardon me...stop with it)?

Yeah, yeah - right. Just more of your bigmouthed empty physical threats. How utterly childish!!!!:bugeye: And your level of intelligence, bad as it is, is quite evident to EVERYONE here - not just me.

Jozen-Bo

10-13-08, 05:06 PM

I'll provide you with exactly nothing.I'm not here to teach you the very basics of the history of electricity, dummy. You should have learned that very simple stuff in school. What happened - sleep all the way through OR didn't even finish as all???

I'll give you one big hint - Edison was already shipping DC around town (as I already told you earlier!) and he wasn't alone. Since you don't trust me (and I don't care one way or the other), just try searching for "History of Electricity." You'll learn LOTS!!!!!

You have no class! You continue to insult and make an ass of yourself. You act as if your the voice of everyone, but you are not. I tire of you. On top of it, your being hypocritical, as you demand from others to prove this and that, yet you won't even bother to provide a link. Your pathetic! :p

Yeah, yeah - right. Just more of your bigmouthed empty physical threats. How utterly childish!!!!:bugeye: And your level of intelligence, bad as it is, is quite evident to EVERYONE here - not just me.

EVERYONE here? You speak for yourself, as I have heard from others here and throughout my life the contrary. You are dangerously close to becoming the second person on my ignore list, because you never back up anything you say except with mindless insults. You call me childish, take a look at yourself. You ignore points that expose your weaknesses, not answering questions that you can't and not even bothering to be honest that you can't. This is weak minded childish BS. I don't want to turn this thread into a spoo match, so I let it rest here.

Read-Only, can you provide a single link where you aren't making a total ass of yourself? Or where you show some basic respect? Then again, if you keep it up, you will be IGNORED. Then you can rant and rave all you want, but I will see you said something...without knowing what nor caring...and simply state that I have decided to ignore you because you are too insulting and rude. If you want to be taken seriously, you should seriously consider what I am say to you.;)

Also, show me one example where I make a physical threat, just one, before you say something like "more of your physical threats"...one only please. Or else let it be known that you twist words and manipulate. This IS shifty, and you are suspicious.

Jozen-Bo

10-13-08, 05:15 PM

As of 1999/2000:

2 days after Tesla died the government officially appointed a specific FBI task force to secure Tesla's belongings. ...

This was as of the year 2000. I will be able to comment further soon when I acquire newer research materials.

OK...I just read the whole thing. It was a lot easier to follow after breaking it down into more paragraphs. I find the whole subject very interesting!

Let us compare read-only's sincere attempt to understand vs. my own...

"Yadda, yadda, yadda. All I see here are a bunch of worthless claims unless you can come up with something to substantiate them..."

Here we see a rather warm hearted attempt to divert attention without even bothering to ask anything. Read-only displays his arrogance boldly and foolishly...which by now seems very typical of him.

My own response (AFTER READING IT- WHICH IS SOMETHING I DOUBT READ-ONLY ACTUALLY DID (DESPITE HIS NAME)):

Where did you come across this information and if possible, can you provide a link? Thank You!

Read-Only

10-13-08, 05:24 PM

You have no class! You continue to insult and make an ass of yourself. You act as if your the voice of everyone, but you are not. I tire of you. On top of it, your being hypocritical, as you demand from others to prove this and that, yet you won't even bother to provide a link. Your pathetic!

DUMMY! Since you mad it clear that you wouldn't believe me anyway, I gave you THE best possible answer of all - search for the history of electricity!!!!

And every thing else you've just said below only proves the totallity of your ignorance and lack of education.:bugeye:

Feel free to put me on ignore - and see if I care. Heh-heh!:D:D

EVERYONE here? You speak for yourself, as I have heard from others here and throughout my life the contrary. You are dangerously close to becoming the second person on my ignore list, because you never back up anything you say except with mindless insults. You call me childish, take a look at yourself. You ignore points that expose your weaknesses, not answering questions that you can't and not even bothering to be honest that you can't. This is weak minded childish BS. I don't want to turn this thread into a spoo match, so I let it rest here.

Read-Only, can you provide a single link where you aren't making a total ass of yourself? Or where you show some basic respect? Then again, if you keep it up, you will be IGNORED. Then you can rant and rave all you want, but I will see you said something...without knowing what nor caring...and simply state that I have decided to ignore you because you are too insulting and rude. If you want to be taken seriously, you should seriously consider what I am say to you.

Also, show me one example where I make a physical threat, just one, before you say something like "more of your physical threats"...one only please. Or else let it be known that you twist words and manipulate. This IS shifty, and you are suspicious.

electrafixtion

10-13-08, 09:01 PM

OK...maybe I learned wrong (I think it was in school...?) regarding Tesla and electricity, though I do recall learning that he developed the means to harness electricity. If not, then who?

You are correct Jozen-Bo, in that it was Tesla that strongly advocated and accomplished the harnessing, and indeed "harvest", of electricity. AC was such a vast improvement over DC because of it's adaptable nature. Pretty much like comparing an electrical outlet in your home that can power pretty much any typical electrical device, to a basic disposable battery of one particular size. The sheer strength and the efficient transmission of AC exemplifies it's vast superiority as compared to DC in the most absolute sense.

I'll run this down quickly for you as I am very tired tonight and I apologize if I make mistakes. I do appreciate your constructive criticism concerning the paragraphs Bozen-Jo. Thank you.

Tesla, much like Einstein and most other great thinkers, took a great amount of constructive direction and conviction from his personal philosophies. Tesla was a staunch non materialistic naturalist from the start to the finish. His root belief was that mankind's essential progress, and more specifically the technologies that helped to forward that progress, lie in scientific principles that did not conflict nature. He believed firmly that mankind's technological attributes would be best founded and developed in complete harmony with nature.

This is where your "harvest/harness" scholastic impressions came from. When Tesla was a young child he saw visions of what at the time was a complete mystery to him. One such vision was of a large wheel at the base of a great waterfall. Many years later, after the invention and establishment of his AC motor and subsequent patents, he designed and was directly responsible for the first large scale hydro electrical facility at Niagara Falls.

Tesla understood that electricity was everywhere within mankind's natural surroundings at all times. It was simply up to man to harness and extract that electricity in harmony with nature. Harmony in this sense merely translates to the most efficient and productive "harvest of electricity" that mankind in cooperation with nature could reap.

kmguru

10-13-08, 10:01 PM

Tesla understood that electricity was everywhere within mankind's natural surroundings at all times. It was simply up to man to harness and extract that electricity in harmony with nature. Harmony in this sense merely translates to the most efficient and productive "harvest of electricity" that mankind in cooperation with nature could reap.

Yes, we are surrounded by electricity....however the big natural electricity such as Lightning is DC....Direct Current....

electrafixtion

10-14-08, 01:09 PM

amethyst08

10-14-08, 01:36 PM

Jozen-Bo, you are funny :D Where do you come from??

kmguru

10-14-08, 11:44 PM

This is fascinating and I just wanted to let you know that you really inspired me with this post. I have actually spent the last few hours in an attempt to better understand AC & DC electricity. It's pretty damn interesting and has actually left me with more questions than I started with.

There are 4 fundamental forces in this Universe. They are Strong, Weak, Electromagnetic and Gravitation. Out of the 4, only electromagnetic force is manipulated to a very large extent by humans to create our modern society that we use everyday.

Electromagnetic Force is very fascinating and you can spend a life time learning about it for the simple reason that when a current (electrons) move through a path, they produce a magnetic field and also it creates a force depending on the field configuration.

Enjoy your study....

Oli

10-15-08, 05:55 AM

Now, Oli, are you saying that Tesla's "Death Ray" was basically akin to a "shotgun blast"????
No I'm not. It was Tesla himself who said it. Not in so many words, although that's one possible description, another would be a string of "pellets" i.e. linear not a spread.
Tesla's particles were "droplets" of metal, NOT sub-atomic particles.

electrafixtion

10-15-08, 09:06 AM

No I'm not. It was Tesla himself who said it. Not in so many words, although that's one possible description, another would be a string of "pellets" i.e. linear not a spread.
Tesla's particles were "droplets" of metal, NOT sub-atomic particles.

How can a "ray" or "beam" consist of metallic particles accept on a molecular level?

OK, in the midst of wondering about what you have brought to light here, I went and did a minuscule amount of research on Tesla's technology (which he himself claims to have built a scale model of and demonstrated said model to complete operational standards) The metallic particles to which you refer were actually microscopic droplets of mercury or as some of his later research shows, microscopic particles of tungsten. These were aligned in single particle width (just as you said) in a focused beam of ionized air and were reported to be effectively destructive at a distance of 300 miles.

A tiny bit of research also concludes (but certainly not places into official acceptance) the fact that Tesla invented the first ruby laser and most assuredly was the basis for the inventive precursor to ionic and basic upper atmospheres derived high frequency manipulation. By the account of many sources, Tesla most assuredly was the inventor of the "wheel" that proceeded particle beam defense research, and indeed Bernard Eastlund's H.A.A.R.P./Poker Flats r&d.

They (the few sources at this point that I have read) say that Eastlund's theories and subsequent proofs may in fact render a great deal of Einstein's theories obsolete. We will see. The sad thing is that presently most of his findings or working proofs are kept classified because of the military nature of his former work. Occult science in action I guess.

I am only now beginning to develop an admiration for a new type (for me I'm saying) of personal "hero". Via this new appreciation, I have added depth to a level of understanding that the vein human being that I can be has long taken for granted. The true distance between the nature of what is Science and Empirical Acceptance is unfathomable. Thoughts like these fro me are both great and exceedingly humbling. It seems that if the truth could be likened to buried treasure, I could dig on the spot on which I stand for eternity.

I think the latest most admirable quote to me, albeit one that could be easily dismissed as arrogant, eccentric and even delusional, was made by Tesla when he stated:

"I am not a scientist, I am a discoverer."

Oli

10-17-08, 06:55 AM

How can a "ray" or "beam" consist of metallic particles accept on a molecular level?
Sloppy terminology most likely.

The metallic particles to which you refer were actually microscopic droplets of mercury or as some of his later research shows, microscopic particles of tungsten.
So I was correct...

Oli

10-20-08, 06:41 AM

Just noticed this:
were reported to be effectively destructive at a distance of 300 miles.
Utter rubbish.
Anything launched with enough velocity to reach 300 miles would vapourise through kinetic heating.

electrafixtion

10-20-08, 08:17 AM

Just noticed this:

Utter rubbish.
Anything launched with enough velocity to reach 300 miles would vapourise through kinetic heating.

Since you just barely understood the premise of his device, and still don't REALLY understand it whatsoever, I am apt to believe Tesla's calculations and understanding of his device's effectiveness far and away over yours. Especially since he is credited via the development of advanced particle beam weaponry as well as the real ground work for what is H.A.A.R.P. technologies

Oli

10-22-08, 07:04 AM

Since you just barely understood the premise of his device
Didn't understand the premise?
You mean as in "it isn't a particle weapon"?
Which but don't you understand?

and still don't REALLY understand it whatsoever
But I do: it isn't a particle weapon.

I am apt to believe Tesla's calculations and understanding of his device's effectiveness far and away over yours.
Regardless of what he did or didn't do anything launched with sufficient initial velocity to cover 300 miles (and especially retain lethal impact at that range) would require such a high speed that air friction alone would vapourise it.
No calculation (calculation? Hmm what happened to the "test"?) will over-ride that fact.

Especially since he is credited via the development of advanced particle beam weaponry as well as the real ground work for what is H.A.A.R.P. technologies
Credited by whom for the "development of advanced particle beam weaponry"? Bearing in mind he denied the existence of the electron...
And HAARP?:shrug:

electrafixtion

10-22-08, 09:39 AM

Didn't understand the premise?
You mean as in "it isn't a particle weapon"?
Which but don't you understand?

But I do: it isn't a particle weapon.

Regardless of what he did or didn't do anything launched with sufficient initial velocity to cover 300 miles (and especially retain lethal impact at that range) would require such a high speed that air friction alone would vapourise it.
No calculation (calculation? Hmm what happened to the "test"?) will over-ride that fact.

Credited by whom for the "development of advanced particle beam weaponry"? Bearing in mind he denied the existence of the electron...
And HAARP?:shrug:

Come on Oli, you have been doing your best to discredit Tesla right along here. You said that the metal he was referring to was not "sub atomic" or the same as what is considered the standard for particle beam weaponry today. So what. Does that honestly surprise you and mean a single thing? No one ever contended they were sub atomic because at the time that electron microscope research facilitation didn't exist. What Tesla contended was that "microscopic" PARTICLES of Tungsten would be used, not just pieces of metal, just any pellets, or buck shot for that matter. You are also not being forthcoming with respect to his purposed method of delivery. This was not intended to be "shot" or "blown" through a typical air stream like a BB gun, but rather energetically repelled via ionic charge. I don't believe you have done any REAL research here Oli, although I will certainly not deny that you are more knowledgeable than myself in many respects. It's my belief that you are spouting the typical disbelief and ridicule that aligns itself with a passé form of empirical scientific knowledge concerning physics. The truth is that the status of typified empirical science has been left in the dark because 90% of the real cutting edge physics research is presently classified and unavailable to the general scientific public like yourself with respect to this specific technology.

Another thing to point out is that Tesla's research paper work has never been completely accounted for with respect to the last 30 years of his life's work. He was theorizing about the forms of the particle beam (directed energy related weaponry) that is being discussed here prior to 1900! A working model of his proto type design has been clearly evidenced as that which the Russians picked up after his death and subsequently developed.

Could you please provide me the sources for what you are stating as Tesla's denial of the electron. I don't believe he ever denied the electron, although I realize his views were not identical concerning the electron. Frankly, I would like to see ANY proof that Tesla was ever wrong with respect to claims he made. I am requesting this from a seriously interested perspective.

Without question, Tesla was the first scientist on the planet that did in depth research and development, say what you will, with respect to directed energy weaponry and ionospheric derived high frequency manipulation.

To say that Tesla did not lay the ground work, which incidentally is what I stated:

"Tesla most assuredly was the inventor of the "wheel" that proceeded particle beam defense research, and indeed Bernard Eastlund's H.A.A.R.P./Poker Flats r&d"

is incorrect. He most certainly did.

fedr808

10-22-08, 09:49 AM

Oli

10-24-08, 05:57 AM

Come on Oli, you have been doing your best to discredit Tesla right along here.
Nope, I'm doing my best to discredit the "Tesla did everything first and he was a veritable god" attitude of so many here and on other forums.

You said that the metal he was referring to was not "sub atomic" or the same as what is considered the standard for particle beam weaponry today. So what.
The point is that Tesla's "particle beam" was not what is understood to be a particle beam today - which is how his device is usually touted.

This was not intended to be "shot" or "blown" through a typical air stream like a BB gun, but rather energetically repelled via ionic charge.
It doesn't matter AT ALL how they were discharged - any velocity sufficient to make a projectile carry 300 miles would vapourise that projectile within metres of leaving the "muzzle".

I don't believe you have done any REAL research here Oli
Your disbelief doens't alter the facts or the reality. I've been an analyst of weaponry of various forms for over 40 years so don't put your lack of knowledge down as a lack of research on my part.

It's my belief that you are spouting the typical disbelief and ridicule that aligns itself with a passé form of empirical scientific knowledge concerning physics.
You're free to believe whatever you like, but the facts don't have to conincide with your beliefs.

The truth is that the status of typified empirical science has been left in the dark because 90% of the real cutting edge physics research is presently classified and unavailable to the general scientific public like yourself with respect to this specific technology.
Um, no actually.
In this sort of field I don't class as one of the "the general scientific public", I'm an insider.

Oli

10-24-08, 06:02 AM

Here's the evidence. Tesla created a machine like the tesla coil that would project high energy at a target. It could theoretically shoot down balloons or aircraft (world war 1 is when it was created). Unfortunately he died before it was constructed. The US government confiscated the blueprints. What has become of it is unknown.

Except that the US Government subsequently released Tesla's papers and every UFO book (among others) that purports to show how UFOs work also tends to include diagram of how to make a Tesla coil...
Ever tried something called "Google"?
http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=%22Tesla%20coil%22&gbv=2&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=iw
So the "confiscation" hardly is hardly relevant these days, is it, since the "blueprints" have since been handed back and published many times?

kmguru

10-24-08, 08:41 AM

any velocity sufficient to make a projectile carry 300 miles would vapourise that projectile within metres of leaving the "muzzle".

Why? Due to friction in the air? What happens when a hyper-sonic ceramic nozzle is used? Just a thought....

fedr808

10-24-08, 09:46 AM

Dude, the "particle weapon" (not even that) was not released. The tesla coil was not confiscated it was published by Tesla himself. And no the blueprints for the theoretical weapon was not released. Theoretically it was made to burn through the wooden biplanes and balloons, which lends itself to the idea that it is more of an energy weapon than a particle weapon. And dude you can find 10,000+ answers for almost any viable thing you look up on google, 90% of them are bs.

phlogistician

10-24-08, 10:15 AM

Why? Due to friction in the air? What happens when a hyper-sonic ceramic nozzle is used? Just a thought....

The projectiles were particulates iirc, ie, very small, so as small individual particulates they would experience a tremendous amount of heating they could not deflect or dissipate.

electrafixtion

10-24-08, 11:36 AM

Except that the US Government subsequently released Tesla's papers and every UFO book (among others) that purports to show how UFOs work also tends to include diagram of how to make a Tesla coil...
Ever tried something called "Google"?
http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=%22Tesla%20coil%22&gbv=2&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=iw
So the "confiscation" hardly is hardly relevant these days, is it, since the "blueprints" have since been handed back and published many times?

I will never doubt your credentials Oli. What good could come of it if I did? I am honestly grateful for your participation in discussions I am a part of, but you are dead wrong about the above. All of Tesla's papers were NEVER conclusively released. That's BS and if in fact you can show proof that they were, I will stand a corrected individual better for it.

Despite your insistence that you do understand the ACTUAL workings of Tesla's death ray, and the subsequent potential energy manipulation that he was developing, you have shown me zero evidence that you do. Just a peripheral understanding at best.

Oli

10-25-08, 09:27 AM

Theoretically it was made to burn through the wooden biplanes and balloons, which lends itself to the idea that it is more of an energy weapon than a particle weapon.
Doesn't follow at all: why does the fact that the intended targets were biplanes and ballons indicate an energy weapon?
New York Times quote -
will send concentrated beams of particles through the free air, of such tremendous energy that they will bring down a fleet of 10,000 enemy airplanes at a distance of 250 miles..
Although I suspect there's possibly some newspaper hyperbole in there: 10,000 planes!!!
Yeah right.

Also -
And no the blueprints for the theoretical weapon was not released.
http://davidszondy.com/future/tesla/teslaray.htm
Happens to have excerpts from the drawings - you know, the ones that weren't released :rolleyes:

Oli

10-25-08, 09:36 AM

Despite your insistence that you do understand the ACTUAL workings of Tesla's death ray, and the subsequent potential energy manipulation that he was developing, you have shown me zero evidence that you do. Just a peripheral understanding at best.

http://www.halfbakery.com/idea/Tesla_20Death_20Ray_20Bandsaw

electrafixtion

10-27-08, 09:21 AM

http://www.halfbakery.com/idea/Tesla_20Death_20Ray_20Bandsaw

Thanks Oli! All information is worthy of consideration. Especially since I have become so interested in Tesla. I will feedback when I have an opportunity to honestly take it "all" in.

Oli

10-27-08, 11:06 AM

Jozen-Bo

10-27-08, 04:05 PM

Jozen-Bo, you are funny :D Where do you come from??

The same place we all come from I suppose. All of this started out somewhere as a singularity that we can never find, yet evidence points to it. Then again, I could answer this question in so many different ways. It is not so easy to answer as it appears. Where was I before I was conceived into this world? The potential of my existence must have been there all along, or else it would never manifest into what I am now. Though was I merely a potential then? Possibly on some other world in a body type, or drifting as a spirit? Not even there? What if all of these things could be correct at the same time?

To cut myself off, the topic it Tesla making UFO's. I noted that I was able to conduct an energy in my mind that allowed me to experience the sensation of jumping into a parallel versing of this world, almost exactly the same. A very interest part of this I noted when returning to this Universe was the amount of electricity blasting actively through the brain, though the consciousness of the mind itself was displaced in another parallel.

Considering this topic overlaps into electricity and electro magnetic fields (which would have been a likely choice to fly objects), my awareness shifts into seeing the incredibly complex waves pulsating through the human brain itself, what a lovely instrument to see. How these waves form themselves when thinking or feeling emotional states while translating and superimposing their signatures into the matter that conducts them, this I find interesting. Giving the waves ability to be controlled; manipulated by our ability to steer these thoughts, the potentials that the shape sequences of mind can quickly go through, indicates there a functions of such a vast range to explore that it is safe to say we barely understand the full scope of possibilities.

No other machine can crush and stamp energy patterns and imaging faster into such intricate shapes and formations. As I scour my memory for these shapes I felt before the jumping, they where focused at the cortex center just behind the central ventricle chambers.

There was a lecture at a University regarding the strong possibility that electrons travel through parallels. I will have to see if I can dig up the details. It was interesting to listen to, and seems to make more sense out of what happened to myself when I fit it in the puzzle.

I wonder if Tesla ever considered using the electricity already in our brains to conduct advanced functions by navigating the energy shapes. As mechanisms, they certainly offer a lot of avenues, one simply needs to start looking in the right direction perhaps to find them.

I think Tesla would have gotten a kick out of the my research...:)

kmguru

10-27-08, 05:14 PM

Though was I merely a potential then? Possibly on some other world in a body type, or drifting as a spirit? Not even there? What if all of these things could be correct at the same time?

http://globalmoxie.com/bm~pix/klingon_woman~s600x600.jpg

phlogistician

10-28-08, 06:07 AM

I realised this weekend that it's actually worse than I'd originally stated.
You may not have to wait for kinetic heating to destroy the particles: it's a little-known fact that metal in very small particles self-ignites due to oxidisation.
Once the surface area to volume ratio reaches a certain figure the metal rusts so fast that it actually catches fire: powdered lead, believe it or not, is a very effective incendiary.

I was going to mention this, 'cos I once saw a really cool demonstration in my chemistry class. My teacher had prepared a very fine powder, which he simply sprinkled in the air, and it caught fire, but I couldn't remember which metal it was, and my Google-Fu failed to find it out.

Here however is a story about some cannonballs recovered by divers, which explains the effect nicely;

http://www.mlssa.asn.au/nletters/june2002.htm

Scroll down to "Old Balls Still Scorch - Pores Made Shipwrecked Cannon Balls Glow Spontaneously."

Oli

10-29-08, 07:49 AM

but I couldn't remember which metal it was, and my Google-Fu failed to find it out.
It could be practically any metal - even aluminium oxidises.
Get the particles small enough and Woomph! instant barbecue.

electrafixtion

10-29-08, 11:22 AM

Oli
I have reached a difficult, nonetheless real conundrum, in the short time that I have been looking into this Tesla death ray business.

There is a HUGE difference in what people report as being Tesla's final invention or proposed invention. The metal particles avenue is definitely one. But there is also the laser, magnetic, AND the high frequency matching devices that he was working on.

The truth (as far as I have been able to discern) is that Tesla was working on inventions of this nature for the last 40 years of his life. They evolved as his understanding of transmittable & high frequency energies evolved.

The truth is that Tesla REALLY pissed off JP Morgan and his associates. He was supposed to be working on an invention to specifically transmit radio signals to large ships at sea. In reality Tesla took the 100,000 clams that Morgan gave him for this exclusive purpose and used it on his wireless electricity idea which was in fact tied into the perfecting of the death ray invention.

The conundrum I have reached revolves around the fact that the device that we both agree (I agree thanks to you specifically) that the idea of sprayed tiny metal objects would self incinerate over such a distance. No question. Thing is, I don't believe this is what he was pedaling whatsoever when it came to what he was actually attempting to sell for 20 million dollars toward the end of his days. No way.

I mean, why would he? This guy was a phenomenal genius. He would have known what you are making clear here in a New York second. He gave us AC for God's sake. He created and engineered the first hydro electric facility at Niagara Falls. Edison despised him (and most likely caused him irreparable damages) because he solved problems constantly that he himself could not fathom.

There is no question that Tesla was eccentric to a degree that rendered him socially awkward and excessively reclusive. That don't mean a thing in the face of all the man gave us. Tesla PROVED to be far and away ahead of his time so to speak and science as a whole hated him for that because he was well beyond relating to at that time. The sad thing is that we will never know just how much spin the government put on his specific efforts because of national security issues.

Tesla was NEVER a quack or the kook that people sometimes make him out to be. He was just WAY too ingenious for his own good and as a result, he pissed off the wrong people. The industry giants of that time. The most powerful publicly recognized people wanted him wiped off the face of the planet for the last 50 years of his life. He threatened them directly because he had no mind for capitalism and as a result his personal history was squashed like an insect and marred like a heretic that crossed the church. So sad, but so true.

fedr808

10-30-08, 06:07 PM

The same place we all come from I suppose. All of this started out somewhere as a singularity that we can never find, yet evidence points to it. Then again, I could answer this question in so many different ways. It is not so easy to answer as it appears. Where was I before I was conceived into this world? The potential of my existence must have been there all along, or else it would never manifest into what I am now. Though was I merely a potential then? Possibly on some other world in a body type, or drifting as a spirit? Not even there? What if all of these things could be correct at the same time?

To cut myself off, the topic it Tesla making UFO's. I noted that I was able to conduct an energy in my mind that allowed me to experience the sensation of jumping into a parallel versing of this world, almost exactly the same. A very interest part of this I noted when returning to this Universe was the amount of electricity blasting actively through the brain, though the consciousness of the mind itself was displaced in another parallel.

Considering this topic overlaps into electricity and electro magnetic fields (which would have been a likely choice to fly objects), my awareness shifts into seeing the incredibly complex waves pulsating through the human brain itself, what a lovely instrument to see. How these waves form themselves when thinking or feeling emotional states while translating and superimposing their signatures into the matter that conducts them, this I find interesting. Giving the waves ability to be controlled; manipulated by our ability to steer these thoughts, the potentials that the shape sequences of mind can quickly go through, indicates there a functions of such a vast range to explore that it is safe to say we barely understand the full scope of possibilities.

No other machine can crush and stamp energy patterns and imaging faster into such intricate shapes and formations. As I scour my memory for these shapes I felt before the jumping, they where focused at the cortex center just behind the central ventricle chambers.

There was a lecture at a University regarding the strong possibility that electrons travel through parallels. I will have to see if I can dig up the details. It was interesting to listen to, and seems to make more sense out of what happened to myself when I fit it in the puzzle.

I wonder if Tesla ever considered using the electricity already in our brains to conduct advanced functions by navigating the energy shapes. As mechanisms, they certainly offer a lot of avenues, one simply needs to start looking in the right direction perhaps to find them.

I think Tesla would have gotten a kick out of the my research...:)

I think you would've sent his head spinning.