I've got a hypothesis about how a regular person could develop telepathy. I know it's probably wrong, and I encourage compitent individuals to poke holes in, and totally shatter this theory. Seriously, I want to have a better idea of this.

I consider some forms of ESP valid. Telepathy being one of them. Considering that we use a tiny portion of our brain, it is possible that we all have the potential to work on a much higher mental level. Knowing that we can increase the power and flexibility of our bodies, this should (theoretically) carry through to our brains. If we were to gain enough information to reach our brain's limit, and we were to continue to push the limit like people do in their physical training, it is possible (over time) to open up a new section of our brains to pick up for what it currently cannot do. This could possibly open up areas involving telepathy.

There it is. Like I said, feel free to shoot it down.

Have you tried it? Did it work for you?

BTW, that "using a tiny portion of our brain" thing is a myth. We use all of our brain. If we didn't, it would be unnecessary wasted space.

i dout it is wasted space i personally think much of our brain is locked... and you can unlock it by disipline and training i would think... people of the past used to be way more spiritual connnected with the world then they are now i think this is because of all the physcical technology that the world has today if people would rely less on physical needs i think much more of our brains would be unlocked poeple who has stonge phycic powers or can use telephathy have unlock a little bit of their brain that many people havnt some people can connect and understand animals another part of there brain is unlock usually by something that happened in there past mabye or mabye they somehow trianed themselves to do this humans have many abilities that we dont even know about... when people first have a OBE i think a part of there brain is beeing unlock since they trained for it and told themselves it was posable and eventually this happens.......

Emmm.... no, not quite. What James was attempting to point out is that the idea that only a relatively tiny portion of the human brain is used is actually a myth - we do actively use all of our brain, just not necessarily all of it all at the same time.

Simply because our minds can imagine it possesses greater powers doesn't necessarily follow that actually they do. We just like to think it.

That's a good point. I suppose no one really knows for a fact that there are special abilities that can be attained. But on the same note, there's no proof that we don't have latent abilities, waiting to be used. Unless there's some article that I haven't seen, and there's a pretty good chance of it. I don't claim to know everything.

http://www.psipog.net/ or http://skepdic.com/? One says you can, one says you can't. I can't say much either way at this point.

I've got a hypothesis about how a regular person could develop telepathy. I know it's probably wrong, and I encourage compitent individuals to poke holes in, and totally shatter this theory. Seriously, I want to have a better idea of this.

I consider some forms of ESP valid. Telepathy being one of them. Considering that we use a tiny portion of our brain, it is possible that we all have the potential to work on a much higher mental level. Knowing that we can increase the power and flexibility of our bodies, this should (theoretically) carry through to our brains. If we were to gain enough information to reach our brain's limit, and we were to continue to push the limit like people do in their physical training, it is possible (over time) to open up a new section of our brains to pick up for what it currently cannot do. This could possibly open up areas involving telepathy.

There it is. Like I said, feel free to shoot it down.


Jeez! You act like you just said you were gay or something.

Of course there is ESP and telepathy. Of course it can be developed. There is lots of literature about how to do it. Go practice kung fu or yoga or do some of that new age stuff. You have to be patient. Might take 3 or 5 years. That is nothing compared to the length of your life.

Be reasonable about your expectations too. It is not Hollywood razzle dazzle like in the X men movies.

the idea works i guess but it would take alot of evolution, thousands of years,etc
so prob not our generation

We have an organ in our brain which can send and receive thoughts. People don't know they own such an organ, but it will be awakened later. It has fallen into a latent state because of a crossbreeding between a primitive and a highly developed human race long ago.

To send a thought to someone you have to think about the person, then feel the person, then be the person. Easier said than done.

(this also means that you can become a spoon for instance, and since the self is omnipresent, you can bend yourself, the spoon, when you have become it. This enhanced will power is a "substance" similar to the electric force)

To receive a telepathic thought you have to empty yourself of all thoughts, otherwise you'll not hear it.

Telepathy works best on the night when the body is asleep and the 'spirit' is awake.

May the force be with you.

~ The 400,000 year old ultramaterial cat from lemurian beaches

an organ in my head other than my brain?

Deep meditation is the usually suggested method to develop telepathy and other psi related skills.

That's a good point. I suppose no one really knows for a fact that there are special abilities that can be attained. g.

What makes you say that? I am someone. I tell you for fact that people can have telepathy.

It is your choice to believe or disbelieve just like it is your choice to believe or disbelieve that the sky is blue.

What makes you say that? I am someone. I tell you for fact that people can have telepathy.

It is your choice to believe or disbelieve just like it is your choice to believe or disbelieve that the sky is blue.
http://www.randi.org/research/index.html
;)

I swear people are lemmings. I have been on the internet for about 10 years. In those 10 years, you know what? When I post that people have telepathy, 98% of the lemmings out there in internet world post that link.

Why are people so purposefully stupid?

If I could read minds, 1 million dollars is a joke. I can go to wall street and make billions.

If I was naive, I would beleive that randi was real and would give me the money. Instead of believeing randi is a front organization that searches the populace for people who beleive they are telepathic. If they pass the test, the government contacts them and who knows what happens. Didn't you see how the government treated telepaths in Babylon 5? That is exactly how it would go down.

Stop being so gullible. Wake up and realize that the people you trust want you to be a cattle so they can own you. They want you to work and pay taxes while they eat caviar and drink champagne. They would tell you any lie that you wanted to hear if it meant that you never bothered them and you continued to give them 50% of your yearly wages in taxes.

Developing telepathy? It'll never happen. But rest assured, there are many, many people lined up waiting to take your money to "teach you how." You can buy books, attend seminars, etc, etc. But in the end, you'll still be the same guessing person you were before.

People who are misguided enough to actually believe they have telepathy are the kinds of people who remember the hits and forget the misses in life. They notice that which is of the slightest significance in life and think it was all because of them. But the fact is that humans are pattern seeking animals and we will find the correlations in everything from the scorch marks on a tortilla that look like a messiah to the last meal eaten when pitching a no-hitter. Thinking about a loved one who suddenly calls by phone is an immediate proof of telepathy, in spite of the fact that the many, many times that loved one didn't call when thought of is completely ignored.

What would be significant is if there weren't coincidences.

Telepathy. Yeah, right. Wanna buy a book on the subject?

Happeh sez:

Of course there is ESP and telepathy. Of course it can be developed. There is lots of literature about how to do it... I tell you for fact that people can have telepathy.

1 million dollars is a joke. I can go to wall street and make billions.

So, why aren't all those people making billions on Wall Street from telepathy? Why hasn't anyone successfully taken the 1 million dollar challenge and walked away with that?

Why, instead, are they trying to sell you literature on telepathy?

Because telepaths are altruistic and don't want fame, of course. They just seek status among internet peers by boasting of their claims. The money made on books barely covers their expenses: publishing, a new home, a Lexis, the new plasma screen, ..... you know, the basic expenses of living.

Or the alternative hypothesis: there is no telepathy and those that claim there is simply want to steal hard-earned money from gullible muggles willing to give it to them.

Happeh,

I swear people are lemmings. I have been on the internet for about 10 years. In those 10 years, you know what? When I post that people have telepathy, 98% of the lemmings out there in internet world post that link.

If 98% of the lemmings out there are delivering the same exact message then thats a significant agreement amongst the lemming population. Rarely (if ever) do agreements reach such high statistical results. Maybe the message of such a statistical anomoly should be examined more closely?


Why are people so purposefully stupid?


Because they accept assertions as true based on attractiveness / authority rather than evidence.


If I could read minds, 1 million dollars is a joke. I can go to wall street and make billions.


Show me the results of this prediction with people whom can read minds.


If I was naive, I would beleive that randi was real and would give me the money. Instead of believeing randi is a front organization that searches the populace for people who beleive they are telepathic. If they pass the test, the government contacts them and who knows what happens. Didn't you see how the government treated telepaths in Babylon 5? That is exactly how it would go down.

Yes, a fantasy television show is a great way to judge reality.


Stop being so gullible. Wake up and realize that the people you trust want you to be a cattle so they can own you. They want you to work and pay taxes while they eat caviar and drink champagne. They would tell you any lie that you wanted to hear if it meant that you never bothered them and you continued to give them 50% of your yearly wages in taxes.

I pay 30% of my annual wages in taxes (which is reasonable for all the services provided), I drink champagne, eat caviar, and aside from the occasional jury duty request, my government isn't asking me for any special favors.

As we have entered the Era of Global Terrorism it is necessary for people to use all their senses for survival and this includes the much derided 6th sense also known as intuition. There are times when logical reasoning thought is countered by a little unexplained doubt urging caution. Listen to that "inner voice" in the Era of Global Terrorism your life may depend on it. The "inner voice" is not permission to harm other people; it is your cue to walk away from what maybe a very dangerous situation. Listen to the doubt.

If your "inner voice" is telling you to hurt yourself or to harm other people seek professional help.

Intuition maybe the survival skill of the 21st century. Learn to listen for it. All you need to do is be quiet and listen for the "inner voice". Taking a moment to do this is not an arduous task, pausing before doing something just maybe very good for your health as well.

Intuition is a far different thing than telepathy. Moreover, there are more than just 6 senses.

Candy, intuition is not a sense, it is the subconscious processing of recently received data, integrated with prior experience. It is, as you suggest, a valuable survival tool.

Yes, a fantasy television show is a great way to judge reality.

I pay 30% of my annual wages in taxes (which is reasonable for all the services provided), I drink champagne, eat caviar, and aside from the occasional jury duty request, my government isn't asking me for any special favors.


U know? Life is odd. Society tells you stereotypes are wrong and bad. That is a lie. Stereotypes are truth.

I have run into the same 98% of lemmings that say "You are talking about a movie or TV" in the same tone you use. What happened to the intelligence human beings are supposed to have?

Who made movie and TV? Humans. Who are the TV and movie shows about? Humans. Who writes the shows? Humans. Who do the writers base their characters on? Humans.

But for some reason saying a movie or TV show points at some aspect of human life is the most outlandish thing these lemmings have ever heard.

The human race is headed for a crash. Stupidity is going to reach critical mass. Then there will be a big war like WW III to thin all of them out.

Bummer.

Happeh sez:

Of course there is ESP and telepathy. Of course it can be developed. There is lots of literature about how to do it... I tell you for fact that people can have telepathy.

1 million dollars is a joke. I can go to wall street and make billions.

So, why aren't all those people making billions on Wall Street from telepathy? Why hasn't anyone successfully taken the 1 million dollar challenge and walked away with that?

Why, instead, are they trying to sell you literature on telepathy?

There are crooks out there. Evil works by watching what works successfully for good, then copying the same methods. What can you do?

As for your question, it shows how you are and what you think. You are about money and possessions. You don't believe in telepathy or other things, so you have no idea of what alternatives there are to life other than chasing money.

Someone like you will find it impossible to believe there is anything better than money. That is your choice and your belief. It is not accurate. You are welcome to do as you please as an adult in this world. Including being wrong.

One could very easily argue that those that buy into conspiracy theories without any basis in fact are simply lemmings. It sounds good, so they buy it.

P.T. Barnum's dream.

There are crooks out there. Evil works by watching what works successfully for good, then copying the same methods. What can you do?

As for your question, it shows how you are and what you think. You are about money and possessions. You don't believe in telepathy or other things, so you have no idea of what alternatives there are to life other than chasing money.

Someone like you will find it impossible to believe there is anything better than money. That is your choice and your belief. It is not accurate. You are welcome to do as you please as an adult in this world. Including being wrong.

Your reply had nothing to do with (Q)'s comment. He made the simple logic that if it isn't about the money, why then are these scam artists so bent on selling their wares. Moreover, there's no reason to believe in telepathy other than blowing the woo-woo whistle of the bullshit train. Telepathy has no apparent users; no apparent cause; no apparent evidence. There are only a few woo-woos who claim it exists or that they can do it, many quite vocally. They're not willing to prove it, but always bitch and moan that skeptics don't know what they're talking about. Of course we do. We're talking about the poppycock that humans are willing to believe in. We're talking about the lack of critical thinking and logical reasoning that exists among people today.

So rather than address (Q)'s comment directly, you construct a strawman about his "materialist" nature... the same tactic creationist nutters throw at scientists who reject "intelligent" design.

U know? Life is odd. Society tells you stereotypes are wrong and bad. That is a lie. Stereotypes are truth.

Like 'believers'? There is a stereotype about them and very few tread off that path.

I have run into the same 98% of lemmings that say "You are talking about a movie or TV" in the same tone you use. What happened to the intelligence human beings are supposed to have?

Who made movie and TV? Humans. Who are the TV and movie shows about? Humans. Who writes the shows? Humans. Who do the writers base their characters on? Humans.

But for some reason saying a movie or TV show points at some aspect of human life is the most outlandish thing these lemmings have ever heard

As I recall, Babylon 5 was about many species including two very old ones whom were about as human as pineapples. Babylon 5 was also classified as science fiction... FICTION. That means made up crap... fantasy... and it is imagination that spawned the concept and use of telepaths.

The human race is headed for a crash. Stupidity is going to reach critical mass. Then there will be a big war like WW III to thin all of them out.

Bummer.

I agree, there are far more 'believers' in the world... they make up the vast majority of the population and they will repeatedly have conflict with each other.

Happeh, would you care to present a single piece of evidence for telepathy, other than spurious claims of charlatans, scripts from sf movies, or rehashes from your own recollections, posing as original thought?
Please excuse the terse nature of my question: I didn't want you think I was on your side of the fence.

One could very easily argue that those that buy into conspiracy theories without any basis in fact are simply lemmings. It sounds good, so they buy it.

P.T. Barnum's dream.

Sure. PT Barnum was evil. He watched priests or whoever bring people into the church. Then he stole their methods and used it to bring people to the circus.

Capitalism is evil. They take what works in converting regular human beings into spiritual people, and use it to teach them to think working and spending money is their purpose in life.

So using 'methods' to 'convert' people into spiritual beings - according to your definition of spirituality - is acceptable, whereas the same methods used to 'convert' them to a different viewpoint is evil. How exactly, using any method of logic known to the Greeks, or my Aunt Marie, would you justify that?
I think you are just winding us up.

Telepathy has no apparent users; no apparent cause; no apparent evidence.

What you are really saying is that since you are not telepathic, no one is. If you watch a whorehouse, it has no apparent users. That is because they go in the back door. They are trying to hide.


There are only a few woo-woos who claim it exists or that they can do it, many quite vocally. They're not willing to prove it, but always bitch and moan that skeptics don't know what they're talking about.

What you call bitching and moaning is a person's loss as to prove something that can only be proved if you can do it. There is no way to prove telepathy to an outside person. By definition it is unspoken communication between two people. If you can't hear it and you don't have telepathy, there is no possible way to prove it to you. People are forced to try to get you to listen and have faith. That is the only way.


Of course we do. We're talking about the poppycock that humans are willing to believe in. We're talking about the lack of critical thinking and logical reasoning that exists among people today.

What if I told you that your critical thinking was the reason you do not have telepathy? That telepathy is associated with the artistic part of the brain. That by you consciously choosing to emphasize the factual part of your brain, you literally shut the door on your possible telepathic ability?

For instance. How do you know who is responsible for the thoughts in your head? Because you are rational, of course the response is "I am". How can you be completely sure? Have you ever had an odd thought and said "Why did I think that?". Some thought that is totally not you. You disregard it because it is not you.

Maybe it was somebody else's thought. Maybe that is why it was strange and did not belong in your head. If you believed in telepathy, you might look around you and see which person the thought belonged to. If you find yourself thinking of sex, maybe it is the women dressed up and going to the bar. If you find yourself thinking of crime, maybe it is the dirty and sneaky looking guy in the corner. You never look because you are certain that all the thoughts in your head can only be yours.

Like 'believers'? There is a stereotype about them and very few tread off that path.


Sure. You say that like it is bad. That is how scientific people are. Belief is a force that truly works. If you believe you can ride a bicycle, you usually can. If you believe you will fall down, you usually do. The only difference is in the emotional confidence of the person. For some reason scientists think that is stupid.


As I recall, Babylon 5 was about many species including two very old ones whom were about as human as pineapples. Babylon 5 was also classified as science fiction... FICTION. That means made up crap... fantasy... and it is imagination that spawned the concept and use of telepaths.

Yes it is a movie that is fiction. I agree. I also said somewhere that all TV shows are written by humans and based on humans. The aliens part is fiction as far as I know. I know the telepathy stuff is not.

Happeh, would you care to present a single piece of evidence for telepathy, other than spurious claims of charlatans, scripts from sf movies, or rehashes from your own recollections, posing as original thought?
Please excuse the terse nature of my question: I didn't want you think I was on your side of the fence.

No I will not. I don't want you to think that I can't. It is that telepathy is impossible to prove.

What you are asking for is proof of something that would literally result in murder or some kind of violence. Honestly. What do you think would happen if someone got on TV and repeated verbatim every word that every person in front of them thought?

They would be lynched by the TV studio crew. The crew would be so afraid that their drug habits, their sexual habits and what they have been stealing from the studio would be exposed, they would kill the person then and there.

Any person who undeniably proves that telepathy works would probably be murdered. Now if you and I were in a room somewhere with no witnesses, and I was able to prove it to you there, that would be different. If you tried violence, I would be confident I could deal with 1 person. I might suggest tying you to a table to prevent your violent urges from being acted on.

That is only if I could do it. I can't prove it to you. But what I describe above is the only safe way anyone can prove telepathy to another person. One on one action with someone they trust.

So using 'methods' to 'convert' people into spiritual beings - according to your definition of spirituality - is acceptable, whereas the same methods used to 'convert' them to a different viewpoint is evil. How exactly, using any method of logic known to the Greeks, or my Aunt Marie, would you justify that?
I think you are just winding us up.

Why? You know what is helpful. Pretend you are an alien xenobiologist who landed on earth to examine humans. Take yourself as a human out of the equation. That removes your bias and self interest in the outcome of what you are considering.

Let's say we observe the human animal. We observe that there are ways that these animals can be opened up so that they become spiritual beings with powers like telepathy, possession, etc. When the humans turn to spiritual beings, they are all happy and life together in peace.

Then we go to another continent to look at those humans. We observe that the people believe in money. They work all day long to attain money. Money is their god. Further study shows us that the methods used to convince people to work for money are the same methods used to convince people to become spiritual. We further note that the people on this continent are not happy. They are stressed, they are busy, they are not peaceful.

From a rational unbaised point of view, doesn't it seem like the happy peaceful people are good, while the people who are working for money are bad? They are not intrinsically bad. There life is bad because they are not happy and spiritual.

The only reason for the difference seems to be the final goal. Spirituality or money. We further note that on the continent after money, there is a small elite that is spiritual. When we use our high tech spy devices on them, we see this small elite in the money country uses the spiritual training to attain spirituality for themselves, their families and their circle of friends. It is only the majority of the workers who are not spiritual and not happy.

I think a reasonable conclusion to reach as xenobiologist is that the money country has a small elite that has perverted the methods used for spirituality to turn the majority of the populace into slaves for them, while the elite still enjoys the benefits of spirituality.

I think most people would say that a small group that lies or manipulates another group for their own self interest is bad. A priest is not converting people to spirituality for selfish means. He is doing it for the good of the person.

Con men convince little old ladies to give them their money because the con man is getting the money. He is selfish. There is no good that happens to the little old lady.

Sure. You say that like it is bad. That is how scientific people are. Belief is a force that truly works. If you believe you can ride a bicycle, you usually can. If you believe you will fall down, you usually do. The only difference is in the emotional confidence of the person. For some reason scientists think that is stupid.

Happeh,

Emotional confidence is a way to enhance / hurt performance. 'Believing' in yourself is a completely different concept than 'believing' in telepathy. Same word, completely different definition. If someone believes they won't get burned if they bathe in a blazing forrest fire, they will end up as crispy critters.

The type of 'belief' that I am referring to would be more accurately termed 'religions belief'. It is the acceptance of assertions as true without consideration of supportive or contradictory evidence. This typically manifests itself in two flavors. One is an idea is so attractive that people want to accept it as truth. The other is an idea is presented as an authority and people accept it as truth based on their unconditional trust (faith) in the authority directly or in the idea indirectly.


Yes it is a movie that is fiction. I agree. I also said somewhere that all TV shows are written by humans and based on humans. The aliens part is fiction as far as I know. I know the telepathy stuff is not.

TV shows like X-Files, Smallville, and Poltergeist? I went to the discovery channel, history channel, PBS, 10 O'Clock new and oddly enough found nothing lined up on telepathy. This tells me that the industry sees it as a as fantasy.

Let's get right to the point. Can you or anyone you know demonstrate telepathy? That 'faith' based BS is a copout... the observer doesn't have to be the experiencer to form a proof.

There is no way to prove telepathy to an outside person.

If you can't hear it and you don't have telepathy, there is no possible way to prove it to you.

What if I told you that your critical thinking was the reason you do not have telepathy?

by you consciously choosing to emphasize the factual part of your brain, you literally shut the door on your possible telepathic ability?

Belief is a force that truly works.

It is that telepathy is impossible to prove.

What you are asking for is proof of something that would literally result in murder or some kind of violence.

Any person who undeniably proves that telepathy works would probably be murdered

Perhaps I'm psychic after all. I did predict each of those silly answers! Happeh, it is increasingly clear that you are in need of some counseling. You're good for a laugh, though. In fact, I'm bookmarking this page so I can show an example of the woo-woo using this very argument in the future.

But what I describe above is the only safe way anyone can prove telepathy to another person. One on one action with someone they trust.Nonsense. It is clear your alleged spirituality has done nothing for your imagination. Here is a scheme that would work perfectly.

The target subject enters a room with ten individuals. One of the ten individuals is the telepath. The target subject does not know which individual this is. The target subject sits in the room for an agreed time, leaves, and summarises his thoughts during that period, in writing. These are witnessed and placed in a sealed envelope.
All ten, including the telepath, who remains anonymous, leaves, and privately right down notes on a sheet which is witnessed and sealed. The telepath identifies himself as such on his sheet, the others write whatever they please.
They all leave.

Complete safety for the telepath.

By the way, if you really believe that a telepath would be murdered in the circumstances where he demonstrated his powers, you are associating with the wrong kinds of people.

Let's say we observe the human animal. We observe that there are ways that these animals can be opened up so that they become spiritual beings with powers like telepathy, possession, etc. When the humans turn to spiritual beings, they are all happy and life together in peace.The spiritual persons I know are not possessed, do not claim telepathy or any special powers, yet they are happy balanced people. They also work, they earn money, they buy material things, but they are not defined by their possessions. They understand that money is useful, but is not everything. Your have created a false dichotomy. Black and white. Good and evil. No shades of grey.
In this approach you are mistaken. Badly mistaken. Corruptly mistaken.

Nonsense. It is clear your alleged spirituality has done nothing for your imagination. Here is a scheme that would work perfectly.

The target subject enters a room with ten individuals. One of the ten individuals is the telepath. The target subject does not know which individual this is. The target subject sits in the room for an agreed time, leaves, and summarises his thoughts during that period, in writing. These are witnessed and placed in a sealed envelope.
All ten, including the telepath, who remains anonymous, leaves, and privately right down notes on a sheet which is witnessed and sealed. The telepath identifies himself as such on his sheet, the others write whatever they please.
They all leave.

Complete safety for the telepath.

By the way, if you really believe that a telepath would be murdered in the circumstances where he demonstrated his powers, you are associating with the wrong kinds of people.

The spiritual persons I know are not possessed, do not claim telepathy or any special powers, yet they are happy balanced people. They also work, they earn money, they buy material things, but they are not defined by their possessions. They understand that money is useful, but is not everything. Your have created a false dichotomy. Black and white. Good and evil. No shades of grey.
In this approach you are mistaken. Badly mistaken. Corruptly mistaken.
what you mean by 'spiritual person'?

regarding 'telepathy' ,,,Oph, how good are you at being able to see body language?

two vewry simple questions..dont extrapolate unnecessarily..

Perhaps I'm psychic after all. I did predict each of those silly answers! Happeh, it is increasingly clear that you are in need of some counseling. You're good for a laugh, though. In fact, I'm bookmarking this page so I can show an example of the woo-woo using this very argument in the future.

My God, you're right!!!

what you mean by 'spiritual person'?
Wearing my spiritual hat I can reply "I can't define it, but I know what it is. That deep sense of connection between self and others, between self and the Universe. The sense of oneness. The awareness of something beyond the material.".

regarding 'telepathy' ,,,Oph, how good are you at being able to see body language?Excellent. I'm serious Duendy. I do this very well. Vastly better than most males, who are notoriously poor at it. I have found it hugely useful in business, and a source of much amusement in watching interactions of people in many situations.

Wearing my spiritual hat I can reply "I can't define it, but I know what it is. That deep sense of connection between self and others, between self and the Universe. The sense of oneness. The awareness of something beyond the material.".

me))))))Just an important point. i dont see spiritualityas being beyond th material. i fact i think that's when the trouble began/begins--is when they are separated

Excellent. I'm serious Duendy. I do this very well. Vastly better than most males, who are notoriously poor at it. I have found it hugely useful in business, and a source of much amusement in watching interactions of people in many situations.
have you ever had pychedelic experience and seen body language that way??

Telepathy has no apparent users; no apparent cause; no apparent evidence.
what about brainwaves? with a suitable decoder our thoughts could be transmitted and recieved over a distance.

This still isn't telepathy. The human brain has different frequencies that can be measured on the electromagnetic spectrum that can be correlated with confidence to specific activities, but there is no evidence that discreet data is transmitted with these waves. Indeed, it is very likely that all neural activity needed by the body and brain is transmitted via neural pathways.

Don't get me wrong, I believe whole heartedly in exploring the possibilities such things, but I still maintain that nutters that believe themselves to have "psychic powers" are nutters and nothing more. For the very reasons that Happeh gave in the quote in my last post.

but I still maintain that nutters that believe themselves to have "psychic powers" are nutters and nothing more.
i see, and agree
edit
isn't telepathy thought transmission over a distance?

have you ever had pychedelic experience and seen body language that way??Please define psychedelic. My singular drug is alcohol. Hardly psychedelic! I don't know quite what you are asking.

Lsd?

I used to have lots of it before decimalisation.

Please define psychedelic. My singular drug is alcohol. Hardly psychedelic! I don't know quite what you are asking.
...err, like have you had psychedelic experience and seen body language whilst doing so

i am not trying to one-up ya. i am not comin on as guru etc and claiming yo are worthles cause yo aint 'enlightened'....You hve freedom to experiment if you so wish

what i am getting at is, that my very first LSD Trip when 15 hd me in this situation at this prty........i didn't know what i had taken. it was tiniest of hlf a blue tab..........others at prty weren't trippin but were plying a game of TELEPATHY....ll comin clear huh?

so i m sat on couch and watchin tese people try and telepathize what thi person i thinking and drawing...and i am atching ll of this as trip comes up. i was hysterically lughing wtching their body lngage which revealed t me teir characters and what they were feeling. and the irony of theat and the game they were playing which in my dimension seemed SO absurdly limited just cracked me up....dont judge me. i was this 15 yar old kid and am rlaying to you what happned is all

right. can you not fthom a continuum betyween body language and more subtle forms of communiction....nd what bout with plants, trees, stones...etc...or is that TOO much for you to consider??

Beethoven's symphonys are a form of communication, from Beethoven to the listener. The major effort, and perhaps the major reward, is made (and received by Beethoven). As the 'intellect' of the other party in the communication declines, the communication becomes more one sided, till it is essentially a from of introspection. Nothing wrong with that. Very effective in fact. But it is not communication with another, it is communication with self. [Hence my attraction to solipsism.]

I believe that understanding intuition is the first step to developing telepathic abilities. If you are conscious of intuitive sensations like the "gut instinct" and pay attention to their symbolic meanings you have taken the first steps into the psi world, next should be the "intuitive pops" of information also called "psychic hits". Become aware of these intuitive events, consciously persue the symbolic meanings and you are half way to telepathy also called "mind speak".

I believe that understanding intuition is the first step to developing telepathic abilities.

Intuition has nothing to do with telepathy.

If you are conscious of intuitive sensations like the "gut instinct" and pay attention to their symbolic meanings

Gut feelings are 50/50, like any guesswork. They have no symbolic meanings.

"mind speak".

Horse pucky.

I believe ...

That's all you really had to say. The rest of your post is meaningless.

Gut feelings are 50/50, like any guesswork. They have no symbolic meanings.
You must have a screwed up life. Gut feelings, for me at least, run at a lot higher than a 50% success rate. As I noted earlier, intuition is the subconscious processing of recently received data, integrated with prior experience. On that basis we should expect a much higher success rate than that due to poor chance - unless we are crap at processing data, remembering past experience, and correlating the two.

Let's get right to the point. Can you or anyone you know demonstrate telepathy? That 'faith' based BS is a copout... the observer doesn't have to be the experiencer to form a proof.

Sure.

I told you it will never happen. No one is going to put themselves in front of a gunsight.

Nonsense. It is clear your alleged spirituality has done nothing for your imagination. Here is a scheme that would work perfectly.

The target subject enters a room with ten individuals. One of the ten individuals is the telepath. The target subject does not know which individual this is. The target subject sits in the room for an agreed time, leaves, and summarises his thoughts during that period, in writing. These are witnessed and placed in a sealed envelope.
All ten, including the telepath, who remains anonymous, leaves, and privately right down notes on a sheet which is witnessed and sealed. The telepath identifies himself as such on his sheet, the others write whatever they please.
They all leave..

Complete safety for the telepath.


You have no idea how the real world works. You believe in the safe civilized world you see on TV. That world is a lie meant to keep you stupid. There is one very obvious flaw in your plan. You don't see it because you live in a fantasy world.

What is to stop someone from killing everyone involved in the experiment? Sort of like when they drop bombs on Iraq and whoever is underneath dies. And, oh well, that is too bad.


By the way, if you really believe that a telepath would be murdered in the circumstances where he demonstrated his powers, you are associating with the wrong kinds of people.

It is not the people I associate with. It is reading the world news. The Isrealis murder palestinians everyday. No one cares. The USA murders Iraqis everyday. No one cares. The British murdered Menenzes on a subway crowded with people. Do you even know who menenzes is?

Who is going to care if someone murders some guy who was a telepath? Seriously? Are you going to hunt down the murderers and bring them to justice?



The spiritual persons I know are not possessed, do not claim telepathy or any special powers, yet they are happy balanced people. They also work, they earn money, they buy material things, but they are not defined by their possessions. They understand that money is useful, but is not everything. Your have created a false dichotomy. Black and white. Good and evil. No shades of grey.
In this approach you are mistaken. Badly mistaken. Corruptly mistaken.

Sure. Whatever you say. Spiritual means what it means to different people. Scientific people say "the dicitionary says it means this so that is what it means". Only to people who agree to be submissive to the dictionary. My definition of spirituality is probably different from other peoples.

There is good and evil. There is black and white. Evil's job is to cloud people's minds so they can no longer tell the difference between good and evil. The USA tortures people. The entire world knows it. Does anyone do anything about it? No. Because the evil that has inhabited the white house has clouded everyone's mind with legal opinions this and that.

Don't let my use of the word evil throw you. I am not saying it like a preacher shouting evil at a service. I am saying evil like I say laundry or car or bank. Evil is a word that describes people and the actions of people. No big deal, no hysteria, nothing mystical or magical.

The British murdered Menenzes on a subway crowded with people. Do you even know who menenzes is?

Who is going to care if someone murders some guy who was a telepath?

Why didn't a telepath tell Menezes not to go to work that day?

You must have a screwed up life. Gut feelings, for me at least, run at a lot higher than a 50% success rate.

If you base your gut feelings stricly on guess work, I can't see how that could be any higher than 50/50 chance overall. But if you base gut feelings on evidence, that could tip the scales in your favor.

I'm assuming the gut feelings that candy has are based on guess work.

[i]I'm assuming the gut feelings that candy has are based on guess work.
Is your assumption based on a gut feeling? :)

Sure.

I told you it will never happen. No one is going to put themselves in front of a gunsight.

Forget about the media. They can put themselves in front of me... no guns/weapons/other devices. Hell, I'll even sign an affidavit stating no harm will come to any such person.

Forget about the media. They can put themselves in front of me... no guns/weapons/other devices. Hell, I'll even sign an affidavit stating no harm will come to any such person.

U just don't get it. Why should anyone trust you? If someone grabbed you and pulled your toenails out, you would tell them anything.

Bush and the gang pull out peoples toenails everyday because they enjoy it.

Tony Blair had a judge sign an affidavit that the death of David Kelly was a suicide. Anyone with a brain knows it was assasination.

Let go of it. It will never happen. If you are truly curious, think that way. Someone will come to you.

Let me put it this way. If you are walking around thinking "Telepathy is bullshit. Those telepathic people are bullshit. If I meet anyone trying to say telepathy is real, I will attack them and ridicule them".

Then you meet a telepathic guy. You don't know it of course. He reads all that shit in your head above. Do you really think the man is going to talk to you? Your mind says as plain as day that you will attack and ridicule anyone talking about telepathy.

That is what you guys never figure out. You are so sure you are right, your brain switches off. If people really have telepathy, they know what you are thinking. If you are thinking bad things or hurtful things or unbeliveing things, they will read that from your mind and never waste time on you.

That is why I and other people tell you to have faith. If you have faith there is telepathy, and you walk around thinking that with a positive, good, friendly attitude, maybe one of them will decide to approach you.

It is all common sense if you only thought about it for a few minutes.

More strawman, paranoia laden poppycock.

For someone that seems to assert it is pointless to try and prove "telepathy," you are very fixated on arguing for it!

Mystery-mongers and significance-junkies always seem to seek status with wild, speculative claims that can never be proven. That's always the safe route in their minds, after all: safe with the knowledge that no matter what, the skeptics will never be able to prove a negative, and therefore it will make you look smart among the gullible when the other significance-junkies in the gallery chime in (like Candy and Devil Inside) and say what a good job you're doing with the skeptics.

How pitiful to be that insecure so as to seek acknowledgement from such peers.

U just don't get it. Why should anyone trust you?

Because I am sincere and have a history of engaging with 'PSI' members (Zanket, BlueMommaPhish, Devil Inside, to name a few) in a very positive manner. Basically, I've established credibility and trust.

I used to have lots of it before decimalisation.

Don't you mean £Sd? ;)

Gut feelings, for me at least, run at a lot higher than a 50% success rate.

I assume the 50/50 thing (ignoring intuition) only holds on equally likely outcomes. Certainly doesn't work with lottery numbers...

That is why I and other people tell you to have faith. If you have faith there is telepathy, and you walk around thinking that with a positive, good, friendly attitude, maybe one of them will decide to approach you.

It is all common sense if you only thought about it for a few minutes.

Have you been approached by any telepaths yet?

Is your assumption based on a gut feeling?

Nope. Evidence. ;)

Because I am sincere and have a history of engaging with 'PSI' members (Zanket, BlueMommaPhish, Devil Inside, to name a few) in a very positive manner. Basically, I've established credibility and trust.

I'll jump in and support Crunchy Cat.
From my experience CC has always maintained an open mind on these issues without lessening the criteria for proof. He has approached psi contentions with integrity and unfortnately this integrity has not allways been reflected.

It is up to the contender to prove his position.

A telepathic trial was undertaken not so long ago in which CC was a major particpant. The thread is linked:

Real time telepathic trial

http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=48723
if you read it you will find support for my opinion of CC's integrity.

I myself have full belief in the pheno of telepathy. I personally experience it every day, however it is often forgotten that telepathy requires at least two people. And to be perfectly honest people don't like having their minds read or manipulated.

So when it comes to developing telepathy, one must always keep in mind that other persons may and usually do instinctively defend and protect themselves. This is in essence why telepathy has yet to be proven as a deliberately willed pheno.

Human instincts also need to be developed. Now if someone has a way of developing someone elses instincts...let me know....

If Randi had one million dollars for a person who can come to his lab, sit in a chair, and on command come up with a genius level insight regarding something, Einstein would have died broke and been shown to be a fraud (at least by people who don't really know, or perhaps they do, perhaps thats why Randi is so secure in his understanding that he'll never have to fork over any money. His experimental 'constraints' violate the nature of that which is to be 'studied'). Some things are not applicable to command performances. That fact does not in itself invalidate those things, only the credibility or the intelligence of the 'experimenter/showman'.

Yes, telepathy can be 'accessed' by training, just not necessarily in the area that you think. It is not a superior brain function, it is something related to all being One. If there is only One Mind, and there is, then it is certainly no trick to access 'thoughts' wherever or whenever they might occur. This is just one siddhi (power) that is found on a sincere inward search for 'Truth/Reality'.
Seeking the 'powers' without the 'inner work' is seeking victory without war.
One is also warned against egoic attachments to these 'powers' when others go 'oooohhh and aahhhh' and "Aren't you special!" and feed the ego. That alone is a good reason to keep one's 'abilities' to oneself.
Many stop at this place of ego comfort and progress no further.
Do know, however, that once you have found and made use of the 'access code', the more that you excercise the 'ability', the easier, stronger and more 'at Will' it becomes.

And to be perfectly honest people don't like having their minds read or manipulated.

So when it comes to developing telepathy, one must always keep in mind that other persons may and usually do instinctively defend and protect themselves. This is in essence why telepathy has yet to be proven as a deliberately willed pheno.
First, people are not aware of being manipulated at that level, and their ego would not allow them to believe it even if they were told!
Second, perhaps one in a million has the training or the natural talent to realize what is happening. The others are absolutely clueless in their sleepwalk. Truly 'experiencing' what they 'think' and 'experience' is also a great act of empathy with no ill-will at all. It would be like having 'ill-will' toward 'self'. All is One.

It is all poppycock. If you claim otherwise, you need only provide the evidence, otherwise it remains poppycock.

Your beliefs are absolutely irrelevent to any and all but yourself. We all believe what is most rewarding to believe. Logic and evidence has little to do with it. Ask a Xtian! Or a 'Materialist'! My experience is not open to your evaluation. I need prove nothing to you and obviously you either have not read or do not understand my above post re: Randi.

When you gaze skyward on a beautiful clear summer's day and see the blue sky, would you consider that you have a 'belief' that the sky is blue or does your experience 'trump' belief? What would you think of someone arguing that it is not blue but fuscia while standing next to you? What if he asks you to 'prove' it is blue?

"Unclench your Mind!"

And I was wondering how to tell a male poppy from a female! *__-

When you gaze skyward on a beautiful clear summer's day and see the blue sky, would you consider that you have a 'belief' that the sky is blue or does your experience 'trump' belief?


Belief really doesn't play a role hear. The wavelength of the sky's coloration can be measured and it falls in a range that humans consider 'blue'.


What would you think of someone arguing that it is not blue but fuscia while standing next to you? What if he asks you to 'prove' it is blue?


Measure the wavelength and show where it falls.

Belief really doesn't play a role hear. The wavelength of the sky's coloration can be measured and it falls in a range that humans consider 'blue'.

Measure the wavelength and show where it falls.
Yo Crunch, are you serious here? This? is your response?
First, I didn't offer what I did for a knee-jerk argument from within clenched minds.
Sorry, but experience trumps speculation, IMHO.
I was answering a serious question from one seriously questioning. In this area I have experience and you toddle up to me with your wires and machines and tell me to look at them and not upon the vault above so that you may 'prove' to me that what I experience is false, and your little machines and wires will 'prove' it so?!?!? A machine that wouldn't know 'blue' if it were made of lapis with turquoise dials? Only Mind can know 'blue'. A machine can 'know/experience' nothing. You couldn't have been serious... Hahahahahahaah....

It is easy to see what YOU 'believe' in!

"Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain! Science alone is the Great and Powerful Oz!!!"

"Unclench your Mind!"

It seems that some people are completely certain that telepathy exists but there is always an excuse why no one can prove it...

It seems that some people are completely certain that telepathy exists but there is always an excuse why no one can prove it...
Only a maniac is 'completely certain' about anything!
I am not certain through belief, my knowledge is experiential. Telepathy is as common to me in my everyday life as sucking wind is in yours. My words are not born of hypothesis and extrapolation, they are accurate descriptors of my daily life.
Did you not read or understand my previous post about 'evidence'?
Ok, let me try this another way.
Imagine that I have a leg missing.Gone from the knee down.
You are sitting 5 meters from where I am sitting.
We have not seen each other as the room has been dark since our entry.
You are blindfolded.
the light is turned on.
I tell you that I have my leg missing.
You ask me to prove it.
You want to 'smell' it gone.
As your nose is incapable of the transmission of this data, your sense of smell is incapable of providing 'evidence' of that which is directly before it.
Get where I'm going here. It isn't difficult if you try...
I respond, sir, remove your blindfold that you may see that which is before you!
You reply, "I, sir, shall not as I have a very fine nose and olfactory sense in general. Beneath it the bouquet of many fine flavors have appreciateively trod! And, sir, this finely tuned proboscis can detect no reality in your claim of leglessness!"
Capisce'?
Perhaps you wish to use your sense of touch?
From 5 meters away, though I be well beyond range, you know of the fine services that your delicate sense of touch is capable of rendering.
Stop me if you are understanding what I am saying.
Have you no machine to help you understand? Some equation?

There are many flavors of evidence, even within science. To insist on that which you insist denotes the same blind 'faith', simple 'belief', that any zealous fundamentalist exhibits when he refuses to even recognise the simplist scientific principle right before his eyes. Your fundamentalism is no better because it is called 'empiricism' then the fundamnentalism of any other religion.

Unclench your Mind!

Your arguments don't merit a formal put-down."Unclench your Mind!"Unclench your sphincter muscle and let all the fecal matter out.

Only a maniac is 'completely certain' about anything!
.....
zealous fundamentalist exhibits when he refuses to even recognise the simplist scientific principle right before his eyes. Your fundamentalism is no better because it is called 'empiricism' then the fundamnentalism of any other religion.
......
Unclench your Mind!
No. I just want someone to prove that they can use telepathy. You respond like this is an unreasonable request.

Don't worry about my beliefs; forget the analogies involving blindfolds. If such a thing exists surely there is some way to demonstrate it.

you got to understand the context your asking this in...IF materialistic acience could harness the paranormal for its greedy fukin progress trip and perpetual wars it would..........in fact the elitists you dont believe in actually apparently ARE believing in the occult and seek to use it along wit materialistic science for their vile purposes

you have to understand that your mindset ala 'science' --its origins, is immoral, in that it is mechanical/solless having agreed to leave VALUE OUTof its proceedings

do you see the problem?

it means your relentelessly trying to fit in subtle experience into your machine-box of tricks cannot ever win, and if it does 'find out' about 'telepathy', whatever.... will carry on doin what it knows best. which is mechanical and immoral.....having lost its soul right at the beginning

you got to understand the context your asking this in...IF materialistic acience could harness the paranormal for its greedy fukin progress trip and perpetual wars it would..........
One thing at a time duendy. We are not discussing what anyone would do with it. I want someone to show that it exists.


in fact the elitists you dont believe in actually apparently ARE believing in the occult and seek to use it along wit materialistic science for their vile purposes
Please stick with the subject.


you have to understand that your mindset ala 'science' --its origins, is immoral, in that it is mechanical/solless having agreed to leave VALUE OUTof its proceedings
Science is a method duendy. It is not immoral. Again duendy you really should do a basic physics or chemistry course. I don't mean that as an insult but you have shown over and over that you do not understand that which you are criticising.

do you see the problem?
Yes the problem is that no one seems to have telepathy.


it means your relentelessly trying to fit in subtle experience into your machine-box of tricks cannot ever win, and if it does 'find out' about 'telepathy', whatever.... will carry on doin what it knows best. which is mechanical and immoral.....having lost its soul right at the beginning
Yes yes more science bashing. As I said in a previous post it just sounds like excuses why no one is able to show that they have telepathy. It really shouldn't be that hard.

One thing at a time duendy. We are not discussing what anyone would do with it. I want someone to show that it exists.

me))i know i know ya do luv...

Please stick with the subject.

me)))))i dont like specializin, but ok just this once

Science is a method duendy. It is not immoral. Again duendy you really should do a basic physics or chemistry course. I don't mean that as an insult but you have shown over and over that you do not understand that which you are criticising.

me))))does science Do itself?....did science invent itself?...can we dispense with Glaileo's part in it, and the rest, like Bacon, Descartes and so on...welll?
the answer is no. science is used by people with subjective as well as objective mindsets

Yes the problem is that no one seems to have telepathy.

me))))how do yo KNOW?.....i know what yu are gonna say next cause i'm telepathic. ie., 'noone has proved it yet'.am i right? THERE dear boyyy is your eveeedence!!


Yes yes more science bashing. As I said in a previous post it just sounds like excuses why no one is able to show that they have telepathy. It really shouldn't be that hard.
let me ask you this. how do you envisage a succesful scientific experiment proving telepathy to your specifications?

Yo Crunch, are you serious here? This? is your response?
First, I didn't offer what I did for a knee-jerk argument from within clenched minds.

The response is intended to remove the 'belief' assertion from the equation.


Sorry, but experience trumps speculation, IMHO.
I was answering a serious question from one seriously questioning. In this area I have experience and you toddle up to me with your wires and machines and tell me to look at them and not upon the vault above so that you may 'prove' to me that what I experience is false, and your little machines and wires will 'prove' it so?!?!? A machine that wouldn't know 'blue' if it were made of lapis with turquoise dials? Only Mind can know 'blue'. A machine can 'know/experience' nothing. You couldn't have been serious... Hahahahahahaah....

* Person 'A' consistently experiences hearing people talk when nobody is around. Because the idea is attractive and the exerpience exists, he concludes he has long range telepathy.

* Person 'B' consistently experiences hearing people talk when nobody is around. He carefully writes down the content of the words he hears and realizes that it is nonsensical and doesn't correspond to truth. He next measures the electrical activity in his brain and realizes that at least one part of his brain is out of sync (frequency-wise). When this is corrected with a TSM device, the voices disappear and upon further experimentation the voices can be induced in others by artifically de-syncing the same part of the brain. Person 'B' reviews the evidence and sees it supports the notion that his brain has an information processing defect that creates auditory 'noise'.


It is easy to see what YOU 'believe' in!


That's just it, I try my hardest to eliminate 'belief' as a way to understand reality.


"Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain! Science alone is the Great and Powerful Oz!!!"


Science has proven to be the best way to ask reality questions and get truthful answers.

Only a maniac is 'completely certain' about anything!
I am not certain through belief, my knowledge is experiential.

To my experience you are either lying or deluded. You can either demonstrate the telepathy or you can't.

It still amazes me that the people who announce the loudest that 'telepathy' exists are the very people who claim the skeptic can never see it. Bad energies, right.

One things for sure, in the interest of boosting your self image among the gallery of believers, you're willing to face down the big, bad skeptic and earn points with them. They speak your srcreen name at woo-woo sites far and wide.

Telepathic claims are all about personal attention. .... unless someone is willing to prove differently.

I knew you were thinking that.

me))))does science Do itself?....did science invent itself?...can we dispense with Glaileo's part in it, and the rest, like Bacon, Descartes and so on...welll?the answer is no. science is used by people with subjective as well as objective mindsets
You said science was immoral. I think it is niether moral or immoral. It is a method used to explain the universe around us. (simplistic definition)


me))))how do yo KNOW?.....i know what yu are gonna say next cause i'm telepathic. ie., 'noone has proved it yet'.am i right? THERE dear boyyy is your eveeedence!!
I don't know. Which is why I said "Yes the problem is that no one seems to have telepathy." That is a perfectly correct statement until it is proven to exist.


let me ask you this. how do you envisage a succesful scientific experiment proving telepathy to your specifications?
Ophiolite did mention a possible test on a previous page involving a target concentrating on something while a telepath writes down their thoughts.

Using strict testing protocols someone would have to get results above those expected by chance. This would have to be repeatable of course.

You said science was immoral. I think it is niether moral or immoral. It is a method used to explain the universe around us. (simplistic definition)

mew____no i mean both Mscience itself and
Mscientists+Mscience-----from now on i am gonna do this term 'Mscience to mean materialistic science, OK..........alright alright, as A tool itis useful analytically. but when seen as philosophy, tus making out all is lifeless material cept precious scientist brain. then it's immoral, cause power corrupts......might seem harml;ess here in thises boards----tho efen here tings can get hosTILE d'youlll!....but its mode of operation has crushed people wit differentworldviews....whcih is immorality


I don't know. Which is why I said "Yes the problem is that no one seems to have telepathy." That is a perfectly correct statement until it is proven to exist.

me)))))))you mscientists seem to confuse 'i dont know' it all is matter and this will be too when proven


Ophiolite did mention a possible test on a previous page involving a target concentrating on something while a telepath writes down their thoughts.

Using strict testing protocols someone would have to get results above those expected by chance. This would have to be repeatable of course.

ohhhmy gaaaaaawd, how veery booooorin

mew____no i mean both Mscience itself and
Mscientists+Mscience-----from now on i am gonna do this term 'Mscience to mean materialistic science, OK..........alright alright, as A tool itis useful analytically. but when seen as philosophy, tus making out all is lifeless material cept precious scientist brain. then it's immoral, cause power corrupts......might seem harml;ess here in thises boards----tho efen here tings can get hosTILE d'youlll!....but its mode of operation has crushed people wit differentworldviews....whcih is immorality

Huh? You don't make a whole lot of sense here. You go from the accusation that science says all material is lifeless except err scientist's brains so it is immoral (?!) because power corrupts. Righty.

Don't know what you mean by things getting hostile either.

If science has crushed any worldviews then those people will have to deal with the truth. This is not immoral. Science is not there to comfort people with delusions.

ohhhmy gaaaaaawd, how veery booooorin
Yes reality often seems boring to believers. I guess this is why you are so keen to believe in anything that will make your life seem more interesting.

Do you have a better test for telepathy duendy?

shall remain nameless:

His experimental 'constraints' violate the nature of that which is to be 'studied'). Some things are not applicable to command performances.

Excuses don't cut it. Experiment requirements are agreed upon by both parties. If its not applicable to so-called 'command performances,' then its most likely crap. You either have the power or you don't, simple.

Yes, telepathy can be 'accessed' by training, just not necessarily in the area that you think. It is not a superior brain function, it is something related to all being One. If there is only One Mind, and there is, then it is certainly no trick to access 'thoughts' wherever or whenever they might occur.

Within ones own mind, that could be true. But, one cannot access anothers thoughts, that is pure horsepucky. That has never been shown by anyone.

One is also warned against egoic attachments to these 'powers' when others go 'oooohhh and aahhhh' and "Aren't you special!" and feed the ego. That alone is a good reason to keep one's 'abilities' to oneself.

More excuses and more crap. Since no one has ever shown those abilities, then no one has ever called someone special preceded by ooohs and aaahs. And if they were to keep it to themselves, why are so many nutjobs claiming they have the ability, regardless of the fact they cannot show their abilities to anyone.

Do know, however, that once you have found and made use of the 'access code', the more that you excercise the 'ability', the easier, stronger and more 'at Will' it becomes.

Do know, that you are either lying or delusional.

To my experience you are either lying or deluded. You can either demonstrate the telepathy or you can't.
I have direct 'eye' witnesses that would swear in court under oath as to what they have experienced which you will discount as you are not one of them. And even if you were a direct witness you would not accept as it violates your invested 'world view'.

Now, the poster of this topic had a specific question that he wished to discuss. Why it it that you clenched materialists feel the need to obfuscate and HIJACK every thread of this nature? The question was not "Do you believe and why". If it was, then feel free. Why is it that you pathetic clueless materialist uncreative sort feel the need to enter a conversation shouting with arms waving attempting to drown out the conversation with your cement headed disrespectful noise? Feel free to start your own thread on your own subject and take your fundamnentalist sh!t there. No one here wants your bible waving noise! Now, with respect to the original poster, FuK OFF and go away.

Am I being clear enough that even uncreative cement headed materialists like yourself can understand when you arent wanted. Do none of you have any respect for anyone but yourselves? Faugh!
{spits in the dust}
Shooo!

The response is intended to remove the 'belief' assertion from the equation.
That's just it, I try my hardest to eliminate 'belief' as a way to understand reality.
Impossible to do. At some and many points, you will believe in assumptions and work from there. You cannot eliminate 'belief'. You appear to 'believe' in the infallibility of 'empiricism'...

Science has proven to be the best way to ask reality questions and get truthful answers.
Perhaps for you. Seems funny, though, that after all this time, science is still being surprised at the directions that those questions lead and the paradoxes they entail. Science can not yet define 'reality'. That is for metaphysics. Truthful? Show me any scientific text that defines 'Truth'!

I have direct 'eye' witnesses that would swear in court under oath...

And of course, no one has ever lied under oath.

*tongue planted firmly in cheek*

Looks like you riled up his emotions there skin

I have direct 'eye' witnesses that would swear in court under oath...

And of course, no one has ever lied under oath.

*tongue planted firmly in cheek*
How did I know that you'd have to go there?
Could it be the predictability of fossilized minds?
I know somewhere you can firmly plant that tongue where it will actually do some good...
(just ask! *__- )

A perfect example of a 'religious belief' that comes face to face with something 'different'.. Sidestep, shuffle, wave arms, shout enough noise where you can no longer hear.. na na na na na na na na dummm de dimmmm ne ne naaaaaa anything from an equally valid different perspective.
Perspectives that do not change regularly, like underwear, start to similarly stink!

Looks like you riled up his emotions there skin
Dont break your arm patting yourself on the back.
One, at least I have emotions, and two I am enjoying telling you clueless cement headed clenched uncreative fossils what I feel about your mewlings.
I an playing the game. Do you really think that you have that much power? Hahahahahaahahahahahaah... It is you who are deluded!

Now, if the rest of you uncreative garbage hasn't scared Lomion off of his own thread, and he wishes to discuss further with me, I'll be glad to.
I won't waste anymore time with the rest of you though, except to say that you exhibit pathological responses and need emotional help.. Clenched people are that way usually due to a stunted emotional growth, hence the 'carved in stone' materialism. Fear is at the bottom... Pathetic!
Enough already.
Have a nice day.
Unclench your Minds!

Impossible to do. At some and many points, you will believe in assumptions and work from there. You cannot eliminate 'belief'. You appear to 'believe' in the infallibility of 'empiricism'...

I actually agree somewhat. 'Belief' is impossible to eliminate for any human being today. What is not impossible is to understand that 'belief' is often used as substitution for 'i dont know'. Knowing this, anyone can mitigate the risk of 'belief'.

I think 'belief' in empiricism is being confused with acceotance of reality. It doesn't matter what I believe... reality is what it is.


Perhaps for you. Seems funny, though, that after all this time, science is still being surprised at the directions that those questions lead and the paradoxes they entail. Science can not yet define 'reality'. That is for metaphysics.

It's not a personal 'Jesus' kind of thing (i.e. just for me). No other method on earth allows us to ask reality questions and get truthful answers. Please feel free to contradict the assertion with evidence.

Science may produce surprising results, certainly has not uncovered all the answers, hasn't defined reality yet, etc. So what? Having to say "I don't know" is far superior than substituting the absence of knowedge with fantasy (metaphysics... intelligent design... psychic powers... god... the tooth fairy).


Truthful? Show me any scientific text that defines 'Truth'!

Here's a starter.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truth#Theories_about_truth

Basically it's reality without interpretation or interpretation validated by reality.

Dont break your arm patting yourself on the back.
One, at least I have emotions, and two I am enjoying telling you clueless cement headed clenched uncreative fossils what I feel about your mewlings.
I an playing the game. Do you really think that you have that much power? Hahahahahaahahahahahaah... It is you who are deluded!

Self back-patting is being confused with pointing out an intentional action that produced a predictable result. I think it's great that you have such strong emotion and that it gives you pleasure expressing them. That's really what the whole PSI thing is all about. Expressing your emotions and making yourself feel good / creative / important / attractive.

Any 'power' anyone has comes from their understanding and what they can do with it. In Skin's case he understood human psychology quite well and made you behave in a manner that he wanted.

Self back-patting is being confused with pointing out an intentional action that produced a predictable result. I think it's great that you have such strong emotion and that it gives you pleasure expressing them. That's really what the whole PSI thing is all about. Expressing your emotions and making yourself feel good / creative / important / attractive.
Wrong, Crunch, it is what the whole HUMAN thing is about. Believing what is most rewarding. Everyone 'believes' what is most rewarding. Of the definition of 'rewarding', logical and intellectual is only a subset. I dont express emotions to make me feel anything, I express them because they are there and part of my humanity which cannot be divorced from my 'intellectualism'. Lack of integration of one's 'completeness' is pathological.

Any 'power' anyone has comes from their understanding and what they can do with it. In Skin's case he understood human psychology quite well and made you behave in a manner that he wanted.
Nonsense. He displays little understanding of the totality of what it means to be an integrated human, and 'made' me do nothing. Or is this some around the corner way of trying to invalidate something I said by creating this straw-man?

I actually agree somewhat. 'Belief' is impossible to eliminate for any human being today. What is not impossible is to understand that 'belief' is often used as substitution for 'i dont know'. Knowing this, anyone can mitigate the risk of 'belief'.
It is impossible to eliminate and you are unwilling to accept its necessary existence as an integral part of the equation. 'Mitigate'? A fools errand...

I think 'belief' in empiricism is being confused with acceotance of reality. It doesn't matter what I believe... reality is what it is.
What a pathetic life. You are the helpless victim of a life that comes from somewhere 'out there', with which you muct somehow 'cope' the best you can, under the circumstances. How powerless. How... 'grey'. YOUR truth, YOUR reality, YOUR life, not mine. You cannot even find a universally accepted definition of Reality in any scientific tomes. It has been the subject of metaphysical philosophy for millenia. Yet all of a sudden, YOU KNOW what it is... for everyone. So, if we just accept your definition (forthcoming?) we all will finally know? How exciting!

It's not a personal 'Jesus' kind of thing (i.e. just for me). No other method on earth allows us to ask reality questions and get truthful answers. Please feel free to contradict the assertion with evidence.
The 'empirical evidence' (your 'Jesus' again) is that previous TRUTHS that science has found had subsequently, almost all of them, been altered as new data is found, again, and again... Just stopping somewhere on the continuum and saying that you are done looking, you will accept the current understanding as your TRUTH is intellectually lazy and exactly equates to religious fundamnentalism.

Science may produce surprising results, certainly has not uncovered all the answers, hasn't defined reality yet, etc. So what? Having to say "I don't know" is far superior than substituting the absence of knowedge with fantasy (metaphysics... intelligent design... psychic powers... god... the tooth fairy).
Anyone that discounts the field of metaphysics as fantasy is either horribly ignorant, incapable of understanding what it is, or a blind 'true believer'. You sound like the 'believer'.
"I have my beliefs, I will not hear your fantasy! It is the work of the devil!!"
Unclench your mind!

Here's a starter. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truth#Theories_about_truth

Basically it's reality without interpretation or interpretation validated by reality.
No need to even go there as I see what the link says, "Theories_about_truth"
Is that the best you got?
Christian sites do better to promote their TRUTH. At least they come right out and tell you that their belief is the TRUTH! Not a 'theory'. I guess if you do not know Truth, all you can do is 'theorize'...

I'm sorry, but with respect to the author of this thread I will not continue this conversation here. My apologies to Lomion.

Wrong, Crunch, it is what the whole HUMAN thing is about. Believing what is most rewarding. Everyone 'believes' what is most rewarding. Of the definition of 'rewarding', logical and intellectual is only a subset. I dont express emotions to make me feel anything, I express them because they are there and part of my humanity which cannot be divorced from my 'intellectualism'. Lack of integration of one's 'completeness' is pathological.

Interesting response and from what I gather, the assertion is people 'believe' what is most rewarding and emotional processing is a determinant of what 'most rewarding' is. It feels good to think a human brain can interpret the information in a foreign brain. That feeling is rewarding and that's why PSI is around. This subsection of the forum is a plethora evidence to support this assertion and there is ZERO evidence to contradict it.


Nonsense. He displays little understanding of the totality of what it means to be an integrated human, and 'made' me do nothing. Or is this some around the corner way of trying to invalidate something I said by creating this straw-man?

I am willing to bet that he knows he could interview college students at a desk smelling of beer and predict with great accuracy what the answer to the question "what are you doing this weekend?" will be. The point being is that he is aware of how to ellicit specific responses.


It is impossible to eliminate and you are unwilling to accept its necessary existence as an integral part of the equation. 'Mitigate'? A fools errand...


Maybe I wasn't heard the first time. I AGREE that it is impossible to eliminate for any human on the planet today. I disagree that the original 'blue sky' assertion has to be 'belief' founded. And yes 'mitigate'... long term (next 500 million years or so) not keeping belief in check could lead to extinction quite easily.


What a pathetic life. You are the helpless victim of a life that comes from somewhere 'out there', with which you muct somehow 'cope' the best you can, under the circumstances. How powerless. How... 'grey'. YOUR truth, YOUR reality, YOUR life, not mine. You cannot even find a universally accepted definition of Reality in any scientific tomes. It has been the subject of metaphysical philosophy for millenia. Yet all of a sudden, YOU KNOW what it is... for everyone. So, if we just accept your definition (forthcoming?) we all will finally know? How exciting!


I am not sure where the interpretation came from where I could define reality. Sounds like your trying to make me take ownership of your assertions. Regarding what I am... it's a manifestation of self awarness in space-time. Nothing helpess, victimizing, or powerless about it.


The 'empirical evidence' (your 'Jesus' again) is that previous TRUTHS that science has found had subsequently, almost all of them, been altered as new data is found, again, and again... Just stopping somewhere on the continuum and saying that you are done looking, you will accept the current understanding as your TRUTH is intellectually lazy and exactly equates to religious fundamnentalism.

It's ok if science re-models. If something is wrong it can be corrected. If something is incomplete, it can be completed. Science can get answers from reality. Sometimes the question is bad. Sometimes the answer is mis-understood. Regarding the whole 'stopping somewhere' bit, you're trying to make me take ownership of assertions that aren't mine again. I never said anyone is 'done looking'. All the while, I opened the door for supplying contradictory evidence and none has been provided.


Anyone that discounts the field of metaphysics as fantasy is either horribly ignorant, incapable of understanding what it is, or a blind 'true believer'. You sound like the 'believer'.
"I have my beliefs, I will not hear your fantasy! It is the work of the devil!!"
Unclench your mind!


I was too hard on Metaphysics. It started off as a philosophy that birthed science and has evolved in a way that is attracting alot of folks whom integrate their 'spiritual' positions into it. The problem isn't with Metaphysics conceptually. The problem is the people whom are driving it.


No need to even go there as I see what the link says, "Theories_about_truth"
Is that the best you got?
Christian sites do better to promote their TRUTH. At least they come right out and tell you that their belief is the TRUTH! Not a 'theory'. I guess if you do not know Truth, all you can do is 'theorize'...

The critieria was to provide a science definition. Science deals with theory and the link's text shouldn't come as a surprise. What's more important is the content of the URL and the simple definition I provided. Anyhow, you asked, I provided, you ignored. The message is that you're unwilling to learn.

Interesting response and from what I gather, the assertion is people 'believe' what is most rewarding and emotional processing is a determinant of what 'most rewarding' is.
No, 'emotional rewards' is merely a subset of 'all possible rewards'.

The brain "tends to search for and hold onto the most rewarding view of events, much as it does of objects," -www.edge.org. It is much more rewarding to attribute death to God's will, and to see in disasters hints of the hand of God.

"We humans are naturally gullible — disbelieving requires an extraordinary expenditure of energy. It is a limited resource. I suggest ranking the skepticism by its consequences on our lives. True, the dangers of organized religion used to be there — but they have been gradually replaced with considerably ruthless and unintrospective social-science ideology." - http://www.edge.org/
__________________________________________________

I have direct 'eye' witnesses that would swear in court under oath as to what they have experienced which you will discount as you are not one of them.

Sure you do. All good scam artitists, cons, charletans, faith healers, revivalists, etc. have armies of "witnesses" and testimonials from which to draw some bit of validation for their claim. And if it isn't a con or a scam, then undoubtedly you have a little following of gullible believers who will be willing to say they saw whatever you wish -perhaps they'll even believe they saw it.

But whenever the microscope of science is placed over the slide of wild claims of telepathy, the telepaths are suddenly unable to perform. Apparently the "materialists" give off "bad vibs" or "negative energies." Or is that the evidence of such sacred abilities is for the true believer only?

You remind me of the neighbor I used to have that was into Wicca and "The Craft." She claimed to be able to cast all sorts of spells and use Reiki and all sorts of nonsense. But when asked to show it? "You're not a believer, dude. It won't work with you."

Right.


Now, the poster of this topic had a specific question that he wished to discuss. Why it it that you clenched materialists feel the need to obfuscate and HIJACK every thread of this nature?

Simple. This is a science board. True enough, this is the parapsychology sub-forum of that board, but it is still a science board. If you expect to be able to make extraordinary claims about silly nonsense like telepathy and go out on the limb and claim to be able to do it on a regular basis, you naturally must expect to be ridiculed. And deserve it.

On the other hand. If you were to actually show some evidence (eye witness testimony does not equal evidence), data obtained from a controlled experiment, that show telepathy exists, I'll willingly eat crow. Until then, you're either lying or delusional.

The question was not "Do you believe and why".

The thread topic was poppycock. Horse-hockey to quote my esteemed colleage. The only way one can develop telepathy with any reasonable measure of success is through literature. Fiction to be precise.

As long as there are those who are willing to lie about their claims or be deluded enough not to temper their beliefs in a science forum, there should always be those willing to call them on it.

If you find my posts offensive, I really don't care. There are those for whom it is one's duty to offend.

No, 'emotional rewards' is merely a subset of 'all possible rewards'.

The brain "tends to search for and hold onto the most rewarding view of events, much as it does of objects," -www.edge.org. It is much more rewarding to attribute death to God's will, and to see in disasters hints of the hand of God.

That example is attrcative... pleasing to the mind... and pleasure is emotional. Maybe there is a different example supporting the assertion?


"We humans are naturally gullible — disbelieving requires an extraordinary expenditure of energy. It is a limited resource. I suggest ranking the skepticism by its consequences on our lives. True, the dangers of organized religion used to be there — but they have been gradually replaced with considerably ruthless and unintrospective social-science ideology." - http://www.edge.org/
__________________________________________________

Yep, it's an great article with excellent points. It demonstrates alot of the harm that can come of 'belief'. What doesn't change is that assertions of PSI abilities have no supportive evidence.

Within ones own mind, that could be true. But, one cannot access anothers thoughts, that is pure horsepucky. That has never been shown by anyone.

It is not horsepucky. It is true. Forget about "I didn't see it on the discovery channel, so you must be lying.

I think scientists are myopic. They only see science. They have no clue about politics or social agendas. As a scientist, the only thing they can see is "prove something is true or not". They fail to see that politicians and regular people have the motive to interfere with scientific fact. If science says that politicians all have a mental problem and should be in insane asylums, you can bet the politicians will murder that scientist and burn his research.

Scientists need to come out of the lab and see how the violent really truly run the world. All that stuff from school and the media about democracy and stuff is just brain programming to keep you working in the lab, making new inventions to make the violent elite wealthy.


One is also warned against egoic attachments to these 'powers' when others go 'oooohhh and aahhhh' and "Aren't you special!" and feed the ego. That alone is a good reason to keep one's 'abilities' to oneself.

And why do they do this? Because people like you or the other naysayers in this thread say "well if you can read minds, why don't you go to amazing randi and get 1 million dollars?". The warnings against getting a big head are reasonable warnings because the first thing most people think of is, "How can I use this ability to take advantage of others for my own selfish needs?".

Don't let them fool you though. Most of them do use telepathy for their own selfish needs.


More excuses and more crap. Since no one has ever shown those abilities,

You really ought to be more accurate or truthful. "No one has ever shown these abilities to you, the poster known as Q.


then no one has ever called someone special preceded by ooohs and aaahs. And if they were to keep it to themselves, why are so many nutjobs claiming they have the ability, regardless of the fact they cannot show their abilities to anyone.


Because you fail to listen. I think I or someone else mentioned that people can naturally resist telepathy. Some can, some cannot, some to varying degrees. If you say to yourself, "I am not going to let my mind be read", and you do it with full concentration, focus and will power, you can probably stop most people.

So if a test is set up, and you are sitting there with your full intellect and willpower, thinking, "This is bullshit", then nothing will happen. Not because it is false or a lie. But because you have stopped the test with your refusal to cooperate.

Then like I said before. If someone says to you "you killed someone and buried their body in the park", are you going to jump up and attack them for that? Everyone has things to hide. Everyone. Because of this, most people, if they really did think telepathy was real, would do anything possible to stop it, or stop the people who can do it.

Happeh, I see the world has been unkind to you. I can think of no other reason that you would:
a) Believe in the conspiracy theory of government.
b) Reject the logic of science.
c) Apply rigid stereotyping to the diversity of humanity.
d) Grasp at the ephemeral straws of pseudo-science
It's quite an unattractive combination. Interestingly, you could change. An open mind, an education and a little more trust in real people might just do it. Are you ready to give it a shot?

It is not horsepucky. It is true. Forget about "I didn't see it on the discovery channel, so you must be lying.

It is horsepucky. And the Discovery Channel is usually horsepucky, too.

I think scientists are myopic. They only see science. They have no clue about politics or social agendas.

Its clear you've no first clue about science. Sometimes politics and agenda are painfully clear to researchers. And the comment, "they see only science," is telling as well. I suppose you're referring to "only that which is measurable." But what you're really saying is, "science won't use its imagination while testing an idea." Well, no kidding, Barney. Your imagination's fine for pretending rain is lemon drops and gum drops (and "oh, what a rain it would be"), but for explaining the world, science relies on the material and the physical. Reality.

Duendy is always going on about "materialist" this and "materialist" that, but face it. If it isn't material, then what is it? If it isn't real, then its fake. imagined.

So called "telepaths" and 'esp' proponents are fake. imagined.

There is no telepathy. Anyone who says there is, is full of shit, lying, or deluded (or some combination thereof).

Huh? You don't make a whole lot of sense here. You go from the accusation that science says all material is lifeless except err scientist's brains so it is immoral (?!) because power corrupts. Righty.

me))))))was emphasizing scientist's high n mighty opinion of hirself is all. ie., they--the mscientists--assume complexmatter produces consciousness. but rthat THEIRprecious brain-producing-consciousnesses will be top o' the tree. how many times the the mscientists here take on that superior ground ....?exxxxactly! wasn't so hard was it?

Don't know what you mean by things getting hostile either.

me))i know. caus YOUR on their side so yous dont feels it darlin


If science has crushed any worldviews then those people will have to deal with the truth. This is not immoral. Science is not there to comfort people with delusions.

me)))))but heyyy. come close....closer still. bit closeer.....pssst. 'yu dont KNOW 'the truth'.....you'll impose your WORLDVIEW. andin the pocess are making a godamn awafgul mess of it, despite all yer flashy gadgits. and actually all them flash gadgets spew toxic shit

Yes reality often seems boring to believers. I guess this is why you are so keen to believe in anything that will make your life seem more interesting.

me)))))and you know reality huh. all you know is facts facts facts, like yer friends. like A machine! a huge part of your being you have let atrophy!

Do you have a better test for telepathy duendy?
test shmest

Do you understand the difference between science, technology, business and politics Duendy?
Science investigates, technology applies discoveries, business implements them, politics structures them. Try not to confuse the different roles.

Do you understand the difference between science, technology, business and politics Duendy?
Science investigates, technology applies discoveries, business implements them, politics structures them. Try not to confuse the different roles.
oh shneezle dizzle....who ya patronizin?

me?

i a tellyou youuuu. that all those supposedly sepARate 'roles' is wokin fo mr maaaan. put that in yer chrimbo-pipe and smioke it

Correct. I was patronising you. Don't you want a patron? Or even just a father figure?

Happeh daze:

I think scientists are myopic. They only see science. They have no clue about politics or social agendas. As a scientist, the only thing they can see is "prove something is true or not". They fail to see that politicians and regular people have the motive to interfere with scientific fact.

This has been a serious flaw in your argument, your own perception of scientists, which you clearly have wrong. Scientists are people, smart people, who are apt to know as much or more than the common layman when it comes to local and world affairs. In fact, they may know much more considering they might be privy to information others are not.

The only thing myopic is your perception of reality.

If science says that politicians all have a mental problem and should be in insane asylums, you can bet the politicians will murder that scientist and burn his research.

Silly, in the extreme.

Scientists need to come out of the lab and see how the violent really truly run the world.

Again, your perception of reality is seriously lacking. Scientists are not imprisoned in laboratories.

Don't let them fool you though. Most of them do use telepathy for their own selfish needs.

Like boasting on internet forums?

You really ought to be more accurate or truthful. "No one has ever shown these abilities to you, the poster known as Q.

Please provide evidence that it has been shown, to anyone.

If you say to yourself, "I am not going to let my mind be read", and you do it with full concentration, focus and will power, you can probably stop most people.

I would never say that, I would welcome anyone to read my mind. I'm sure other 'naysayers' here would do the same.

So if a test is set up, and you are sitting there with your full intellect and willpower, thinking, "This is bullshit", then nothing will happen. Not because it is false or a lie. But because you have stopped the test with your refusal to cooperate.

That is just a petty excuse and a strawman argument.

Then like I said before. If someone says to you "you killed someone and buried their body in the park", are you going to jump up and attack them for that? Everyone has things to hide. Everyone. Because of this, most people, if they really did think telepathy was real, would do anything possible to stop it, or stop the people who can do it.

Please, you're letting your imagination run amok, again. Another petty excuse and strawman argument.

And speaking of arguments, yours is getting weaker as you progress.

Happeh, I see the world has been unkind to you. I can think of no other reason that you would:
a) Believe in the conspiracy theory of government.

I believe it because it is true.


b) Reject the logic of science.

I do not reject the logic of science.


c) Apply rigid stereotyping to the diversity of humanity.

I ignore the mind warping that is meant to make people powerless slaves. I use stereotypes that are accurate to some degree just as anyone in the world does. If I see a pit bull, I walk away. Sure it is a stereotype. I will never be bitten by a pitbull because I believe in that stereotype.


d) Grasp at the ephemeral straws of pseudo-science

What makes you say this? You have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt I am wrong. We both know you cannot do this.


It's quite an unattractive combination. Interestingly, you could change. An open mind, an education and a little more trust in real people might just do it. Are you ready to give it a shot?

Give what a shot? I have an open mind and an education. Your assertion that any people are real is fallacious. All people are liars. You just have to wait. No one on this earth will disappoint you. They will lie to you if you give them enough time. It is law of the universe.

Its clear you've no first clue about science.

If you believe that, it is clear you jump to conclusions. You do not know me well enough to say that.


There is no telepathy. Anyone who says there is, is full of shit, lying, or deluded (or some combination thereof).

Nope. It is you that is full of shit, lying, or deluded. I don't know how many times I have to say that no one that is a telepath is going to have anything to do with haters or name callers. They don't have to prove anything to you. You should be on your knees begging them to prove it. Not beating them over the head with negative comments. They are not children that you beat in to submission.

Happeh daze:

I think scientists are myopic. They only see science. They have no clue about politics or social agendas. As a scientist, the only thing they can see is "prove something is true or not". They fail to see that politicians and regular people have the motive to interfere with scientific fact.

This has been a serious flaw in your argument, your own perception of scientists, which you clearly have wrong. Scientists are people, smart people, who are apt to know as much or more than the common layman when it comes to local and world affairs. In fact, they may know much more considering they might be privy to information others are not.

Sure they are. But people are slaves. They believe that all scientists are 100 percent correct all of the time. I have to shout loudly that scientists make mistakes to wake people up so they admit that scientists do make mistakes.


If science says that politicians all have a mental problem and should be in insane asylums, you can bet the politicians will murder that scientist and burn his research.

Silly, in the extreme.

What am I supposed to say to this? Call you names? That statement is obviously completely untrue. Many scientists have been murdered thruout history in order to repress one scientific idea or another. It is a matter of historical record. Why would you say something like that and totally destroy any credibility you might have had? Who was it that was burned at the stake for saying the sun was the center of the solar system? Galileo?


Scientists need to come out of the lab and see how the violent really truly run the world.

Again, your perception of reality is seriously lacking. Scientists are not imprisoned in laboratories.

This is really tedious. We all know that scientists have a reputation for being geeks. If you want to interpret my words literally to say I am saying they are imprisoned, you are being foolish. Their minds are imprisoned by the narrow rules of science. They need to break that and look at the real world of politics etc.


Don't let them fool you though. Most of them do use telepathy for their own selfish needs.

Like boasting on internet forums?

I don't know. Have you seen them do that?


And speaking of arguments, yours is getting weaker as you progress.

And speaking of arguments, yours is so boring I gave up dealing with such stupidity. Play word games with someone else. I have better things to do with my time.

Damn materialists flock to threads like this, having nothing to contribute nor are even wanted; too 'clenched' and 'clueless' to even know that though. They come and scream and rage and shout and denigrate and hold their breath and turn purple, squinch their tiny glazed eyes and ... and hope that all their obnoxious, clueless noise will close the thread in the name of their god 'Empirical Science'. And it often works, as they have nothing to contribute, are notoriously uncreative and turn a pleasant respectful discussion ugly by their presence.
Responding to them just fuels their pathology.
Go away. Shoo.
Perhaps a citronella candle will keep them away and on their own turf.

I don't know how many times I have to say that no one that is a telepath is going to have anything to do with haters or name callers. They don't have to prove anything to you.

If that statement is true it disproves, at the very least, that you have anything to do with telepathy. The reason is,