create another God as powerful as he? He is omnipotent.

He did, Satan is equal to God in every way except one.

He can not create something from nothing.

He needed a worthy "oppontent" to child-train His children....and teach them about the character of God.

god, being fictitious, can do anything the story writer can come up with.

can he make me rich and succesful then...or should I ask satan

"Seek ye first the Kingdom of Heaven, and all these things shall be added unto you."

The question should have been, " Can GOD create another GOD who is MORE powerful than him? :bugeye:

Originally posted by riverline
The question should have been, " Can GOD create another GOD who is MORE powerful than him?
no, the question should not have been that, as it is grammatically incorrect. Your question is in short form. In long form it would be "Can GOD create another GOD who is MORE powerful than him IS?" The last two words make it evident that the last pronoun should be "he" (if the speaker wished to refer to the sky pixie as a male) as presented in the original question:
Originally posted by Olaus
Could God...create another God as powerful as he? He is omnipotent.
long form: "Could God...create another god as powerful as he is?"

Either way, the answer is still:

Originally posted by Unregistered1921
god, being fictitious, can do anything the story writer can come up with.

Unregistered1921

Execuse my weak english but can you check the statement you proposed?

It seems either sophisticaed to me or defective. :bugeye:

Originally posted by riverline
Unregistered1921

Execuse my weak english but can you check the statement you proposed?

It seems either sophisticaed to me or defective. :bugeye:

you're not making sense. could you restate your post?

Unregistered1921

"Can GOD create another GOD who is MORE powerful than him IS?"

I copied the above statement from your reply, are you sure its gramatically correct?

Originally posted by riverline
Unregistered1921

"Can GOD create another GOD who is MORE powerful than him IS?"

I copied the above statement from your reply, are you sure its gramatically correct?

Unregistered was pointing out why it was NOT grammatically correct.

Originally posted by Olaus
create another God as powerful as he? He is omnipotent.

In mathematics, is it possible to create another 1 (one), without multiplying the original 1?
I think not.
God, as per scripture, is mathematically, numero uno, the original, the primeval entity, He can multiply Himself into innumerable beings, but He always remains numero uno. :)

Love

Jan Ardena.

Originally posted by Jan Ardena
In mathematics, is it possible to create another 1 (one), without multiplying the original 1?
I think not.
God, as per scripture, is mathematically, numero uno, the original, the primeval entity, He can multiply Himself into innumerable beings, but He always remains numero uno. :)

Love

Jan Ardena.

Then he isn't omnipotent and isn't really God. The Real God could do anything, even things which are not logically possible. The Real God would trump all reason, condition, manifestation, everything. How could The Real God be confined by dogmas. This is abstract idolatry. Post-Jesus Movement Christianity is Pauline idolatry.

The Real God is humanly worthless because it says nothing to us. Only a phantom pretender to the heavenly throne is worthwhile, apparently, because it can be given human cares and attributes and can be (not really, but dogmatically) quantified. I say it's better to not care about Gods period, aside from conjecture or artistic expression. Or alternately, if there is The Real God(let's call It Meta-God), I suspect only an internal gnosis can access It. Of course, that's a heresy and therefore evil and Satanic.

OK, continue your blathering pointlessness.

Actually, "than him" is a proper construction. The construction relgates the lexeme "than" to the grammatical role of preposition, rather than conjunction. "than he is" is also proper, relegating "than" to the role of conjunction.

Thus: A - "than him" and B - "than he is"

Analysis A: Than - preposition, him - pronoun: prepositional object. A = adjectival compliment.

Analysis B: Than - conjunction, "he is" - subjective subclause.
B = clausal compliment.

Why was this so hard? :D

LOL! I'll say this for God - he can sure make everyone confuse the hell out of everyone else!!

Originally posted by TheVisitor
"Seek ye first the Kingdom of Heaven, and all these things shall be added unto you."
doesnt the bible says that if you ask "surely your every prayer will be answered?"
so why it doesn't work?:rolleyes:

Originally posted by Q25
doesnt the bible says that if you ask "surely your every prayer will be answered?"
so why it doesn't work?:rolleyes:

Furthermore, the very fact that this passage exists is a massive blow to Jesus-based philosophy. Why would you need prayer if you "forsake tomorrow and worry not for food or possessions. Look upon the birds of the air. Do they plan for their next day?"

Prayer apparently contradicts this suggestion, though the Biblical Jesus advocates it as well.

Theres a catch, It says "If you belive in your heart, without any doubt"....
You can have what you asked for.

It works, but be carefull what you ask for....you might just get it.

"Prayer apparently contradicts this suggestion, though the Biblical Jesus advocates it as well"

You apparently contradict the law of natural selection...
But your here.:cool:



The Real God(let's call It Meta-God), I suspect only an internal gnosis can access It

Someone with this apparent gift for stating such obvious contradictions in the scriptures.....(Gnosis ..maybe?)
Should have been president or world leader by now....NOT

Make your snide comments about the scriptures......yeah, you've got my attention now!
Prove one contradiction in the bible...you can't.
It's just the sign of a dazed and confussed mind that scoffs at what they don't understand.

OK, continue your blathering pointlessness

create another God as powerful as he? He is omnipotent.

umm.. okkk.. im gonna take a stab at this.. im not a theist, but i'll try and pretend to believe in god for this moment :p

major religions have described the qualities of god as being omnipotent, omniscient, perfect, creator of all things etc etc etc..

if god wanted to create another god, there would probably be a need for it... considerin that god is perfect, there is no need for it... i've heard ppl make logicall fallacies by asking if god can create a rock that even he can't lift.. you can't ignore one aspect of his characteristics and keep pushin it...

according to religions
God = perfection
you cannot perfect perfection
if you could, then it wouldn't be perfection.. it would be almost perfect.

therefore, you cannot create beyond that is perfect... becuz there wudn't be a need to in the first place.. therefore the whole premise of if god can create another god etc etc is quite dumb..

hmphh.. im gonna get beat up by my atheist friends now :D

<a href="http://www.aish.com/rabbi/ATR_browse.aspl=All&offset=150">CAN GOD LIFT THE ROCK?</a><p>

<a href="http://sami119.tripod.com/shemaisrael/">sami</a>

Originally posted by TheVisitor
He did, Satan is equal to God in every way except one.

He can not create something from nothing.

He needed a worthy "oppontent" to child-train His children....and teach them about the character of God.

Are you nuts TheVisitor, Satan is equal to god in every way but one of creation. So Satan is love, mercy, compassion, patience, all hearing, all seeing, forgiver, giver of faith.....These are all characteristics of god. TheVisitor, you are going straight to hell in the company of Satan who you think so high off. He also think so higly of you.

Originally posted by Jan Ardena
God, as per scripture, is mathematically, numero uno, the original, the primeval entity, He can multiply Himself into innumerable beings, but He always remains numero uno. :)

Love

Jan Ardena.

On the other hand, Jan Ardena got her religious concepts straight. I hope she goes to heaven.

Sorry. the link didn't work. So, here is the text, from: http://www.aish.com "Ask the Rabbi":

Q: "Can God terminate His own existence? I've asked many people, and the only (unsatisfying) answer I got was: "Why would He want to?"

A: "The answer is that there is a fundamental flaw in the question. The question assumes that infinities -- an infinitely heavy rock and an infinite God -- can be compared. But as we know from 10th grade math class, two infinities cannot be quantified, and thus cannot be compared. It's not an inability in God, rather incoherence in the task proposed.

Let's try stating it a bit differently: If God is infinite, then He is represented by the numerical equivalent of "infinity." The question of making a rock of such proportions thus begs the question -- which is greater, infinity, or infinity plus one?

Essentially, there is no such thing as infinity plus one, for if you could add one to the mathematical value of infinity, then infinity in the equation, "infinity plus one" would, by definition, not be infinite. Clear?

In Jewish terms, the question is further flawed since it implies that physical characteristics apply to God. Yet one of Maimonides' 13 Principles of Faith states: "I believe with perfect faith that God does not have a body. Physical concepts do not apply to Him. There is nothing that resembles Him at all."

<a href="http://sami119.tripod.com/shemaisrael/">sami</a>

If god made a wall that could not be penetrated and made a force that could not be stopped and the two met.. what would be the outcome? :D

Originally posted by sami
Q: "Can God terminate His own existence? I've asked many people, and the only (unsatisfying) answer I got was: "Why would He want to?"

A: "The answer is that there is a fundamental flaw in the question. The question assumes that infinities -- an infinitely heavy rock and an infinite God -- can be compared. But as we know from 10th grade math class, two infinities cannot be quantified, and thus cannot be compared. It's not an inability in God, rather incoherence in the task proposed.



correct. the question is logically invalid construction of a sentence.

Originally posted by SnakeLord
If god made a wall that could not be penetrated and made a force that could not be stopped and the two met.. what would be the outcome? :D
He will ensure that both of them never meet..! if u want funy answer - the force & wall will interchange their position, God can do the swapping too.. u know..!:D

Satan is not powerful as God. He is not even from the highest dominions of angels! He is a cherub (read those Isaiah passages baby!)

Originally posted by sami
"The answer is that there is a fundamental flaw in the question. The question assumes that infinities -- an infinitely heavy rock and an infinite God -- can be compared. But as we know from 10th grade math class, two infinities cannot be quantified, and thus cannot be compared.No, that is mathematically incorrect. Infinities can be compared and can, in fact, be lesser or greater than one another.

Consider:

There are an infinite number of odd integers and there are an infinite number of all integers (both odd and even) yet the infinite number of all integers is intrinsically larger than the number of only odd integers.

~Raithere

Raithere:

<i>the infinite number of all integers is intrinsically larger than the number of only odd integers.</i>

Umm... technically, no. The set of all integers has exactly the same cardinality as the set of odd integers.

In principle, you're right - some infinities are larger than others. The particular pair you picked just happen to be the same size.

Originally posted by sami
Sorry. the link didn't work. So, here is the text, from: http://www.aish.com "Ask the Rabbi":

Q: "Can God terminate His own existence? I've asked many people, and the only (unsatisfying) answer I got was: "Why would He want to?"

A: "The answer is that there is a fundamental flaw in the question. The question assumes that infinities -- an infinitely heavy rock and an infinite God -- can be compared. But as we know from 10th grade math class, two infinities cannot be quantified, and thus cannot be compared. It's not an inability in God, rather incoherence in the task proposed.

Let's try stating it a bit differently: If God is infinite, then He is represented by the numerical equivalent of "infinity." The question of making a rock of such proportions thus begs the question -- which is greater, infinity, or infinity plus one?

Essentially, there is no such thing as infinity plus one, for if you could add one to the mathematical value of infinity, then infinity in the equation, "infinity plus one" would, by definition, not be infinite. Clear?

In Jewish terms, the question is further flawed since it implies that physical characteristics apply to God. Yet one of Maimonides' 13 Principles of Faith states: "I believe with perfect faith that God does not have a body. Physical concepts do not apply to Him. There is nothing that resembles Him at all."

<a href="http://sami119.tripod.com/shemaisrael/">sami</a>


Well, there it is. Thanks. I originally proposed the question as an experiment. No one would respond to serious questions, so I made a dumb one to see if it would generate fifteen gazillion response posts as one usually would. This is a smart answer to a dumb question.

Why didn't any of our resident faith-basers give me this before page two?

Well...I'm not a math major.

Can anyone further elucidate the larger/smaller infinite set statement?

Originally posted by sami
Sorry. the link didn't work. So, here is the text, from: http://www.aish.com "Ask the Rabbi":

Q: "Can God terminate His own existence? I've asked many people, and the only (unsatisfying) answer I got was: "Why would He want to?"

A: "The answer is that there is a fundamental flaw in the question. The question assumes that infinities -- an infinitely heavy rock and an infinite God -- can be compared. But as we know from 10th grade math class, two infinities cannot be quantified, and thus cannot be compared. It's not an inability in God, rather incoherence in the task proposed.

Let's try stating it a bit differently: If God is infinite, then He is represented by the numerical equivalent of "infinity." The question of making a rock of such proportions thus begs the question -- which is greater, infinity, or infinity plus one?

Essentially, there is no such thing as infinity plus one, for if you could add one to the mathematical value of infinity, then infinity in the equation, "infinity plus one" would, by definition, not be infinite. Clear?

In Jewish terms, the question is further flawed since it implies that physical characteristics apply to God. Yet one of Maimonides' 13 Principles of Faith states: "I believe with perfect faith that God does not have a body. Physical concepts do not apply to Him. There is nothing that resembles Him at all."

<a href="http://sami119.tripod.com/shemaisrael/">sami</a>

Wait, wait, wait...

The second part, at least I thought, was pretty good. But it doesn't answer the first part. COULD God terminate his own existence? That's disturbing, by the way. Talk about an apocalypse.

Originally posted by Olaus
Wait, wait, wait...

The second part, at least I thought, was pretty good. But it doesn't answer the first part. COULD God terminate his own existence? That's disturbing, by the way. Talk about an apocalypse.
Its same as the rock paradox. . if yes, then God won't be eternal. if no then God is not omnipotent. The question is aimed at an answer to contradict. The question is logically invalid construction of a sentence (gramatically the sentence is not wrong) cuz the answer would be indeterminate.

btw, God could terminate himself in the 'reality' of atheists.. thats what he had already done, it seems.:D

How can Satan exist if God doesn't exist? There is no question of who is the more powerful, nor is there a question of what either can do, because *wait for it* NEITHER EXIST!! Is this not a valid argument? Who's gonna challenge me on this? Come on! TELL ME HOW THE HELL ANYONE CAN BELIEVE IN GOD!!!!!!!! I want an answer people! No point in giving these poxy arguments as to why and why not - I want PROOF!! Give me PROOF!! Give me an argument that will change my belief forever!!
Otherwise, I'm afraid this is all pointless babble...:bugeye:

Originally posted by Gizz
How can Satan exist if God doesn't exist? There is no question of who is the more powerful, nor is there a question of what either can do, because *wait for it* NEITHER EXIST!! Is this not a valid argument? Who's gonna challenge me on this? Come on! TELL ME HOW THE HELL ANYONE CAN BELIEVE IN GOD!!!!!!!! I want an answer people! No point in giving these poxy arguments as to why and why not - I want PROOF!! Give me PROOF!! Give me an argument that will change my belief forever!!
Otherwise, I'm afraid this is all pointless babble...:bugeye:
Hi Gizz,

welcome to sciforums..!

What sort of PROOF u want.. what is ur belief that u want to change..

Hello! Thanx for the welcome - I knew I wasn't invisible!!

I'm not really looking for proof to change any of my philosophies about God, I just find it amusing that people can go into such depth (and get so aggravated!) about something none of us really know anything about.
I mean, despite all the people claiming to 'know' God talks to them, how the hell can they be sure it's God? It might be something else, like....aliens!!
Same for people who deny God so absolutely - none of truly know.

<i>But as we know from 10th grade math class, two infinities cannot be quantified, and thus cannot be compared.</i>

I think Cantor's work on transfinite numbers goes a little beyond 10th grade math.

Originally posted by TheVisitor
Prove one contradiction in the bible...you can't.
It's just the sign of a dazed and confussed mind that scoffs at what they don't understand.
http://www.ffrf.org/lfif/contra.html
http://www.sullivan-county.com/nf0/nov_2000/bible_con.htm
http://www.krysstal.com/contradi.html
http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/contradictions.html
http://www.geocities.com/blindfools/i08bibcon.html

Originally posted by TheVisitor
"Prayer apparently contradicts this suggestion, though the Biblical Jesus advocates it as well"

You apparently contradict the law of natural selection...
But your here.:cool:



The Real God(let's call It Meta-God), I suspect only an internal gnosis can access It

Someone with this apparent gift for stating such obvious contradictions in the scriptures.....(Gnosis ..maybe?)
Should have been president or world leader by now....NOT

Make your snide comments about the scriptures......yeah, you've got my attention now!
Prove one contradiction in the bible...you can't.
It's just the sign of a dazed and confussed mind that scoffs at what they don't understand.

OK, continue your blathering pointlessness


Are you a board troll? I thought they threw those out here.

Just reading his posts makes me think that perhaps he's a recovering drug addict who took upon christianity as a way to be accepted back into society. Although most of his posts seem copied, they're still irrelevant.

Originally posted by James R
Umm... technically, no. The set of all integers has exactly the same cardinality as the set of odd integers.

In principle, you're right - some infinities are larger than others. The particular pair you picked just happen to be the same size.Thanks for the correction and sending me back to the books. ;)

Here's a good basic explaination of the cardinality of infinite sets for anyone who's interested:

http://www.mathacademy.com/pr/minitext/infinity/index.asp

~Raithere