Hi all,

Apparantely, the chimpanzee brain is evolving more quickly than the human brain - are we in trouble?

Best Wishes,

Nicola

Yes, we're in trouble, the human brain is going backwards at a million miles an hour best I can tell.
I just got back from a trip to the supermarket. Stupidity was on the move.

Hi all,

Apparantely, the chimpanzee brain is evolving more quickly than the human brain - are we in trouble?

Best Wishes,

Nicola

Anything to support that bit of news?

Anything to support that bit of news?

Chimps as a collective have learned to think for themselves and have therefore surpassed 78-83% of the human populus.

Hi all,

Apparantely, the chimpanzee brain is evolving more quickly than the human brain - are we in trouble?


What do you mean by "trouble"? Do you mean trouble as in competition?

Hi all,

Apparantely, the chimpanzee brain is evolving more quickly than the human brain - are we in trouble?

Best Wishes,

Nicola

Seemingly minor differences in our genetic makeup have resulted in two very different critters, and science is only now beginning to sort it all out. There are yet other differences. Chimpanzees are more genetically diverse than humans; among humans, those living in Africa are more genetically diverse than non-Africans. One theory is that all humans living today sprang from a single female ancestor living in Africa some two hundred thousand years ago. This theory is based not on nuclear DNA, but on mitochondrial DNA. This is another story for another day, but we can be sure that the 1 percent difference between humans and chimpanzees is more astonishing than the 99 percent similarity.

So go ahead and ask a brother chimp if he can spare a banana...chances are he'll have no idea what you're talking about!

References:

Cornell News, December 18, 2003

University of Chicago Hospitals article, "Human Brain Still Evolving," September 8, 2005

Wikipedia.com, article on "Mitochondrial Eve"

http://darwinawards.com/science/chimpanzee_cousins.html

I think he thinks this one
http://www.jewcy.com/files/images/radicals_banksy_0.jpg

Ridiculous of course.

Could you provide a link or just paste the reference addy and I can edit it to create the link please nicnacuk?

Do chimps have organized religion? No?
Oh, they are obviously smarter and have been for a long long time.

I actually read about this in Mind magazine. However, I have found a link that discusses the same topic. If you type 'Not So Fast, Einstein animal intelligence' into google, the link should come up.

Apparantely, the chimpanzee brain is evolving more quickly than the human brain - are we in trouble?Arguably, the key to the supremacy of Homo sapiens is language. This technology fostered a quantum increase in our ability to create, share, evaluate, preserve, improve and hand down information. Information processing including communication was the engine of every paradigm shift, from agriculture, to civilization, to industry, to the current one which is named simply the Information Age.

Chimpanzees and bonobos (as well as gorillas) at their current state of evolution have demonstrated the ability to learn human language by using ASL or manipulating written symbols. The last I heard, they had achieved a vocabulary of 3,000 words and a comparable level of grammar and syntax, which puts them at level 7 on my powers-of-three scale of fluency. One more level and they'd be able to participate in our civilization as well as I do when I travel to a Spanish-speaking country.

I don't know if they're capable of that. But if they evolve to that point, assuming the rest of their cognitive abilities reach the same level, they could hold menial jobs, support themselves, obey the laws, stay out of trouble, have some fun, and generally be on a par with the developmentally-challenged people who staffed the mail room at my old job.

This puts their brains a long way from being able to challenge us and take over the world. I'm not saying they can't get there, but it's not a pressing problem for the next few generations of humans.

http://static.rateyourmusic.com/album_images/s89892.jpg
Get your hands off me, you damned, dirty ape!!!!




Someone had to post this. I can't believe it took this long.

Anything to support that bit of news?

Maybe he would have to provide proof or anything at all that human brain evolved. Why don't you do it.

Maybe he would have to provide proof or anything at all that human brain evolved. Why don't you do it.

That's such an established and foregone conclusion - why should I bother? Have you never heard of a branch of science called anthropology?

That's such an established and foregone conclusion - why should I bother? ?

Because you CANT do it.

Get your hands off me, you damned, dirty ape!!!!
Someone had to post this. I can't believe it took this long.

That is what I was thinking. In labs around the world, people are learning to splice human genes to practically everything (a relative of mine doing the deed in a lab in India). Soon they will stumble upon the development of a talking live pet and then a slave race and the Planet of the apes could be a reality....

Because you CANT do it.

Sorry - once again I responded without noticing who you were. Forget it - I'm not here to be your private tutor. Go do some serious study on your own... And start with a basic book on anthropology - you sure need it badly!

Yes, we're in trouble, the human brain is going backwards at a million miles an hour best I can tell.
I just got back from a trip to the supermarket. Stupidity was on the move.

We're uhhh Diversifying, ya that's it...Diversifying.

This is a SCIENCE forum, science is about learning. Back up your statements without attacking the posters. And yet you cannot provide one sentence to support that the human brain evolved and the OP is worried that Chimps will surpass humans in intelligence. See the problem?

I learned a long time ago that anything is easy once you know how it is done. So go ahead ReadOnly impress us with your proof.

I will go easy on you RO, read this-
http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=1065704

As far as understanding how our brains evolved, more questions remain than have been answered. One problem is that we don't really know enough about how our brains differ from those of other mammals and primates, although work by Zilles and others is helping here. We also know very little about how the areas of our brain are physically linked up, and we need to understand that before we can see how we differ from our nearest relatives. And as far as identifying the gene changes that were selected during evolution, although we have several candidates, we don't know how or if these gene variants affect our cognitive abilities. It is one thing, concludes Dunbar, to identify genetic or anatomic differences between human and ape brains, but quite another to know what they mean in terms of actual cognitive processes.

Just remember, just because you want something to be true does not mean it is.

Here is your statement-
That's such an established and foregone conclusion - why should I bother? Have you never heard of a branch of science called anthropology?

I will go easy on you RO, read this-
http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=1065704



Just remember, just because you want something to be true does not mean it is.

Here is your statement-

John, I learned way back when you first appeared that you are almost impossible to deal with and that's why I've been purposefully avoiding you. You seem to have extreme difficulty in understanding some of the most simple things.

Take this particular post of yours for example - while writer in the link you quoted freely admits that there is a LOT about the development of the human brain the we do not yet understand, he also clearly implies that there ARE things we have learned about it's development. And yet you seemed to not even comprehend that.

If you actually do WANT to learn something about that subject then go visit this article about a particular branch of anthropology and follow the external links provided near the bottom of the page. If you try really, really hard you'll be able to see what I've been telling you is accurate: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neuroanthropology

There is a definate trend in the fossil record. Older homo species had smaller brains, later ones became dramatically increased in size.

There is a definate trend in the fossil record. Older homo species had smaller brains, later ones became dramatically increased in size.

Quite correct. :) But it's hard to tell if he even understands that. Personally, I'd say he doesn't.

Fair enough, it is not that big of a deal to me as it is to RO.

Take this particular post of yours for example - while writer in the link you quoted freely admits that there is a LOT about the development of the human brain the we do not yet understand, he also clearly implies that there ARE things we have learned about it's development. And yet you seemed to not even comprehend that.

Possibly, what you perceive as evolution is called LEARNING.

There is a definate trend in the fossil record. Older homo species had smaller brains, later ones became dramatically increased in size.

That does not mean much to someone who may be inclined to believe that WE ARE THE homo species. Obviously language networks human brains together, eliminate communication and well i guess we would not be human. Like a super computer with the adding ability to form and operate upon concepts in abstraction, in accordance with rationality and logic.

That being said i know about the brain size differences. However, i am not sure how much of a gauge brain size is to intelligence. Having never seen an elephants brain i can only imagine them to be larger than a human's.

Either way, to me this is of little consequence. Here is an interesting article:

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1200/is_20031202/ai_7049264

Search for the word brain to get to the good stuff.:)

As far as chimpanzees taking over:

http://www.alphadictionary.com/articles/ling002.html

I think the first paragraph provides one reason that will never happen.

Fair enough, it is not that big of a deal to me as it is to RO.

Really??? YOU are the one that said I couldn't prove it and challenged me to do so - and now you're saying you don't really care all that much???????

And I know full well that you have NOT taken the time to study the information that I provided you with.

It's clear that you are NOT interested in learning and are just trolling and arguing for argument's sake - nothing more. What a waste you are! :bugeye:

Clearly god designed us with a reptilian brain structure at the base of our super-brains just to mess with any of his "children" that were foolish enough to become scientists.

And I know full well that you have NOT taken the time to study the information that I provided you with.


Are you serious?

Clearly god designed us with a reptilian brain ...

That is a bad attitude where science is concerned.

That being said i know about the brain size differences. However, i am not sure how much of a gauge brain size is to intelligence. Having never seen an elephants brain i can only imagine them to be larger than a human's.Brain size correlates with body size because of the need for more motor and sensory processing. You have to really get in there and measure the size of the different regions to compare the potential difference in intelligence between two animals of much different size, since so much of the difference can be attributed to non-cognitive processing. Several species of parrots are very likely more intelligent than dogs, yet their brains are tiny because their bodies are tiny. Whales have huge brains but they have so much more body to manage with them.

And don't forget that much of brain is unused so size can be deceiving.

And don't forget that much of brain is unused so size can be deceiving.
How much?
Actually that's an urban myth. Most of the brain is used, but the way the brain is used is different from individual to individual.

And don't forget that much of brain is unused so size can be deceiving.

Oh, come on, Fraggle! You aren't buying into THAT old myth, are you? Do a little basic research and come back and tell us what you learned from it. ;)

while it is true that very little of the brain is being used at any given time to say that parts of the brain aren't used is false. also i think chimps will probably surpass us if we don't destroy the planet first.

Chimps and Gorillas are likely to go extinct very soon, their numbers are declining along with their habitat.

Arguably, the key to the supremacy of Homo sapiens is language. This technology fostered a quantum increase in our ability to create, share, evaluate, preserve, improve and hand down information. Information processing including communication was the engine of every paradigm shift, from agriculture, to civilization, to industry, to the current one which is named simply the Information Age.
I can't argue with you there. Our speech (and intelligence) is what differentiates us from all other organisms.


Chimpanzees and bonobos (as well as gorillas) at their current state of evolution have demonstrated the ability to learn human language by using ASL or manipulating written symbols. The last I heard, they had achieved a vocabulary of 3,000 words and a comparable level of grammar and syntax, which puts them at level 7 on my powers-of-three scale of fluency. One more level and they'd be able to participate in our civilization as well as I do when I travel to a Spanish-speaking country.
Let's take a look at this statement. I do not doubt one word of it. However, if you think about it, going on this statement, if that's the case, chimps and bonobos are learning at a faster rate because humans are teaching them.
Do you honestly think that we, as humans, wouldn't progress exponentially if say, a race of far more advanced than us, extra-terrestrials came down here and taught us all their technology and learning methods? I mean, look at the advancements in tecnology even over the past 10 years, compared to the 10 years before that.
I guarantee you that chimps would not be learning all of this stuff if humans didn't exist to assist them with that learning.

I, for one, welcome our new simian overlords. I'd like to remind them that as a Registered Senior User, I can be helpful in rounding up others to toil on their many banana plantations.

I have seen smart people who are 4' 6'' tall and skinny with proportional head size that is a lot smaller than a person that is 350 Lbs and 5' 10" that I saw today.

Ok so i'm just going to throw in what I know real quick. Brain evolution in our ansestrial line started with australopithicines. It wasn't brain SIZE that enabled more complex thinking later on. I mean there's some big brains out there attached to some pretty simple organisms. It was the orginazation of the brain. They know this is by taking a cast of the braincase (endocast) of the austra. and comparing it to other earlier species. As well as modern chimps and humans of course. There's a line in your brain that divides where simple and complex functions are done. This is called the lunate sulcas becsuse of it's moon shape. Now in chimps, as well as earlier human ansestors then austra, the line is far to the back of the skull. In austra and every other human ansestor after, the lunate sulcas is further toward the middle of the brain. Making the part of your brain that controls complex functions larger.

Now other then brains becoming larger over time since then (Homo habilis, Homo erectus, and Homo heidelbergensis all had increasingly larger brain sizes) there's no other way to really map brain evolution in our species. How do you get a specimen to examine from millions of years ago? Fossils? Brain tissue breaks down WAY too fast to ever be preserved in a state that is truely able to be studied the way we study our own. The best you can do is what they've already been doing which is map out the outside of the brain through making endocasts. And the only major change my examining this is the change in position of the lunate sulcas.