Canned hunting facilities, also known as hunting ranches or trophy ranches, are acreages enclosed by high, game-proof fences. For a fee, “hunters” can kill the animals held captive there. The facilities range in size from ten acres to several hundred acres. It is estimated that there are currently over 4,000 hunting ranches in the United States.

Many of these facilities offer a “no-kill, no-fee” policy. Animals in these facilities range from domestic species of game birds, deer and elk, to exotic species such as Russian boar, wildebeest, and zebra. Hunters of all skill levels are welcome and offered a choice of weapons; guns, bow and arrow, and in some cases, spears.

Some facilities offer guides who will go out on ATVs, find the quarry, and drive the animals into the line-of-sight of the hunters. In other cases, tree stands or blinds are set up near feeding stations-you simply wait for the species of your choice to walk by. In some facilities, the animals are drugged.

http://blogcritics.org/archives/2007/12/12/231732.php

People are sick

Hunting club:
http://www.safariclub.org/

American Humane Society article
http://www.hsus.org/wildlife/stop_canned_hunts/

People are sick

You got that right :mad:
They should put all those people in a hunting facility and let them slaughter each other.

Iraq? Already did that I think.

Thats not a solution.

What is the mentality of such people, I wonder?

Iraq? Already did that I think.

Thats not a solution.

No, it isn't a solution. There isn't one really.. people just suck.

well...if they kill animals but not people...its for the better. Otherwise they could have killed normal people like us instead of some antilope. Choosing lesser evil over the other evil.

It always amazes me that people pay thousands of dollars to go shoot animals for sport, when they could use that money for something to make the world a better place.

I always think of that scene in Crocodile Dundee where he has the wallaby shooting at the poachers, when this subject comes up.

It always amazes me that people pay thousands of dollars to go shoot animals, when they could use that money for something to make the world a better place.

its not about money...its about the feeling and emotions in chaos or synchrony within people

its not about money...its about the feeling and emotions in chaos or synchrony within people

Thats what I mean. They would RATHER spend the money on shooting animals.

well...if they kill animals but not people...its for the better. Otherwise they could have killed normal people like us instead of some antilope. Choosing lesser evil over the other evil.

WTF ! :bugeye:

I always think of that scene in Crocodile Dundee where he has the wallaby shooting at the poachers, when this subject comes up.

If it were up to me, all poachers would be dropped in the middle of the jungle without any defense

WTF ! :bugeye:

Enmos...not all humans are in synchrony with themselves. In order to get rid of that tension they need this sort of thing...and it is a lesser evil that if people were killed.

As a representative of a human species I have an obligation to strive for human survival and to improve it.

Enmos...not all humans are in synchrony with themselves. In order to get rid of that tension they need this sort of thing...and it is a lesser evil that if people were killed.

As a representative of a human species I have an obligation to strive for human survival and to improve it.

I'd rather see those people killed than the animals.

I'd rather see those people killed than the animals.

realize that this is wrong.

realize that this is wrong.

It isn't more wrong than killing those animals. And as the animals are innocent and those humans murdering bastards, I'd rather see those humans killed.

It isn't more wrong than killing those animals. And as the animals are innocent and those humans murdering bastards, I'd rather see those humans killed.

well than we differ in our opinions.

I'd rather see those people killed than the animals.

Me too

If it were up to me, all pochers would be dropped in the middle of the jungle without any defense

LOL. Poachers.:D

Draqon, do you cheer on bullfighters ? Or do you silently hope the bull will kill the bullfighter ?
For me, definitely the latter..
Nothing is more despicable than killing animals for the pure fun of it.
I wouldn't have the slightest problem with capital punishment for people that have done gross injustice to animals. Like for instance in the Netherlands some years ago there was someone killing and seriously wounding animals (like ponies, horses and goats and whatnot) that were in "little zoo's". There isn't a word for it in English I think, I will post pictures.. The animals were stabbed at night, often in their genitals, and were found the next morning either dead or dying.
Anyway, they can hang that person for all I care.. :mad:
Examples of 'dierenweides' (literally translated: Animalmeadow... pasture is something else.) as we call them:

http://img423.imageshack.us/img423/4986/dierenweide22uq.jpg

http://www.de-heraut.nl/heraut-online/media/heraut/week_29_07/Gezellige%20afsluiting.jpg

well...if they kill animals but not people...its for the better. Otherwise they could have killed normal people like us instead of some antilope. Choosing lesser evil over the other evil.

The worrying thought is that there are people out there that get their kicks from making animals suffer. At least if these people were trying to kill other humans then there are laws in place to punish/imprison them, animals have no such protection it seems.

Thats terrible Enmos. I think in U.S they call them petting zoo.

Thats terrible Enmos. I think in U.S they call them petting zoo.

Ah that might be it, thanks :)
Yea.. and I just realized that I don't even know if they caught him/her or not :(

Yes, its unsportsmanlike, but I don't see it as inhumane. I think any animal shot in a canned hunt shouldn't be allowed in the record books either. Maybe that would slow it down.

Yes, its unsportsmanlike, but I don't see it as inhumane. I think any animal shot in a canned hunt shouldn't be allowed in the record books either. Maybe that would slow it down.

:confused:
Unsportsmanlike ?? wtf !? is that all ?

:confused:
Unsportsmanlike ?? wtf !? is that all ?

uh, yeah. Its cheating.

uh, yeah. Its cheating.

For God's sake, they have the animals lined up to be killed.
Imagine that'd happen with humans.. it would make the Nazi's look like sissies.

Why do people keep comparing animals to humans??
Its like when people talk about gay marriage, they always bring up marrying animals. What's up with that?

Oh and I call. Godwin's Law (http://www.sciforums.com/encyclopedia/Godwin%27s_law) on Enmos!!!

Why do people keep comparing animals to humans??
Because they are the same. Humans are animals.

Its like when people talk about gay marriage, they always bring up marrying animals. What's up with that?
I wouldn't know about that.. lol

Oh and I call. Godwin's Law (http://www.sciforums.com/encyclopedia/Godwin%27s_law) on Enmos!!!
I try to honor that law whenever I can :D

As bad as this sounds, it's still not as sick as internet hunting.

Internet hunting, also called remote controlled hunting, utilizes Internet technology to allow a computer user to aim and fire a weapon that is mounted on a mechanized tripod at a remote location, usually a game ranch where exotic animals are kept penned and shot at close range. The customer signs up through a web site, and pays a user fee and a deposit for the animal that he or she wishes to kill. The animal is lured to a feeding station within range of the mounted rifle. When the animal approaches, the desktop hunter uses the computer mouse to line up the cross hairs and fire the rifle. Guides at the game ranch will finish the job if the shot misses. Trophy mounts are prepared at the ranch and shipped to the customer.

from the Humane Society Web site (http://www.hsus.org/legislation_laws/citizen_lobbyist_center/internet_hunting_state_laws.html)

Thankfully a number of states have banned the practice already.

Because they are the same. Humans are animals....

Not to the people who eat them (the animals, not the humans)

Not to the people who eat them (the animals, not the humans)

What do you mean ? I eat animals, still I know I am an animal :shrug:

What do you mean ? I eat animals, still I know I am an animal :shrug:

Argh. Do you treat that animal you are eating as if you are eating a person.

Hunters know they are animals. I know I am an animal. I have not a single qualm about eating animals because they are not human.

Not to the people who eat them (the animals, not the humans)

I would use an organ from a person who died too. And people stuck in impossible situations have also eaten other people.

That does not mean I should shoot them if I feel an itch in my liver.

Hunting for sport is wrong.

No, wasting the animal you have killed is wrong. Killing an endangered animal is wrong.

Argh. Do you treat that animal you are eating as if you are eating a person.

Hunters know they are animals. I know I am an animal. I have not a single qualm about eating animals because they are not human.

You are an animal, you just said it yourself. Now thats why I compare humans with animals (your earlier question).
Eating animals in itself isn't wrong, it killing or hurting them for the pure pleasure of it.

Hunting for sport when you do not need to, ie there is lots of meat already available, is wrong.

If you live in the backwoods, its alright.

But if you usually eat dead meat, and only hunt for pleasure, it is wrong.

People who hunt animals for sport usually have the desire to kill; its how you identify pathologies in children.

No, wasting the animal you have killed is wrong. Killing an endangered animal is wrong.

If you kill it for sport and don't need to eat it it's wrong, whether you're going to eat it or not.

We have hunters up here who hunt for sport all the time. They don't need it. They donate it to Homeless shelters. It gets used. Its not wasted.
They enjoy it, and don't need it.

We have hunters up here who hunt for sport all the time. They don't need it. They donate it to Homeless shelters. It gets used. Its not wasted.
They enjoy it, and don't need it.

Why don't they just buy food for the homeless ?

Because they enjoy hunting. win/win for everyone.

No need to protest feedlots, chicken factories, slaughter houses.

Because they enjoy hunting
Why would anyone enjoy killing?.

I've killed many animals for experiments and enjoyment is not a word that comes to mind.

Because they enjoy hunting. win/win for everyone.

No need to protest feedlots, chicken factories, slaughter houses.

Protest ? They can just walk into any supermarket and buy stuff, then give it to the homeless.

And what sick sort of person enjoys killing another creature ? :bugeye:

Why would anyone enjoy killing?.

I've killed many animals for experiments and enjoyment is not a word that comes to mind.

Why speak badly of people who kill animals when you yourself do it on a daily basis?

There's a word for that, you know.

Why speak badly of people who kill animals when you yourself do it on a daily basis?

There's a word for that, you know.

I don't do it for fun, I do it because right now there are no alternatives.

I would actually prefer to do it on humans but people are strangely reluctant to part with a piece of their liver of muscle or body fat for biopsies.
Or take experimental drugs unless they are already dying.And its illegal.


But I don't wake up and spend thousands of dollars so I can have some "fun" killing animals.

I don't do it for fun, I do it because right now there are no alternatives.

But I don't wake up and spend thousands of dollars so I can have some "fun" killing animals.

Since when did "I don't do it for fun" become a legitimate excuse to kill?

I agree that "canned hunting" is an abomination, but there is little credibility in hearing it from someone who is paid to kill animals.

Know what I mean?

Since when did "I don't do it for fun" become a legitimate excuse to kill?

I agree that "canned hunting" is an abomination, but there is little credibility in hearing it from someone who is paid to kill animals.

Know what I mean?

I also eat animals, but I don't eat for fun either.

I dislike the idea of turning an animal into sport and investing your money into it as a venture for fun.

So stop complaining...

Protest ? They can just walk into any supermarket and buy stuff, then give it to the homeless.

And what sick sort of person enjoys killing another creature ? :bugeye:

What is the difference? This way there is no packaging, no trips for deliveries etc. I've never hunted myself, probably i never will either. The animals still go through the process.

So stop complaining...

Why? If I saw someone torturing an animal for fun, should I walk past because I do experiments on them?

By that logic, a doctor who autopsies people should condone cutting up people for fun?

Youre nuts

Why? If I saw someone torturing an animal for fun, should I walk past because I do experiments on them?

These "can hunters" don't torture the animals; rather, they kill them instantly. Besides, what is the end result of your actions and the actions of these hunters? In both situations, the animal is left dead, so there's really no difference.

By that logic, a doctor who autopsies people should condone cutting up people for fun?

Autopsies are performed to bring people to justice. All you do is pointlessly kill rats, never achieving anything new.

Youre nuts

What about my nuts, you pervert?

These "can hunters" don't torture the animals; rather, they kill them instantly. Besides, what is the end result of your actions and the actions of these hunters? In both situations, the animal is left dead, so there's really no difference.

So there is no difference between a person whose body is used for science and a person whose body is cut up by a guy who enjoys it?



Autopsies are performed to bring people to justice. All you do is pointlessly kill rats, never achieving anything new.


Hope you refuse all the results of animal research then.:bugeye:

What about my nuts, you pervert?

Between a dick and an asshole.:mad:

So there is no difference between a person whose body is used for science and a person whose body is cut up by a guy who enjoys it?

In the end, obviously not. Besides, what discoveries have you made, Sam, throughout your barbaric and systematic slaughter of innocent rats?

Hope you refuse all the results of animal research then.:bugeye:

If you like real-life testing so much, why don't you volunteer? I know a place down the block trying to get a new shampoo out on the market.

Between a dick and an asshole.:mad:

Why are you mad?

In the end, obviously not.

With a system of ethics like that, further discussion is pointless.:shrug:

With a system of ethics like that, further discussion is pointless.:shrug:

Yeah, whatever.

Just stop complaining about animal rights when you're killing them for money every single day.

Yeah, whatever.

Just stop complaining about animal rights when you're killing them for money every single day.

No need to justify blood thirsty tendencies to me.

Anyone who kills for fun is still nuts in my book.

No need to justify blood thirsty tendencies to me.

Anyone who kills for fun is still nuts in my book.

Anyone who kills for money is still nuts in my book.

Anyone who kills for money is still nuts in my book.

http://medicalsupplies.indoff.com/media/ANT/catalog/COX22236.jpg

kills bacteria for your money

What is the difference? This way there is no packaging, no trips for deliveries etc. I've never hunted myself, probably i never will either. The animals still go through the process.

Are you serious ?
The animals that are hunted are wild animals. I this case maybe not but it is also about the morality of it. You just don't kill for fun. It's wrong.

These "can hunters" don't torture the animals; rather, they kill them instantly. Besides, what is the end result of your actions and the actions of these hunters? In both situations, the animal is left dead, so there's really no difference.

Yea, dream on. Often the animals are not killed instantly, especially when it's amateurs doing the shooting.

Yea, dream on. Often the animals are not killed instantly, especially when it's amateurs doing the shooting.

There is never a guarantee an animal is killed instantly anywhere. Even in a slaughterhouse.

And my family always enjoyed hunting. They went out as a family, they stalked the animal. They lost more animals than they shot. It's the thrill of the hunt, like treasure hunting. I could never do it, but I understand it. Hell yeah they enjoyed it. I don't know of any hunters who don't. :shrug:
You act like the hunters enjoy torturing the animal and are psychopaths.

I also eat animals, but I don't eat for fun either....

??? I don't understand that.

There is never a guarantee an animal is killed instantly anywhere. Even in a slaughterhouse.
If performed properly the animals are killed instantly. At least the chance of them being killed instantly is much higher.

And my family always enjoyed hunting. They went out as a family, they stalked the animal. They lost more animals than they shot. It's the thrill of the hunt, like treasure hunting. I could never do it, but I understand it. Hell yeah they enjoyed it. I don't know of any hunters who don't. :shrug:
Guess who else went out as a family..
Did shot animals sometimes get away ?
Of course hunters love to kill, otherwise why would they do it.

You act like the hunters enjoy torturing the animal and are psychopaths.
Don't know about them being psychopaths but they certainly couldn't give a shit whether the animals end up being tortured. Either that or they are dumbfucks, no offense..

Yea, dream on. Often the animals are not killed instantly, especially when it's amateurs doing the shooting.

Yeah, but they're not tortured as Sam would indicate.

??? I don't understand that.

According to Sam, it's okay to kill animals for food and money, but it is barbaric to kill them for fun. :rolleyes:

Yeah, but they're not tortured as Sam would indicate.

I'd say it would qualify as torture if you have to shoot the animal several times to kill it.
Some hunters don't kill it with their guns on purpose and only wound it badly so they can kill the animal with their knife. I have seen this on a documentary once..

I'd say it would qualify as torture if you have to shoot the animal several times to kill it.
Some hunters don't kill it with their guns on purpose and only wound it badly so they can kill the animal with their knife. I have seen this on a documentary once..

It's not torture, Enmos. The animals die quickly after being shot, if not instantly.

On topic, however, I strongly disagree with "Canned Hunting", as I've said before. It is just a little annoying to hear people criticize these hunters for killing animals in the name of sport when they themselves kill animals for the sake of money.

It's not torture, Enmos. The animals die quickly after being shot, if not instantly.

On topic, however, I strongly disagree with "Canned Hunting", as I've said before. It is just a little annoying to hear people criticize these hunters for killing animals in the name of sport when they themselves kill animals for the sake of money.

Well, nobody is completely free of hypocrisy.. not even you ;)
The thing about this 'Canned hunting' is that it's completely amoral.

I'd say it would qualify as torture if you have to shoot the animal several times to kill it.....

So people should be born knowing how to kill an animal. You can target practice all you want but there are so many variables. <sigh>
I just don't see how its viewed as torture. I always thought torture was done on purpose.

So people should be born knowing how to kill an animal. You can target practice all you want but there are so many variables. <sigh>
I just don't see how its viewed as torture. I always thought torture was done on purpose.

Are you saying they hunt by accident. If you can't be certain you kill it instantly, you shouldn't be killing at all. And even then, you just don't kill for fun.

If someone just enjoyed killing animals they would not hunt to do it. Way too little of that enjoyment, for the effort spent.

Hunting is not killing - and this canned stuff is not hunting. It is arranged killing, and that's what's wrong and different about it.

By that logic, a doctor who autopsies people should condone cutting up people for fun? I once heard a doctor explain why she didn't go into surgery as a specialty: it was because, unlike a good surgeon, she did not enjoy the feel of a knife cutting into living flesh.

...If you can't be certain you kill it instantly, you shouldn't be killing at all. And even then, you just don't kill for fun.

huh :bugeye:

Canned hunting facilities, also known as hunting ranches or trophy ranches, are acreages enclosed by high, game-proof fences. For a fee, “hunters” can kill the animals held captive there. The facilities range in size from ten acres to several hundred acres. It is estimated that there are currently over 4,000 hunting ranches in the United States.

Many of these facilities offer a “no-kill, no-fee” policy. Animals in these facilities range from domestic species of game birds, deer and elk, to exotic species such as Russian boar, wildebeest, and zebra. Hunters of all skill levels are welcome and offered a choice of weapons; guns, bow and arrow, and in some cases, spears.

Some facilities offer guides who will go out on ATVs, find the quarry, and drive the animals into the line-of-sight of the hunters. In other cases, tree stands or blinds are set up near feeding stations-you simply wait for the species of your choice to walk by. In some facilities, the animals are drugged.

http://blogcritics.org/archives/2007/12/12/231732.php

People are sick

Hunting club:
http://www.safariclub.org/

American Humane Society article
http://www.hsus.org/wildlife/stop_canned_hunts/

Many people in society have an urge to kill things. These hunting clubs are a great outlet for such people. Personally I think it is sick to not give people outlets for their psychological needs.

You act like the hunters enjoy torturing the animal and are psychopaths.

Hmm so in your opinion stalking an animal for fun and shooting them is normal behaviour?

So if you saw a man pop around the corner with a gun, and he shot a dog which he had been stalking, you'd consider it perfectly normal?

hunting wild game and pets are not the same. Is it a feral dog?

I once heard a doctor explain why she didn't go into surgery as a specialty: it was because, unlike a good surgeon, she did not enjoy the feel of a knife cutting into living flesh.

That sounds right to me. I've done minor surgeries on rats and believe me, a live rat under anesthesia is scary, because you're wondering if he'll wake up or (if you've misjudged the anesthesia) if he won't.

Its way easier to put down a rat with gas, chop off it's head with a guillotine and separate the various parts. You don't have to keep checking (and worrying) if he will survive your experiment.

hunting wild game and pets are not the same. Is it a feral dog?

Its not his pet. He has no special feeling for it. He just enjoys stalking and shooting dogs.

I just don't see how its viewed as torture. I always thought torture was done on purpose.

Lets turn it around and see.

Lets imagine you are placed in an enclosure, where the fence is electrified. You are then denied necessary food and water, to weaken your body. After a few days, a bunch of people enter the enclosure with guns, with the sole purpose of hunting you for sport. You try to run and hide, but there is nowhere for you to go. So they casually walk around, guns at the ready, looking for you. You keep thinking to yourself that you need to do something, but cannot. You are no longer physically able to fight them, since the lack of food has lessened your strength. You can't climb the fence, as doing so will cause you pain, if not death. They then catch up with you and put a bullet in your leg. Just to slow you down a bit. You keep trying to run, but the pain is excruciating. So they casually follow your blood trail and decide to end it, thereby putting a bullet in your head.

Or lets imagine this scenario (also used in game hunting)..

You are in the wild. Then a couple of men decide to chase you with a gun or spear. They don't shoot you. Just chase you down for days on end. This is to tire you. You don't have time to eat or drink. When they catch up with you, they might cut one of the tendons in your legs... just so you slow down a bit. After several days of this, you find they are replaced with hunters, who then take pot shots at you as you flail about in pain and exhaustion. They finally take you down, after you cannot run any more.

You don't view either of those scenario's as torture? Hunting like this is done on purpose. It is done for a game and for sport. And it is one of the most depraved things a human being is capable of.

Ugh I did not even know all these details. And I stay up nights after poking rats in their legs for a glucose tolerance test. :bawl:

so wild game has human emotion and human feelings.
Is it torture for them to be hunted by a bear or wolf? or only humans?

so wild game has human emotion and human feelings.
Is it torture for them to be hunted by a bear or wolf? or only humans?

Lets just say I don't have to be human to feel the pain of being tortured for fun.

From the commencement of the hunting season in November to its end in April, fox hunters terrorize the fox population, in hunts which typically last from late morning to tea time. Chased by numerous hunters and hounds, and often, radio-equipped trucks for tracking, the fox usually dies an agonizing death after hours of pursuit. As a group called "earthstoppers" usually fill every visible fox hole the night before the hunt, the hunted fox has no means of escape, and is forced to flee until exhaustion. Hunting hounds are bred for endurance, not speed, which means that each fox hunt can last as long as two hours, until the fox is finally seized, and if lucky, shot, before being thrown to the hounds. Sometimes, the fox is literally eaten alive by the dogs, torn to pieces, with the tail, feet and head usually taken as trophy. Some hunts still engage in the practice of "blooding," where the foxes' blood is smeared on the faces of those witnessing their first kill, usually children.

http://www.arkonline.com/foxhunt.html

so wild game has human emotion and human feelings.
Is it torture for them to be hunted by a bear or wolf? or only humans?

A bear or a wolf will chase down an animal until it tires, and then kill it quickly for food. A bear or a wolf cannot carry on a chase for too long, since the amount of energy it burns is detrimental to them.

A bear or a wolf will not toy with their kill for days on end for their own sadistic pleasure. Nor will a bear or a wolf pose for photos with their kills, and then have it packed up and shipped to a taxidermist to have it stuffed so they can mount its head on a wall, or have it standing in their trophy room.

... Nor will a bear or a wolf pose for photos with their kills, and then have it packed up and shipped to a taxidermist to have it stuffed so they can mount its head on a wall, or have it standing in their trophy room.

Is that the torture part?

Why is this different?

On Tuesday, August 28, Travis Wilson was sentenced for felony burglary in the theft of "Dexter", a 35-pound Basset Hound that subsequently was mutilated and burned before being tossed on his owner's driveway. Dexter had astonishingly survived an earlier beating on February 12, though he was paralyzed as a result. The second beating which happened weeks later, involving the cutting off of all four of Dexter's legs, proved fatal

http://dogsinthenews.com/issues/0108/articles/010831b.htm

This type of behavior, although i do not condone it, sounds like a type of surplus killing found in some predators.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surplus_killing

"It is likely that this is a survival mechanism; the selection for aggressiveness toward prey being an evolutionary development toward becoming a more successful hunter"

Is that the torture part?

:bugeye:

Ermm Orleander, the whole point of the hunt and the hunt itself is torture.

:bugeye:

Ermm Orleander, the whole point of the hunt and the hunt itself is torture.

How is hunting defined as torture? As I see it, those who do hunt as described in the OP is not even hunting. Now an actual hunter, at least those that I know, kill the prey and leave it at that. They do not wound it on purpose, then watch it bleed :shrug:

How is hunting defined as torture? As I see it, those who do hunt as described in the OP is not even hunting. Now an actual hunter, at least those that I know, kill the prey and leave it at that. They do not wound it on purpose, then watch it bleed :shrug:

I meant it in regards to the OP and canned hunting and other practices where the animal is maimed in one form or another, to allow the "hunter" an easier kill for their own pleasure.

Hunting is not all that difficult anyway. The more animals the more to get hit by cars too and since almost everyone here DRIVES?????

How is hunting defined as torture? As I see it, those who do hunt as described in the OP is not even hunting. Now an actual hunter, at least those that I know, kill the prey and leave it at that. They do not wound it on purpose, then watch it bleed :shrug:

Lemme see, they use gas to knock it out, those actual hunters?

All they want is to see the animal dead?

I meant it in regards to the OP and canned hunting and other practices where the animal is maimed in one form or another, to allow the "hunter" an easier kill for their own pleasure.

Sorry about the misunderstanding, yes I totally agree with you. Although I do not have any evidence to support it, I believe a lot of the so called "hunters" that do this type of thing are big city hunters who can not hack the real thing. If you are going to hunt, at least have the decency to hunt on the animals home turf with the advantage going to the prey.

Lemme see, they use gas to knock it out, those actual hunters?

All they want is to see the animal dead?

And I completely agree with you, it is a pussified type of hunting.

I don't know a single hunter who does any of this canned "hunting " stuff, and someone who did would be despised in my area.

What these game farm guys are doing is taking the hunting out, and putting more killing in. They have the same view of hunting as SAM or Bells here - it's sadistic killing - only they enjoy it rather than being revolted by it.

Either that or they live in some fantasy world in which they actually are hunting - because humans are born hunters, after all: it's something that almost all human beings enjoy doing. It's easy to underestimate the effect of insulation and ignorance, and realize what city folk or rich people just don't know about animals and hunting.

The question trophy hunters should ask themselves is "why do I enjoy killing animals?".

Personally I would never willing harm an animal, but I do enjoy shooting people in video games. Perhaps hunters have never heard of Xbox 360??

The question trophy hunters should ask themselves is "why do I enjoy killing animals?".


Thats what I wonder too.

huh :bugeye:

Huh what ! :mad:

...
/restrain

Many people in society have an urge to kill things. These hunting clubs are a great outlet for such people. Personally I think it is sick to not give people outlets for their psychological needs.
I agree, kiddie brothels are a great psychological outlet for pedophiles as well, it would be sick not to allow them to express themselves.
I mean what kind of society are we living in where we cant let people do what ever they want no matter what the consequences, cuh.

:bugeye:

Ermm Orleander, the whole point of the hunt and the hunt itself is torture.

so you are saying my brother and son tortured this animal? :bugeye:
http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o186/orleander_photos/rack.jpg

Christ how you do dickheads do it, such wonderful majestic creatures, killed so you and little jimmy can have a shite story to tell when youre bored and there's nothing on tv.

What an utterally sad, pointless, reason to kill. What a disgrace.

so you are saying my brother and son tortured this animal? :bugeye:
http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o186/orleander_photos/rack.jpg

So.. why did they kill it again ? :mad:

Christ how you do dickheads do it, such wonderful majestic creatures, killed so you and little jimmy can have a shite story to tell when youre bored and there's nothing on tv.

What an utterally sad, pointless, reason to kill. What a disgrace.

Yes :(

I went deer hunting once. I could have easily shot bambi's momma, right through the left temple. I just couldn't do it. I have shot I don't know how many pesky Gopher's on my dad's farm(digging up land so bad you can't even run a swather), but I could not kill such a magnificent beast. I guess it was just because it didn't seem necessary...

So.. why did they kill it again ? :mad:

they ate it. We grew up eating antelope, deer, and elk. Kill the older ones, let the younger ones move up, more diversity in the gene pool.

Christ how you do dickheads do it, such wonderful majestic creatures, killed so you and little jimmy can have a shite story to tell when youre bored and there's nothing on tv.

What an utterally sad, pointless, reason to kill. What a disgrace.

So you think they shot it, took pics, and walked away?
You're right, that would be dickhead behavior, utterly sad, and a disgrace.

Its not what happened, but that probably doesn't matter to you does it.

Its not that. Who looks at a beauty like that and thinks, where is my gun?

they ate it. We grew up eating antelope, deer, and elk. Kill the older ones, let the younger ones move up, more diversity in the gene pool.

Nature can manage fine by itself !
And.. don't you have supermarkets over there ?

Originally Posted by heliocentric
Christ how you do dickheads do it, such wonderful majestic creatures, killed so you and little jimmy can have a shite story to tell when youre bored and there's nothing on tv.

What an utterally sad, pointless, reason to kill. What a disgrace. What creates this kind of ignorance? Inhaling too many bus fumes ? A mother who wouldn't allow even a pet cat because it would jump on the counter ?

I'm the last person to defend the average hunter, actually - so many seem to have the basic attitude of the PETA types, only coming to the opposite recommendations for action, plus they litter - but this notion that people hunt because they enjoy killing things is just goofy. And so is the idea that some kind of aesthetic, "wonderful majestic animal" appreciation shows the slightest respect for actual animals and their real lives.

This is the only way we're going to keep species from going extinct. If there's a value put on them.

Otherwise, let's turn that acreage into a subdivision.

This is the only way we're going to keep species from going extinct. If there's a value put on them.

Otherwise, let's turn that acreage into a subdivision.

What a very sad set of priorities humans have. :(

Nature can manage fine by itself !
And.. don't you have supermarkets over there ?

considering humans have been hunting as long as we have been on the planet, I think we are part of nature.

My family LOVES hunting. The killing is secondary and over with in seconds. The hunting is a day(s) long thing.

And saying they should go to the store instead of hunting seems hypocritcal. Why does it matter what meat they eat or who kills it as long as it is done humanely?

This is the only way we're going to keep species from going extinct. If there's a value put on them....

Today's hunters are some of the most staunch advocates for the environment. They see when animals are disappearing. They see when migratory/breeding grounds are being affected.

Anyone heard of Ducks Unlimited (http://www.ducks.org/hunting/)? (A conservation group that aids hunters and vice versa). They are huge here, I suppose because we have so much water.

considering humans have been hunting as long as we have been on the planet, I think we are part of nature.

My family LOVES hunting. The killing is secondary and over with in seconds. The hunting is a day(s) long thing.

And saying they should go to the store instead of hunting seems hypocritcal. Why does it matter what meat they eat or who kills it as long as it is done humanely?

There is a big difference between killing and eating wild animals and killing and eating domesticated livestock. Don't you think ?
We have been around for a very short time compared to the rest of life on earth, and there are indications that some animals have gone instinct because of our hunting forefathers too.
I don't think in this day and age we can afford losing species through needless hunting. Already a lot of animal species are extinct or threatened because of us and our wonderful industrialization and the pollution that comes with it. Not to speak of our invasion of natural habitat because of overpopulation.

Yeah, well, I don't think elk, deer, antelope, etc are in any danger of being wiped out here in the US. I think its more humane to eat wild animals vs domesticated. Wanna compare their habitat? When was the last time you saw a cow that starved to death due to overpopulation and the food source eaten up?? When was the last time you saw a duck factory or a deer feedlot?

And hunting is separate from building on and polluting the environment. Again, hunters are staunch environmentalists. They want wetlands saved. They want the forests protected. Canned hunting is cheating and most real hunters find it repulsive. Its about killing and ego, not about hunting.

Again, hunters are staunch environmentalists. They want wetlands saved. They want the forests protected.
I think this is too general. I used to live in a rural area and certainly a good number of the hunters I met were like this. But there were a good number who were not.

I think this is too general. I used to live in a rural area and certainly a good number of the hunters I met were like this. But there were a good number who were not.

They only want to save nature so they can keep hunting.

Yeah, well, I don't think elk, deer, antelope, etc are in any danger of being wiped out here in the US. I think its more humane to eat wild animals vs domesticated. Wanna compare their habitat? When was the last time you saw a cow that starved to death due to overpopulation and the food source eaten up?? When was the last time you saw a duck factory or a deer feedlot?

And hunting is separate from building on and polluting the environment. Again, hunters are staunch environmentalists. They want wetlands saved. They want the forests protected. Canned hunting is cheating and most real hunters find it repulsive. Its about killing and ego, not about hunting.

I disagree. Hands off nature.. :bawl:
Domesticated livestock is bad enough already..

I think this is too general. I used to live in a rural area and certainly a good number of the hunters I met were like this. But there were a good number who were not.

And not all hunting is like a canned hunt. Not all hunters shoot an animal just to wound it so they can then slit its throat.

Not all hunters are bad.

I disagree. Hands off nature.. :bawl:.....

well then we disagree don't we.

well then we disagree don't we.

Yep, quite.. ;)

And not all hunting is like a canned hunt. Not all hunters shoot an animal just to wound it so they can then slit its throat.

Not all hunters are bad.

I think I made it clear that I thought not all hunters were bad, so it seems strange to have you now say this to me. I've come in late to the discussion here. If some people are saying all hunters are bad, I don't agree. I don't think saying all hunters believe in conservation or care about wetlands etc. is really helpful, even when other people are making countergeneralizations that are also false.

Then we get two myths floating around and this is unpleasant for those of us who live in a more nuanced world and have noticed it.

They only want to save nature so they can keep hunting.
In my contacts with hunters I would say you are describing only some of them. I found a decent % who loved, understood and did more for nature than most non-hunters. And then there were others whose way of hunting reminded me of the attitudes rapists have. Then there were more neutral types who never looked at the big picture. It was like picking mushrooms or something.

I mean, I'm a vegetarian and I love many animals much more, I think, than I could love most people. I hate what is happening to nature. But I just don't think hunters are the real problem. Agribusiness, Gene modification, militiary and industrial waste, pesticides, waste in general, overpopulation...

these things seem like real threats to nature.

Youre nuts

Is this appropriate for a moderator? :eek:

Hypocrite.

Is this appropriate for a moderator? :eek:

Hypocrite.

she was talking about cashews...the nuts that everyone loves

In my contacts with hunters I would say you are describing only some of them. I found a decent % who loved, understood and did more for nature than most non-hunters. And then there were others whose way of hunting reminded me of the attitudes rapists have. Then there were more neutral types who never looked at the big picture. It was like picking mushrooms or something.

I mean, I'm a vegetarian and I love many animals much more, I think, than I could love most people. I hate what is happening to nature. But I just don't think hunters are the real problem. Agribusiness, Gene modification, militiary and industrial waste, pesticides, waste in general, overpopulation...

these things seem like real threats to nature.

Of course, hunters aren't a major problem. But it's the attitude that bothers me. Take fox hunting for example.. that pisses me off.. :mad:

And not all hunting is like a canned hunt. Not all hunters shoot an animal just to wound it so they can then slit its throat.

Not all hunters are bad.

Hunting references always remind me of this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ba7QvrreqU4

:D

Shikar

http://www.persianshikar.com/

Grmbl.. :mad:

Ugh! :bugeye:

Of course, hunters aren't a major problem. But it's the attitude that bothers me. Take fox hunting for example.. that pisses me off.. :mad:
yeah, I hate that too. It mixes in class anger, for me, also.

I guess my point was that hunters in general are not a problem, when it comes to the destruction of ecosystems, except those that break laws - around endangered animals, for example. That some hunters have very unpleasant attitudes about animals, life, etc. is a real phenomenon. But I don't think this is even most hunters.

yeah, I hate that too. It mixes in class anger, for me, also.

I guess my point was that hunters in general are not a problem, when it comes to the destruction of ecosystems, except those that break laws - around endangered animals, for example. That some hunters have very unpleasant attitudes about animals, life, etc. is a real phenomenon. But I don't think this is even most hunters.

I wouldn't know if it's most hunters.. I just know more than a fraction are like that. Appalling behavior...

Then there are those that are not particularly cruel on purpose and maybe don't give it much thought at all..
I think all hunting is wrong, except when people need to to eat. If there are other means to get food available you shouldn't hunt.

I agree, kiddie brothels are a great psychological outlet for pedophiles as well, it would be sick not to allow them to express themselves.
I mean what kind of society are we living in where we cant let people do what ever they want no matter what the consequences, cuh.

Way to devalue people. I think you might enjoy this thread as well:

http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=75148

I wouldn't know if it's most hunters.. I just know more than a fraction are like that. Appalling behavior...

Then there are those that are not particularly cruel on purpose and maybe don't give it much thought at all..
I think all hunting is wrong, except when people need to to eat. If there are other means to get food available you shouldn't hunt.

Are you a vegetarian?
If not you should know that using available meat in the stores probably caused more suffering to an animal then a hunter did.

My point is that even if other meat is available it is not better for animals if we just buy it in the store and let other people handle the miserable life of the animal and its killing. (as long as hunters follow the laws)

If you are a vegetarian the broad issue is still animals being killed and to focus on hunters in particular is judge those who actually take responsibility for their killing, and, in general are killing animals who got to live vastly better lives. (free range animals an exception).

Its like a war - sadly - there are those, generals, presidents - who send other people to kill for them. If we call the soldiers killers, we really need to focus on those with more responsibility, even if they never got out of their chairs.

Are you a vegetarian?
If not you should know that using available meat in the stores probably caused more suffering to an animal then a hunter did.....

he's not a vegetarian and I've already told him that. :rolleyes: But, he's addicted to his hands free prepackaged wrapped meat.
huh Enmos? lol

That makes me sick.

I think that if people want to hunt, one person should agree to be the victim and the rest of the group should shoot at them.

so you're a vegetarian I take it.

As a matter of fact yes I am.

then you're allowed to hate it.
You're not allowed to hate hunting if you eat the meat from a slaughter house.