So powerful to fight North Korea and Iraq at the same time?

How many US soldiers will be sacrificed?

Here's an idea: how about you address your own post in some sort of critical
manner rather than just lobbing out a random thought and then running out
the door, never commenting again as you always seem to do in this forum.

Let us see a little creative thing on your part for a change. It won't hurt you.

:m: Peace.

We can handle Iraq no problem. North Korea isn't much of a threat to our troops, because our troops wont be doing the fighitng. Our troops are stationed in SK so that, if the North attacks, we'll be brought into the war and have an excuse to use our resources in a conflict. The South Korean military is perfectly capable of handling the North, but US help would definetely aid during a crisis.

Originally posted by Kyle_S
...our troops wont be doing the fighitng. Our troops are stationed in SK so that, if the North attacks, we'll be brought into the war...So you are saying our troops will be doing some of the fighting as well.The South Korean military is perfectly capable of handling the North...I would not make so glib a prediction. North Korea has the world's third-largest standing army (I think) - approximately 1.2 million soldiers. It has reportedly developed a large arsenal of biological and chemical weapons, and has built nuclear bombs, which can be delivered via their ballistic-missile technology that Iran, Iraq, Syria, and Egypt are buying.

General Thomas Schwartz, commander of the 37,000 U.S. troops there said, "Korea remains a place where U.S. forces could almost instantaneously become engaged in a high-intensity war involving significant ground, air and naval forces. Such a war would cause loss of life numbering in the hundreds of thousands and cause billions of dollars in property destruction.''

It does not seem that the United States military shares your optimism.

:m: Peace.

i think US can fight >2 wars at the same time, but with painful price!

why not she saves her money to boost the economy?

US's military action against Iraq can only viewed as INVASION.

cause havoc and more conflicts in middle east, hamper world's economy recovery, provides more reasons for extremists to launch revengeful attack on US and its allies.

http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=14822

Originally posted by Seeker01
So powerful to fight North Korea and Iraq at the same time?Most definitely, we are the supper power, we have the largest military budget in the world (thanks to our tax-suckers), and most of all. We have nothing more intelligent to do.

How many US soldiers will be sacrificed? Some, but who cares, (military should have the right to earn their income, just like police and firemen), we have many more from where they came from and besides those who die will come back home in a nice sarcophagus with our beautiful flag and CNN will switch to a special programming, with all honors
and musical background as in a Hollywood movie.

…we witness that during desert storm, and looks like the people misses it.

who cares, (military should have the right to earn their income, just like police and firemen),


I take that as an insult.

Does my sacrifice to protect my family and friends mean so little to you?

I may fight, and I may die. It's discouraging to know there are people like you that think their lives are worth more than those who fight to save it.


we have many more from where they came from


Yeah, people like you. I hope I never have to be your platoon commander when you're drafted (or will you flee to Canada?), because you'll just be looking out for yourself, at the expense of everyone around you. :mad:


those who die will come back home in a nice sarcophagus with our beautiful flag…we witness that during desert storm, and looks like the people misses it.


And I've been in some of their funerals. Have you? Or, did it piss you off when the special programming interrupted your cartoons?

Originally posted by VAKEMP
I take that as an insult.

Does my sacrifice to protect my family and friends mean so little to you?

I may fight, and I may die. It's discouraging to know there are people like you that think their lives are worth more than those who fight to save it.



Yeah, people like you. I hope I never have to be your platoon commander when you're drafted (or will you flee to Canada?), because you'll just be looking out for yourself, at the expense of everyone around you. :mad:



And I've been in some of their funerals. Have you? Or, did it piss you off when the special programming interrupted your cartoons? You are free to consider any comment or view as an insult, that’s your right.

Yes, if you fight, you can die that’s the nicest thing about holding and using a gun. Is that molesting you?

Yes, I do think that my life is more worth to me than the life of those who are trying to defend it for me without asking me at their own conviction. If you are convinced about it, fair enough one day you’ll have to ask God for the credit.

Yes, you better hope that I never end-up in your platoon. If I get drafted, I will decide the cause and not simply be used like a puppet. That’s democracy to me! ..and there’s no need to go Canada way.

If I’ll ever go, it will be by my own convictions and not by wanting pity or laurels for protecting some lazy ass out there.

I look for my self and loved ones at my expenses the same as when our government expends millions more on weapons than helping the needed. Do you have a problem with that?

Yes, I have been to two funerals caused at desert storm, and the families left behind at first hold tight onto their inherited medals, however, looking at all now, I’m sure they would have loved more to hold onto a financial support than the rusted medals.

No, they never interrupted my cartoons. I watched with attention every military related report. How else could I judge my points of views?

Microzoft,
I have realized that you are just a man that is mad. You don't know who to direct your anger to.

You're mad at your government, so you insult the military because you don't know anything about it. You have no personal experience of being in the military, so you just assume that they are mindless, heartless souls who are nothing but a human shield between you and your enemy. That helps you sleep at night, to think that they are lesser than you, and that you have a right to dismiss them as people who shouldn't be treated with the dignity and respect you expect to be treated with yourself.

In summary, you are a stubborn, ignorant person, who does not know how to cope with feelings of anger and confusion.

I know there are many problems here in America, but I still love it. I just hope you will try and learn the errors of your ways someday.

Someday.

Originally posted by VAKEMP
Microzoft,
I have realized that you are just a man that is mad. You don't know who to direct your anger to.

You're mad at your government, so you insult the military because you don't know anything about it. You have no personal experience of being in the military, so you just assume that they are mindless, heartless souls who are nothing but a human shield between you and your enemy. That helps you sleep at night, to think that they are lesser than you, and that you have a right to dismiss them as people who shouldn't be treated with the dignity and respect you expect to be treated with yourself.

In summary, you are a stubborn, ignorant person, who does not know how to cope with feelings of anger and confusion.

I know there are many problems here in America, but I still love it. I just hope you will try and learn the errors of your ways someday.

Someday. Thanks for expending your valuable time on my opinions and secondguessing me, but unfortunately your psychological approach is running 180 degrees from your subject.

I can assure you that if I was ever mad, I have no problem yielding the target.

No, I’m not mad at our government, they just capitalizing on the ignorance of the masses, and that is perfectly normal. However, I hold my right to discuss and argue their methods and intentions.
Yes, I do have experiences and mostly on foreign assignments.

I don’t assume that the military are mindless, simply that a great majority are sheep’s and opportunists. Which I may ad, it is also normal. And they don’t help me to sleep at night, …only the wealth and security of my family does, since I’m the only one taking them seriously and without profit or reserves.

I can treat individual for their own gain and respect, an Army is not an individual
….don’t forget that the Army doesn’t treat you as an individual but instead as a member of the masses.
Stubborn? Maybe
Ignorant? Yes! …But fortunately only in your opinion.
Yes! I can definitely cope with seldom cases of feeling anger and confusion. But I don’t need to prove that to you, or do I??

Do you think that any American that disagrees in the highest possible tone any issue of our land, actually hates our land??? You can’t really be so narrow, can you??

Kyle that you consider it an option tells me you may not value life too much. The 1 war they are planning is 1 war too many, whatever the outcome lives will be lost. Now to take on Korea too, that is just asking for bodybags. Maybe you should enlist, Kyle stand up for your beliefs, cause everyone will be needed should they fight 2 wars, Iraq is a proud enemy women soldiers will be fighting you too; can you shoot at women? If history will serve lessons quite a few nations went into wars hoping for quick decisive victories only to be dragged into protracted horrors that gave us the term "pyrrhic victory" - victory at high cost. America may well heed the cautions of Sun Tsu in his treatise - "The Art of War" avoid war if you can.
http://www.chinapage.com/sunzi-e.html

I'm enlisted in the US Army and am shipping out in June this year after I complete my semester at ASU. I enlisted November last year. My MOS is combat engineer and I've enlisted for 3 years. Thanks for making the suggestion, but I already made the decision. Now get off your high and mighty soapbox.

I hate to break it to you, but as the world becomes smaller, wars are going to become more common place. Congress recognized this years ago, and passed the war powers act. It's essentially a declaration of war authorizing a president to go to war for two months without needing Congressional approval. It allows the US to conduct low level operations. The check on this is that Congress controls the purse strings and there's an unwritten promise by the president that he won't get the US into a war it doesn't want, then ask for a declaration.

There is no "1 war is a war too many". That's a teary eyed fallacy; war was upon us in 9/11 (even long before then) and if we want to stop the loss of lives on our side, then we have to go into the Middle East and eradicate the fundamentalism that infects it. That's what the objective is, starting with Iraq. There won't be massive losses of lives, but even if there were, it would be for the better.

No, I’m not mad at our government, they just capitalizing on the ignorance of the masses, and that is perfectly normal. However, I hold my right to discuss and argue their methods and intentions.
Of course you have the right. I would never keep that from you. But I also have the right to tell you that I don't appreciate you acting as if military members were like logs that you could keep throwing on a fire...especially when you yourself supposedly served.

we have many more from where they came from and besides those who die will come back home in a nice sarcophagus with our beautiful flag

You don't think that's disrespectful?

I don’t assume that the military are mindless, simply that a great majority are sheep’s and opportunists.

I don't know your military background, (I'm guessing Army, since you use that and soldier all the time) but I know about 275,000 Marines that would like to kick your @&& for stereotyping.

However, I hold my right to discuss and argue their methods and intentions.

Once again, I remind you that you insulted the service member, not the government, with your comments.

How old are you may I ask Kyle, not that it matters, I'm just curious here. Well I can speak for my part in that I detest war for whatever reason you on the other hand think the more lives lost the better:rolleyes: oh well, take care, soldier!

Originally posted by VAKEMP
Of course you have the right. I would never keep that from you. But I also have the right to tell you that I don't appreciate you acting as if military members were like logs that you could keep throwing on a fire...especially when you yourself supposedly served.
You don't think that's disrespectful?
I don't know your military background, (I'm guessing Army, since you use that and soldier all the time) but I know about 275,000 Marines that would like to kick your @&& for stereotyping.
Once again, I remind you that you insulted the service member, not the government, with your comments. You are talking like a teenager office boy and I find unreal that you have served 7 years ...and illiterate on international laws covering war engagements. What an investment, a typical ignorant patriot that only has the flag to hold onto.

Besides, you recently mentioned that you are in for the money and occasional trips.
You also get easily touchy as if you haven’t got your tan from Korea yet.

Well, you have your point and I have your ignorance. Good luck!

Originally posted by firdroirich
How old are you may I ask Kyle, not that it matters, I'm just curious here. Well I can speak for my part in that I detest war for whatever reason you on the other hand think the more lives lost the better:rolleyes: oh well, take care, soldier! 19. I don't value lives lost, but war is a better alternative to appeasement. Problems aren't going to go away with self-hate and universal brotherhood. They're going to go away because of naked force. This is historical fact and it's as applicable today as ever.

Originally posted by Kyle_S
19. I don't value lives lost, but war is a better alternative to appeasement. Problems aren't going to go away with self-hate and universal brotherhood. They're going to go away because of naked force. This is historical fact and it's as applicable today as ever. Historical facts?
You mean like in Vietnam? or Saigon? …Perhaps like in N.Korea?
or so any other places. So many thousand lives lost in unfinished wars, and you call that a Fact?

Playing the game of politicians,...Ok, joint the statistics!

Kyle, force, war, it doesn't make problems go away. It adds to the problem. Violence is not a solution.

You are talking like a teenager office boy and I find unreal that you have served 7 years ...and illiterate on international laws covering war engagements. What an investment, a typical ignorant patriot that only has the flag to hold onto.

Microzoft,
Your past military experience might have been different than mine. Does that make me wrong?

I am illiterate in international laws covering war engagements. That doesn't mean I am a waste. I handle the budget for the Marines stationed at all 139 US embassies in which US Marines are stationed. A budget of approximately $40 million. So lemme guess, to oust me, you're going to say that you have experience in the Persian Gulf, and while you were out fighting the Iraqi's, you also handled an enormous budget. You don't know the amount of responsibility I have. How I choose to disperse the funds determines the welfare of over 1,500 Marines directly. If I cannot fund security upgrades, Marines and Embassy personnel can possibly die. I have regulations that would go up to my waist if they were in print, because I need to follow the Department of State rules AND the Department of Defense rules. Did you do anything like that?

I used to work at the Pentagon, rm 4B535 to be exact. We moved our office on the Friday before the attacks. Guess what? The next Tuesday, 4B535 was destroyed. Our new spaces weren't far away, and we were temporarily relocated to the Navy Annex for two months so they could clear all of the smoke out of our newly renovated offices.

My only times out of the country are to teach the Marines on post at the Embassies how to deal with Budget and Finance officers (who are State Dept employees), because, let's face it, DoS and DoD mix about as well as oil and water.

Besides, you recently mentioned that you are in for the money and occasional trips.

Never did I EVER say that I was in it for the money and trips @&&hole. The road that eventually led me to my current job was long, but I originally enlisted as a grunt. I won't waste my time going into detail of how I got to my current MOS, but I assure you it wasn't by choice. This is the last thing I wanted to do. But sometimes we just have to shut up and do it. You should know that.

You know, with your experience, you could probably help people understand things they were previously unaware of. For example, your experience in the middle east, and knowledge of the GC. Instead, you seem to be here for your own entertainment. I mean, why else would you say you don't care if service members lose their lives in N Korea?

What is your agenda here? To belittle people who are doing the same thing you once did? Am I to blame when I wasn't taught the same things you were taught in the military? Or maybe you went out on your own to find your information, and you feel everyone should have done the same by now? If you know something I don't, why don't you help me by telling me where to find it, instead of insulting me because I haven't found it?

My anger towards you has stemmed from your earlier comment about how you don't care if service members die in N. Korea. My anger towards you has grown with your further comments in which you seem to think YOUR time in the service was more important than MINE, because you got to read the GC.

You have yet to reveal your military history to me, btw.

Originally posted by VAKEMP
Microzoft,
Your past military experience might have been different than mine. Does that make me wrong?

This is the last thing I wanted to do. But sometimes we just have to shut up and do it. You should know that.

You know, with your experience, you could probably help people understand things they were previously unaware of

What is your agenda here?

My anger towards you has stemmed from your earlier comment

You have yet to reveal your military history to me, btw. Military experiences doesn’t make anyone right or wrong, it just has nothing to do with the discussions at hand.

No, I’m not going to tell you what I did or didn’t do (no gona fall for that), you couldn’t imagine in your wildest dream, and besides it is not in discussion on this thread. I think we have already managed enough to bore the audience here, don you think?

By the absents of an affluent discussion, …converting it into a personal glamour. Not my style!

I have and I am training people based on my foreign tours, but will never in this sort of forums. …Obviously!

Yes, I’m here in this forum for entertainment purposes if reading people’s opinions its exactly that. And when exactly have I said that I don’t care if service people lose their lives in NK??? Please read again.

My position is that professional military personnel generally have very clear in their minds that as we kill sons and fathers, humans as valued as human life can be. It is perfectly normal and a fair game to expect the same. Now, you can call that what ever you want to, or you can interpret it as you ever please, but don’t you ever go on turning the meaning to satisfy your own fancy at my cost.

If I have triggered your anger, learn to manage it. If you can’t deal with it, than ignore me.

Don’t let anger be a part of your assessment on debating your opinions.

No, I don’t have to reveal any single part of my private life. It is pointless to the general public and am not in the business of using my private life to backup my opinion and free thoughts. Sorry and Goodbye on this thread!

By the absents of an affluent discussion, …converting it into a personal glamour. Not my style!

...No, I don’t have to reveal any single part of my private life. It is pointless to the general public

Then maybe you should have answered my PM, which I did, in fact, send you before this discussion was made public!

Originally posted by VAKEMP
Then maybe you should have answered my PM, which I did, in fact, send you before this discussion was made public!

Private Message from: VAKEMP
Your comments about military members...

Microzoft, you obviously have no military experience. Your ignorant comments are evidence of this. Please STFU if you don't know what you're talking about, mmm-kay?

Sincerely,
VAKEMP
__________________
You couldn't get a clue during the clue mating season in a field full of horny clues if you smeared your body with clue musk and did the clue mating dance.
- Edward Flaherty


Staff Sergeant Vakemp, I'm sure you have more challenging and interesting things to do. ...At list, I do!

That clue stuff hehe:D hey Kyle I've seen a war & I read somewhere sometimes there is a certain peace that can only be found after war ... there is nothing there but death & dying - pity they send 19 year olds instead of the people who start it all, I don't see them "war pigs"volunteering in droves.
I like that quote at the bottom of gooyfish's post by the king of Belgium, how true.

I hope you get banned for posting my PM. It's a personal message, meaning I intended only for you to see it. I don't appreciate you posting it publicly. :mad:

BTW, doesn't the topic of my PM sound familiar? Kinda like I was tryin' to keep my problem with you private?

Oh, excuse me. I assumed a person with prior military experience wouldn't say things like:

Some, but who cares, (military should have the right to earn their income, just like police and firemen), we have many more from where they came from and besides those who die will come back home in a nice sarcophagus

Did I misunderstand you? If you were to say so, I would apologize. But no, you haven't.

So, I can only assume that you are lying about your prior military experience, or you are just what the USMC affectionately refers to as the 10%. 'You know, there's always that 10%'. Maybe both. :rolleyes:

Whatever. I feel my response was justified. If you really feel that way about the military, I'm glad you got out. But don't worry, I'll still take a bullet for you if I have to. Like I said before, I can only hope that one day you'll see the error of your ways.

I retract my previous statement. I don't think you should get banned from this forum for posting my PM. But I will say that I don't appreciate it, so don't do it again.

firdroirich, the most common message I hear when listening to radio talk back is war veterans ringing up and saying they've had enough, they don't want to see any more children sent off to die. I agree, instead of sending the innocence off to fight over leaders disagreements, it is the leaders who should be made to go instead of sitting in their comfortable offices signing the death warrants of thousands of people they will never know and will always be a faceless statistic to them.