An anorexic Brazilian model just died from her disease. (Story (http://euronews.net/create_html.php?page=detail_info&article=391031&lng=1))

I think this is totally fucked up. It's one thing to want to look athletic, or even thin, but the way fashion models look is just ridiculous. I don't know any woman (including me) who truly feels good about her body. This is in part due to our nature, but the fashion industry imposing impossible, photoshopped standards of beauty on women multiplies it.

Women need to take their fate into their own hands and start setting some realistic beauty standards. And stop feeling so goddamn bad about themselves. Either you want to be thin, you shut up, watch your diet and work out like I do, either you don't and you shovel chocolate down your throat, which is just as good. The problem we have today is the girls who feel bad about their body, so they eat to feel better, so they look bad, so they eat etc. Grr.

An anorexic Brazilian model just died from her disease. (Story (http://euronews.net/create_html.php?page=detail_info&article=391031&lng=1))

I think this is totally fucked up. It's one thing to want to look athletic, or even thin, but the way fashion models look is just ridiculous. I don't know any woman (including me) who truly feels good about her body. This is in part due to our nature, but the fashion industry imposing impossible, photoshopped standards of beauty on women multiplies it.

Women need to take their fate into their own hands and start setting some realistic beauty standards. And stop feeling so goddamn bad about themselves. Either you want to be thin, you shut up, watch your diet and work out like I do, either you don't and you shovel chocolate down your throat, which is just as good. The problem we have today is the girls who feel bad about their body, so they eat to feel better, so they look bad, so they eat etc. Grr.

What about the female you are promoting in your avatar? I can see her ribs and her arms are like twigs. The boobs make it a nice erotic shot, but take away the boobs and you have a VERY skinny possibly anorexic model.

I share your anger Sandoz I have spent the last 5 years helping my g/f recover from Bulimia.

I share your anger Sandoz I have spent the last 5 years helping my g/f recover from Bulimia.

did you participate in the 'most beautiful woman on Earth ' thread?

it's all about promoting skinny females,

I don't see any average weight or fatties there? You guys are full of shit. You stop desiring trophy girlfriends who look like they haven't had a meal in months and we'll start piling the pounds back on. I like my body but that's because it fits the present desired view but now and again I feel I should be thinner because that is what the media is shoving down my throat! MEDIA Stop shoving!

did you participate in the 'most beautiful woman on Earth ' thread?

it's all about promoting skinny females,

I don't see any average weight or fatties there? You guys are full of shit. You stop desiring trophy girlfriends who look like they haven't had a meal in months and we'll start piling the pounds back on. I like my body but that's because it fits the present desired view but now and again I feel I should be thinner because that is what the media is shoving down my throat! MEDIA Stop shoving!

Im pretty sure one I posted was average weight.

did you participate in the 'most beautiful woman on Earth ' thread?

it's all about promoting skinny females,

I don't see any average weight or fatties there? You guys are full of shit. You stop desiring trophy girlfriends who look like they haven't had a meal in months and we'll start piling the pounds back on. I like my body but that's because it fits the present desired view but now and again I feel I should be thinner because that is what the media is shoving down my throat! MEDIA Stop shoving!

I never even opened that thread, it didn't interest me. But I certainly would not have chosen a skinny model thats for sure. I encourage my g/f to be within the normal healthy weight range and that is all that concerns me. But I would prefer her to be nearer the top than then bottom.

did you participate in the 'most beautiful woman on Earth ' thread?

it's all about promoting skinny females,

Skinny women look more fertile than overweight women. Humans are simply biological machines designed by nature to pass genes and replicate.

Humans are nothing special.

Skinny women look more fertile than overweight women. Humans are simply biological machines designed by nature to pass genes and replicate.

Humans are nothing special.

actually ab, skinny women have more trouble conceiving than overweight women, some anorexics can never have children even after they recover and gain weight due the damage it does to their insides.

skinny women look fertile how? How do no breasts and bones project an image of fertility exactly? Note Sandoz anorexic avatar has had a boob job thus any image of fertility you gleam from that is 'fictional'.

I never even opened that thread, it didn't interest me. But I certainly would not have chosen a skinny model thats for sure. I encourage my g/f to be within the normal healthy weight range and that is all that concerns me. But I would prefer her to be nearer the top than then bottom.

out of interest what height is your gf and what do you consider her 'healthy weight' range to be?

actually ab, skinny women have more trouble conceiving than overweight women, some anorexics can never have children even after they recover and gain weight due the damage it does to their insides.

skinny women look fertile how? How do no breasts and bones project an image of fertility exactly? Note Sandoz anorexic avatar has had a boob job thus any image of fertility you gleam from that is 'fictional'.

I never said anything about anorexic women. Your comment involved skinny women. So, we talk in general. Anorexia is a different story.

http://www.menshealth.co.uk/news/story.phtml?id=2347

You tell me that overweight women have an hourglass shape? Maybe peach shape.

She is 9 Stone and 5 5" I don't have any personal idea of what is healthy I go by offical health guides and I think she is in the middle. If she went higher than the guide I would encourage her to maintain but other than that I don't care what her weight is.

I never said anything about anorexic women. Your comment involved skinny women. So, we talk in general. Anorexia is a different story.

http://www.menshealth.co.uk/news/story.phtml?id=2347

You tell me that overweight women have an hourglass shape? Maybe peach shape.

hourgalss women are generally NOT skinny Ab, skinny tend to go straight up and straight down, BUT

hourglass can apply to size 6 to size 20+, as long as they go in at the waist more than the chest and hips, then they have the hourglass shape and thus the shape does not relate to weight.

meanwhile I don't give that link any credit.

This is funny, people are writing about poverty and this model is starving her own self. This world has to be the best reality show beaming back to the universe.:p

Skinny to me is showing your body's frame with little ambiguity. Overweight people don't show it very well. The dictionary disagree's with me, but basically to me it means "not overweight."

So we are arguing on different definitions.

Why don't you give the link any credit? Surely I could find more... but why? Is it because you find it hard to believe that a women's body may actually displays signs telling whether or not she may be worth it for men to persue simply for making babies and passing on genes?

Here is something similar... but it's more general: http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=0962-8452(19990122)266%3A1415%3C211%3AVCTFPA%3E2.0.CO%3 B2-S

It uses BMI... even though I think it's trash, it's works "in general."

Who in the fuck determines what a model should look like? I have no fucking idea. Because most guys that I know, "love" Women with Big tits & Round Asses. These models are nothing more then a bag of bones. Brazillian women are classified as the most sexiest women in the world. There was no need for her to alter anything about her.

Who in the fuck determines what a model should look like? I have no fucking idea.

The model essentially does. In their minds (anorexics), they see themselves as fat.

It's funny that some bodybuilder's have a similar problem.. only they do not think they are ever big enough. Look at those like Ronnie Coleman. Those like him are getting too big... they think they look good, but they think they can look even better bigger. And they do, every year they are bigger. They are actually WAY past ideal.

The ideal body for men is something like Steve Reeves. I believe it's based on an ancient Greek standard. I have a feeling the golden ratio comes into play somewhere :p

http://www.schwarzenegger.it/mro/reeves/sr69.jpg

Most people agree he was the most proportioned man in history, if not one of the most.

Women like skinny women not men! Women often don't dress to impress men it more to impress or out do other women.

http://media4.ugoto.com/pictures/anorexic-or-just-stupid-a32.JPG

..she still has to reduce some fat

http://media4.ugoto.com/pictures/anorexic-or-just-stupid-a32.JPG

..she still has to reduce some fat

Jesus! that is more repulsive than any fat woman.

Wow. That cannot be a serious photo shoot.

Skinny to me is showing your body's frame with little ambiguity. Overweight people don't show it very well. The dictionary disagree's with me, but basically to me it means "not overweight."

So we are arguing on different definitions.

Why don't you give the link any credit? Surely I could find more... but why? Is it because you find it hard to believe that a women's body may actually displays signs telling whether or not she may be worth it for men to persue simply for making babies and passing on genes?

Here is something similar... but it's more general: http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=0962-8452(19990122)266%3A1415%3C211%3AVCTFPA%3E2.0.CO%3 B2-S

It uses BMI... even though I think it's trash, it's works "in general."

like I said Ab, hourgalss can apply to skinny or extremely obese, the link has no credit because it is impossible to know if certain women 'catch' more easily than others, unless we stick them in a lab 24/7 and screw them an equal amount of time same guy etc, monitor guys sperm count make sure it does not vary from woman to woman, make sure other factors do not restrict conception occurring such as body temp, anxiety, diet etc, million things Ab a million things.

I don't doubt men are attracted to hour glass figure, that's not exactly news now is it.

The model essentially does. In their minds (anorexics), they see themselves as fat.

.

actually they are repeatedly told they are fat by their agents, photographers and clients, they are told to lose weight, to get that boney look. I am watching 'next top model' as we speak and the skinniest are told to lose weight.........and given one week to do so.

Media does it

I don't doubt men are attracted to hour glass figure, that's not exactly news now is it.

to me, Im attracted to cukooclock figures and philips digital radio alarm asses.

Even women like Jo Brand have anorexia these days. We went to see her a few months back and like she said she is plauge by thoughts that shes over-weight.

http://media4.ugoto.com/pictures/anorexic-or-just-stupid-a32.JPG

..she still has to reduce some fat

Wow, I thought that chick was wearing some bamboo chest piece for a moment until I realized it was her ribs. :bugeye:

- N

actually they are repeatedly told they are fat by their agents, photographers and clients, they are told to lose weight, to get that boney look. I am watching 'next top model' as we speak and the skinniest are told to lose weight.........and given one week to do so.

Media does it

So we take the responibility away from those in control of their own bodies?

If I were a female I'd tell them to fuck off.. take it or leave it. Anything below 15% body fat (on a woman) little to no muscle definition is just bad looking and unhealthy. Pictures such as the above does very little but make me want to throw up. Is she targetting females? Way to go.

So we take the responibility away from those in control of their own bodies?

If I were a female I'd tell them to fuck off.. take it or leave it. Anything below 15% body fat (on a woman) little to no muscle definition is just bad looking and unhealthy. Pictures such as the above does very little but make me want to throw up. Is she targetting females? Way to go.


I feel the same about the physcial image projected by body builders but it doesn't stop guys like you aspiring to it as an ideal does it?

We are being slowly brainwashed,

There is a difference between trying to become as skinny as possible and becoming a strong or big as possible. The former is very unhealthy. Running the latter route is not unhealthy as long as one stays away from steroids.

Either way, there is a trend to do either because of social pressures. However, each person has control over their own body. That, and we lack education on many things. A lot of the skinniest females I have known tend to be stupid. A lot of the largest guys (muscles, anyway) I have known tend to be the same thing. In both cases, I think they do it to make up for a lack of wit or intellect. Hell, if you are stupid why not make up for it somewhere else? Just like guys with super large pick-up trucks and noisey motorcycles... I wonder what they lack.

There is a difference between trying to become as skinny as possible and becoming a strong or big as possible. The former is very unhealthy. Running the latter route is not unhealthy as long as one stays away from steroids.

Either way, there is a trend to do either because of social pressures. However, each person has control over their own body. That, and we lack education on many things. A lot of the skinniest females I have known tend to be stupid. A lot of the largest guys (muscles, anyway) I have known tend to be the same thing. In both cases, I think they do it to make up for a lack of wit or intellect. Hell, if you are stupid why not make up for it somewhere else? Just like guys with super large pick-up trucks and noisey motorcycles... I wonder what they lack.

I think we need a recent pic of you and your Abs Absane to see if you are overdoing it or not

I think we need a recent pic of you and your Abs Absane to see if you are overdoing it or not

Doing 100 sit-ups a day doesn't give anyone 6-pack. Anyway, any noticable changes are usually seen with 6-months to a year. I'm only at it for 2-3 months. And I only just a week ago started on a "lose some fat" thing.

http://www.fathersforlife.org/images/walkingdead.jpg

What about the female you are promoting in your avatar? I can see her ribs and her arms are like twigs. The boobs make it a nice erotic shot, but take away the boobs and you have a VERY skinny possibly anorexic model.You've got good eyes, I can't see the ribs in such a tiny picture myself.

I'm thinking about changing it anyway, it's attracted a few creepy comments. :bugeye:

Jesus Christ.. the lady on the left looks 100x better just by comparison. She is still ugly though.

Skinny women look more fertile than overweight women. Humans are simply biological machines designed by nature to pass genes and replicate.

Humans are nothing special.

Incorrect.
Attractive mate qualities are typically signs of a disease free and healthy individual. Good teeth, big breasts, glossy hair, bright plummage, etc.

Skinny women are culturally more attractive because being skinny in the industrial and post-industrial era is a sign of wealth, and we assume, sunbconciously, that the individual is wealthy because they have good genes.

Look at these old fertility idols:
http://www.tomkinscollection.org/art/5/27542_media_files_media_521_medium.jpg

http://witcombe.sbc.edu/willendorf/images/willendorfa.jpg



The same thing with the attractiveness of tans. Back in the day, when we labored outside, pale skin was a sign of wealth. It meant you weren't working in the fields like a commoner. Just check out Renaissance art. It's full of pale white bodies and chunky women.

You've got good eyes, I can't see the ribs in such a tiny picture myself.

I'm thinking about changing it anyway, it's attracted a few creepy comments. :bugeye:


:) The boys here will salivate at the mere mention of 'female' regardless of any avatar! You know some like to imagine I am naked in mine and I am only showing my head and neck! So you can't win! Yours is a nice pic just a skinny bird is all. Though looking at it again, the lines I assumed were ribs are appearing across other parts of the pic, so it may just be my pc's pic resolution or whatever the technical term is.

Roman.. eww. No good fertility out of that for me.

.....I am naked in mine and I am only showing So you can.....Yours...........looking at it.......again......other parts of the.........

:eek: so...continue... I want to hear the development of this story....:)

Roman.. eww. No good fertility out of that for me.

You'd be drooling over that if it was the neolithic.

You'd be drooling over that if it was the neolithic.

If that is the case.. I wonder why we push for overweight women to lose some weight. I mean.. Rosie O'Donnell looks bad. Monica Lewinsky does, too. Kirstie Alley,...

http://www.msmagazine.com/summer2005/images/alley250.jpg

Eh.

If that is the case.. I wonder why we push for overweight women to lose some weight. I mean.. Rosie O'Donnell looks bad. Monica Lewinsky does, too. Kirstie Alley,...

http://www.msmagazine.com/summer2005/images/alley250.jpg

Eh.

this one's better

http://steelturman.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/fat_actress1.jpg

If that is the case.. I wonder why we push for overweight women to lose some weight. I mean.. Rosie O'Donnell looks bad. Monica Lewinsky does, too. Kirstie Alley,...

http://www.msmagazine.com/summer2005/images/alley250.jpg

Eh.

Culture.
The same reason we wear clothes in hot environments.
Or maybe women look better un burkas?

You missed my question.. but then again I didn't ask one and I was vague.

You missed my question.. but then again I didn't ask one and I was vague.

What was it.

What was it.

Absane comments " I wonder why we push for overweight women to lose some weight."

draqons answer: Because our society wants to feed on anything that can be made money of...including the market of diet pills.

Absane comments " I wonder why we push for overweight women to lose some weight."

Cultural. We want them to lose weight because of cultural reasons. In other cultures, they get their women fat.

We used to like fat women because food was scarce. Hence fat -> rich. Now there's food all over the place and we're sedentary, so being thin means you have the time and money to go to the gym.

Same thing about skin color. In the old days beautiful women had milky skin because peasants worked in the sun while aristocrats stayed in the shade. Today tan is beautiful because tan means you can afford to go on vacation.

Both standards take just as much work (believe you me, staying thin and tan is a LOT of work), but the difference is: anorexia and skin cancer kill.

Though I believe I'm a long stretch from either. Hopefully.

We used to like fat women because food was scarce. Hence fat -> rich. Now there's food all over the place and we're sedentary, so being thin means you have the time and money to go to the gym.

Same thing about skin color. In the old days beautiful women had milky skin because peasants worked in the sun while aristocrats stayed in the shade. Today tan is beautiful because tan means you can afford to go on vacation.

Both standards take just as much work (believe you me, staying thin and tan is a LOT of work), but the difference is: anorexia and skin cancer kill.

Though I believe I'm a long stretch from either. Hopefully.

So in future we will like no real women, because in future AI models with female body will be developed instead of women, and only those who can afford those models are those that are rich...

Looking back, the past wasn't that bad at all...just full of misconceptions by some.

as long as it wasnt adriana or alexandra its ok.

i mean alessandra

this one's better

http://steelturman.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/fat_actress1.jpg

I'd do her.

You must be desperate.

Yes! I haven't had any for 12 hours, what do you expect?:)

You know your hand doesn't count. :p

You know your hand doesn't count. :p

Oh shucks! So I have to recarve my tally then now?

Yep. I guess zero is a depressing number though.

Are you Spuriousmonkey? you have his way about you, but I guess he wouldn't make his hatred of me that obvious.

I'm just me, Goddamnit.

Besides, I don't hate you at all. I actually kinda like you. We're just exchanging (not so) witty banter.

Are you Spuriousmonkey? you have his way about you, but I guess he wouldn't make his hatred of me that obvious.
Does he 'hate' you (in inverted commas - it's a strong word, hate, isn't it?)? If so, why?

Aren't I alowed to exaggerate? It makes up for the departments where I am lacking.:D

ok, so why does he hate you exaggeratedly?

Jeezus, are there so many absurd feuds going on in this place?

We used to like fat women because food was scarce. Hence fat -> rich. Now there's food all over the place and we're sedentary, so being thin means you have the time and money to go to the gym.

Same thing about skin color. In the old days beautiful women had milky skin because peasants worked in the sun while aristocrats stayed in the shade. Today tan is beautiful because tan means you can afford to go on vacation.

Both standards take just as much work (believe you me, staying thin and tan is a LOT of work), but the difference is: anorexia and skin cancer kill.

Though I believe I'm a long stretch from either. Hopefully.

Thin (assuming its not too thin) means you're in good health.

ok, so why does he hate you exaggeratedly?
Because I make chicks wet just by looking into their eyes I guess.

You must be desperate.

You see you are buying into the myth that overweight women are sexually undesirable. Yet men I generally blamed for women killing theirselves to be thin, but maybe its your problem rather than ours.
http://steelturman.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/fat_actress1.jpg
OK much fatter than that and I wouldn't touch her with a barge pole, but I genuinely think that you have got it wrong in which way is best to go in terms of weight.

http://www.fathersforlife.org/images/walkingdead.jpg

Only in my nightmares would I be that desperate.
She would probably fall appart anyway.

Is it attitudes like yours that make her do it, imaplanck?

Discuss.

http://www.fathersforlife.org/images/walkingdead.jpg

Only in my nightmares would I be that desperate.
She would probably fall appart anyway.

I can't believe!!!!!

You see you are buying into the myth that overweight women are sexually undesirable. Yet men I generally blamed for women killing theirselves to be thin, but maybe its your problem rather than ours.
http://steelturman.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/fat_actress1.jpg
OK much fatter than that and I wouldn't touch her with a barge pole, but I genuinely think that you have got it wrong in which way is best to go in terms of weight.


I think this woman is attractive, she is buxum and soft and likely to be nice to snuggle with. She takes care of her hair and her colour and her makeup.

Rather this than a bone

Is it attitudes like yours that make her do it, imaplanck?

Discuss.

Hey Im no sexist(really im not;) ), but we all know that body image all comes down to desired attractiveness to the opposite sex(for hetrosexuals anyway).
If one believes it's for competition with other women, what does one suppose they are competing for?

Hey Im no sexist(really im not;) ), but we all know that body image all comes down to desired attractiveness to the opposite sex(for hetrosexuals anyway).
If one believes it's for competition with other women, what does one suppose they are competing for?
I know several intelligent, happily married women who are constantly worrying about their weight. The problem runs much deeper than who wants to fuck who.

I know several intelligent, happily married women who are constantly worrying about their weight. The problem runs much deeper than who wants to fuck who.

Yes but it all stems from desirability and desirability equates to how sexually attractive a woman is.

http://steelturman.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/fat_actress1.jpg

I wonder if she has the golden ratio?

Im going to do a poll on this if I may?

I can see a brown starfish.

In the sea. Obviously.

I can see a brown starfish.Thanks for that image.

I think this woman is attractive, she is buxum and soft and likely to be nice to snuggle with. She takes care of her hair and her colour and her makeup.

Rather this than a bone

Reminding me of a bone ....can you imagine how long a guy's dick would have to be to get throught all that fat just to get to the "meat of the matter"???

Baron Max

An anorexic Brazilian model just died from her disease. (Story (http://euronews.net/create_html.php?page=detail_info&article=391031&lng=1))

I think this is totally fucked up. It's one thing to want to look athletic, or even thin, but the way fashion models look is just ridiculous. I don't know any woman (including me) who truly feels good about her body. This is in part due to our nature, but the fashion industry imposing impossible, photoshopped standards of beauty on women multiplies it.

Women need to take their fate into their own hands and start setting some realistic beauty standards. And stop feeling so goddamn bad about themselves. Either you want to be thin, you shut up, watch your diet and work out like I do, either you don't and you shovel chocolate down your throat, which is just as good. The problem we have today is the girls who feel bad about their body, so they eat to feel better, so they look bad, so they eat etc. Grr.
The industry is controlled by gay guys (that is, the annoying kind of gay, not the friendly one). So they like that little boish figure. Men (or at least me) detest it... :bugeye:

The industry is controlled by gay guys (that is, the annoying kind of gay, not the friendly one). So they like that little boish figure. Men (or at least me) detest it... :bugeye:You're absolutely right.

The problem is that men too are starting to turn into a gay man's fantasy, hairless and boyish. *shudder* What ever happened to real men?

You're absolutely right.

The problem is that men too are starting to turn into a gay man's fantasy, hairless and boyish. *shudder* What ever happened to real men?

I still remember back when I was a junior in HS. I was on the bus.. and this kid (sophomore) was bragging about his shaved arms.

WTF?

We are starting to see reversed roles. Women are trying to become more masculine to compete with men... and those men that cannot cope with that are becoming more feminine. It's almost as if the brain is wired to act opposite the other gender and it is not programmed for a set of roles based gender. If a women is tough, men act weak. If women act weak, men act strong.

That or society is telling the alpha male to get lost.

Yes, it's terrible. Women ashamed of being real women, men being ashamed of being real men...

And if the alpha male isn't welcome in today's society, he'll always be welcome in my arms.

You're absolutely right.

The problem is that men too are starting to turn into a gay man's fantasy, hairless and boyish. *shudder* What ever happened to real men?

lol, you're describing my bfriend, he shaves his chest and looks very much younger than he is, infact some people do think he's gay. My ex was hairy like a wolf and sported a pot belly. I think when I was younger I would have agreed with you Sandoz, but now I'm older I appreciate what my 'computer geek' has to offer. (handsome geek ;))

I have to change my own light bulbs though ...........:(

Out of those two male pics, I think I also prefer the chubby guy and if I was a lesbian I confess I would deffinately prefer the stereotypical beauty of slim with huge breasts. I'm trying to think of who my ideal lady would be.....................bleh, maybe a T girl.

Multi-quote: GO!!

Jeezus, are there so many absurd feuds going on in this place?

Yeah. It's what we're about. Instead of watching daytime soaps, we come here to participate in our own drama.

Thin (assuming its not too thin) means you're in good health.

Not if you're in Africa. Thin means you got the HIV.
Not if you're in Indonesia. Thin means you ain't got food.

Thin doesn't = healthy. Re-read Sandoz' post.

Reminding me of a bone ....can you imagine how long a guy's dick would have to be to get throught all that fat just to get to the "meat of the matter"???

Baron Max

This reminds me of the copulation of bed bugs. Female bed bugs evolved a way to control when their eggs were fertilized. They could mate with a male, then hold onto the sperm for an indefinite time while mating with other males.

This way, a female bed bug wasn't putting all her eggs in one basket, so to speak. If half the males of the population were susceptible to a deadly pathogen, only half her offspring would die if they caught the disease, rather than her having a 50% chance that all her offspring die.

So male bed bugs began evolving longer penises to fertilize females with, bypassing the mechanisms that allowed the female to control fertilization. Eventually, the males evolved beak-like penises that they use to bore through the female's abdomen, piercing straight to her ovaries.

Cool, huh?

I still remember back when I was a junior in HS. I was on the bus.. and this kid (sophomore) was bragging about his shaved arms.

WTF?

We are starting to see reversed roles. Women are trying to become more masculine to compete with men... and those men that cannot cope with that are becoming more feminine. It's almost as if the brain is wired to act opposite the other gender and it is not programmed for a set of roles based gender. If a women is tough, men act weak. If women act weak, men act strong.

That or society is telling the alpha male to get lost.

Society doesn't need alpha males.
They tend to end up in prison, anyway.

lol, you're describing my bfriend, he shaves his chest and looks very much younger than he is, infact some people do think he's gay. My ex was hairy like a wolf and sported a pot belly. I think when I was younger I would have agreed with you Sandoz, but now I'm older I appreciate what my 'computer geek' has to offer. (handsome geek ;))Then maybe I'll change with the passing of time but I really don't think so.

There can't be a relationship with me if you're not a real man (or a real woman).

Are you Spuriousmonkey? you have his way about you, but I guess he wouldn't make his hatred of me that obvious.

lol, I wondered this at one point as he has disappeared.......

I really need to get into sockpuppet therapy, I have it bad :eek:

Then maybe I'll change with the passing of time but I really don't think so.

There can't be a relationship with me if you're not a real man (or a real woman).

with a T girl you can have both ;)

although you did say 'real'

but then how real are women these days?

false eyelashes, makeup, hair extensions, flase nails, false, boobs, bums, suck it all flat unerwear, botox, collagen

(all of which I advocate and support now I'm older)

but I do wonder about the guys being decieved, but then I think that first impressions are lasting so when everything falls off at bedtime, it's too late. they've been suckered in. Phew just as well.

Hmmmm whats a T girl Tor?

Yes, what's a T girl? A tranny?

Anyway, defining what a real woman is is even harder than defining what a real man is. I would say a real woman is a girl who doesn't take any shit from anyone, yet doesn't feel she has to prove she's strong (like me, hopefully). But that would also apply to men.

Hmm...

Yes, that's tough.

Society doesn't need alpha males.
They tend to end up in prison, anyway.

I don't know what you think the alpha male is.. but it's actually the male that takes care of everyone. We see it in animals. The most dominate male is the one that takes care of the other's in his group.

Today, many try to immitate dominance by being a bully. That's the opposite of an alpha male.

Hmmmm whats a T girl Tor?

They are the most beautiful women you have ever seen, they have amazing faces, figures, hair, breasts but they retain their cock.

edit:

Well some of them are, I just checked out a site and actually most look like dudes in frocks, but the ones who model are pretty amazing looking.

Ah ladyboys?

Apparently a while earlier some other model died of a heart-something after spending months on a diet of lettuce and diet coke.

or dickchicks

lol, I wondered this at one point as he has disappeared.......

I really need to get into sockpuppet therapy, I have it bad :eek:

You ever been on his forum? he has about 10 members and most of them only posted because here was down.http://*******************/forums

I don't know what you think the alpha male is.. but it's actually the male that takes care of everyone. We see it in animals. The most dominate male is the one that takes care of the other's in his group.

Today, many try to immitate dominance by being a bully. That's the opposite of an alpha male.

Haha, more lies from softy sociologists.
In a lion pride, do you know what the first thing the alpha male does when he reaches alpha status?
In primate troops, do you know the first thing the alpha male does when he reahces alpha status?

They kill all the offspring of the other males.

Then they bully all the other males and keep them from mating with the females.

Alpha males aren't caregivers. That's what an alpha female does. The alpha male dominates. With testosterone. And testes ain't for takin care of babies.

Haha, more lies from softy sociologists.
In a lion pride, do you know what the first thing the alpha male does when he reaches alpha status?
In primate troops, do you know the first thing the alpha male does when he reahces alpha status?

They kill all the offspring of the other males.

Then they bully all the other males and keep them from mating with the females.

Alpha males aren't caregivers. That's what an alpha female does. The alpha male dominates. With testosterone. And testes ain't for takin care of babies.Yep. Which is why alpha males end up as CEOs of Fortune 100 companies. Or in my bed.

Yep. Which is why alpha males end up as CEOs of Fortune 100 companies. Or in my bed.

Or prison.

Or all three. :D

But seriously, I don't think alpha males are likely to end up in prison, because guys who end up in prison are out of control of their life. Alpha males are in control.

Except for the high flying criminals you see on TV, 99.9% of men who end up in prison are losers and small timers. Being a thug or a bully isn't being an alpha male.

Or all three. :D

But seriously, I don't think alpha males are likely to end up in prison, because guys who end up in prison are out of control of their life. Alpha males are in control.

Except for the high flying criminals you see on TV, 99.9% of men who end up in prison are losers and small timers. Being a thug or a bully isn't being an alpha male.

Alpha doesn't mean you're in control. Alpha male means you're top dog. Control might help you be top dog, but so could viciously slaughtering your competition.

But we're not allowed to slaughter people anymore.

Being top dog, in the long run, only comes from toughness and smarts.

Being top dog, in the long run, only comes from toughness and smarts.

In modern human society, all it comes from is smarts. We've been selecting away from the traditional he-man alpha towards something leaner, hairless and cunning. A creature that uses guile and words, rather than force and violence.

We've been selecting for a woman.

Apparently a while earlier some other model died of a heart-something after spending months on a diet of lettuce and diet coke.
The subject of this thread favoured apples and tomatoes, apparently. Exclusively. Obviously.

Such a shame. All that money and couldn't afford a Big Mac.

[/Cynical]

For $4.99, you can buy big tub of peanut butter. The brandI have is a total of 10,890 calories. So, if you are starving, buy a big tub of peanut butter :)

For $4.99, you can buy big tub of peanut butter. The brandI have is a total of 10,890 calories. So, if you are starving, buy a big tub of peanut butter :)Yes, I'm sure she didn't think of that.

...But we're not allowed to slaughter people anymore.Tell that to governments of US and Israel, please.

Tell that to governments of US and Israel, please.OR you could tell that to Saddam Hussein and Sheik Ahmed Yassin.

Yes, I'm sure she didn't think of that.

Half of its calories is from fat. So, we are talking about gaining about 1.5 pounds of fat.

Yeah, but the point is that anorexic girls don't die because they can't think of fatty stuff to eat, it's because they have a disease that makes them UNABLE to.

Tell that to governments of US and Israel, please.

Arabs aren't people.

I hereby declare all advertising illegal from now on.


This should sort out the problem.

An anorexic Brazilian model just died from her disease. (Story (http://euronews.net/create_html.php?page=detail_info&article=391031&lng=1))

I think this is totally fucked up. It's one thing to want to look athletic, or even thin, but the way fashion models look is just ridiculous. I don't know any woman (including me) who truly feels good about her body. This is in part due to our nature, but the fashion industry imposing impossible, photoshopped standards of beauty on women multiplies it.

Women need to take their fate into their own hands and start setting some realistic beauty standards. And stop feeling so goddamn bad about themselves. Either you want to be thin, you shut up, watch your diet and work out like I do, either you don't and you shovel chocolate down your throat, which is just as good. The problem we have today is the girls who feel bad about their body, so they eat to feel better, so they look bad, so they eat etc. Grr.

It's not aneorexia that killed her. It's society, it's the media, it's all these spin doctors who say women must be thin.

Self esteem about body, or how you feel about body, is not due to nature, it's due to other people telling you how you should look, giving you dolls at a young age to put the idea into your head, etc.

Arabs aren't people.

You arent a person either. You are a brute.

You arent a person either. You are a brute.

http://www.pmzg.nu/images/illustrations/troll.jpg


Grrrraaaaaaaaaaggghhhhh!!!

Why does he have a beer belly?

Yeah, but the point is that anorexic girls don't die because they can't think of fatty stuff to eat, it's because they have a disease that makes them UNABLE to.

It's not a disease, stop calling it that. That makes people who have eating disorders think it's their fault.

Sandoz, I expect better from you, I know you have a high self esteem, why use weak language like disease? It puts the blame on the woman, like shes the problem, when in reality the fashion industry created all this shit.

These women are products, created by the fashion industry. It's very much like many others in the media killing themselves. Do we say that drug addicts or gangsters who became that way because of the media, have a disease?

Anyway, you are a factual person, here is some evidence, some proof, in the video series killing us softly

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1993368502337678412

Why does he have a beer belly?

All frat boys have beer bellies.

It's not a disease, stop calling it that. That makes people who have eating disorders think it's their fault.

Sandoz, I expect better from you, I know you have a high self esteem, why use weak language like disease? It puts the blame on the woman, like shes the problem, when in reality the fashion industry created all this shit.

These women are products, created by the fashion industry. It's very much like many others in the media killing themselves. Do we say that drug addicts or gangsters who became that way because of the media, have a disease?

Anyway, you are a factual person, here is some evidence, some proof, in the video series killing us softly

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1993368502337678412

I agree completely.
There are no AIDS victims.
Just AIDS sufferers.

It's not a disease, stop calling it that. That makes people who have eating disorders think it's their fault.

Sandoz, I expect better from you, I know you have a high self esteem, why use weak language like disease? It puts the blame on the woman, like shes the problem, when in reality the fashion industry created all this shit.

These women are products, created by the fashion industry. It's very much like many others in the media killing themselves. Do we say that drug addicts or gangsters who became that way because of the media, have a disease?

Anyway, you are a factual person, here is some evidence, some proof, in the video series killing us softly

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1993368502337678412


Anorexia nervosa is a disease. Its an eating disorder with neurological components.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anorexia_nervosa


Anorexia nervosa is a psychiatric diagnosis that describes an eating disorder characterized by low body weight and body image distortion. Individuals with anorexia often control body weight by voluntary starvation, purging, vomiting, excessive exercise, or other weight control measures, such as diet pills or diuretic drugs. It primarily affects young adolescent girls in the Western world and has one of the highest mortality rates of any psychiatric condition, with approximately 10% of people diagnosed with the condition eventually dying due to related factors.[1] Anorexia nervosa is a complex condition, involving psychological, physiological,neurobiological, and sociological components.

People with anorexia typically have a disturbed electrolyte imbalance, particularly low levels of phosphate which has been linked to heart failure, muscle weakness, immune dysfunction, and ultimately, death. Those who develop anorexia before adulthood may suffer stunted growth and subsequent low levels of essential hormones (including sex hormones) and chronically increased cortisol levels. Osteoporosis can also develop as a result of anorexia in 38-50% of cases,[4] as poor nutrition lead to the retarded growth of essential bone structure and low bone mineral density.

Furthermore, changes in brain structure and function are early signs of the condition. Enlargement of the ventricles of the brain is thought to be associated with starvation, and is partially reversed when normal weight is maintained.[5] Anorexia is also linked to reduced blood flow in the temporal lobes, although as this finding does not correlate with current weight, it is possible that it is a risk trait, rather than an effect of starvation.

1. The word 'disease' tends to make someone feel like it's not their fault, not vice versa. A disease is something you get - not something you do.

2. Yes technically disease is the word used to describe it and many other lifestyles. I disagree with this choice. A disease should be something that simple will power cannot overcome. At the very least there are two types of diseases.

(i) ones that will power cannot resolve.
(ii) ones that will power can resolve.

Anorexia is a lifestyle. A bad one, mind you, but still a lifestyle. And it is the woman or mans fault. Like any other lifestyle choice. That the fashion industry and other outlets largley influence the lifestyle choices of people is undoubtable. However I am a firm believer that we are still human beings who have an ability to chose our own lifestyle within the constraints of the law of our land. How much you let a cultural force affect you is ultimatly your decision. To say otherwise is to suggest that everyone should logically be simply bending to the norms of the industry in question.

There's a reason not every girl has anorexia. Some are more susceptible to industry images than others. It is only by their will power, guided by friends, family and therapists usually, that they can overcome this.

1. The word 'disease' tends to make someone feel like it's not their fault, not vice versa. A disease is something you get - not something you do.

2. Yes technically disease is the word used to describe it and many other lifestyles. I disagree with this choice. A disease should be something that simple will power cannot overcome. At the very least there are two types of diseases.

(i) ones that will power cannot resolve.
(ii) ones that will power can resolve.

Anorexia is a lifestyle. A bad one, mind you, but still a lifestyle. And it is the woman or mans fault. Like any other lifestyle choice. That the fashion industry and other outlets largley influence the lifestyle choices of people is undoubtable. However I am a firm believer that we are still human beings who have an ability to chose our own lifestyle within the constraints of the law of our land. How much you let a cultural force affect you is ultimatly your decision. To say otherwise is to suggest that everyone should logically be simply bending to the norms of the industry in question.

There's a reason not every girl has anorexia. Some are more susceptible to industry images than others. It is only by their will power, guided by friends, family and therapists usually, that they can overcome this.

We conform to cultural standards because we are human, not inspite of it.

Anorexia nervosa is a disease. Its an eating disorder with neurological components.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anorexia_nervosa

I think it's BS. Living in modern society is the disease. There was no such thing as eating disorders until thin became hyped as the way to be.

In tribal society, and in other countries, no one has this problem. It seems like a western problem, why is that?

Show me that people in Africa have eating disorders, or that the native Americans did, or that animals do, and then you'll convince me it's a biological disease and not a social problem.

I'm not one of the people who thinks that every social problem is a matter of brain disorders. Do you think racism is a brain disorder? Is it a disease? What about sexism? Is that a brain disorder? What about aggression and criminality?

You can reduce everything to a brain disorder but this does not change the fact that there are producers, products and entire industries set up to take advantage of these brain disordered people.

So my opinion, instead of calling the victims weak and disordered, or diseased, which we could call just about everyone, we should be thinking about what caused this specific brazillian to become a model in the first place, and what caused her to starve herself to death, and get a wide scope of the problem, otherwise it's just going to be another disease. Thinism is a lot like racism, it's the same way of thinking, do we call racists or thinists diseased because they want to promote their concept of beauty? No of course not, we only call the products the diseased.

I think it's BS. Living in modern society is the disease. There was no such thing as eating disorders until thin became hyped as the way to be.

In tribal society, and in other countries, no one has this problem. It seems like a western problem, why is that?

Show me that people in Africa have eating disorders, or that the native Americans did, or that animals do, and then you'll convince me it's a biological disease and not a social problem.

I'm not one of the people who thinks that every social problem is a matter of brain disorders. Do you think racism is a brain disorder? Is it a disease? What about sexism? Is that a brain disorder? What about aggression and criminality?

You can reduce everything to a brain disorder but this does not change the fact that there are producers, products and entire industries set up to take advantage of these brain disordered people.

So my opinion, instead of calling the victims weak and disordered, or diseased, which we could call just about everyone, we should be thinking about what caused this specific brazillian to become a model in the first place, and what caused her to starve herself to death, and get a wide scope of the problem, otherwise it's just going to be another disease. Thinism is a lot like racism, it's the same way of thinking, do we call racists or thinists diseased because they want to promote their concept of beauty? No of course not, we only call the products the diseased.

All mental disorders have a psychological or biological basis and are related to susceptibility of the mind/body to the environment.

Anorexics are attracted to and more susceptible to environments that predispose them to eating disorders, which is reflected in their biological parameters.

Roman:

Yes I know that. But not everyone falls to social pressures to the degree of anorexia. Which means it is not the lone factor in producing anorexia. There is also matters of will, character and values of the individual person. Most of my female friends do not have an eating disorder. Some do. Both groups experience the same social pressure. There is another element at play.

1. The word 'disease' tends to make someone feel like it's not their fault, not vice versa. A disease is something you get - not something you do.

2. Yes technically disease is the word used to describe it and many other lifestyles. I disagree with this choice. A disease should be something that simple will power cannot overcome. At the very least there are two types of diseases.

(i) ones that will power cannot resolve.
(ii) ones that will power can resolve.

Anorexia is a lifestyle. A bad one, mind you, but still a lifestyle. And it is the woman or mans fault. Like any other lifestyle choice. That the fashion industry and other outlets largley influence the lifestyle choices of people is undoubtable. However I am a firm believer that we are still human beings who have an ability to chose our own lifestyle within the constraints of the law of our land. How much you let a cultural force affect you is ultimatly your decision. To say otherwise is to suggest that everyone should logically be simply bending to the norms of the industry in question.

There's a reason not every girl has anorexia. Some are more susceptible to industry images than others. It is only by their will power, guided by friends, family and therapists usually, that they can overcome this.

All of us are programmed from birth. Men are programmed to be aggressive, given toy soldiers, and taught to treat women as sex objects. Women are taught to be submissive, to look however men want them to look, and to obey. Then you have all the different races which are all being programmed by the media to behave in certain ways, you have gangster rap telling urban youth to kill themselves, you have rock n roll telling people to become drug addicts, you have the most corrupt youth culture that has ever existed in any society.

Finally, you have stuff like girls gone wild, and really this is a commercial that even pisses me off. All the women look the same, they all are really stupid, and flashing random guys.

I suppose a young person, a typical young male, would be looking at this video as a collection of breasts and body parts, and not really paying attention to what exactly is being done to the women in these videos, or whats being promoted by videos like this.

Basically, the media and advertising is getting worse and worse. I have no problem with porn, but that girls gone wild stuff is on regular TV. Porn is alright, the women get paid so they choose to do it, but I don't think it should be advertised on free TV.

Right now we have no ethical standards for the media. Remember when smoking was cool? Now having an eating disorder is cool, and being a gangster is cool, and using all sorts of drugs is cool, whats next?


The problem with words like diseased, or disordered, these are weak words. If you call yourself diseased you are saying something is wrong with you, and not saying something is wrong with them. You can help people, if you first stop using weak language, a lot of people who have these problems don't have a high self esteem and calling them diseased is equal to callnig them unfit, like FAT is now becoming a disease.

What gives them the right to call you diseased and poke fun of your flaws when they are just as diseased and flawed themselves? Everyone is flawed, all of us can fall for this type of programming, all of us have fallen for it, so why call some of these people diseased? The real problem is with the media, the people were like this for thousands of years and were doing just fine until the damn media was invented, now we have toy soldier boys and barbie girls going around starving themselves to death and killing themselves in various ways.

Roman:

Yes I know that. But not everyone falls to social pressures to the degree of anorexia. Which means it is not the lone factor in producing anorexia. There is also matters of will, character and values of the individual person. Most of my female friends do not have an eating disorder. Some do. Both groups experience the same social pressure. There is another element at play.

Not everyone catches a cold.
That means a virus is not the lone factor in producing a cold.
Which means the cold's not a disease.

Ahhhhhh, none of that is in response to what I said.

And I don't think anorexia is deemed cool. I've never heard that said or implied and most articles or magazines you pick up talk about the problem with anorexia.

It's still just a fact that as much as society tries to conform you, physically and psychologically you have the ability to break out of those grasps. Lots of people do on a daily basis, there's no excuse for anyone else.

Ahhhhhh, none of that is in response to what I said.

And I don't think anorexia is deemed cool. I've never heard that said or implied and most articles or magazines you pick up talk about the problem with anorexia.

It's still just a fact that as much as society tries to conform you, physically and psychologically you have the ability to break out of those grasps. Lots of people do on a daily basis, there's no excuse for anyone else.

Don't bother with Time Traveler. He's... dense. More than that. Because you disagree with one of his views, he assumes he knows why you disagree, and no matter what you say, he'll reply like you're saying something else.

He's also ignorant of most of the things he talks about.

So don't bother with him.

Not everyone catches a cold.
That means a virus is not the lone factor in producing a cold.
Which means the cold's not a disease.

Immunity does make a difference.

Not everyone died of the Black plague either.

If you attain virus x you have likelihood p of getting the symptoms consistent with that virus. If you do not get the symptoms, then you have an extra factor (genetic) which allows you to experience this.

The reasoning you listed is not the same structure as the reasoning I made.

And no, a virus is not the lone factor in determining if you get a cold.

And that was not even my argument for why it's not a disease. I said because will power can rid you of it, it is not the same as a biological disease. Which will power alone can not get rid of.

Whether you like it or not, this is a distinct difference in attainment of the symptoms and prescription. Which means the two must be classified differently.

All mental disorders have a psychological or biological basis and are related to susceptibility of the mind/body to the environment.

Anorexics are attracted to and more susceptible to environments that predispose them to eating disorders, which is reflected in their biological parameters.

What about alcoholics who beat up their wives? The alcohol industry, targets a specific demographic, and this creates new industries to handle domestic abuse and domestic affairs.

What about gangster rap, you see it on TV all the time, where gangster raps promote gangs, and tell young people to kill other young people, are these gang members diseased?

What about people who want to be normal, is it a disease to want to be normal? Is it a disease to want to be cool?

You are saying, that eating disorders are a disease and not a social problem, but what about criminality? Is that a disease or a social problem? What about violence against women, are these men diseased or is it a social problem? What about violent people in general, are they diseased?

You are being very selective with what you choose to call diseased and what you choose to call normal flaws. Either all flaws of this sort are diseases or none of them are.

If you attain virus x you have likelihood p of getting the symptoms consistent with that virus. If you do not get the symptoms, then you have an extra factor (genetic) which allows you to experience this.

The reasoning you listed is not the same structure as the reasoning I made.

And no, a virus is not the lone factor in determining if you get a cold.

And that was not even my argument for why it's not a disease. I said because will power can rid you of it, it is not the same as a biological disease. Which will power alone can not get rid of.

Whether you like it or not, this is a distinct difference in attainment of the symptoms and prescription. Which means the two must be classified differently.

Will power has been shown in numerous medical trials to get rid of diseases.
That's why controls involve a placebo.

Ahhhhhh, none of that is in response to what I said.

And I don't think anorexia is deemed cool. I've never heard that said or implied and most articles or magazines you pick up talk about the problem with anorexia.

It's still just a fact that as much as society tries to conform you, physically and psychologically you have the ability to break out of those grasps. Lots of people do on a daily basis, there's no excuse for anyone else.

I posted the video up for all to see. Eating disorders, large breasts, etc are all considered cool, because the media says it's cool. If the media says starving to death is normal, it becomes cool. This is something that is happening to teenage girls, they think it's cool, they don't know yet how harmful it is, or how dangerous it is, but they want to be thin so bad that they'll starve to get there.

It's the same with breast implants and plastic surgery later on, hollywood thinks it's cool, the media thinks it's cool, and eventually it becomes cool. There are actually sites on the internet, hosted by women, who are actually saying that it's good to have an eating disorder, and that it's good to get breast implants. You need to check out some of the womens forums on the internet.

Will power has been shown in numerous medical trials to get rid of diseases.
That's why controls involve a placebo.

No, thats not true. Will power does not get rid of actual diseases, otherwise AIDs patients would will themselves into a cure. I don't think it's that simple.

The placebo effect works only on some diseases, otherwise the entire supplement industry would just give out placebos to make penis and breast size bigger and make a fortune selling bullshit.

No will power has shown undoubtedly to be a good factor. The right mental attitude gives your body strength.

There is one definition:
"a disordered or incorrectly functioning organ, part, structure, or system of the body resulting from the effect of genetic or developmental errors, infection, poisons, nutritional deficiency or imbalance, toxicity, or unfavorable environmental factors; illness; sickness; ailment. "

And another, which is that of the psychological disease.

I believe attributing the word disease to the latter makes the patient believe that it occured from means beyond their control, which is detrimental in helping them overcome.

Arabs aren't people.

Yeah I'm ignorant, just listen to the bully, er I mean brute.

A mental illness is just as much of an illness as a physical one.

If you think it's not an illness and just a disorder where a girl doesn't eat enough, then you haven't met a truly anorexic person. Being Calista Flockhart is not being anorexic. Voluntarily starving to death is -- and no healthy person does that. No healthy person actively fights one of our most basic survival impulses.

It's a disease, believe me.

A mental illness is just as much of an illness as a physical one.

If you think it's not an illness and just a disorder where a girl doesn't eat enough, then you haven't met a truly anorexic person. Being Calista Flockhart is not being anorexic. Voluntarily starving to death is -- and no healthy person does that. No healthy person actively fights one of our most basic survival impulses.

It's a disease, believe me.

In that case, so is being a liar, a thief, or a criminal. In that case being violent is a disease also. And you cannot dispute it, because you just said so.

You have to look and see what all these people have in common. They have NO self esteem.
They are harming themselves, is it new? No it's not, and eating disorder is just one of the new ways it's being done but this has always been happening, either people are eating themselves to death or starving themselves to death because they are dying inside.

Calling people with no self esteem, mentally ill, sure it might be something you or I could say, because we have a self esteem, but these people with no self esteem vastly outnumber us, what prevents them from saying we are mentally ill for wanting to survive and enjoy our lives?

Sandoz I never said it wasn't an illness. I said it wasn't a disease.

Whether you like it or not, there are categorical differences between biological diseases and things such as anorexia. For some reason everyone gets hyperdefensive over this so I have to condition my statement with: THIS IS NOT TO PASS VALUE JUDGEMENT OVER WHICH IS WORSE.

Anyway, in biological diseases the cause is not simply a result of lack of will power with respect to societal pressures. And whether you like to say so or not, caving to the pressures of the fashion industry, etc. is to have less will power in their face than the girls who don't cave.

Again, this is not to say that there aren't problems with advertising, or problems with girls' education. It's just to say that the route problem is something psychological within girls. The fashion industry simply plays off of an already existent predisposition - say, the desire to be popular, or attractive, in short.

The word disease makes it feel like it's something you contacted, not something you chose to do. And unless you think people don't have a will of their own, then it was a choice. Frankly I give people enough credit to think they can make their own choices if they really want to.

I wrote a paper on this a while back. Essentially I agree with the level of outrage from feminist groups and plain ol' social action groups and I sympathize. But I don't think the outrage should be aimed towards the fashion industry. I still believe in a fairly libratarian government and advertisers should be allowed to do what they want - if they can outsmart the people, then so be it.

In fact, I think one of the reasons this is good is because it will require us to adapt on self-reliance. The outrage should be directed towards how and what these girls are being taught by their parents and schools growing up. Some people are more susceptible to ads and societal norms than others - that is a fact. We should be gearing people from a very young age (guys, not just girls) to have the capacity to cope with these pressures and forces.

You will never get rid of every bad advertisement like the fashion industry, you will never get rid of every bad societal norm and pressure. So don't make that your approach. The assault needs to come on taking away the power fom these forces and giving it back to the individual person. Every girl needs to learn to be strong enough not to let how thin the models are effect them.

I'll give you two analogies (not as proof, but just as better description) of why I want this...

(i) when your 8 year old kid is starting to receive peer pressure you try and teach him how to not respond to it, how to make his own choices. you don't go around and find every peer putting pressure on him and build a fence to make sure they can't talk to him. why? it's impossible. besides, teaching him that strength is a good life lesson.

(ii) When someone has contacted AIDS and viruses begin to assault the body - like they do to everyone - the ideal situation would be to remove the AIDS, not make a million drugs to block every virus. It would be impossible to stop every single illness from coming in on a person, besides living with AIDS won't be fun anyway. So we search for the drugs and treatments that can rid someone of AIDS. You attack the source, not the forces which play off this.

And there is my case against 'disease' and anorexia being cause for attacking the industries.

Right.

In modern human society, all it comes from is smarts. We've been selecting away from the traditional he-man alpha towards something leaner, hairless and cunning. A creature that uses guile and words, rather than force and violence.

We've been selecting for a woman.

http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=50706&page=3

http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?t=53762&page=6

...who's to say the male in the human species will last?