Hello,

I have a question. I have read that on many athiesitic sites and such about a poll of some sorts being taken, and it saying that more people discriminate againest athiests than they would homosexuals?

This is a question I've been meaning to ask, but has always slipped away from me, I suppose...

:o

I don't think thats true. But both are discriminated against by religious groups. How wrong you all are

Personally I only go for gay athiests, you interested Thor?


sheesh my posts are bordering on deletable tonight, need to lay off the caffeine/sugar at work.

In Canada at least it is very wrong. The only time I see an atheist 'discriminated' against is when you run into the odd small-town person who goes "you don't believe in god? what the hell kind of a person are you?". Gays on the other hand still suffer greatly as youth.

Ach. They can be gay if they want. It's just strange and foreign to me, which induces the usual feeling of threat built inside human brains.

I think actual discrimination against atheists would be quite rare. Atheism isn't something you wear on your sleeve. Unless you tell somebody you're an atheist, nobody will ever know.

What you might be referring to is a Gallup poll that has been periodically conducted in the US since the '30s.

The question: "If your party nominated a generally well- qualified person for president who happened to be a 'X' would you vote for that person?"
<center><font face="Verdana,arial,Times,Times New Roman" size="1">
<table border="1" bgcolor="#dddddd" width="50%"><tr bgcolor="#9f9fff"><td width="20%"><b>Factor</b></td><td width="20%"><b>1937</b></td><td width="20%"><b>1959</b></td><td width="20%"><b>1978</b></td><td width="20%"><b>1999</b></td></tr><tr><td width="20%">Atheist</td><td width="20%">Not asked</td><td width="20%">22%</td><td width="20%">40%</td><td width="20%">49%</td></tr><tr><td width="20%">Baptist</td><td width="20%">Not asked</td><td width="20%">94</td><td width="20%">Not asked</td><td width="20%">94</td></tr><tr><td width="20%">Black</td><td width="20%">37</td><td width="20%">49</td><td width="20%">77</td><td width="20%">95</td></tr><tr><td width="20%">Catholic</td><td width="20%">60</td><td width="20%">70</td><td width="20%">91</td><td width="20%">94</td></tr><tr><td width="20%">Homosexual</td><td width="20%">Not asked</td><td width="20%">Not asked</td><td width="20%">26</td><td width="20%">59</td></tr><tr><td width="20%">Jewish</td><td width="20%">46</td><td width="20%">72</td><td width="20%">82</td><td width="20%">92</td></tr><tr><td width="20%">Mormon</td><td width="20%">Not asked</td><td width="20%">Not asked</td><td width="20%">&nbsp;</td><td width="20%">99</td></tr><tr><td width="20%">Woman</td><td width="20%">33</td><td width="20%">57</td><td width="20%">76</td><td width="20%">92</td></tr></table></font></center>

Thiefed from <a href="http://www.religioustolerance.org/amer_intol.htm">Religious Tolerance</a>

<blockquote>Atheism isn't something you wear on your sleeve. Unless you tell somebody you're an atheist, nobody will ever know.</blockquote>

Actually there are a few ways to detect atheists. They have no reflection in mirrors(and possibly badly done hair). Or they might smell faintly of brimstone. Oh, and water makes them melt.

That's really interesting, Voodoo child.

What scares Americans so much about atheists? I wonder.

I also wonder what the results would be if this poll was done in Australia. I suspect that very few people would be that concerned about religion here.

Actually there are a few ways to detect atheists. They have no reflection in mirrors(and possibly badly done hair). Or they might smell faintly of brimstone. Oh, and water makes them melt.

*Pats forehead*

Hmmm, I'm feeling kind of horny right now.

I suspect that discrimination against gays is generally worse. It's more obvious to be seen making out with your girlfriend than it is to mention offhand that you don't believe in God(s).

I can't speak for everyone, and half of this is purely hypothetical (seeing as I'm not gay.)

But!

Predjudice against Atheists, if directed towards me, (as an atheist) would not entirely bother me. Were I perhaps homosexual, an insult towards this would affect me. I can't imagine someone drawing conclusions as to the unnatural state of Atheism, whereas I'd expect an insult at homosexuality, race etc. would hit a nerve.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that there might be a higher degree of predjudice against Atheists, but does it really have the same value and affect? Plus... I've never felt comfortable with statistics.

I think its obvious there is widespread discrimination against atheists. Why do you think so many athiests are 'in the closet' to a certain degree?

Maybe its where I live but anytime I tell someone my beliefs, they give me a look that I would expect if I told them I eat puppies for breakfast. Kinda of a confused, unbelieving, disgust look.

However, while possibly more widespread, the dicrimination itself is not as severe as against homosexuals. As sublime alluded to, homosexual are physical attacked and ridiculed from an early age. People are afraid of homosexuals. I think its getting better though...

I don't see a lot of discrimination against atheists. But maybe it's just the east coast. There certainly is a lot of heavy duty gaybashing here.

I see alot of discrimination against Atheists where I come from (lots aginst myself). In a religious studies class, a poll was taken about what religion you are. It didn't have atheism or anything similar, so I complained. From then on, everyone, but my friends, were out to get me. They wanted my blood.
Now, if I told them I was gay (I'm not), you would have seen my decapitated head inside a church

Some dumb southern state where everyone is sanctimoniously "religious" and they clutch bibles and cry out the glory of some weird god they beleive in. I could never stomach that.

Originally posted by James R
What scares Americans so much about atheists? I wonder.


The poll is about electing an atheist. Don't read more into than that.

If an atheist doesn't believe in (and fear) a higher power that defines "right" and "wrong", then why should they be trusted to do what's right for the people that elected them? Or at least that's my theory about why atheists would rate so low on that poll.

I think that it belief in God provides a basis for morality that is familar and visible to people. Atheists don't have a specific set of values, so voters can not "see" their moral source. A christian has "christian" values; when a person says he/she is christian we have a means by which we can know their values and predict their actions. Atheists believe (or don't believe) on thing. Who the hell knows what their other values are?

Originally posted by Voodoo Child
Who the hell knows what their other values are?

Well, if they're atheistic, certainly no one in Hell. :p

Atheists are not descriminated against as youths although gays are. Now later on in life gays are accepted and atheists (once found to be one) somehow lose respect from their peers and society. The general population in this world seems to be pathetically mindless.

from the people i know, and where i live, in my little town... we have all relegious types, athiests of course being one of them. as from peers, i never saw any real descrimiation against them... at all..... although the only one i knew personally blew his head off a few moths ago because he parents foced him to be jehovas witness, and a load of toher reasons...... as for being gay at a young age, the boyfriend of a male friend of mine was beat to daeth over it. i find descrimitation against homosexuals much stronger than against athiests. If the common christain is at work, and learns that a friend/co-worker is an athiest, depending on how relegious they are, they may take note, but not say anything and continue on, or they may talk to them and give their opinion, and usually conitnue on..... however if it were a homosexual, not an athiest in the same situation.. usually the person will just turn away and disconnect.

I've been discriminated against for my lack of religious beliefs.

Last time I was pulled over for speeding away from a bank robbery/multiple homicide, the cops put the cuffs on me and started asking questions, and after a while one of the cops said "You'd better start praying boy!" I replied "Dude, I'm an atheist." Then they started in on me with pepperspray, batons, and zappers.

Once I was kicking the crap out of this little old lady, and she said "God forgives you sonny!" I replied "I don't believe in God, madam." And she spat at me! How rude is that?

Anyway, those are only two of many such events. It happens all the time here. People can be so cruel...

I am an atheist, I live in Texas, and I see discrimination over it frequently. Granted, I do not wear an arm band with "Savage" on it or anything, but if someone asks, I tell them, and they immediately act differently towards me.

For those who think it does not happen, consider this story:

A close friend of mine is also an atheist, she has been her whole life, raised that way, you know. When she was a child, when it became known to kids at her school that she was an atheist, they began to abuse her over it. I don't mean just some teasing either, I mean beating her up, sticking her head in the toilet, etc. When her mother complained to the school, the Principal got hold of some of the perpetrators, who told him that they had asked their preacher about how they should treat an atheist. He had told them, "Anything you do to an atheist is ok because someone who does not believe in God is no better than an animal." A Preacher told them to abuse another child based on religious differences. The mother complained to the police and the church about the preacher, but nothing was done. The Principal issued a few detentions and took no other steps, and the teachers turned a blind eye as well. Eventually, my friend had to be taken out of school and home-schooled.

Originally posted by Northwind
I am an atheist, I live in Texas, and I see discrimination over it frequently. Granted, I do not wear an arm band with "Savage" on it or anything, but if someone asks, I tell them, and they immediately act differently towards me.


Discrimination and prejudice show just how far we have not developed beyond our animal instincts. Discrimination and prejudice are a part of the "survival of the fittest" doctrine. Anyone (human or animal) that is not like the rest of the herd is deemed somehow "unfit" and is ostracized from the herd. We are simply continuing the process that is ingrained in our genes.

If you lived in a society where the overwhelming majority were atheist and you were the one with a religious belief in God, then its likely that you'd still be experiencing discrimination and prejudice.

I am an atheist, I live in Texas

you live in the southern belt. you should expect descrimination there. that would be like moving here to detroit and being against american cars. your not going to get very far.

i also live in the bible belt. i dont wear anything on my sleeve, but if asked i will tell someone i'm an athiest. other than a "you're going to hell" , i've never really been discriminated against.

I live in Arkansas -- yes, deep within the Bible Belt -- but I have experienced very different reactions towards my atheism.

On the negative side, while I don't feel the need to proclaim my lack of belief in a deity far and wide, if asked I try to be honest about it. This has resulted in quite a few awkward moments and worse, encounters with the confrontational and somehow insulted. However, after watching the treatment given to my gay relatives and friends, I believe that while atheists are more disliked, gays are more openly discrimated against. An atheist might get a stern tongue-lashing or bible-quoting. A homosexual is lucky not to get beaten to a pulp. Fundamentalism is very strong in Arkansas, particularly in the rural areas.

Even so, I've also seen a lot of positive things regarding people's tolerance of atheism and homosexuality, particularly in the larger cities and college towns in the state, as well as on an archaeological dig. There are many members of the very active LBGSA in Conway and Little Rock, and demonstrations go on at the capitol regularly for gay rights. Atheists don't have a similar support group, but I've never felt the need for one. Who needs Atheists Anonymous? :) A lot of the universities and the liberal arts colleges -- and also the more tolerant churches -- hold debates between atheist scholars and theologians, biologists and creationists, and also have non-religious speakers. Also, on a volunteer archaeological dig, I met another atheist, two agnostics, and plenty of people that were interested and not at all threatened or insulted by our beliefs. Sometimes it's good, sometimes it's bad, it just depends on what area of the state you're in.

Actually, where I go to school there is in my opinion some pressure on Christians -- particularly those of the more conservative stripe -- to not share their beliefs openly. But only sometimes, when the loony Fundamentalist Atheist Goons show their heads. But that's another thread altogether.

As a friend of mine said, "Here at Hendrix [College], if you're not a Methodist, you're an atheist! Or a Unitarian. Or an Episcopal. Or a pagan. Or... Well, something."

-Joey, the long winded

"Survival of the fittest" also includes tricks like "cheating" and "lying". Cheaters and liars are common among all living things. If cheating or lying can improve the survival rate, people will do it. So I just wonder among all those people who said to believe in god, how many are real and how many are fake? :D

There have been presidents that have had homsexual proclivities but never had one admitted to be an athiest.

None admitted to homosexuality, either.

*Originally posted by daktaklakpak
So I just wonder among all those people who said to believe in god, how many are real and how many are fake?*

Two thirds fake and one third real, and that's just amongst Christians.
Among others who claim to believe in a god, it's pretty much 100% fake.

And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God.
(Zechariah 13:9, KJV).

Originally posted by tony1
*Originally posted by daktaklakpak
So I just wonder among all those people who said to believe in god, how many are real and how many are fake?*

Two thirds fake and one third real, and that's just amongst Christians.
Among others who claim to believe in a god, it's pretty much 100% fake.

And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God.
(Zechariah 13:9, KJV).

lol!

Just like you, Tony, to say something like that. I believe there is a word to refer to people like you who inflate their theories as truth when they have no proof. Oh, yes, that's it! Idiots.

And if I were a Theist, I would elect a good Atheist for president because shouldn't they be allowed to have a good life before they burn in hell? :p

idiots? do me a favor and prove there is a god....... oh u cant well that just sucks. As for burning in hell when i die, well there is no hell. But last time i checked god was all forgiving, so when i die and if there ends up being a god all i got to say to him is "sorry" and he will forgive me. Or did your religion tell ya a scary story about what happens to people that dont buy in to that crap and conform like good little sheep?

Originally posted by milenko
idiots? do me a favor and prove there is a god....... oh u cant well that just sucks. As for burning in hell when i die, well there is no hell. But last time i checked god was all forgiving, so when i die and if there ends up being a god all i got to say to him is "sorry" and he will forgive me. Or did your religion tell ya a scary story about what happens to people that dont buy in to that crap and conform like good little sheep?

I'm an Atheist, you dumb fuck.

"If I were a Theist..."

Oh, and I am sure I would be discriminated against by many if I wore around a shirt that said I am an Atheist, but I don't. If somebody asks me, I tell them.

That's why I don't get discriminated against.

I am the closest to being a atheist then I ever have been in my life. Why? Because musclemen (a jesusfreak) is a moron. Christians are starting to scare me.:(

I am the closest to being a atheist then I ever have been in my life.

Come to the rational side, Counseler. Come, feel the power of, ah, vanilla milkshakes. Ummm, and.....ah, we're cooler. And we have milkshakes! Not just vanilla, but chocalate and strawberry and marshmallow-pistachio!

Really GOOD milkshakes!

Marshmallow-pistachio??? Lucky bastards.

Mmmmm milkshakes....no must resist, must stay undecided.....

We have pizza too! And we have dancing girls! (http://striporama.com/blstrip.gif) And pizza! (http://www.jupiterspizza.com/images/pizza.GIF) Dancing girls and pizza and milkshakes, c'mon, what more could you want?

Sign me up!

Okay Im an atheist.... Im being tricked but its so worth it.

Mmmmm dancing girls.... must my kill unborn children....

yew athess our sew evvil thet iz wigh wee descremminete agenst yew bich's.

yew athess our sew evvil thet iz wigh wee descremminete agenst yew bich's.

You're jealous we have dancing girls!

*Xev tries to dance to "Ich Will Dich" and trips on one of the many piles of laundry that adorn her room*

THAT IS WHAT IS SO STRANGE ABOUT YOU ATHEIST PEOPLE, YOU LIKE GIVING US QUESTIONS AND ANSWERING THEM YOURSELVES AND PUTTING WORDS IN OUR MOUTH AS IF WE SAID IT...NOT ONE TRUE CHRISTIAN HAVE CLAIMED GOD CANNOT BE PROVEN. GOD CAN BE PROVEN BUT U DONT WANT TO HEAR IT, RATHER U REJECT FACTS AND LOGIC AND HANG ON TO PROOFLES CLAIM, SUCH AS ATHEISM, AGAIN GOD CAN BE PROVEN PHILOSOPHICALLY AND SCIENTIFICALLY, ANYONE DARE CHALLENGES TO DEBATE ME? STEP UP, AND WE WILL BEGIN...

So Xev, going to bring me a milkshake, or something else to slurp on?

THAT IS WHAT IS SO STRANGE ABOUT YOU ATHEIST PEOPLE, YOU LIKE GIVING US QUESTIONS AND ANSWERING THEM YOURSELVES AND PUTTING WORDS IN OUR MOUTH AS IF WE SAID IT...NOT ONE TRUE CHRISTIAN HAVE CLAIMED GOD CANNOT BE PROVEN. GOD CAN BE PROVEN BUT U DONT WANT TO HEAR IT, RATHER U REJECT FACTS AND LOGIC AND HANG ON TO PROOFLES CLAIM, SUCH AS ATHEISM, AGAIN GOD CAN BE PROVEN PHILOSOPHICALLY AND SCIENTIFICALLY, ANYONE DARE CHALLENGES TO DEBATE ME? STEP UP, AND WE WILL BEGIN...

Don't you just hate it when the inmates take a break from smearing jello on the padded walls and post to forums instead?

Adam:
Get your own damned milkshake, I'm still waiting for my beer.

muscleman,

You might get a better response if you push the large key labelled "Caps Lock" on your keyboard.

OTHERWISE PEOPLE WILL THINK YOU ARE SHOUTING!

Unfortunately I doubt very much that his keyboard has a "LITERACY" button.

GOD DOESN'T EXIST BECAUSE I USED EVEN BIGGER LETTERS!

::trembling with self control::

I will not bait, I will not bait, I will not bait, I will not bait...

::sucking on a butterscotch milkshake and waiting for the dancing girls::

~Raithere

Originally posted by muscleman
THAT IS WHAT IS SO STRANGE ABOUT YOU ATHEIST PEOPLE, YOU LIKE GIVING US QUESTIONS AND ANSWERING THEM YOURSELVES AND PUTTING WORDS IN OUR MOUTH AS IF WE SAID IT...NOT ONE TRUE CHRISTIAN HAVE CLAIMED GOD CANNOT BE PROVEN. GOD CAN BE PROVEN BUT U DONT WANT TO HEAR IT, RATHER U REJECT FACTS AND LOGIC AND HANG ON TO PROOFLES CLAIM, SUCH AS ATHEISM, AGAIN GOD CAN BE PROVEN PHILOSOPHICALLY AND SCIENTIFICALLY, ANYONE DARE CHALLENGES TO DEBATE ME? STEP UP, AND WE WILL BEGIN...

musselmen eye lighk gud thess liek yew, alweys sew mach smertar thun the athess idits! eye wesh eye our ass smert ass yew musselmen. bat anfirchinitley eye im in idit. :(

Muscleman I hope your happy. You have turned me onto atheism because I realized how stupid/freaky jesus people are.:mad: