the usual

link (http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3423679,00.html)

Fire from northern Gaza continued Tuesday, as eleven mortar shells were launched towards the western Negev. There were no casualties although two structures sustained damages.

The shooting began at around 11:00 a.m., when Palestinians launched five mortar shells at the Kerem Shalom crossing, on the border between Israel and central Gaza. Two structures were damaged, although no one was hurt.

Three additional mortars were fired shortly afterwards at western Negev communities. Later, at around 3:15 p.m., an additional barrage of three mortars hit the area, landing in open areas. There were no ensuing casualties or damages in either of the later volleys.

The latest round of mortars has become part of the routine for area residents. During a tour of Sderot on Monday, Italian Prime Minister Romano Prodi asked in disbelief three times, "5,000 Qassams have hit Sderot and the Gaza perimeter?"

"It's hard to see the daily suffering of the residents here. It's impossible to live like this," said the Italian premier, on his first visit to the Qassam-battered southern city.


just another day in the negev. ;)

Yup, just another day.

Troops invade Nablus surround several neighborhoods
author Tuesday July 10, 2007 08:57author by IMEMC Staffauthor email saed at imemc dot org Report this post to the editors

Palestinian sources in Nablus, in the northern part of the West Bank, reported on Tuesday at dawn that Israeli soldiers invaded the city and surrounded the Physicians Housing and Rafidia neighborhoods and used loud speakers to call the residents out of their homes.The eyewitnesses added that soldiers fired rounds of live ammunition into the air but did not kidnap any resident.

Moreover, students of the Al Quds Open University were supposed to hold one of the final exams but the students could not reach the university due to the invasion.

The army also detained several local reporters and cameramen and barred them for entering the invaded areas.

In an invasion to Jenin city, Israeli soldiers kidnapped one of the leaders of the Islamic Jihad. At least twelve residents were kidnapped in the invasion.


Israeli closure halts UN Gaza building work
Published: Tuesday, 10 July, 2007, 01:37 AM Doha Time
Palestinians construct new houses in a project funded by Unrwa in Rafah, southern Gaza Strip, yesterday
JERUSALEM: The UN suspended yesterday all of its construction projects, worth some $93mn, in the Gaza Strip, citing a concrete shortage it said was caused by Israeli closures of a border crossing.
Israel largely closed off the Karni terminal, the main commercial crossing to and from Gaza, soon after Hamas Islamists took over the territory by force last month following weeks of fighting against loyalists of President Mahmoud Abbas.
The UN Relief and Works Agency (Unrwa) funds scores of building projects in the largely impoverished Gaza Strip. It buys its materials from Israeli housing companies and hires mostly Palestinian contractors.
“Some $93mn worth of projects are on hold because cement and other building supplies have run out,” said John Ging, Unrwa’s director in Gaza, citing the crossing closure.
Christopher Gunness, an Unrwa spokesman, said some concrete was transferred from Israel to Gaza in recent weeks but it was not enough. The suspension of the projects would affect thousands of Palestinians, he and Ging said.

Israel still refusing to disclose cluster bomb details in Lebanon
London, July 10, IRNA

UK-Israel-Cluster Bombs
The British government has repeated its call on Israel to pass on details of its cluster bomb attacks on Lebanon last year after revealing that it was still in defiance of the demand made at the time by UN secretary-general Kofi Annan.

"I take this opportunity to repeat the UN secretary-general's call for this information to be made available immediately," Baroness Royall said during a debate on the issue in the House of Lords on Monday.

The government spokeswoman said that the British Embassy in Tel Aviv had last raised the defiance with Israeli defence forces in April, when the EU also reiterated its call for the full disclosure of all relevant information to the UN.

"However, I very much regret that Israel has yet to provide the UN with detailed data on the use of cluster munitions during last year's conflict," she told her fellow peers.

how shocking, why should israeli invade nablus and other palestinians towns, its not like their residents are being fired by mortar weapons. :shrug:

its not like we left gaza or something.

how shocking, why should israeli invade nablus and other palestinians towns, its not like their residents are being fired by mortar weapons. :shrug:

its not like we left gaza or something.

For once you got it right.

Israel troops attack Gaza Strip

RAMALLAH, July 5 (PL). — An Israeli military operation in the center of the Gaza Strip left five Palestinians dead, three of them members of the Islamic Resistance Movement, Hamas.

Medical personnel reported that three more people were injured, two of them seriously.

Hamas, which has controlled Gaza for the past three weeks, confirmed in a communiqué that it lost three of its activists east of the Al Bureij refugee camp.

In the Israeli invasion, a rocket fired by a helicopter killed two members of the Ezzedin al Qasam Brigade and the third individual was killed while repelling the Israeli attack.

A spokesman for the Israeli army said that the military action was a routine operation and that when their troops entered Gaza they were confronted by the Palestinians.

8 Hamas militants killed in clashes with Israeli troops in Gaza
By Associated Press
Thursday, July 5, 2007 - Updated: 01:20 PM EST

GAZA CITY, Gaza Strip - Israeli troops clashed with Hamas militants inside the Gaza Strip on Thursday, killing eight in fierce fighting that drew in Israeli aircraft, tanks and bulldozers.
It was the second-deadliest day of fighting between the two sides since the Islamic militant group wrested control of Gaza in mid-June. In all, more than 30 Palestinians - nearly all of them militants but including a 12-year-old boy - have been killed in at least five separate Israeli military operations in Gaza since the Hamas takeover.

wait, this dates back a few days ago, didnt the israelis left gaza in 2006? evacuated all their armed forces there and civilians? i guess those israelis are quite stupid. they left gaza and now their civilians are being fired by mortar weapons. i have a better idea. maybe we should leave gaza on all parameters. stay out all together and stop providing them gas, electricity, water etc. you cant eat the cake and leave it full you know.

Yeah lets look back at 2006, while Israeli troops "routinely" kill Palestinians today.

Yeah lets look back at 2006, while Israeli troops "routinely" kill Palestinians today.

you mean just like you diverted this to the palestinians after israel was attacked by mortar shells?

you mean just like you diverted this to the palestinians after israel was attacked by mortar shells?

Considering that they are occupying Palestine, their whining seems rather strange to me.

Boo hoo they are attacking us for occupying them.

Duh.

Considering that they are occupying Palestine, their whining seems rather strange to me.

then you dont have any problem if ill go and fire mortar shells on your house if it constitute as whining. what else are the palestinians allowed to do in the name of occupation?

i can say the same about them, i dont see why they are whining about an occupation while they fire on us. of course, ive come to expect this childish arguments from you.

that is why i say, they want us to stop occupy, lets give them what they want. leave all the west bank as well, and stop providing them with medical care, money, fuel, electricity, water. they can use the money they get to build those things by themselves, like we did 60 years ago.

then you dont have any problem if ill go and fire mortar shells on your house if it constitute as whining. what else are the palestinians allowed to do in the name of occupation?

i can say the same about them, i dont see why they are whining about an occupation while they fire on us. of course, ive come to expect this childish arguments from you.

that is why i say, they want us to stop occupy, lets give them what they want. leave all the west bank as well, and stop providing them with medical care, money, fuel, electricity, water. they can use the money they get to build those things by themselves, like we did 60 years ago.

You need to pay restitution for 60 years of occupation and oppression, like Germany did and does. And revert to 1967 borders.

You need to pay restitution for 60 years of occupation and oppression, like Germany did and does. And revert to 1967 borders.

what does germany got do with this? you compare this to holocaust? i thought you had enough of the jewish whining.

anyway, ignoring unrelated issues, we gave them money, they used it for terror. their problem.

what does germany got do with this? you compare this to holocaust? i thought you had enough of the jewish whining.

anyway, ignoring unrelated issues, we gave them money, they used it for terror. their problem.

You're still occupying and oppressing them. The money does not change the daily military incursions, lack of food and water and basic amenities being regulated by Israeli closure of all entry points. Accompanied by bulldozing of their livelihood (the orchards), their homes and kidnapping and killing on a widespread scale with helicopters, tanks and missiles, and I would say 11 mortars are a joke.

You can't treat people like that and complain when they object.

You're still occupying and oppressing them. The money does not change the daily military incursions, lack of food and water and basic amenities being regulated by Israeli closure of all entry points.

we havent closed all entries only our side of the border, and still we give them food and other vital supplies. they have a government we established, police, money, now even a military, they have everything they need and still they are dependent on us.


Accompanied by bulldozing of their livelihood (the orchrds), their homes and kidnapping and killing on a widespread scale with helicopters, tanks and missiles, and I would say 11 mortars are a joke.

so lets give them more weapons, so they can do wider damage and then sam couldnt argue you cant compare the two. and its ridiculous, nobody is using helicopters and tanks to make widespread damage, if we did we had more then some militants dead.

You can't treat people like that and complain when they object.

so 11 mortars are nothing more then objection? are you serious? when are you going to see israelis as humans? by luck nobody died. you criticize israel with every breath and show no care when they are under attack. its despicable.

Want some cheese with that whine?

we havent closed all entries only our side of the border, and still we give them food and other vital supplies. they have a government we established, police, money, now even a military, they have everything they need and still they are dependent on us.

so lets give them more weapons, so they can do wider damage and then sam couldnt argue you cant compare the two. and its ridiculous, nobody is using helicopters and tanks to make widespread damage, if we did we had more then some militants dead.

Reality check:

During the week we spent in Ramallah, Gaza and Rafah, all we saw was destruction: villages, roads and homes, all demolished. Crops have been burned and public services bombarded. Missiles from helicopter gunships or F-16 fighter planes have destroyed newly completed civilian infrastructure. The European Commission has compiled an extraordinary list of the EU-funded projects that have been damaged. These include Gaza international airport, Gaza seaport, Ramallah’s Voice of Palestine radio station, Bethlehem’s Intercontinental Hotel and a forensic laboratory. Municipal infrastructure including schools, public housing projects, roads, sewers and recycling centres have been destroyed, together with the administrative offices of a peace project in Jenin, reforestation projects in Beit Lahia, the central statistics office in Ramallah and irrigation systems in Jericho. In total 17 projects valued at $15.58m. Does anyone believe that all these sites were terrorist hideouts?

We visited a razed village near Rafah on the Egyptian border and walked among the rubble of bulldozed homes. Exercise books, kitchen utensils and a toothbrush were strewn about, signs of life reduced to pieces. One woman told us that residents were given five minutes to leave their homes in the middle of the night. The bulldozers returned several times to "finish the job"; these three words may well become the Israeli army’s catchphrase. Mounted high atop the watchtowers, infrared machine guns watch over the wasteland. There are no soldiers about. At night the guns fire automatically as soon as any lights are turned on. The first few rows of houses are riddled with bullet holes and their residents face the constant threat of automatic weapons fire. This must be how buffer zones are created.

Like some stinging insect bent on inflicting injury, the war machine is in perpetual motion, spreading boundaries wherever it goes, patiently and absent-mindedly. Here the border is an all-pervasive force, cutting through street corners, hillsides, villages, even houses. Military fortifications have replaced the olive groves. City walls are all reinforced, each one a hostile presence. Any private home might conceal a lurking sniper. Checkpoints loom up at every bend in the road, sometimes every 100m; there are over 700 in the West Bank alone. Because some roads are blocked off, travelling to Bir Zeit University means you have to take a bus and a taxi as well as walking part of the way. The occupied territories have become a grid of impenetrable cells, with the Israeli army controlling all access in and out. There are some 220 of these rat traps — perhaps reservations or ghettos might be a better term — with battalions of Merkava tanks and Apache helicopters (supplied by the US military) on constant patrol.

This is a new type of frontier: portable, porous and hazy, a border in motion. One evening we climbed with Mahmoud Darwish, the poet, to the top of a small hill in Ramallah, where we looked out on the twinkling lights of Jerusalem only a few kilometres away. In the foreground lay areas in shadow, with only a few scattered lights from Palestinian homes. To our right off in the distance, there was a zone of bright light with a deserted illuminated roadway leading to an Israeli settlement. And amid this shimmering nightscape, I could pick out the border.

The Israeli occupation comes down to this: the right to determine what will be illuminated and what will be cast into darkness, what will be rendered visible or invisible, accessible or inaccessible. The border governs every aspect, even the division of light and shadow, like some supernatural apparition.

Want some cheese with that whine?

your hate towered jews\israelis is obvious and disgusting. maybe its a common thing with muslims? they just cant sympathize with israelis cause they arent muslims? one of the kaffirs, sons of apes and pigs.

im sure you are so despicable and anti social you wouldnt find any problem there.

your hate towered jews\israelis is obvious and disgusting. maybe its a common thing with muslims? they just cant sympathize with israelis cause they arent muslims? one of the kaffirs, sons of apes and pigs.

im sure you are so despicable and anti social you wouldnt find any problem there.

More whining? :rolleyes:

Reality check:

ha ha ha
its dated 2002 nice try.:p

http://mondediplo.com/2002/05/08bulldozer

More whining? :rolleyes:

if ill shoot you in the head like i want to will its still be whining? and when are you going to change that stupid avatar?

ha ha ha
its dated 2002 nice try.:p

http://mondediplo.com/2002/05/08bulldozer

Whats changed now?
http://www.kibush.co.il/datapage.asp?lang=1&section=5&yr=2007&mn=4

http://www.poica.org/editor/case_studies/view.php?recordID=1005

Whats changed now?

http://www.poica.org/editor/case_studies/view.php?recordID=1005

we left gaza and got a civil war, hamas in power and mortar shells.

we left gaza and got a civil war, hamas in power and mortar shells.

You "left" Gaza and are still killing people in Palestine (30 in the last month alone)

Again, what's changed?

You "left" Gaza and are still killing people in Palestine (30 in the last month alone)

Again, what's changed?

beacuse you disclosed 2006, we left gaza a year ago, being fired upon by qassam rockets, and then retaliated. now they fire mortar shells as part of their military start up. what change? the palestinians want us back in:

For example, Majed Azzam wrote in the Hamas-affiliated weekly Al Risala in Gaza that Palestinians “should have the courage to acknowledge the truth,” that the only thing that “prevents the chaos and turmoil in Gaza from spreading to the West Bank is the presence of the Israeli occupation.”

Another Palestinian writer, Bassem al-Nabris, a poet from Khan Yunis, in the Gaza Strip, wrote in the Arabic electronic newspaper Elaph that if there was a referendum in the Gaza Strip on the question of whether people would like the Israeli occupation to return, “half the population would vote ‘yes.’ But in practice,” he continued, “I believe that the number of those in favor is at least 70 percent, if not more.”

“If the occupation returns,” Mr. Nabris added, “at least there will be no civil war, and the occupier will have a moral and legal obligation to provide the occupied people with employment and food, which they now lack.”

i dont blame them.

beacuse you disclosed 2006, we left gaza a year ago, being fired upon by qassam rockets, and then retaliated. now they fire mortar shells as part of their military start up. what change? the palestinians want us back in:


i dont blame them.

Want you back in? You are in Palestine.:rolleyes:

One journalist quoted by MEMRI, Majed Azzam, wrote in the Hamas-affiliated Al Risala weekly in Gaza that Palestinians "should have the courage to ...

:rolleyes:

Want you back in? You are in Palestine.:rolleyes:


:rolleyes:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k69ld_YPahk&mode=related&search=

Reminds me of "Jews drinking the blood of infants.":rolleyes:

http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/corpus-paul/20021007/003978.html

divide and conquer is very passe.

Reminds me of "Jews drinking the blood of infants.":rolleyes:

http://lists.ibiblio.org/pipermail/corpus-paul/20021007/003978.html

divide and conquer is very passe.

stay on topic. that video contains a news report of what was going on in gaza during the civil war, and a palestinian making a remark "we want the israelis back to maintain order".

stay on topic. that video contains a news report of what was going on in gaza during the civil war, and a palestinian making a remark "we want the israelis back to maintain order".

Oh goody, we must listen to what the Palestinians are saying*


*conditions apply

Oh goody, we must listen to what the Palestinians are saying*


*conditions apply

especially after for years they said they wanted us out and now they want us back in.

You need to pay restitution for 60 years of occupation and oppression, like Germany did and does. And revert to 1967 borders.

So that the next invasion will work.

Good plan. "Live in peace with your neighbours...did we say peace? What we really meant was - submission."

Whine if you want, but it's not my word.

Israel is in palestine supporting one side of a civil war. There is still continued oppression and denial of health services to the palestinian people.

http://adbusters.org/the_magazine/images/stories/66/palestine_wall.jpg

the link shows an image of a wall built supposedly to 'protect' the Israeli road from the palestinians. what the wall does is deny hospital support to many impoverished palestinians.

So that the next invasion will work.

Good plan. "Live in peace with your neighbours...did we say peace? What we really meant was - submission."

Whine if you want, but it's not my word.

So pre-Israel, were the Jews in Palestine treated like the Palestinians are treated today by the Israelis?

Israel is in palestine supporting one side of a civil war. There is still continued oppression and denial of health services to the palestinian people.

http://adbusters.org/the_magazine/images/stories/66/palestine_wall.jpg

the link shows an image of a wall built supposedly to 'protect' the Israeli road from the palestinians. what the wall does is deny hospital support to many impoverished palestinians.

supposed ha?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,,1153746,00.html

So pre-Israel, were the Jews in Palestine treated like the Palestinians are treated today by the Israelis?

which ones? the one with israeli citizenship or the ones on the other side?

It's funny how you 2 are acting out the israeli, palestinian conflict in this thread and behaving exactly as they do in real life. No hope I tell you the cycle just continues. :grumble:

It's funny how you 2 are acting out the israeli, palestinian conflict in this thread and behaving exactly as they do in real life. No hope I tell you the cycle just continues. :grumble:

:roflmao:

supposed ha?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,,1153746,00.html

No excuse for pregnant women dying at the checkpoints, for lack of medical attention.

Monday, April 30, 2007
68 Palestinian Women Gave Birth On Israeli Checkpoints, 33 Infants and 4 Women Died


The Palestinian Independent Commission for Citizens Rights (PICCR) reported that Israeli troops stationed at hundreds of roadblocks in the occupied territories barred dozens of pregnant women from crossing the checkpoints while in labor; 34 infants and four women died on their roadblocks.

No excuse for pregnant women dying at the checkpoints, for lack of medical attention.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpXOwN9hy5M

So pre-Israel, were the Jews in Palestine treated like the Palestinians are treated today by the Israelis?

Pretty much, yeah. Aggressive dhimmitude marches, assaults and the like. Your basic sharia.

Pretty much, yeah. Aggressive dhimmitude marches, assaults and the like. Your basic sharia.

Strange then, that Christians have all but disappeared from Israel and yet are still defending Palestine.

Strange then, that Christians have all but disappeared from Israel and yet are still defending Palestine.

You're confusing eras there, I think.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpXOwN9hy5M

Sorry no defense for pregnant women dying at checkpoints for lack of medical attention.

You're confusing eras there, I think.

No ask any Palestinian Christian what they think of Israel.

Or Hamas. Or sharia.

Spock,Sam said,Pre Israel.

Also what about the thousands that will suffer because of the fence ,what about the appalling no. of ambulances turned way at checkpoints with the people in need of assistance?
But of course, the death of 8 Israeli's will be put higher than the thousands that will die .

Or Hamas. Or sharia.

Sure that too, notwithstanding that Hamas was created by Israel to counteract the secular PLO.

The Palestinians have assimilated with scores of people throughout the history of their nation.

There were no suicide bombers before Israel, not in Palestine, not in Lebanon; just like there were no suicide bombers in Iraq before the US.

Sorry no defense for pregnant women dying at checkpoints for lack of medical attention.

using the good will of Israelis to help the palestinians in their hospitals by smuggling explosives isnt enough?

using the good will of Israelis to help the palestinians in their hospitals by smuggling explosives isnt enough?

You're still occupying them, remember?

Spock,Sam said,Pre Israel.

Also what about the thousands that will suffer because of the fence ,what about the appalling no. of ambulances turned way at checkpoints with the people in need of assistance?
But of course, the death of 8 Israeli's will be put higher than the thousands that will die .

why should they suffer beacuse of the fence? maybe because they are dependent on us? the fence is between the israeli west bank border. the fence works. they get enough money to take care of themselves.

You're still occupying them, remember?

you remember what happened in gaza when we left?

you remember what happened in gaza when we left?

Let me guess, the Israelis funded Fatah when Hamas was the elected government, then they supplied arms to Fatah, then after instigating riots, they used the opportunity to immediately come back into Gaza with their troops.

They are dependant as often NGO's have to be approved by the israeli miltary,Also there isn't much else to go to, Israel is still occupying and controlling most of the major facilities in Palestine

Let me guess, the Israelis funded Fatah when Hamas was the elected government, then they supplied arms to Fatah, then after instigating riots, they used the opportunity to immediately come back into Gaza with their troops.

your premises are wrong. they started that civil war, they suffered for it, gaza is in chaos. we left in 2006, we didnt want to come back, why would we? we wanted nothing to do with gaza. we entered gaza beacuse of rockets attacks, and the way things are going they arent going to stop firing. now they want us back in!!!!! well they can rot.

olmert was elected to leave the west bank as well. now that isnt gonna happen, and the palestinians can blame themselves.

your premises are wrong. they started that civil war, they suffered for it, gaza is in chaos. we left in 2006, we didnt want to come back, why would we? we wanted nothing to do with gaza. we entered gaza beacuse of rockets attacks, and the way things are going they arent going to stop firing. now they want us back in!!!!! well they can rot.

olmert was elected to leave the west bank as well. now that isnt gonna happen, and the palestinians can blame themselves.

Yeah right. :rolleyes:

They are dependant as often NGO's have to be approved by the israeli miltary,Also there isn't much else to go to, Israel is still occupying and controlling most of the major facilities in Palestine

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Governorates_of_the_West_Bank_and_Gaza_Strip

Yeah right. :rolleyes:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Realignment_plan

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Realignment_plan

Please, lets stick to reality.

Please, lets stick to reality.

whats not reality there? that is why he was elected for:

The realignment plan (Hebrew: תוכנית ההתכנסות) (originally dubbed the "convergence plan") was formulated and introduced to the Israeli public by prime minister Ehud Olmert, in a number of media interviews during the election campaign for the 17th Knesset in early 2006. Olmert stated that if he was elected prime minister, within four years he would remove Israeli settlements from most of West Bank(Judea and Samaria) and consolidate them into large groups of settlements near the 1967 border. The area of removal would correspond to the area east of the route of the West Bank barrier that was begun under his predecessor, Ariel Sharon, or a similar route with national consent and international legitimization.

i think you are just having a har time adjusting to the fact the palestinians messed up.

Sure that too, notwithstanding that Hamas was created by Israel to counteract the secular PLO.

Those islamophobes.

The Palestinians have assimilated with scores of people throughout the history of their nation.

And those people have been bound under the stricture of dhimmitude. Pre-Civil War America "assimilated" black people, too; but not in a way they liked.

There were no suicide bombers before Israel, not in Palestine, not in Lebanon; just like there were no suicide bombers in Iraq before the US.

And there was no Haganah, no Irgun, before Jewish immigrants were terrorized and pressured into defending themselves, either.

I love history. Don't you?

Those islamophobes.



And those people have been bound under the stricture of dhimmitude. Pre-Civil War America "assimilated" black people, too; but not in a way they liked.



And there was no Haganah, no Irgun, before Jewish immigrants were terrorized and pressured into defending themselves, either.

I love history. Don't you?

Actually Jewish terrorists predate all others.

Sicarii comes from the Latin word for dagger sica, and means assasins or murderers. The Sicarii, or "dagger men" carried out murders and assassinations with short daggers.
Founded In: 1st Century CE (Common Era, the first year that Jesus Christ is assumed to have been born. Also called A.D., anno domini, meaning "in the year of our Lord.")

The Sicarii were led by descendents of Judas of Galilee, who helped foster revolt against direct Roman rule in 6 CE, when they attempted to carry out a census of the Jews under the rule of Roman governor Quirinius in Syria, so that they could tax them. Judas famously proclaimed that the Jews should be ruled by God alone.

terrorism are acts of violence against civilians by militant groups. this are political assassination, which derives from the word hasasin.

terrorism are acts of violence against civilians by militant groups. this are political assassination, which derives from the word hasasin.

Doesn't sound like it

Sicarii (Latin plural of Sicarius 'dagger-' or later contract- killer) is a term applied, in the decades immediately preceding the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 CE, (probably) to an extremist splinter group[1] to the Jewish Zealots, (or insurgents) who attempted to expel the Romans and their partisans from Judea:

"When Albinus reached the city of Jerusalem, he bent every effort and made every provision to ensure peace in the land by exterminating most of the Sicarii." —Josephus, Jewish Antiquities (xx.208)

The sicarii even resorted to murder to obtain their objective. Under their cloaks they concealed sicae, or small daggers, from which they received their name. At popular assemblies, particularly during the pilgrimage to the Temple Mount, they stabbed their enemies (Romans or Roman sympathizers, Herodians, and wealthy Jews comfortable with Roman rule), lamenting ostentatiously after the deed to blend into the crowd to escape detection. Literally, Sicarii meant "dagger-men".

The victims of the Sicarii included Jonathan the High Priest, though it is possible that his murder was orchestrated by the Roman governor Felix. Some of their murders were met with severe retaliation by the Romans on the entire Jewish population of the country. On some occasions, they could be bribed to spare their intended victims. If the narrative of Barabbas is not an invention to create a parable, even convicted Sicarii were occasionally released on promising to spare their opponents, though there is no evidence for this practice outside the Gospels, which are largely in accord on this point. Once, Josephus relates, after kidnapping the secretary of Eleazar, governor of the Temple precincts, they agreed to release him in exchange for ten of their captured comrades.

And this is much much before the Hashashin.

Interesting history though:
At the beginning of the Jewish Revolt (66), the Sicarii, and (possibly) Zealot helpers (Josephus differentiated between the two but did not (in depth) explain the main differences), gained access to Jerusalem and committed a series of atrocities, in order to force the population to war. In one account, given in the Talmud, they destroyed the city's food supply, so that the people would be forced to fight against the Roman siege instead of negotiating peace. Their leaders, including Menahem ben Jair, Eleazar ben Jair, and Bar Giora, were important figures in the war, and Eleazar ben Jair eventually succeeded in escaping the Roman onslaught. Together with a small group of followers, he made his way to the abandoned fortress of Masada, where he continued his resistance to the Romans until 73, when the Romans took the fortress and found that most of its defenders had committed suicide rather than surrender.

Doesn't sound like it



And this is much much before the Hashashin.

so in the past they had daggers, now they publish books on apartheid. ;)

anyway, its not under the definition of terrorism.

Only 11 shells? I'm not impressed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Governorates_of_the_West_Bank_and_Gaza_Strip

Who controls entry and exit access to the west bank and gaza ?
The IDF.

if ill shoot you in the head like i want to will its still be whining?

That wouldn't be very logical...

Actually Jewish terrorists predate all others.

A straw, perchance, to grasp at?

A straw, perchance, to grasp at?

Just an example that there have been Jewish terrorists, even before there were any others.

1948 Zionist group led by former Begin bombed the King David Hotel, Killing more than 20 people.

Just an example that there have been Jewish terrorists, even before there were any others.

To the point of...what, exactly? Antisemitism? I don't recall my point being suicide bombing.

To the point of...what, exactly? Antisemitism? I don't recall my point being suicide bombing.

You're right. The Romans weren't anti-Semitic. What you said what there were no Irgun, etc.

The creation of Israel has a lot to answer for.

It's creation does?

Maybe you should call God.

Or, maybe accept the idea that everything can't be thrown at the feet of Jewish people.

It's creation does?

Maybe you should call God.



God wrote the UN resolution banishing the unwanted European Jews?

If they were unwanted, maybe the locals shouldn't have sold them land. Or, tried to turn them into second-class citizens. After all, the Middle East has "introgressed" numerous unbelievers in the same way, much like the natives in North America. Perhaps the Jewish immigrants simply didn't understand how the system was supposed to work.

It's funny too how immigrants are welcome in the minds of some posters on the site, yet not in other situations. You know; how some people think "unwanted European Jews" ought to be expulsed if they try to create a state, yet curiously not for other immigrants in the same position elsewhere, who say have a large undercurrent of antagonism towards their host culture. What does such a shifting moral goalpost say about the reasonability of the poster?

If they were unwanted, maybe the locals shouldn't have sold them land. Or, tried to turn them into second-class citizens. After all, the Middle East has "introgressed" numerous unbelievers in the same way, much like the natives in North America. Perhaps the Jewish immigrants simply didn't understand how the system was supposed to work.

It's funny too how immigrants are welcome in the minds of some posters on the site, yet not in other situations. You know; how some people think "unwanted European Jews" ought to be expulsed if they try to create a state, yet curiously not for other immigrants in the same position elsewhere, who say have a large undercurrent of antagonism towards their host culture. What does such a shifting moral goalpost say about the reasonability of the poster?

I hear the Irish had the same problems with British landowners who evicted the tenants

For god's sake, stop the electricity and gas flowing to the residents of Gaza. Make them pay for their actions using that high price, and then they will have to call for their government themselves and command it to stop launching those rockets. Besides, If you want a true 'disengagement' then make it full.

For god's sake, stop the electricity and gas flowing to the residents of Gaza. Make them pay for their actions using that high price, and then they will have to call for their government themselves and command it to stop launching those rockets. Besides, If you want a true 'disengagement' then make it full.

They've already destroyed the only power station there.

They've already destroyed the only power station there.

it wasnt a power station it was a transformer. and they still have electricity to power up their water.

it wasnt a power station it was a transformer. and they still have electricity to power up their water.
Thats good to know.

Gaza Strip to remain without full electrical power for a year
By Gideon Levy, Haaretz Correspondent, and the Associated Press

It could take between eight to 14 months to fix a Gaza Strip power plant destroyed in an Israel Air Force strike in late June, and to restore full electrical power to the region.


Do they still have those unmanned automatic gun towers that fire at any light source in the night?

Thats good to know.


gidon levi is a moron and a liar. if they had no water a cholera plague would break out that would affect us as well. this is why the army is still reluctant to stop all electricity to gaza.

Do they still have those unmanned automatic gun towers that fire at any light source in the night?

WTF?

gidon levi is a moron and a liar. if they had no water a cholera plague would break out that would affect us as well. this is why the army is still reluctant to stop all electricity to gaza.

Must be a lot of morons there then:

The Catholic confederate welfare organisation Caritas Internationalis is engaged in ongoing projects in Gaza. In early August it reported on the ongoing disaster.

Omar Shaban, director of Caritas member Catholic Relief Service's office in Gaza, said the constant attacks by the Israeli military into Gaza have led to an ever-worsening situation for people living in the Gaza Strip.

"Even if we get 200 food packets for families whose homes have been destroyed, the next day we need 200 more, because every day more people's homes are destroyed," Mr. Shaban said. "Every day it gets worse." …

Caritas Jerusalem reports that shortages of electricity, fuel, food, water, medicines, and medical equipment have reached critical levels. The infrastructure is tattered; poorly functioning wastewater treatment plants have led to major public health concerns. Furthermore, thousands of health care workers and government employees have not received salaries in months, and are barely scraping by.



You did not answer this question:


Do they still have those unmanned automatic gun towers that fire at any light source in the night?

Must be a lot of morons there then:




You did not answer this question:

the world is full of morons. what automatic gun towers?

the world is full of morons. what automatic gun towers?

Israel deploys robo-snipers on Gaza border
Man still in the loop...to begin with
By Lewis Page → More by this author
Published Tuesday 5th June 2007 12:07 GMT
Mobile computing: Opportunities and risk - Free whitepaper

Israel has begun deploying stationary robot gun-and-sensor installations along its borders with the Gaza Strip, according to reports.

Both Jane's Defence Weekly and Defence News reported last week that the Israeli Defence Forces (IDF) have begun deploying automated gun stations in pillboxes along the Gaza border. The robot systems are said to mount cal-fifty (12.7mm) machine guns, protected by "armoured folding shields" until ready to fire.

Defence News says the auto-gun network is developed by Rafael, the Israeli state weapons bureau. Given the reported calibre of the weaponry, this suggests that the gun-bots in use are the Mini-Samson type, normally used as a remote-controlled gun turret on light fighting vehicles so as to avoid a gunner having to poke his torso up out of a hatch (top gunner is one of the most dangerous jobs in counter-insurgency vehicle patrolling.)

In this case, the automatic guns and their long range electro-optical sensors will be tied in by optic fibre to a command network which will also be able to draw information from existing ground sensors, manned aircraft, and overhead drones.

According to Defence News Tel Aviv correspondent Barbara Opall-Rome, "each machine gun-mounted station serves as a type of robotic sniper, capable of enforcing a nearly 1,500-meter-deep no-go zone".

"The IDF's Southern Command is also considering adding Gill/Spike anti-tank missiles to extend the no-go zones to several kilometers, defense and industry sources here said."

The integrated robo-sniper network has reportedly been dubbed "See-Shoot" by the IDF, suggesting that asking questions isn't on the priority list.

"Nobody has any business approaching our border fence," an unnamed Israeli official told Opall-Rome. "It's well-understood that this area is off-limits..."

All in all, the Israeli gun-bot force seems distinctly more hardcore than the South Korean one. Not only do the IDF robo-snipers pack a more arse-kicking gun, their automatic armour-shuttered pillboxes seem a lot harder to circumvent than the Korean SGR-A1's "anti-theft alarm".

What's more, there seems to be a future plan for the Israeli gun systems to become true killer robots rather than just remote hardened weapon stations.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/06/05/israel_robo_sniper_gaza/

Some more info:

Sarit Michaeli, a spokeswoman for the Israeli Information Center for Human Rights in the Occupied Territories, said she is concerned about the deployment of such a system, regardless of whether it is operated in automatic or semi-automatic mode.
“There have been many cases in which people with no hostile or terrorist intentions were shot approaching the perimeter fence,” she said.
“Some attempted to enter Israel to find work, others suffered from disabilities, and still others were children who may have wandered into the forbidden areas. From a human rights perspective, the technology here is not as important as the need to evaluate each potential threat on a case by case basis.”
According to Michaeli’s statistics, since Israel’s withdrawal from Gaza, 14 unarmed Palestinians were killed by Israeli security forces at ranges of 100 meters to 800 meters from the perimeter fence. IDF statistics for that same period, however, show seven “terrorists killed” and 12 others wounded in the no-go buffer zone.
http://www.kibush.co.il/show_file.asp?num=20516

can you quote the part it says:

Do they still have those unmanned automatic gun towers that fire at any light source in the night?

Some more info:


http://www.kibush.co.il/show_file.asp?num=20516

ha kibush, lovely. i dont see how this is related to what you said before. just another crazy left winger that has no clue how the military works.

can you quote the part it says:

That is another kind, I'm trying to locate the reference, I read that it fires at lights across the border, so that houses close to the border are peppered with bulletholes or forced to stay in darkness.

I'll try and find the link.

That is another kind, I'm trying to locate the reference, I read that it fires at lights across the border, so that houses close to the border are peppered with bulletholes or forced to stay in darkness.

I'll try and find the link.

yeah yo do that, beacuse that is against opening fire procedures.

yeah yo do that, beacuse that is against opening fire procedures.

here is the article:

Mounted high atop the watchtowers, infrared machine guns watch over the wasteland. There are no soldiers about. At night the guns fire automatically as soon as any lights are turned on. The first few rows of houses are riddled with bullet holes and their residents face the constant threat of automatic weapons fire. This must be how buffer zones are created.

http://www.palestinemonitor.org/Reports/palestine_from_near_and_far.htm

here is the article:


http://www.palestinemonitor.org/Reports/palestine_from_near_and_far.htm

sounds complete bogus to me. that against the military policy. the military is very sensitive when it comes to that, they know that a lot of civilians are close to the border. the orders are specific, fire only when you see a weapon. doesnt sound credible at all. but apparently facts are negligible when it comes to the israeli palestinian conflict.

sounds complete bogus to me. that against the military policy. the military is very sensitive when it comes to that, they know that a lot of civilians are close to the border. the orders are specific, fire only when you see a weapon. doesnt sound credible at all. but apparently facts are negligible when it comes to the israeli palestinian conflict.

Umm did you read the earlier posts about the robosnipers?

Anyway, I am asking you. I know that Israel has unmanned gunboats and robosnipers, it would hardly be surprising if they also had automatic infrared machine guns.

Umm did you read the earlier posts about the robosnipers?

Anyway, I am asking you. I know that Israel has unmanned gunboats and robosnipers, it would hardly be surprising if they also had automatic infrared machine guns.

maybe, maybe not. but im sure they dont fire on people houses beacuse they turned on the light. thats completely preposterous.

maybe, maybe not. but im sure they dont fire on people houses beacuse they turned on the light. thats completely preposterous.

I haven't been able to find any other references, so quite possibly you are right. Maybe you could find out.

I haven't been able to find any other references, so quite possibly you are right. Maybe you could find out.

i have better things to do at the moment. maybe in another time.

i have better things to do at the moment. maybe in another time.

I know you better than that. ;)

I know you better than that. ;)

i have exmas.

i have exmas.

Ah, in that case, I wish you the best.

They've already destroyed the only power station there.

And how odd was it, that they had to repair it themselves only few months later in order to prevent a humanitarian crisis in Gaza. Same goes for gas and water flowing to the strip by Israeli engineers.

And how odd was it, that they had to repair it themselves only few months later in order to prevent a humanitarian crisis in Gaza. Same goes for gas and water flowing to the strip by Israeli engineers.

So they've repaired it? Its working now?

So they've repaired it? Its working now?

No, I was wrong. The Israelis didn't repair it but someone else must have. Anyway, Israel itself has been providing Gaza with most of its electricity, not that power plant.

http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/07/02/news/power.php

The strike initially knocked out power to 700,000 Gazans. The plant provided 90 megawatts of electricity, 43 percent of Gaza's power; the rest is delivered from Israel. Officials at Israeli and Palestinian electric utilities said that Israel could not cover the shortfall because electric lines connecting Gaza to Israeli power sources do not have the capacity.

No, I was wrong. The Israelis didn't repair it but someone else must have. Anyway, Israel itself has been providing Gaza with most of its electricity, not that power plant.

http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/07/02/news/power.php

So its working now then? They have adequate food water housing medical care and proper sanitation?

Gaza should be bombarded with waste, nuclear AIDS-infested watermelons, sewage, and some more AIDS

that way the relentless propaganda coming from Gaza will finally be confirmed!

Gaza should be bombarded with waste, nuclear AIDS-infested watermelons, sewage, and some more AIDS

that way the relentless propaganda coming from Gaza will finally be confirmed!

Be careful what you wish for. :shrug: